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Thread: Psycho-Pass (Re-Edit Discussion)

  1. #121
    Harasho 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Kaiten's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    His purpose always was to take down the system, not be integrated into the machine. To Makishima, integration into Sybil is as much a form of slavery as Sybil dictating his life, what he was fighting against in the first place. He's an anarchist in the truest sense, as as opposed to leading as he is to being lead.

    What Makishima wants, I think, goes far beyond enjoying himself. When he says he wants to enjoy the game, I believe he means that in the existential sense. He wants the freedom to make his own decisions, find his own path, choose his own career, and take responsibility for his own decisions. His enjoyment comes from being an active participant, not a leader or a follower. He is saying that the true pleasure in life is making your own decisions, and living with their consequences.

    I am glad that Sybil really did turn out to be powered by the brains of the criminally asymptomatic. That adds a nice layer to Psycho-Pass's societal metaphor, that our lives are governed by the whims of an unseen, unknown, far off bureaucracy. Rather than machines, the back end of Sybil is human, only far removed from the populace, and operating with a hive mentality.
    Last edited by Kaiten; February 15, 2013 at 05:26 PM.

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  3. #122
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity yukihime03's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    I was hoping that Kagari survives but... oh well.

    Does it mean something that I know what Makishima's answer would be even before the question was asked? I love how he easily bashes the chief though...

    I am a bit worried about the requirement to be a member of a Sybil system... Wouldn't that mean that Akane is qualified in a way?

    How nice of Makishima to call Kogami right away. It's as if they're buddies already.

    So.. I guess Makishima is officially an anti-villain. A show of anti-villain vs anti-hero... Yummy. I'm looking forward to next eps.

  4. #123
    Kya~ 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Doraku's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Watched EP 17. Actually since the android granny chief mentioned Kouzaburo Touma, somehow I knew that criminally asymptomatic people are the power house behind the Sibyl System, especially since he was described as "disappear" instead of "died" or "handled professionally". That was the most logical explanation so expected or not, I'm fine with the way secrets are unraveled.

    Now I really think Makishima is a gifted guy, being criminally asymptomatic, and has intellectual and physical capacities which are necessary package to defy the system which has been exist for a long time. I think this episode wonderfully reveal his grand scheme and personality as a whole, and his purpose of attaining a place where he could see the beauty of people's souls, even though his means are not necessarily to be.. appropriate.

    Quote Originally Posted by yukihime03 View Post

    I am a bit worried about the requirement to be a member of a Sybil system... Wouldn't that mean that Akane is qualified in a way?

    How nice of Makishima to call Kogami right away. It's as if they're buddies already.

    So.. I guess Makishima is officially an anti-villain. A show of anti-villain vs anti-hero... Yummy. I'm looking forward to next eps.
    As much as I love the idea of Kou & Makishima cooperating to destroy the core of Sibyl system, I'm still wondering how Makishima would persuade Kou to assist him. The possibility isn't low, since now it's clear that the one who killed Sasayama is not Makishima, but the Sibyl system or Kouzaburo Toma to be exact. I feel that Kou is seemingly still unable to put his rancour on Makishima aside, in order to become partner to decimate the Sibyl system. I know Kougami is a smart guy, but unfortunately I'm still unsure whether he is able to make a right decision while he's corrupted by hatred.

    Even if Kou is willing to help Makishima, I wonder how his superior, especially Ginoza, would react to his decision. Obviously Kou has to find his own way to "escape" from his colleagues since I'm pretty sure that Ginoza would be a hindrance for Kougami to act freely. Ginoza himself is afraid that if he defies the Sibyl system, his PP would become cloudy, hence I believe that Ginoza will reject the idea of assisting Makishima.

    I'm also looking forward to the next episode.

  5. #124
    Harasho 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Kaiten's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Ginoza learning to loosen up could be a future development. Unit 1 is now deeply embroiled in Makishima's mess. Ginoza is under orders to find a dead man, or be punished himself. Blindly following Sybil will only lead him to becoming an enforcer himself, or worse. At some point he will have to consider becoming more like Kougami and Akane.

    I'm not sure, at least in the short run, about Makishima working with Kougami. Makishima is still a vicious criminal. No matter his goals, he is responsible for a great deal of suffering. He is going to have to be apprehended first, secretly. Kougami and company would have to keep arrest a secret, and keep him hidden from the Bureau. I think that will eventually happen, but not yet. In the meantime, I think he is going to escape, disappearing for a few episodes. I think the next few episodes will be about the fallout from the riots, and investigating Kagami. That investigation will begin leading to the truth about Sybil, and back to Makishima.

    I wonder who that woman was, at the beginning of the episode. She must be important, she got a close up before walking off screen.

    While she is able to maintain a clean hue, I don't think Akane would be much good as part of Sybil. What makes the criminally asymptomatic useful is their lack of empathy, a total lack of human emotion. That is how Touma could commit such horrible crimes without his hue changing, he felt no pity for his victims, no guilt, no remorse, and no anxiety about being caught. That is what the chief meant by having the ability to observe people as though they were outsiders. Akane might be able to maintain a clean hue, but she feels normal human emotions. Remember in episode one, when she paralyzed Kougami before he could shoot the woman? Someone willing to do that could never be part of the Sybil System.
    Last edited by Kaiten; February 16, 2013 at 11:26 AM.

  6. #125
    MH's Funniest Member 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity digitaldude's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Makishima is one of my favorite villain. In fact he is not even that, he is a true Anti-Villain! And I am glad that they revealed what sibyl is so quickly.

  7. #126
    MH Senpai 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! phio_chan's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    /random thoughts start/

    Makishima is a person who appreciates freedom. He mentioned it himself. He was annoyed when Sibyl came to life, ordering everything around, so he wanted to find out what it is and destroyed it. Now he did, and offered to be part of it, but why should he? He wanted to fight for the free life he always had. This adds more to his motivation of destroying Sibyl. For that I think he might be willing to give 'signals' to Kougami, like what he did at the end of the episode. Small clues, like he previously did, to drive the police units themselves to deny the system they serve. Makishima is not really a field-player type, I guess, and that he prefers to be the director.

    I also agree that Akane wouldn't make a good Sibyl nor agreed to it, lol. She is too... alive, to be put in such.. death.

    \random thoughts end\

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  9. #127
    MangaHelper 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Asarii's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Quote Originally Posted by phio_chan View Post
    Makishima is a person who appreciates freedom. He mentioned it himself. He was annoyed when Sibyl came to life, ordering everything around, so he wanted to find out what it is and destroyed it. Now he did, and offered to be part of it, but why should he? He wanted to fight for the free life he always had. This adds more to his motivation of destroying Sibyl. For that I think he might be willing to give 'signals' to Kougami, like what he did at the end of the episode. Small clues, like he previously did, to drive the police units themselves to deny the system they serve. Makishima is not really a field-player type, I guess, and that he prefers to be the director.
    100% agreed. When Touma gave Makishima the offer of being part of the Sibyl System, I thought, "Pfft... he will never agree". Everything Makishima has done is to thwart the system: he hates how it limits free will and simplifies human nature. If he did comply, he would end up living his entire existence being a brain in a jar whose only purpose is to judge others. Not only would he lack the mobility to move around with his OWN body, he would be a collective first as opposed to an individual.

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  11. #128
    4-Star Loli-Hunter 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Skyguardian's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Episode 18:

    First, the animation was horrible. No not just bad it was really really really horrible.

    That aside I liked the episode. It was like a turning point. The counter attack will begin. Can't wait to see all their faces when they notice what Sibyl really is.
    I couldn't imagine Akane to kill Kougami though.
    But I do get the feeling Ginozas dad will die at some point... =/

  12. #129
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Hakuteiken's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    The animation was really weird. The facial expressions look totally different from what it was even just an episode back.

    Story-wise, it wasn't really an unexpected development to see Ko and the MWPSB parting ways, so, no shocking development. What made it more interesting than a regularity was Ginoza's initial approach to the matter, forcing a backdoor move to keep Ko in the case.
    I really wonder who is playing the Chief at the moment. Now that Touma is gone, I don't think this new impostor is someone who knows Makishima in person. Regardless, the obsession towards the man is gradually escalating.

    So, more of a transition to a new phase as it seems, but in any case, an episode without Makishima is just missing something.

    The way Ko chose now made it more unlikely that he will try to solve the matter through allying with Makishima.

  13. #130
    Kya~ 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Doraku's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    For those who complain that the animation is horrible, congratulations, you are right. Budget problems seems plaguing this episode, which makes this week episode is less enjoyable. The director of PP (Shiotani) made a statement on twitter that they'd redo the episode in the BD release. Here is the collection of derp faces found throughout the episode here. Also, comments on the episode later.

    ---------- Post added at 06:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:15 AM ----------

    First of all, I have to admit that I laughed for several times during this episode due to inconsistencies of animation quality, which I expected won't happen to anime made by IG; Chuckles I had during the time I watched this episode somehow detracted the strong emotional impact which is supposedly given by this episode, to some extent.

    About the episode itself, I guess I can say anything much apart from the fact that this episode is "the calm before the storm". My predictions were not true on several things, mainly the fact that Ginoza could loosen up to his hound. The scene where Chief wants to shoot Kou with lethal eliminator is thrilling, so glad that Akane is able to react in time. If there is something about "obsession" which I'm wondering about, it's more like Kou obsession with Makishima somehow. The way I look at it, it seems Kougami isn't the type who is able to think clearly when his personal interest is on the line. I used to think once Kou knows the nature of Sibyl, he won't be that obsessed to kill Makishima, but I might be totally wrong on that part.
    Last edited by Doraku; February 21, 2013 at 11:24 PM.

  14. #131
    Light and Shadow 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member naruto-niichan's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Was it really that bad though? I noticed that the art was off at times but it didn't bug me all that much. Better a bit less of good animation than the story going haywire. I don't expect good animation each and every episode from a 2 cour anime anyway, there only are a few rare exceptions. Still I'm happy that they will redo the episode in the BD release, will make it even more worth of buying

    That being said, I don't mind Makishima being left out for one episode. He was the focus almost each episode for a pretty long time so I actually appreciate a little breather, as great of a character he may be.
    This episode dealt with a completely different matter: What can be done if you notice that a criminal/criminals can't be judged by the law, for one reason or another. Do you become a criminal yourself or do you try to bend the law and reform it from within?
    While the first path most likely is easier and will give you a way quicker success in taking down a criminal, the second grants a victory beyond this one criminal. It's far from being such an easy matter though. What happens if you have to deny your own self, the person you are, to act according to the law? Do you "just" change yourself? It might be a small sacrifice if you consider the possible greater good but that's only from an objective point of view. It's up to the person if he's willing to sacrifice his own beliefs, behaviour and attitude or if he's not.

    Yes, Akane's path is the more righteous but there's no way I would judge Kougami for what he's done. Humans are far from being just do-gooders and the instinct of protecting oneself can weigh a lot higher than what's objectively good.
    Akane and Kougami parting was really sad for me, but their actions are both justified by their own values. Now I'm really looking forward to what PP has in store for us.

  15. #132
    Kya~ 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Doraku's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Quote Originally Posted by naruto-niichan View Post
    Was it really that bad though? I noticed that the art was off at times but it didn't bug me all that much. Better a bit less of good animation than the story going haywire. I don't expect good animation each and every episode from a 2 cour anime anyway, there only are a few rare exceptions. Still I'm happy that they will redo the episode in the BD release, will make it even more worth of buying
    It is really that bad, at least that's how I felt and I'm not the only one who feels that way. I'm curious what seems to be the problem though, they decided to improve the OP here and there since the 14th episode, but suddenly went full derp for the whole 17th episode. It's a matter of consistency rather than bad animation per se, I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by naruto-niichan View Post
    Yes, Akane's path is the more righteous but there's no way I would judge Kougami for what he's done. Humans are far from being just do-gooders and the instinct of protecting oneself can weigh a lot higher than what's objectively good.
    Akane and Kougami parting was really sad for me, but their actions are both justified by their own values. Now I'm really looking forward to what PP has in store for us.
    I'm still missing something to understand what is Kougami trying to protect. I mean, while I could argue that Makishima's action is not in the righteous side, I'm sure that he's not totally sinister either. That's why I said that Kougami's act probably is merely based on his desire for personal gain rather than greater good. The last scene is touching, probably one of the most emotional-dramatic scenes in PP so far. Unfortunately I'm inclined to believe there won't be a happy ending for both of them.

  16. #133
    Light and Shadow 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member naruto-niichan's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Quote Originally Posted by Doraku View Post
    It is really that bad, at least that's how I felt and I'm not the only one who feels that way. I'm curious what seems to be the problem though, they decided to improve the OP here and there since the 14th episode, but suddenly went full derp for the whole 17th episode. It's a matter of consistency rather than bad animation per se, I guess.
    Well I guess some people just focus more on the art/animation than I do. I just don't care about some silly looking faces here and there and I didn't feel like the animation was that bad overall. Obviously not as good as past episodes but far from being so worse that it would seriously bug me.

    And who knows about the reasons, what matters is that they plan to fix it later on. To me it's far from being a big deal, I enjoyed the episode as much as I usually do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doraku View Post
    I'm still missing something to understand what is Kougami trying to protect. I mean, while I could argue that Makishima's action is not in the righteous side, I'm sure that he's not totally sinister either. That's why I said that Kougami's act probably is merely based on his desire for personal gain rather than greater good. The last scene is touching, probably one of the most emotional-dramatic scenes in PP so far. Unfortunately I'm inclined to believe there won't be a happy ending for both of them.
    Kougami is trying to protect himself, nothing else. Just his own personal wish/desire. Obviously there isn't much greater good he's after, it's his personal gain. That's just what I described above, he values himself more despite knowing it's not the right thing to do. What I tried to say was that Akane's choice isn't just white (right) and Kougami's is black (wrong).

    I don't feel like they will have a happy ending either.

  17. #134
    Kya~ 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Doraku's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Quote Originally Posted by naruto-niichan View Post
    Well I guess some people just focus more on the art/animation than I do. I just don't care about some silly looking faces here and there and I didn't feel like the animation was that bad overall. Obviously not as good as past episodes but far from being so worse that it would seriously bug me.

    And who knows about the reasons, what matters is that they plan to fix it later on. To me it's far from being a big deal, I enjoyed the episode as much as I usually do.
    Well, bad faces were already there since earlier episode (fourth or fifth, I'm not exactly remember which one) but the production in this episode is just too apparent hence I feel disturbed, even though only slightly. Bad faces, missing in-between scenes, mouths, fingers, inconsistent environment.. it's too many so it's hard to catalog all of them. But that's it. I won't complain forever and encircling this thread with the same topic over and over.

    Quote Originally Posted by naruto-niichan View Post
    Kougami is trying to protect himself, nothing else. Just his own personal wish/desire. Obviously there isn't much greater good he's after, it's his personal gain. That's just what I described above, he values himself more despite knowing it's not the right thing to do. What I tried to say was that Akane's choice isn't just white (right) and Kougami's is black (wrong).

    I don't feel like they will have a happy ending either.
    I think he doesn't want to "protect" but rather prosecuting Makishima by his own hands. But what's with all this egoistic motive? He's everything but not stupid. It's just.. surprising that a person like him can be that motivated by desire, since normally he's the one who calmly assess about possible consequences of an action before doing something.

    Why do you think Kou's action can be justified, by the way?

  18. #135
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Hakuteiken's Avatar
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    Re: Psycho-Pass

    Quote Originally Posted by Doraku View Post
    I think he doesn't want to "protect" but rather prosecuting Makishima by his own hands. But what's with all this egoistic motive? He's everything but not stupid. It's just.. surprising that a person like him can be that motivated by desire, since normally he's the one who calmly assess about possible consequences of an action before doing something.

    Why do you think Kou's action can be justified, by the way?
    It's probably because the system which turned him into a hunting dog now cannot even judge a mass murdered that he gets angry with. Considering Makishima has been doing nothing to justify his own actions, but rather trying to emphasize the reinstatement of the will behind an action, it makes sense that he wants to hunt down this man through his own method. Eliminating Makishima with a Dominator and its Sibyl-based methods is impossible.
    Whether this justifies the method itself or not is another issue, but since there is no way to justify a course of action other than Sibyl itself, and the path he has taken on is out of Sibyl's boundaries by definition.

    In a way, Makishima was willing to play, and Ko just accepted it.

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