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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
If you have some kind of protection from yips, Hyakuren Aura + some way to offset the speed loss that is enough to defeat Yukimura. He really had nothing that can deal with that outside of yips when Ryoma used it, and from his dialogue it sounds like Tezuka can do the same thing (Tezuka can't move the aura but he has TZone so he wouldn't need to chase after the ball). From the flashback scene, it seems like Tezuka was better than Yukimura when they were both in elementary school. In fact it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out Yukimura developed yips to deal with Hyakuren aura (which Tezuka had in elementary school).
Does that mean he got Yips after the disease? If so, the winner of the assumed match between him and Tezuka would be Tezuka... interesting.
Yukimura obviously has a reputation of possessing yips as a technique. Unless he got his reputation from the quarterfinals and below matches against people not important enough to show on screen (he didn't play in semifinals, he probably didn't even play in the earlier rounds but let's just say he did), he couldn't have possibly developed yips between the time he was hospitalized to nationals because there wouldn't be anyone noteworthy to even see that technique.
I'd say it's far more likely he got his disease because he has crazy mental powers. In POT all super powerful techniques tend to carry some risks.
Although the elementary match between Tezuka and Yukimura was never shown the finale, Sanada did say Tezuka had the upper hand. I don't see how Yukimura can beat Hyakuren with normal rally unless he had yips as a technique as an elementary student. It'd actually make a lot of sense if he developed yips to counter Hyakuren since he lost to it in the past. Looking at the game against Ryoma, it sure looks like he'd lose Hyakuren + TZone if he didn't have yips.
Edit: Here ya go:
Apparently, Yukimura did have Gullan-Barré, until Konomi realised he was a bit of an asshole with the people out there who had that syndrome and knew it can't be cured with a surgery.
Nevertheless, it's still "Guillan-Barré" (it's almost the same), except that it can be cured with surgery. It's probably a PoT-only disease. And so, I'm still scared of Yukimura lol.
Last edited by Hardy; October 16, 2012 at 02:05 AM.
It was initially Guillain-Barré Syndrome, but he got some complaints as it's something that cannot be treated with something as simple as a one-time surgery.
It's likely his Yips was less developed back then too.
It likely during 2nd Year it went from making people not wanting to play, to blurring vision and no vision.
Then the illness.
Then when he came back we see him steal all 5 senses.
It's not to say everybody in the audience was fully aware of the whole Yips power.
In that first year match against Tezuka, we can assume it didn't finish.
Since Yuki states he and Tezuka have something to settle in a PP.
Also, TZ + Hyakku Ren shouldn't really win against Yuki. It will do damage but Yuki was returning Doubled Return shots.
It was that Ryoma was running around the court that changed things.
Since TZ brings the ball back to Tezuka, and breaking TZ+HJnK apart looked really simple by Sanada.
He just hit some Ka's and Rin's. I don't think it's beyond Yuki to hit hard shots back.
If Ryoma had the power down of Big Bang.
This Ryoma after hitting Super Ultra Great Delicious Storm.
As a matter of fact, it took 6 shots in a rally with HJnK + SKnK with Ryoma to think of a way against Yuki.
So Yuki is far from physically weak.
I'm not saying he can overcome it but it definetely isn't a given that HJnK all-around the body is enough.
It was far from Tezuka's one sided 1rally call against Chitose in SKnK + HJnK.
Although Tezuka had TZ along with it.
So its SKnK + HJnK + TZ that is the damaging thing.
Last edited by Airgrimes; October 16, 2012 at 10:54 AM.
Sanada overpowered TZone because he's much stronger physically than Tezuka. I don't see any indication that Yukimura ought to be physically stronger than Tezuka.
In the Ryoma versus Yukimura shot, after Yukimura returned a double powered shot it let Ryoma set up one of his move for his first point against Yukimura. Therefore, while he can return a double powered shot he can't do it flawlessly.
Ryoma's copied power shot never works on anyone. I assume this is because copied power shot do not still uses the strength of the user, not the guy you copied, or copying Duke would reliably get you #3 in Japan if you can copy his strength. Niou is the only exception to this I can think of. Even Kabaji, who can copy moves that Muga normally cannot copy, is still subject to this as his copied move cannot knock away the G20 guys.
Just the fact that Yuki shat on FuuRinKaZan shows he is likely stronger than Tezuka.
Ka presented zero problems To Yuki.
Whilst it began to tear apart TZ from the first point. Tezuka wasn't even moving around in the rally. He was standing still and Ka was just pressurizing him.
Secondly, Yuki hit Rai back with the racket gut whilst Tezuka's racket flew out of his hand. It's cited there is a difference in physical strength between them I believe.
Yuki returned more than one Doubled Returned shots actually. No not flawlessly like Sanada but the fact that he can do it, means there is no way he is physically weak.
Its not like it was standard shots that Tezuka hits whilst standing in one spot, it was more advanced than that.
It was Ryoma running around playing normally but all of his shots with Doubled power in both Right hand or Left hand.
So in Physical Stength, nothing suggests that Yuki isnt solid.
I don't see Atobe effortlessly hitting back Ka's.
I'll say it again. In answer to the thread title question.
Yuki is definetely in Top 4. Tezuka, Ryoma then its Yuki or Sanada.
Something we might found out in Sanada's next match, or in Yuki's next match since we don't know how strong Konomi will make Sanada yet.
Besides plot-armored Ryoma and then Tezuka, Sanada is the only MSer possibly pulling off a win against Yuki. Could go either way there.
I thought we all realized that the Yips was the same disease Yukimura had?
Yeah, he inflicts it against other players, and it makes him even scarier because he makes them go through what he had for months.
Let's take the mountain cilmbing scene in NPOT.
Kaidoh can carry Momoshiro while climbing a mountain, but he can't get very far.
Kabaji can carry Momoshiro and doens't seem to even slow down.
Sanada and Kawamura can catch a guy falling off a cliff with one hand while not moving.
I don't see Yukimura doing what the last two did, and honestly I don't think he (or Tezuka) would be able to carry Momoshiro for longer compared to Kaidoh.
Of course Yukimura has massive tech bonus in terms of returning power shots due to his skill, but there's no reason to believe he's supposed to be able to do any feat of extraordinary strength, which is needed to defeat the Tezuka Zone with sheer power.
They caught them. But they didn't carry either Hitouji nor Konjiki on their backs up the cliff.
I didn't see that as impossible. It looked really awesome when they did though.
I don't see this relates to how easily HJnK + TZ was ripped apart from the very first point.
Why should you need extraordinary strength? All you have to do is change between one hard shot and a drop shot constantly with different spins.
Fuu, Rin and Ka all have different spins. Sanada chose to rip TZ apart from the very first point for his own reasons.
You think its impossible for people besides Sanada to stop it over a longer period of time? I'm not expecting others to do it from the get-go like Sanada did, but it doesnt look hard at all.
As long as somebody can hit back the Doubled Return shots, then HJnK + TZ isn't impossible to overcome.
Seeing as Yuki was returning Doubled Return shots from both of Ryoma's hands as Ryoma was running around the court, it doesn't seem out there.
Again, I believe there are other MSers who could overcome HJnK + TZ.
You really think Power is the only way to overcome things in Tennis? PoT has never been that way.
It's just that Sanada likes to crush things head-on, so he chooses to use Power.
We're talking about Yukimura not just people in general. Sure you can overcome TZone with Atobe vision, but only Atobe gets crazy eye visions. Yukimura isn't going to suddenly learn to do that. He currently has no offensive moves outside of yips (which obviously beats everything once it works). He clearly implies Hyakuren Aura combined with TZone gives him trouble in the game against Ryoma. While we can assume he'll be able to overcome it due to yips, I see no other move in his arsenal that can deal with this combo. He used yips to defeat Ryoma's moveable Hyakuren which is on par with the Hyakuren + TZone combo (maybe better). If he had a lesser move that can do the same thing, he should've used that instead.
Ka is used by someone who always has implied immense physical strength. It is not surprising to see Sanada or Kawamura pick up someone falling off a cliff with one hand. It's hard to see Yukimura do that, because he's not someone who's associated with immense strength. In the limited samples we have of Yukimura he seems to be more of a speed/precision player when it comes to rally but TZone completely negates these advantages.
In no way does Yukimura ever begin a match saying, I'm going to use my Yips.
The fact that Yuki can take points from Sanada who wasn't yipped means Yuki's attack is solid.
Sanada is amazing. In case you forgot PoT, Yuki was acing Ryoma effortlessly.
I'm gonna need to ask you to name me MSers who can confidently take points off of Sanada w/out BA.
This Yuki can't attack nonsense is baseless.
PoT isn't about moves. There are all kinds of aspect in this story.
Tokugawa doesn't have ''moves'' as far as we know. Still kicked the ass of Ryoma.
You don't need ''offensive moves'' if you're technique is high enough to take out most moves in the series.
Yuki is more of a Speed/Precision player?
Tell me where and how you came to that conclusion.
He can attack, and in terms of strength, he has to be solid like others.
You're not getting my point.
Sanada and Kawamura are extremely strong.
He shat on Ka and Zan, Big Bang, Yuki is a solid All-Rounder like Shiraishi and Atobe and Sanada.
Since when was Power the most important aspect in Tennis?
Technique is just as key.
If Sanada tore apart HJnK+TZ from the first point with Ka and Drop shots,
you think after a game or two Yuki, Atobe and others can't???
With HJnK, Sanada hit back doubled power shots coz he likes to crush head-on.
Chitose and Fuji showed us you can just hit weak shots with great technique and HJnK poses no threat.
You think if Chitose and Fuji are capable Yuki can't? Yukimura is comfortably stronger than the both of them.
With TZ added, if the shots stay soft, and Players interchange between Drops and standard shots, then TZ will also begin to spread out.
Since Yuki isn't at some low level where TZ+Doubled Returned Weak-hit shots will kill him off.
I don't see how HJnK+TZ can take out such a high-level tier.
---------- Post added at 11:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:27 AM ----------
Phantron, read my WHOLE post please.