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Thread: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama <3

  1. #46
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted gnut's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Quote:
    Though, how did Madara survive if even Hashirama thought he was dead?
    well until proven otherwise...izanagi is the only thing i can think of.



    "While many can pursue their dreams in solitude, other dreams are like great storms blowing hundreds, even thousands of dreams apart in their wake. Dreams breathe life into men and can cage them in suffering. Men live and die by their dreams. But long after they have been abandoned they still smolder deep in men's hearts. Some see nothing more than life and death. They are dead, for they have no dreams."


  2. #47
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by jalix View Post
    I really do think Madara could have used Izanagi. It was said in the manga that using the jutsu would result in blindness. But now there seem to be all sorts of qualifications surrounding this. And with the 'introduction' of Hashirama's dna to both Madara and Obito, it seems that Hashirama's cells just may play a convenient role in how/why he could have used it.

    Danzou lost the ability to use the eye after using Izanagi and Obito mentioned it was imperfect, though he trued to take advantage of Hashirama's dna. Obito used it with a sharingan in his left eye, and it went blind. But what if you wouldn't go blind in that eye if you had the EMS AND Hashirama's DNA?

    Point is, I can see Kishimoto changing the rules in order to make Obito, Madara or Sasuke 'special' in comparison to others. He can come up with some sort of exception to the rule that will allow someone like Sasuke use the jutsu without going blind. Like... maybe Sasuke and Madara can use it without going blind becasue they have the "Eternal" MS, which helped them to not lose the light to
    Madara still had that wound in the end, if he used Izanagi there wouldn't have been any wound. If he activated it after getting stabbed, he'd still have died. And nowhere was it ever mentioned that having Hashirama's cells can prevent Izanagi users from getting an eye sealed. Other than it being eternal, I don't see how that'd prevent the eye from being sealed.

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  4. #48
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted gnut's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    Madara still had that wound in the end, if he used Izanagi there wouldn't have been any wound. If he activated it after getting stabbed, he'd still have died. And nowhere was it ever mentioned that having Hashirama's cells can prevent Izanagi users from getting an eye sealed. Other than it being eternal, I don't see how that'd prevent the eye from being sealed.
    i agree that hashirama cells do not stop the sealing of the eye...look at obito vs konan.

    but i disagree to the fact of...where didi madara actually say he was mortally wounded...only that hashirama defeat him.this was the open door for madara to say he used this tech to get away from hashirama...not actually stating he was mortally wounded just on the verge of death.



    "While many can pursue their dreams in solitude, other dreams are like great storms blowing hundreds, even thousands of dreams apart in their wake. Dreams breathe life into men and can cage them in suffering. Men live and die by their dreams. But long after they have been abandoned they still smolder deep in men's hearts. Some see nothing more than life and death. They are dead, for they have no dreams."


  5. #49
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member marshall313's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by gnut View Post
    well until proven otherwise...izanagi is the only thing i can think of.
    You think so?

    What if madara did exactly the same like jiraiya who used his own freewill to stay alive for that moment? Maybe madara just want to stay alive that badly. Then his freewill/feelings/emotion as a prideful uchiha and as a rival of hashirama that make madara to stay breathing. I think sometimes, when someone doesn't want to die yet his feelings/freewill will make him to avoid that death. Maybe that's what happened to madara.
    When i claimed that minato knows Kage Bunshin, They said that I'm wrong.
    When i claimed that minato is a sage mode user, they said that I'm delusional.
    When i claimed that minato can extend his chakra arms and can activate BM, they said that I'm ridiculous.
    Seriously, Who's "wrong", "delusional" and "ridiculous" now?

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  7. #50
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member jalix's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    Madara still had that wound in the end, if he used Izanagi there wouldn't have been any wound. If he activated it after getting stabbed, he'd still have died. And nowhere was it ever mentioned that having Hashirama's cells can prevent Izanagi users from getting an eye sealed. Other than it being eternal, I don't see how that'd prevent the eye from being sealed.
    Just about anything is possible in this manga. He could have been stabbed and still lived. How many times have people been stabbed and lived? Sasuke had his chest blown off and lived. lol There's always an 'out'.

    It hasn't been mentioned, but it's a theory so people have to have some imagination and be open minded to the possibilities. Supposedly, people weren't supposed to be able to break free from ET the way Madara did, yet here we are. Kishimoto can change his mind and often he'll set a limit so that in the future one of the special characters can 'break' the rule. That or... he just decides to squash whatever the parameters were altogether. So this is the point of the theories IMO. For example, Obito has used his MS jutsu loads of times and doesn't appear to be going blind. A plausible theory is that Hashirama's cells somehow help him with this. Meanwhile he used Izanagi with Konan, adn that eye went blind so perhaps that was because A: it wasn't his eye and B: just having Hashirama's cells isn't enough, it must be Eternal. Another, is that Kishimoto just went back on his rule (and let's face it, that has happened.) Another is that having the EMS may mean that the user can cast the jutsu without going blind. In a way, I like this pet theory because to me it makes sense. The light returns to the user... so maybe it will prevent the light from going out as well.

    Hashirama's cells may not have prevented him from going blind. But the scene of him being stabbed - I'm not 100% convinced that this is everything there is to the end of their fight anyway. Something else happened in the end because from what we've seen of Madara, to me he isn't the type of character to just whither away in a shallow grave (IMO, the best thing about the Obito flashback was the imagery and metaphor of Madara, living underground 'between the living world and the dead', in a grave wiht his only company being clones made from the cells of his greatest rival and most hated opponent). Izanagi makes some sense to me - I wouldn't be at all surprised if he used it and didn't go blind. Madara was quite special and we don't know when exactly it was that he stole Hashirama's cells.

    Either way, two things I can't get past is that both Madara and Hashirama were elite & special. I question if Hashirama was really 'tricked' by Madara faking his death with Izanagi or not. Second, the aftermath of the battle with Madara being somewhat 'sealed' away and hiding underground for God knows how long seems a bit odd for someone with such incredible ambitions.
    Last edited by jalix; November 20, 2012 at 09:39 AM.

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  9. #51
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Izanagi WAS NOT USED. If he used Izanagi then he could not have 2 eyes to give to Nagato. He was damaged, Hashirama belived him dead (not big woop) and then Hashirama made Zetsu goo and "healed" himself with it.

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  11. #52
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member jalix's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Izanagi WAS NOT USED. If he used Izanagi then he could not have 2 eyes to give to Nagato. He was damaged, Hashirama belived him dead (not big woop) and then Hashirama made Zetsu goo and "healed" himself with it.
    Fair enough. But I think it could have been used. lol So see, we are at a stalemate.

    I think that rules in this manga are made to be re-written or broken by special circumstances and characters. And Madara is anything but a typical character, with typical sharingan eyes (for the Narutoverse). He didn't just have the sharingan or even the MS, his was 'eternal'. I wouldn't put it past Kishimoto to use this as an 'out' for him to not only use the jutsu, but keep the power of his eyes because then, without ramification, would it be a 'complete' jutsu within the narutoverse.

    Just my 2 cents however. The reality is that we don't know what happened at the end of the fight because it's still shrouded in mystery... all we can do is make theories about it. I guess it also comes down to if people think Hashirama would be tricked by izanagi or not, or tricked by Madara some other way or not, and if Hashirama would spare Madara's life or not. When we saw Madara, he was old and decrepid but he lived a long time in a unique grave. Could he have gotten out at some time? If not, who put him there? There are still some un-answered questions about what happened, and why.

  12. #53
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member number12michael's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Maybe he just assumed madara was dead/dieing

    And u forget Hashirama was a peace lover....personally i think if madara asked for hashirama to spare his life he would.

    i also think they are scored lovers and when Hashirama met mito he began to love her, that or madara developed feelings for hashirama in all their battles and due to madara always fighting he never had a chance to meet someone and his feelings transferred to the one person he respected and admired....Hashirama
    "Keep Eating Shit For The Rest Of Your Life " - 愛憎のロクサーヌ- Roxanne of Love and Hate

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shafagh's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Quote Originally Posted by number12michael View Post
    Maybe he just assumed madara was dead/dieing

    And u forget Hashirama was a peace lover....personally i think if madara asked for hashirama to spare his life he would.

    i also think they are scored lovers and when Hashirama met mito he began to love her, that or madara developed feelings for hashirama in all their battles and due to madara always fighting he never had a chance to meet someone and his feelings transferred to the one person he respected and admired....Hashirama
    and that peace lover already defeated so many clans ... are you think he beat those clan with talk no jutsu !?

    I think EMS and Rinnegan won't get blind after using Izanagi , these eyes only have some cool time ....

    Ruckudo's used Izanagi and created 9 Bijju and he didn't get blind as well ....
    خداحافظ

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  15. #55
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted gnut's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    starting to think it was izanami madara used and hashirama accepted his fate immediately....
    Spoiler show

    bottom panel....same situation they experienced since kids(loopin an event like itachi did kabuto)....
    Spoiler show

    bottom panel....hashirama accepting his fate
    Spoiler show

    a resolve...in which kabuto could not reach
    Spoiler show

    looking at this page again...in this perspective...is hashirama noticing madara(getting away)?????



    "While many can pursue their dreams in solitude, other dreams are like great storms blowing hundreds, even thousands of dreams apart in their wake. Dreams breathe life into men and can cage them in suffering. Men live and die by their dreams. But long after they have been abandoned they still smolder deep in men's hearts. Some see nothing more than life and death. They are dead, for they have no dreams."


  16. #56
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    If izanami had saved madara then wouldn't he be blind in one eye? Nagato was perfectly able to see through both eyes... I guess hashirama cells could explain that however it would still be a weird develpment. Even dead itachi went blind from using izanagi....

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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Totally agree with kkck. Unless there is some kinda hax that EMS won't go blind even by using Izanagi etc (Madara had EMS because he and Izuna woke MS and then he took Izuna's eyes)

  18. #58
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted gnut's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Spoiler show

    one eye
    funny it's in the same socket as his"one sharigan"

    i'm starting to think once he gave/implanted the one rinnegan within nagato...it just made his set of regular eyes become rinnegan(like nagato's paths or obito's jins)
    infact...i think this is the very reason he wanted to be resurrected and didn't try to prolong his life with the rinnegan...because he only had one and need the resurrection to be able to use/wield two eyes again

    i believe this would be possible...hence kabuto was able to create a fake set of ems sharingan/rinnegan eyes for madara...i don't see why madara couldn't have used his real rinnegan to change both nagato's eyes into a real set...or adding the rinnegan(to an uzumaki not an uchiha no less) changes it...just stabbing at it

    few other things i want to point out...the rinnegan and the sharingan that we see him with anytime after his last battle with hashirama...pre-resurrection...is on the same side he has hashirama's face on his chest....
    and if you notice in the above panel...the right side which he has no eye(i'm presuming)is the same side of black zetsu(his will)
    Last edited by gnut; February 11, 2014 at 04:06 PM.



    "While many can pursue their dreams in solitude, other dreams are like great storms blowing hundreds, even thousands of dreams apart in their wake. Dreams breathe life into men and can cage them in suffering. Men live and die by their dreams. But long after they have been abandoned they still smolder deep in men's hearts. Some see nothing more than life and death. They are dead, for they have no dreams."


  19. #59
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    I'm guessing Madara just used genjutsu on Hashi. I don't see how he could counter that, especially if he didn't know it had been used on him.

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    Re: Izanagi definitely saved Madara from Hashirama

    Or may be Madara used one of his wood clones to die instead of him, while hiding under the rock or something

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