Manga News: Check out this week's new manga (10/13/14 - 10/19/14).
Forum News: The nomination phase of the Community Awards 2014 is live! Visit new sections for Nisekoi and Kingdom!
Translations: Bleach 600 by BadKarma
So prevailing theories about Clare's body within the blob:
1) It did not dissolve her flesh (so to speak) and then reform her. It may or may not have restored parts of her body to her "own" flesh, to include the right arm. It did unzip her body as though she were still lying on the operating table at HQ waiting for yoma flesh to be put in her (or Teresa's head in this case). So the question is, was allowed into, or out of, her body while unzipped? I suppose you would have wonder what other biological material was in the blob at the time.
2) Clare's biological material was dissolved along with the others in the blob, and allowed to mingle and reform to any extent with elements throughout her old body. This would include Irene's arm, but maybe other material as well.
The issue I see with (2) is then why bother emerging from the blob with an unzipped body. If the body was going to/did reform, wouldn't the DNA and the "natural" state of a body demand that it be reformed correctly as one piece? Was something performing half-assed surgery in there?
Another issue is by what means did she gain Raftela's Fight Style? Was this purely an acquisition on a mental level due to a psyche-meeting with Raftela? Or was it due to (1) happening in the blob?
Obviously there are other questions about what happened in there, but the blob mechanics are hazy to me at best. You guys have probably fully brainstormed all this before but I'm a bit new here. Also, I find a few chapters ago, that Clare's re-emergence was not explained at all really. She had virtually nothing to say about, then immediately was like "ok me need 2kill Prissy nao, kbai!" as if nothing had happened and nothing had changed.
oh right and forgot to mention, in Chinese scan now, they have that one full page pane of just Irene's full body, withback turned to us, after a few panes the show Clare kicking some serious ass. I do wonder what is the meaning of the pane, and if it to show us that Irene now truly is a part of her and not just contained within an appendage.
Oh, also, technically she isn't 1/4 yoma anymore right? possibly 1/3 considering the arm to begin with, and then god-only-knows-what-happened from the blob right?
Last edited by fluorideconspiracy; December 02, 2012 at 10:44 AM.
It also would seem Yagi
randomlyintroduced another concept: a soul or consciousness that exists even if the body is no longer. After all, how was Clare able to keep her identity if her body (brain and heart) were basically not there anymore?
Although I could accept that soul/consciousness being able to keep a perfect image of the body in memory, and being able to reform it.
Not necessary? How about for the sake of plot coherence? Yoki is basically the magic in this universe, and the fact that we know so little about its workings this close to the probable end of the manga is deplorable.Quote:
If we scream 'ass-pull!' or 'plot hole!' Yagi can go 'lol wut? I never explained anything so you can't say that!' That's just lame. Some things do not need to be explained and the fans can come up with their own theories, but others need to be. Especially if they are core components of a story.
All this is beside my original point: if Clare reconstructed her body from scratch, she could only have used raw material present at hand. That is the Destroyer's flesh. If that is so, then her body is, for all intents and purposes, that of an Awakened Being. Or at least extremely similar. I would think that is something of great significance.
Unless, of course, Claymore's flesh and blood are no different from that of an AB, but I do not believe that. I guess this delves into what makes ABs what they are. If it's sorely their consciousness, or whether yoki, flesh and blood all matter.
In fact, thinking about it, how did they know? No one had considered the possibility that Clare could come out a misshapen monstrosity. They just knew she'd come out fine. Except for the scar thing of course.
If this is what happened, we can't call her just 1/4 anymore now, can we? This is beginning to confuse me.
Maybe Clare considered the scar like, er, a badge of honor? Something to identify her as a Claymore? Wait, never mind that. It sounded less stupid in my head. In any case, ABs don't seem to sport the wound/scar, so we can assume awakening heals it. Since Clare still has it, it's probably her own body.Quote:
That brings up another headache, namely how she could perfectly survive in there, and a few others.
I would say it's the first option. After awakening there was nothing at all of Rafaela left in the Destroyer (as far as memories/emotions/feelings go), so I doubt being in the Blob would teach her much in that regard.Quote:
Rafaela gave all those memories to Clare, so in there she probably found that fighting style. What's odd is how she can do it perfectly...the first time. No training or anything like that.
I missed those brainstorming sessionsQuote:
And yes, people were expecting Yagi to at least give an idea of what might have occurred inside the Blob, but it's like Clare went to sleep and just woke up next morning. Nothing to see here, move along.
but, going by what yoma really are, that being parasitic demonic entities, then we have to question that. it seems somewhat obvious that obviously you would not use the tissue from the host of the parasite. the yoma did not merge with the tissue really, it manipulated it and wore it out. thus it can be determined that the tissue was, for the most part, human.
but then let us think on this. it is said that they use yoma flesh and blood to make claymores. it is obvious now that they do this by implanting the tissue into the torso which affects the rest of the body..... however, if we follow it for what it is, implanting Yoma tissue, that means they implanted the tissue of the parasite. it is obvious the human flesh was no used, as it was disposable, and the yoma simply jumped to a new body when they wear the old one out. basically, iy would be like trying to make a clone by using someone sweater.
thus, there could be a third thing. what if what is implanted into the calymore is, in fact, a refined variation of the yoma parasite? the take the parasite from the dead yoma, then do some extra process to it that mutates it again, turning it into a symbiote of some kind. thus the claymores have a, mostly, benign yoma parasite implanted in their body cavite. this makes sense as it seems the transformation, at least those i have seen, happens From the torso outwards, though that could go with the original theory.
thus we have to question this. was the flesh of teresa that was put into clare in fact, teresa's own yoma symbiote transplanted from her corpse? That would make a hell of a lot more sense than what we presumed before. from what we know now, it simly cannot be just simple, dead tissue of a yoma within them, especially now that yoma are shown to be parasites. and teresa's torso was undamaged from the fight, simply dying from decapitation. the reason clare is so much weaker in strength and yoki than normal claymore might be because her symbiote, which was originally another's, is not fully in sync with her.
this All would mean that clare is, in fact of whatever is close to biology for yoki entities, physically a claymore, but only has half the potential power. her drastically increasing strength might be attributed to the symbiote inside of her finally beginning to sync with clare...... however, this theory could lead to a problem of a plot point. what would happen if the symbiote, teresa's so caleld flesh, suddenly fully synched with clare? considering how enormously powerful teresa was, it seems to me that there would be a sudden and enormous increase to her yoki levels. perhaps, far too much for her to control, and she would be at risk of awakening
---------- Post added at 01:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:35 PM ----------
i think it is more lalong the lines of he has not yet revealed it. it took over a hundred chapters for us to learn what yoma really are after all, and if you look closely, you can see hints that make one suspicious on the nature of the yoma. my best evidence of it, the crying yoma of chatper one.
---------- Post added at 02:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:41 PM ----------
if yagi simly did this to buy time, he could have simply had it that the priscilla destroyer was still taking on the other awakened. it would not be unlikely they coud, at least, hold out for a few more chapters. the ones featured in this chapter themselves managed to escape harm. i am more saying that he did not need to itnroduce a new character for a continued distraction.
at large, the rigful doll changes things. i think it will get better once we understand its origins, but it is obvious it is on the same level. not saying it is a strong, as it seems neither riful nor that cat abyssal one were as powerful as isley. and also, the fight here is different than an abyssal fight because we are talking about two things with seemingly limitless power. i doubt that either of these two will be injured or worn till anytime soon. priscilla has so much energy she rapidly regenerates, and so can this new being i wager. priscilla took on so much damage that a abyssal one would have been violently weakened, as riful was after taking the brunt of the Destroyer's attack, which was not even focused on her i might add. but she recovers without any visible signs of wearing.
either way, the game already changed. originally, the ghsot plan was to unleash priscilla and clare, and hope the destroyer would attack priscilla. priscilla, weakened form long confinement nad starvation, would be more vulnerable. here, the destroyer fled into her body, likely filling in any missing gaps of power, and has fed upon the energy of dozens fo high level awakened.
and like i said, if he merely wanted a distraction, he would have displayed this creature as a distraction. instead, riful doll is displayed to be able to fight priscilla directly and not rely on cheap shots nor keeping a distance. and also, he could have simply had it that the destroyr priscilla was still attacking the awakened around her. it is nto implausible that the awakened there could ahve held on a while longer, as i have said.
---------- Post added at 02:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:00 PM ----------
i went back an read that part, and i can tell these are two different situations. it was obvious that douf stood no chance against priscilla. she got an upper hand on priscilla, but all other moves prior were countered an or meaningless. even his signature rod attack was stopped without effort.
here is a whole different ball game. jsut compare the brief exchange between these two. douf was obviously out match, ever time he was touched by priscilla he shattered. the riful doll actually takes he brunt of priscilla's body's raw strength, stands her ground, and retaliates.
...hmm, maybe i will be proven wrong, but let us just look at the evidence here. riful doll has a similar level of power, can take on priscilla had on, and more importantly, is capable of withstanding priscilla's power...... i have yet to see yagi set up a priscilla vs other match where the opponnent has taken the brunt of priscilla's attack and is left standing. and we all know priscilla is more than capable of rending apart other awakened with her bare hands.
it is obvious riful doll is not here to defeat priscilla. however, it could be priscilla jsut cannot defeat riful doll either. think of it this way. riful doll is after priscilla, and cassandra is likely emiting some of prisiclla's yoki.
About the "yoki subject":
A story doesn't NEED to explain clearly its elements at all, the only important thing is to not create incoherent plot twists, and Yagi never did it.
Basically, when a situation is unclear, what actaually happens in the story is EXACTLY what estabilishes truth, simple as that.
I have read TONS of mangas, books or even played videogames where some certain elements in the story where never explained in detail (for example, using your own example, the nature of "magic"....or "inner energy").
What's funny is that even our own REAL world is TOTALLY founded on something mysterious that is impossible to determine , so i don't see why a manga should feel the need to explain it, especially since judging by the level of technology of that world is 100% possible (and very very VERY probable) that in truth even the Mibs have no idea of how yoki really works, they just make experiments and see the results.....in other words what i'm saying is that it makes sense that NO ONE KNOWS what yoki really is and how it really works, they just observe the MACROSCOPIC effects of yoki.
So in conclusion, as much as it may seem absurd, explaining how yoki works is probably the most moronic thing that Yagi could do even from a logical point of view, ironic, isn't it?
If her body is the same as before a super easy explanation could be that Claire's soul simply reconstructed her own body exactly how it was before.Quote:
....and when i say reconstructed i mean that her body was reconstructed from a quantistic level (basically as if the soul contain the information of the body and the body is automatically rebuilt from zero following that plan), so it's totally irrelevant if the destroyer's flash and blood are the same or not compared to a normal warrior, "matter" is "matter".
I respect your opinion, but tbh what you say this is clearly wrong: not even half of the ABs were able to survive Prissy-destroyer FIRST attack, how the hell can you think that they can buy time???Quote:
....not to mention that, how can Yagi make the ABs help the ghosts if they have Prissy trying to kill them?
No, what i said is quite evident, chibi-Riful is no doubt the perfect solution to buy some time.
Said that, it doesn't mean that her role has to be limited to that, on the contrary i hope she will become a new interesting character (please Yagi, let her have Riful's personality!),not just a filler.
About your theory, i have to say that it's an interesting speculation.
I'll read it again in the future.
It seems there is a misunderstanding here, it's probably my fault for not being very clear.Quote:
I know perfectly well that chibi-Riful versus Prissy is a completely "different ball game" compared to what it was with Dauf or Isley (afterall it's quite evident that chibi-Riful is far stronger than the past opponents), what i'm saying is that the different ball game will have a very similar conclusion (Prissy winning when she gets "emotional").
Last edited by MalakTawus; December 02, 2012 at 05:32 PM.
i sitll question the idea of her 'winng' even if priscilla takes over. the moment priscilla got seriosu is when the enemy was shredded. more than likely, when she gets serious, is when this fight is just g3etting started. we have yet to see all of this new creature capabilities. hell, technically, she has not even revealed her true form yet. not to mention riful doll has already shown she can take the full brunt of pricilla's strength without harm... no, if they reallly got serious, that is when the claymores, awakened, and humans would be fleeing for their lives as the entire area became nothing but desolation.
jsut saying, in reality the destroyer was every bit a match for priscilla, it was just incapable of focusing on one target originally. and once it was focused on the target, it was fully capable of restraining her. basically, they had an arm wrestling match, and the destroyer managed to out muscle her in that aspect.
SO, basically - if Yagi said that Clare was able to reconstruct her entire body ( including all cells and electrons from brain being put perfectly in place ) than she could. No other explanation is required.
---------- Post added at 10:15 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:04 AM ----------
Their abilities could also be explained as influence of that substance at user's will ( to me it's similar to "Crysis" and nanosuit when you want to run faster or be stronger, just in Claymore case it is much more advanced ) except for some rather strange cases ( like Anastasia's hair ).
At least for me there is no magic in Claymroe as almost all things can be explained without going into "magic" domain ( I said almost all because there are some things I do not know how they work, like that Falcon Sword ).
---------- Post added at 10:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:17 AM ----------
Probably reason why Clare is so weak because it takes time for some abilities to become available, so Clare had to become stronger so that she could unlock some of Teresa's powers ( she probably had sensing ability form the beginning ).
---------- Post added at 10:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:34 AM ----------
As for the current situation... I am afraid those AB's are nothing more than ordinary meat shields to hold Cassandra down, same goes for zombi Riful.
All those AB's that Isley was able to gather were about average, and Alicia and Beth were able to kill them all easily like they were nothing. It is already seen that AB's will probably all die while Ghost will all probably survive ( being that most of them are stronger than No.1's with Miria and Clare being exception to that ) in fight against Cassandra.
I am not sure they will be able to fight Priscilla at all and win without some casualties.
You don't get it.Quote:
Chronos said clearly that less than half has survived the first attack,basically only 9 iirc.
There are no other ABs around, they have already died or escaped.
The ones helping the ghosts are all the survivors, so if they stayed around fighting with Prissy there would be no one helping the ghosts (not to mention that they would be able to buy a lot of time.....around 30 seconds,lol)........so yes, chibi-Riful is clearly to buy some time.
You call that "the full brunt of Priscilla's strenght"????? OK...........Quote:
The main reason that the destroyer was able to restrain Prissy is almost surely due to the fact that she can drain Priscila's energy, that ability is basically the perfect ability possible to contrast Prissy, but in truth the simple fact that the destroyer was unable to drain ALL her energy is already a clear indication that Prissy's power is even greater than the destroyer's......and also the fact that Claire was inside is not a little detail to forget.Quote:
Last edited by MalakTawus; December 03, 2012 at 05:54 AM.
just saw the raws.....
roll on the translation
Anyway i had the confirmation: for me Claymore with Claire is A LOT better
---------- Post added at 03:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:06 PM ----------
English version is out, go grab it!!!
Gernot's translation and mangastream scans is really a good combo on the paper.....but "high-speed sword"??? Is it really Gernot's translation?
Last edited by MalakTawus; December 03, 2012 at 10:08 AM.
Ya the english scan iss out I love the side text on the end page "The Most Evil Reinforcements" hehe it makes it all the more exciting about the fact that these Awakened could easily backstab the ghosts whenever they want ! i also noticed a speech bubble with "Biki" doesent that normally mean Yoki is being used ? So maybe all the Awakened will fully transform next chapter? Oh god i really want to see their Awakened forms XD
---------- Post added at 04:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:04 PM ----------
Just looked up the word Slovenly and it means messy and dirty, lol Octavia called Cass messy looking haha
Yup, "Biki" is generally used as the sound effect for yoki release.Quote:
Well, the english confirms Clare's QS power-up. But it's only supposed to be "as powerful" as Irene's?? At least it's more accurate than her old QS due to WC influence and all that training. Anyone know if Clare is at 10% or 30% yoki right now?
It kinda bothered me, but also made me chuckle a bit, to see the MiBs and also Chronos/Lars laugh at the claymores' attempt on Cassandra. The MiBs pretty much were in line with my thoughts on Clare's limiting factor being her small human size vs a size of an AO. But Chronos/Lars/Octavia really really bother me with their baseless arrogance.
However, I can't wait to see what Octavia and her crew can do in the next chapter vs Cassandra, if they think the Claymores are so pathetic. Time for these no-name AB to back up their smack talk!!!!!
Seeing Priscilla fighting is few and far between, so I'm liking this too. Overall, I've long ago abandoned any hope for the actual plot, but I can certainly appreciate the good action of this chapter and look forward to more. Also the general drawing imo is better than normal.
i dont know but there is something wrong with this pace. i was expecting some sort of fight with the ABs (so the claymores can prove their worth and we would see what kind these supposed supers they really are) rather than cassandra. also she is getting overpowered too much. claire also pumped up,than downgraded in the span of 5 chapters. no logical rythm as far as chapter goes. also the manga seems to get ready to climax without us seeing the mainland i was actually expecting that continent.
Prisscilla vs Ruful clone (i guess yagi couldnt find any other design for the mindless being.... a shame) fight seems anti-climactic so far. i want whole continent razed by them.