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View Poll Results: What will the 10th Elder do?

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Thread: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

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    MH's Best Reviewer 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Jammin's Avatar
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    Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Last week's poll was on whether or not the Union would back down. The vote was split pretty evenly, which is what I like to see, with a slight edge going to "them fighting it out". So far it's looking REALLY good for the majority.

    Now onto the review!

    Chapter Summary

    And "this" was the moment I felt silly for thinking things wouldn't get violent.


    This week starts us out with Mark-24 snooping around Frankenstein's house when he returns to find it completely empty. He thinks back to Yuri saying that their would likely be a "disturbance" and decides to get right to work and take full advantage of the situation.

    Meanwhile on roof in the city, the Bonerre and the two Union Elders find themselves standing across from Seira, Regis, M-21, Raizel, and Frankenstein. They demand to know who Frankenstien is but he's in no mood for questions and launches and attack that forces them back and stands between them and Raizel. When he asks if his master is alright, Raizel tells him that Tao and Takeo are missing. Frankenstein says he will take care of it.

    The 11th has had enough by this point and tries to charge in but is again effortlessly forced back by one of Frankenstein attacks The 10th momentarily calms him and tries to get some answers from Seira regarding who these people are and why she didn't tell him about them before but receives an icy "I have no obligation to explain such things to you." in response.

    When the 10th continues to press, Frankenstein uses the questions as an opportunity to annoy and irritate them with his classic big evil smile on his face; as Raizel and the others look on with a "Here he goes again" expressions He even goes so far as saying to the 10th & 11th Elders "Double digits should know their place.". His goading is completely successful and the 10th Elder gives the 11th permission to attack.

    After that the fight is on between the 11th Elder and Frankenstein. At first it seemed that the 11th had the advantage but, naturally, it was just Frankenstein sadistically playing with him. Upon seeing this the 11th Elder shows his full power in a mantis-like form. Frankenstein just laughs and calls down the Dark Spear. But the Dark Spears black lightening that normally descends from the sky when it's called out ends up striking the 11th Elder and seems to do considerable damage. This causes another bout of evil laughter to come from Frankenstein as he remarks about what terrible luck he must have to accidentally hit by that.

    Raizel and the others, meanwhile, look on as Raizel worries aloud that Frankenstein's personality is getting worse.


    Chapter Review

    Regis admiring Franky... Somewhere in Lukedonia Gejutel feels an icy shiver run down his spine.


    Substance

    Franky is angry. Oh so angry. After reading the first line of his dialogue there was no doubt there was going to be a fight (and that I was wrong). There are few things more entertaining in Noblesse than Franky unleashing in his full sadistic glee on somebody and that's what we got this week from him.

    The Elders for their part acted about how most thought they would. The 10th's reaction was thoughtful and restrained, even holding back the 11th for a bit, and the 11th was much more aggressive and easily goaded by Franky. In terms of power, I was a bit underwhelmed by the 11th's performance thus far. He hasn't shown me anything that would make me think of him as more of a threat than the 12th Elder was. I was hoping for a bit more.

    The tidbit we got with Mark-24 showed that, despite how disastrous this situation appears to be for the Union, Yuri's still turning it to his advantage by using it as a distraction. I'm not really sure what data Mark-24 is going after but in this situation it looks like he will probably get it.


    Presentation

    Great the art this week. All the lighting, shading, and character detail was there in the big moments and the rest of the time it was pretty good too. My favorite panel was probably the one where the 11th cut through the side of the skyscraper and when the piece fell off you could see the reflection of the other buildings on it's windows. That is the kind of fine touch I just love.

    Pacing-wise it was solid. Using the scene at the beginning with Mark-24 to remind us of goings on outside the fight while also serving as a transition to how Frankenstein and the rest are spending their evening. The rest was mostly fun and fast paced action.

    Overall Rating

    A second really good chapter in a row. Plentiful action, great artwork, and just a touch of humor. What more could we ask for?

    I give it a 5 out of 5 (Even though I really don't like giving out two "perfects" in a row like this....)

    Predictions Section



    New Prediction

    Can't think of anything good...(Sorry)

    Old Predictions: (18 Wins/ 21 Losses)

    No change. I still think the Union will back down. Even if the 11th Elder gets killed off that could remain true. (It's starting to look bad though...)

    Spoiler: Ongoing show
    Last edited by Jammin; November 05, 2012 at 11:37 PM.
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    The Gamer [Esp. for Everybody]
    I Don't Want This Kind of Hero [Esp. for Superhero/Comedy fans]
    Girls of the Wild's [Esp. for Romance/Martial Arts fans.]
    Ultimate Legend: Kang Hae Hyo [Esp. for Delinquent/Comedy fans]
    Otogi Taisen Fantasma [Esp. for Harem Fans]

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    As you stated, there's not a huge amount to say this week, although it was a nice chapter. The 11th Elder did appear to be weaker than the 12th Elder, although the 10th Elder did comment the past few chapters that the 11th Elder needed more time and stuff (which could imply that he was the weakest of the Elders, or that he was relatively new or something).

    In terms of the Predictions section, this isn't ToG. As much as Androssi is probably my favorite ToG character, this is Noblesse. :P

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    11th Elder will fight for sure Despite being pushed suddenly back, he's too enraged and hot headed so I don't expect him back down. But on contraty, I also don't expect 10th support, moreover he will probably try to get out and negotiate, as he's more intellingent than to simply "charge and be killed". Well, not THAT much intelligent since he tried to attack Rai after a few minutes, but it might be possible he will try to calm down the situation.
    Heh, I feel pity for him and wish good luck in calming down pissed of Franky. They really drove him pretty crazy

    I don't think that 12 elder was weaker than 11, it just seemed to me, that 11 is more stupid, since the 12 tried at least escape when his boots was full and his end was sealed the moment, he choosed Rai as a hostage.
    But to tell the truth, I doubt Franky will let them go away, instead he will probably take his time to get the answers, that troubles Rai, out of the elders and Bonerre. And that won't be comfortable for those three at all

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Blackdynamite410's Avatar
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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    The 11th elder is going to die. I wonder if the 10th were to try to assist him would Seira join the battle? I think the 10th is the type that will back down once he realizes he doesn't have the advantage. He'll probably inquire about Tao and Takeo in order to buy time. Bonerre just might crack and talk if he sees how easily Franken beats the 11th.

    I don't think that the 11th elder is weaker than the 12th. Their circumstances are completely different, Frankens goal was to ask the 12th some questions concerning Roctis when they first met but was attacked. He probably had every intention of killing him eventually but that wasn't his initial intent. This time around he's pissed and wants to kill the 11th elder pay for making Rai use his power. Even though he played around with the 11th initially it was obvious from the beginning that his goal is to kill him.

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quiet frosty! Androssi rules all D:

    I knew you would talk about that panel, jamm xD It just gave a icy in the cake that the chapter deserved.
    About comparing the 12th with the other elders... Idk, the 12th had a "noble" power that came from roctis so he must have been stronger than some of the other elders.
    I'm hoping for more franky action next week and I wonder what will happen when Crombell finds out that frankenstein is his "master".

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member MangaPage's Avatar
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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Another great chapter!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jitt View Post
    11th Elder will fight for sure
    I don't know how much damage he received from Franky calling the dark spear, but in this page (last panel) he seems pretty beat up, so he might already be K.O.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jitt View Post
    But on contraty, I also don't expect 10th support, moreover he will probably try to get out and negotiate, as he's more intellingent than to simply "charge and be killed".
    As much as the 11th elder is stupid, don't forget he is an elder, so he's extremely important. I can't see the 10th just standing there an watch him die. So, either: he tries to save the 11th elder (if at that moment he is still confident in his abilities) or he uses his fight as an opportunity to escape (if he realizes quickly that he is no match, besides being outnumbered), but not just stays watching him die. In the end the 11th elder will die anyway, and in the end the 10th will try to back down, whether at that moment or later. He knows that things have reached a point where it's impossible to try and negotiate/talk. I don't think he will be able to escape (unless he has a special way of doing it) because Franky will seriously try to prevent him from doing it, bc if he survives Rai and the others will be in a very bad position, with the union having information about them, plus Franky doesn't know that the 10th knows nothing about Tao and Takeo so he needs to question him.

    Hum... I don't know why but I can't see Bonerre dying or revealing things... That would put Rai and the group in a too good position to be true (true in fiction). I think it would work better for the storyline if they don't know a thing about what happened to Tao and Takeo. They would be in a more delicate position thinking the union has them and might even use the two to have influence over them. At the same time, Crombell would gain more info and power, and might plot something. As to how Bonerre survives, don't ask me, I have no idea. Maybe Yuri will show up or do something? Well it's just a theory, I might be completely mistaken.

    Anyway things are advancing really quick, and the situation as it is now seems to lead to a near big fight against the union.

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    The 11th Elder did appear to be weaker than the 12th Elder, although the 10th Elder did comment the past few chapters that the 11th Elder needed more time and stuff (which could imply that he was the weakest of the Elders, or that he was relatively new or something).
    If you're talking about this page, there were some translation differences so I'm not sure what was the correct one (this was posted in a previous chapter discussion):

    Originally posted by strixflash:

    "Re: Noblesse: Chapter 256 Discussion/257 Predictions
    Is it me or the Mangapirates (MP) mistranslated some sentences? I compared EGS and MangaPirates release and there were some difference.
    You know when Bonerre thinks (after 11th Elder fires a shot) is one of the most prominent example.
    In MP release,it says "As I thought,He needs more time in order to face the Nobles" and
    EGS release says "So. 'He' will require more time before he is able to face the elders."
    Well both the sentences have completly different meaning,right? In MP it talks about 11th Elder and nobles while EGS talks about Crombell and Elders."

    So in this case I think he's talking about Crombell needing more time to face elders and not the 11th elder needing more time to face nobles. Sorry if you were talking about another thing but I just don't remember any other occasion where it could be stated the 11th elder needs more time, so I still think he is stronger than the 12th.
    Last edited by MangaPage; November 06, 2012 at 10:58 AM.

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    MH's Best Reviewer 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Jammin's Avatar
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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quote Originally Posted by FrostyMouse View Post
    In terms of the Predictions section, this isn't ToG. As much as Androssi is probably my favorite ToG character, this is Noblesse. :P
    Very true, but panels where characters say something about predictions I can use don't exactly grow on trees. Which is why, until a get a Noblesse panel that works, you will see Androssi's glorious visage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jitt View Post
    11th Elder will fight for sure Despite being pushed suddenly back, he's too enraged and hot headed so I don't expect him back down. But on contraty, I also don't expect 10th support, moreover he will probably try to get out and negotiate, as he's more intellingent than to simply "charge and be killed". Well, not THAT much intelligent since he tried to attack Rai after a few minutes, but it might be possible he will try to calm down the situation.
    Heh, I feel pity for him and wish good luck in calming down pissed of Franky. They really drove him pretty crazy

    I don't think that 12 elder was weaker than 11, it just seemed to me, that 11 is more stupid, since the 12 tried at least escape when his boots was full and his end was sealed the moment, he choosed Rai as a hostage.
    But to tell the truth, I doubt Franky will let them go away, instead he will probably take his time to get the answers, that troubles Rai, out of the elders and Bonerre. And that won't be comfortable for those three at all
    You make a good point. It's hard to imagine Franky taking it down a notch until until the Tao and Takeo situation is settled.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdynamite410 View Post
    The 11th elder is going to die. I wonder if the 10th were to try to assist him would Seira join the battle? I think the 10th is the type that will back down once he realizes he doesn't have the advantage. He'll probably inquire about Tao and Takeo in order to buy time. Bonerre just might crack and talk if he sees how easily Franken beats the 11th.

    I don't think that the 11th elder is weaker than the 12th. Their circumstances are completely different, Frankens goal was to ask the 12th some questions concerning Roctis when they first met but was attacked. He probably had every intention of killing him eventually but that wasn't his initial intent. This time around he's pissed and wants to kill the 11th elder pay for making Rai use his power. Even though he played around with the 11th initially it was obvious from the beginning that his goal is to kill him.
    Yeah, Franky is definitely pulling no punches this time around. So it maybe it is just that that Franky is sooo good, as opposed to the 11th being bad.
    Last edited by Jammin; November 06, 2012 at 01:10 PM.
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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quote Originally Posted by MangaPage View Post
    ...

    As much as the 11th elder is stupid, don't forget he is an elder, so he's extremely important. I can't see the 10th just standing there an watch him die. So, either: he tries to save the 11th elder (if at that moment he is still confident in his abilities) or he uses his fight as an opportunity to escape (if he realizes quickly that he is no match, besides being outnumbered), but not just stays watching him die. In the end the 11th elder will die anyway, and in the end the 10th will try to back down, whether at that moment or later. He knows that things have reached a point where it's impossible to try and negotiate/talk. I don't think he will be able to escape (unless he has a special way of doing it) because Franky will seriously try to prevent him from doing it, bc if he survives Rai and the others will be in a very bad position, with the union having information about them, plus Franky doesn't know that the 10th knows nothing about Tao and Takeo so he needs to question him. ...
    As a Elder 11th is indeed important, but I can't really say, they are friends (though they are allies), since every one of the Elders is heading up to different goal. Crombel (as the 13th) let killed 12th Elder without even blinking, because "it suited his situation", though it was Elder (though the least important one). I wouldn't be surprised, if similar "friendship" was between the other Elders as well ... that's why they will never win, since their goals are pretty shattered (one wants power, another wants to rule, third wants plenty of experimental subjects ...) and the only reason I see for them to gather is reaching their own goals faster "under" the Union, than trying to do it alone ...

    And that's why I think 10th won't be really eager about heading towards the battle just to save 11th's ass. There would must have been even greater motivation to risk his own life, than simple "I'm your friend, I'll help you out of this crap" like the "good guys" are. To put it simply, he's using 11th as his "underling" and I bet he won't cry if the 11th will die.

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quote Originally Posted by Jitt View Post
    As a Elder 11th is indeed important, but I can't really say, they are friends (though they are allies), since every one of the Elders is heading up to different goal. Crombel (as the 13th) let killed 12th Elder without even blinking, because "it suited his situation", though it was Elder (though the least important one). I wouldn't be surprised, if similar "friendship" was between the other Elders as well ... that's why they will never win, since their goals are pretty shattered (one wants power, another wants to rule, third wants plenty of experimental subjects ...) and the only reason I see for them to gather is reaching their own goals faster "under" the Union, than trying to do it alone ...

    And that's why I think 10th won't be really eager about heading towards the battle just to save 11th's ass. There would must have been even greater motivation to risk his own life, than simple "I'm your friend, I'll help you out of this crap" like the "good guys" are. To put it simply, he's using 11th as his "underling" and I bet he won't cry if the 11th will die.
    You're right about that, I don't believe they're friends, they might even hate each other in secret. I agree with you on that, I never meant he would save him because of things like "I'm your friend", but my point was that the 10th Elder would not be seen positively by the other elders if he was there when the 11th died while he safely survived unscratched. He can't do things so openly. There were no signs for the other elders that Crombell was involved in any way with the death of the 12th, but in this case it's quite different. The 11th may be one rank inferior, but he's still an elder (remember how the others gave importance to Crombell's opinion back then), not an underling in the sense of someone he can command, but just someone who isn't as important as him. Sure, if it was a non-elder, he could do what he wants about him, even kill him himself, but I think in this case the matter is more serious than just "let him die", even if he doesn't care about him at all. Of course, he could always lie and invent something, but I don't think he would risk anything like that. And I also never meant he would risk his life for that, I had that as the possibility for if he still thinks he isn't at risk - I'm sure he's stronger than the 11th -, in case he already realized he had no chance he would back down like I said, he would never put his life in danger.

    Though I could be wrong and he wouldn't intervene at all and then would battle them (I still think it's unlikely, either he helps 11th if he's confident or he atempts an escape if he realizes the difference in power). Sorry if I didn't make my previous post clear.

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    No, you don't need to apologize, I just wrote what crossed my mind ...

    And your last post reminded me something other: What if the 10th Elder has been chosen to be the "lamb" to take the wrath of the Union upon himself unconsciously, in other words, his survival is already counted in Crombell plans, because if other Elders already had hints towards Crombell's intentions, it will be very good chance for him to let their attention off him by throwing the guilt (and other dirty stuff) on the "innocent" 10th Elder ... something like "look at him, he let 11th killed, so it's possible, he wanted to eliminate 12th too, so poooor 13th, he will be another target of the 10th" ... motive? Dunno, my imagination sometimes runs wild ... O

    No need to take me that seriously Sometimes I wonder myslef, how I could come up with something so impossible

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quote Originally Posted by MangaPage View Post
    If you're talking about this page, there were some translation differences so I'm not sure what was the correct one (this was posted in a previous chapter discussion):

    Originally posted by strixflash:

    "Re: Noblesse: Chapter 256 Discussion/257 Predictions
    Is it me or the Mangapirates (MP) mistranslated some sentences? I compared EGS and MangaPirates release and there were some difference.
    You know when Bonerre thinks (after 11th Elder fires a shot) is one of the most prominent example.
    In MP release,it says "As I thought,He needs more time in order to face the Nobles" and
    EGS release says "So. 'He' will require more time before he is able to face the elders."
    Well both the sentences have completly different meaning,right? In MP it talks about 11th Elder and nobles while EGS talks about Crombell and Elders."

    So in this case I think he's talking about Crombell needing more time to face elders and not the 11th elder needing more time to face nobles. Sorry if you were talking about another thing but I just don't remember any other occasion where it could be stated the 11th elder needs more time, so I still think he is stronger than the 12th.
    Yeah, I am talking about that page. Usually the original tlers of a series (EGS in this case), who also take more time in their tls, are correct, but in this case, even the "he" is ambiguous. It doesn't necessarily imply Crombell there, as it's an ambiguous statement. It's not talking about Rai, but it could ostensibly be about M-21. With the apostrophes around the he, you'd think it would be special, but you never know.

    On the other hand, MP's tl is radically different.

    Also, the 11th Elder's beast transformation didn't mention anything about being a contractee of a noble, so perhaps whatever method is used to give a beast transformation without contracting with a noble produces a weaker result. However, it does appear that Franky used more power than he ever had previously, such as that explosion of purple power around him when the 11th Elder was in the air.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jammin View Post
    Very true, but panels where characters say something about predictions I can use don't exactly grow on trees. Which is why, until a get a Noblesse panel that works, you will see Androssi's glorious visage.

    You make a good point. It's hard to imagine Franky taking it down a notch until until the Tao and Takeo situation is settled.

    Yeah, Franky is definitely pulling no punches this time around. So it maybe it is just that that Franky is sooo good, as opposed to the 11th being bad.
    I know, but it's about Dragonballs, which makes it even worse. Androssi is quite fun though.

    Everyone did seem a little more impressed by the 12th Elder's blue beams and attacks than the 11th Elder's green beam, however.
    Last edited by FrostyMouse; November 06, 2012 at 10:55 PM.

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Quote Originally Posted by Jitt View Post
    No, you don't need to apologize, I just wrote what crossed my mind ...

    And your last post reminded me something other: What if the 10th Elder has been chosen to be the "lamb" to take the wrath of the Union upon himself unconsciously, in other words, his survival is already counted in Crombell plans, because if other Elders already had hints towards Crombell's intentions, it will be very good chance for him to let their attention off him by throwing the guilt (and other dirty stuff) on the "innocent" 10th Elder ... something like "look at him, he let 11th killed, so it's possible, he wanted to eliminate 12th too, so poooor 13th, he will be another target of the 10th" ... motive? Dunno, my imagination sometimes runs wild ... O

    No need to take me that seriously Sometimes I wonder myslef, how I could come up with something so impossible
    Haha, yes, maybe your imagination ran a bit too wild... Did you undo the seal on your brain just like Franky?
    Right now I think it's impossible, because the thing is Crombell himself doesn't know exactly the strength of that "mysterious person(s)" that always defeats the Union members that go there. So basically he has no idea if both will die, both will survive, or one will die and the other survive, or if they will even fight. That's why that information fake-M-24 is looking for right know is so important. Once Crombell gets his hands on it, he'll be at an advantage over both Rai group and Union. So right now instead of his "lamb" I think Crombell is using both elders as a ruler, a measuring subject to have an idea "that mysterious person"'s strength.

    But that gives some ideas for the future. Even not having calculated the situation of 11th-death-10th-survival, if that happens, he might have the idea you had or a similar one and use it against the 10th. Or he might try another time to throw the guilt to another elder. Well, Crombell is intelligent so I think when he has the info to understand precisely the situation he'll come up with some good plans for Rai group and the Union to kill themselves , or just good plans where they don't kill themselves

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    If the 10th elder survives and escapes he might not be punished as severly because the traitors will surely realize that his opponent was Frankenstein and he really had no chance, especially with anothher clan leader present. Also, they might be too busy shi**** bricks if they realize Rai is alive.

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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    MangaPage: Oh, yeah, about that seal, sometimes i have the same feeling

    Crombell and Franky already met (and introduced their powers to each other) at the same time, when Rai awakened M-21's powers (or around that time). They both slightly grazed each other, which might gave the Crombell some idea about how strong Franky is ... and because Crombell didn't know any other "modified human" outside the Union (moreover with the strength actually on par with him, although it was only test clash), he already targeted Franky and his group and concentrating his interest in them. Although he don't know about the Noblesse existence yet (most probably). So i think, Crombell already know that mysterious person annihilated the 12th, and will probably do the same to 10th and 12th. But yes, Mark's information will be a great help to him, maybe a new monster will be born from that.

    Although looking at Franky's expression, I can't imagine the way, how the 10th elder could twist from him, since he's already made his mind about the idea to squeeze every information from 10th and not letting him go. Since he was one of those who forced Rai use his power (and that he's not gonna forgive).

    Or ... he will kill both of them, since there's probably no one (besides Rai, who didn't take any action yet), who is able to put the seal on his brain back to it's place (if not also the power) to make him realize the "prize" of 10th alive in his palm Since there's at least Bonerre left to provide informations (+ for him, he didn't really threaten Rai, so Franky might take that into consideration, though it won't be easy for Bonnere)

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member MangaPage's Avatar
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    Re: Noblesse Chapter 257 Review

    Hum... About Crombell knowing Franky's the one who is causing all this mess, I don't think that's completely true. He suspects of him but isn't certain. They only clashed for a brief moment and Franky hadn't undone his seal, and we have been shown that even after releasing the seal and even after calling the dark spear out we still might not know the full extent of his power (Frosty mentioned the explosion of purple power). Crombell is quite probably weaker than Franky, so should not have realized his true strength. Crombell might even not be hugely strong, if I remember correctly I think it was stated he was promoted to Union Elder for his experimental/technological achievements, not his strength. Also depending on which translation we pick for the page which was mentioned in this thread, Crombell might need more time to face other elders (though that's not sure, it's a difference in translation, I personally think this interpretation is the right). Crombell seemed surprised when strong people died there in Korea, which shows he wasn't expecting such strength. Crombell is not sure it's him, he just turns to him because that's the only non-Union strong guy he knows there, but I never saw him show certitude of that.

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