Naruto 609 Discussion

[tousendrinksbleach]

so now naruto can learn how to restore other people chakra? And while we are on it, why not teach them how to send biju-damas too?

[hatsuharupeace]

But if that were true, wouldn't you think that Kamui's power would also be cut in half? Though, Kakashi's version was a lot weaker than Obito's to begin with, until the latest chapter.

It depends. What sort of power range are you attributing Kamui to? All we know is that Kamui allows objects to move into an alternate dimension; how would half a pair of eyes affect the power of that technique, unless we're talking about range and how many times it can be used. Then again, how many times it can be used depends on the chakra store of a person, and we know that Obito has a large capacity thus why he's able to use it so freely. The only thing against this is the fact that it's a Sharingan technique, which slowly deteriorates your eye. So the only thing which I can see only having one eye affect the capabilities of Kamui is the range of it's usage.

[Uchiha_Blood]

That may be true, but for detailed readers such as ourselves, it's inevitable to spot this anomaly. By Kishi's theory, it should've already been impossible for either Kakashi or Obito to use Kamui any further without any severe side-effects.

Since when you are under the impression that Kishi cares about us detailed readers?
The whole Obito thing should've made it clear that he is above petty things like being coerent

so now naruto can learn how to restore other people chakra? And while we are on it, why not teach them how to send biju-damas too?

Bijuu can transfer chakra since the fist-bump thing, Samehada can too.
Its not really that surprising imo

[Roman]

It depends. What sort of power range are you attributing Kamui to? All we know is that Kamui allows objects to move into an alternate dimension; how would half a pair of eyes affect the power of that technique, unless we're talking about range and how many times it can be used. Then again, how many times it can be used depends on the chakra store of a person, and we know that Obito has a large capacity thus why he's able to use it so freely. The only thing against this is the fact that it's a Sharingan technique, which slowly deteriorates your eye. So the only thing which I can see only having one eye affect the capabilities of Kamui is the range of it's usage.

I think of Kamui as the weakest MS technique just because of the fact that Obito never showed any fatigue while using it, nor had any side-effects. We don't know how a pair of eyes would affect Kamui, but if I let my imagination do the works, I think it would be a lot more able than just jumping through dimensions. As for the range, I don't agree, as Kakashi used it on Deidara from pretty far distance.

[enmymiguel]

the 10 tails is summon. now there is some problem.

1- for the moon plan to work. the 10 tails need to have a host. and the host need to cast the justu on the moon.
2-madara or obito cannot be the host.
3- obito knew he was not going to be the host, thats why he need sasuke. sasuke is the only hope for madara and obito.
4-madara cannot be the host cause hes a zombie and hes revive plan fail.
5-obito cannot be host cause hes half human and half wood and they will not be total control of the body and the 10 tails will destroy hes body from inside.

[Roman]

Since when you are under the impression that Kishi cares about us detailed readers?
The whole Obito thing should've made it clear that he is above petty things like being coerent

I'm not usually under that impression but since it's Sharingan related (which pretty much is one of the main topics of power), this has to be explained. If it's let unexplained, I'll just think that a one MS eye acts like EMS. :P

[hatsuharupeace]

I think of Kamui as the weakest MS technique just because of the fact that Obito never showed any fatigue while using it, nor had any side-effects. We don't know how a pair of eyes would affect Kamui, but if I let my imagination do the works, I think it would be a lot more able than just jumping through dimensions. As for the range, I don't agree, as Kakashi used it on Deidara from pretty far distance.

That's fair enough then haha, everyone has their own interpretation of the skills in the manga. Then again, it would be interesting to see how potentially devastating two-eyed Kamui would be, and if that would also affect the scale and if there would be multiple dimensions to the technique workings. Perhaps Kamui is an offshoot of Tsukiyomi, due to the fact that there is only eye present in the two individuals, there is a loss of genjutsu ability, but the space-time technique is still there.

And for range, you're right Totally forgot about that, it's been way too long ago since I read that part. Just seems like Kamui is actually quite over-powered if used correctly, like Tobi's/Obito's usage of the technique.

[darkprince0521]

the 10 tails is summon. now there is some problem.

1- for the moon plan to work. the 10 tails need to have a host. and the host need to cast the justu on the moon.
2-madara or obito cannot be the host.
3- obito knew he was not going to be the host, thats why he need sasuke. sasuke is the only hope for madara and obito.
4-madara cannot be the host cause hes a zombie and hes revive plan fail.
5-obito cannot be host cause hes half human and half wood and they will not be total control of the body and the 10 tails will destroy hes body from inside.

may be that's a fact that i don't know. but where it is said that those Zombie cannot be host? so far i can remember, we have seen 5 zombies not too long ago each hosting a biju.

[LnDRash]

Kakashi: Eye is a transplant, so its a poor mans EMS.
Obito: Hashirama Cells.

I'am pretty sure that will be Kishi's "explanation" for the blindness mess... at least in case he even bothers to explain at all.

[Invader]

He can only be hit inside his dimension when he phases into it to avoid an attack from the real world. If you are in his dimension but he doesn't phase in you can't hit him....

Not trying to be snide - but - DUH. The point was that Obito was warping. He warped several times after he absorbed Torune. Then he warped a bunch more times after he absorbed Fuu and he had both of them in there. He warped when he went to get Sauske. He warped when he dumped Sauske in front of Danzou. He warped when he escaped from Danzou's sealing technique. He warped when he left Sauske. He warped when he came back to get Sasuke away from Naruto. He warped TONS of times and never once did Fuu or Torune ever so much as try anything. If you were trapped in a mystery dimension and body parts were appearing and dissappearing out of nowhere wouldn't you at least TRY to grab onto them once or twice to see what happened? If they were obviously the body parts of your enemy, wouldn't you take a shot at them? Just ONCE? If you were a SENSOR wouldn't you be able to tell when/where they were showing up?

and we still have no idea how big that dimension is, it could be endless

Sorry - but the average stock-boy does less reaching than this. If this dimension is hypothetically endless - or 'miles' big even - then why is every single instance taking place in the same spot in this fight? If Obito's dimension is huge and he can dump people wherever he wants in it then WHY on earth is he having his phased body parts appear where they can be hit? If what you are saying made any sense then Obito would dump Kakashi and Naruto way out in some BFE part of his dimension, and have his phased body parts appear somewhere completely safe.

If he could do all the things you guys are claiming then he would be invincible. He would literally have no weakness. Nothing could stop him. He could have just warped up to anyone he wanted - sucked them up (INSTANTLY putting them in a genjutsu) and warped away knowing nothing (even stuff in his dimension) could possibly hurt him because he could just dump it anywhere he wanted and warp himself in some other safe part. The hits Naruto & Kakashi have gotten would not be possible.

Come on guys. Why can't you just bring yourselves to admit that his is a big, huge, massive, stupid fuster-cluck of a PLOT HOLE? Either Obito should have been hashed by Fuu/Torune OR he should have genjutsued Naurto/Kakashi when he sucked them up. There is no other choice here unless you just accept a bunch of illogical, implausible hypothetical bad excuses.

[Chatte]

To do what exactly ?
Chouji really needs to go XXL and Shino better have big mosquitos in reserve.



On a serious note,Shikamaru analysis might be helpful

Well, maybe this is where Kishi will show the developed Konoha 11?
We never know.

[Invader]

Well, maybe this is where Kishi will show the developed Konoha 11?

They'll show up and this is the only thing that will be said...

"The best way we can support Naruto now is by not getting in his way..." (sits meekly down on the ground & does nothing)

[0Xellos]

Not trying to be snide - but - DUH. The point was that Obito was warping. He warped several times after he absorbed Torune. Then he warped a bunch more times after he absorbed Fuu and he had both of them in there. He warped when he went to get Sauske. He warped when he dumped Sauske in front of Danzou. He warped when he escaped from Danzou's sealing technique. He warped when he left Sauske. He warped when he came back to get Sasuke away from Naruto. He warped TONS of times and never once did Fuu or Torune ever so much as try anything. If you were trapped in a mystery dimension and body parts were appearing and dissappearing out of nowhere wouldn't you at least TRY to grab onto them once or twice to see what happened? If they were obviously the body parts of your enemy, wouldn't you take a shot at them? Just ONCE? If you were a SENSOR wouldn't you be able to tell when/where they were showing up?

He could've just genjutsu'd them...

[mattiaildivino]

Well once they reach to the hideout of tobi, then who cares about the worsening eye sight, every one will get plenty , but seriously i dont think there is any specific limit of how much u can use ur eyes, i mean Iachi used it for a long period and his eyes took a longer time to reach to the state in which they were while fighting with sasuke, so does Kakashi who is using MS from quite some times still no ill effects shown but Sasuke was almost near blind when he was about to face Naruto at the bridge.

actually,itachi did state this very issue: that is the more you use the ms,the more it gets worse. kakashi hasn't been using it for years,that's the reason why he wasn't affected by blindness: he used it during the timeskip,and then against deidara. after that,he just activated it in volume 43,after fighting tobi. but he actually used it only against pain (2 times). afterwards he used it once against sasuke. yet,he's spamming it since the beginning of this fight versus tobi. he had already lost a bit of seesight,as he hinted in volume 29,talking to itachi's clone. obito is different probably because of hashirama's cells,but I doubt kurama's chakra can do the same.

[narutoaged]

Does anyone observe that in the last chapter KYUUBI is bored just a Madara is bored ? Take a look http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/86022516/11 , so maybe there Is still more to be expected from Kyuubi n Naruto vs 10 ten tails ...