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Thread: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

  1. #46
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by darkprince0521 View Post
    the problem is, the exam was not about having the info beforehand. there were already many observers in the room and also two ninja having the info were planted as students. the sole purpose for all of this was, how a student will be able to extract the info without being detected.

    the exam was all about that, the information itself was nothing. so, sakura memorized the info, very well, but she very much failed the main purpose. the ones who collected the info from others without being detected are the actual stars of the exam. namely, shikamaru, sasuke, ino, neji etc. would be the names of such people who got the purpose of the exam and acted accordingly.
    That's ibiki's fault. They/he give an examination that beyond of a genin's logic. The purpose of that difficult exam, is just like you said, to make the students/genins to extract or to use their ability to collect an info or the correct answers. But sakura doesn't need to collect or to use his ability to gather the best answers/info at that exam, because she already knows it. Her logic/intelligent is far greater than any of the genin who took the exam at that time. It only shows how awesome sakura's IQ /intelligent really is.

    Shikamaru, sasuke and neji knows that the examination are beyond to their knowledge. They came into the conclusion that the purpose of that exam is to show how to gather/collect the correct info/answers because that exam is clearly beyond on their understanding and it's too difficult for them as a genin to answer those stuff. They cheat or used their ability because they knows nothing.

    Sasuke used his sharingan's ability to cheat because he knows nothing.
    Neji used his byakugan's ability to cheat because he knows nothing.
    Shikamaru rely on ino's ability because he knows nothing.

    As simple as that.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Sakura is good for 3 things:
    1-Drooling over Sasuke.
    2-Hitting Naruto for no good reason.
    3-QQ-ing about anything.

    Oh and what she said there is just wrong. Its the biggest inlogical thing you can come up with. It just tured up right as it is a bloody manga.

    She said "it makes sense that if he can make his hole body disapear then he should be able to do the same with individual body parts".

    Imagine separating half the brain... I mean wtf? You have to be a MORON to belive that individual can function with half his brain... How about removing his upper torso... How would he even STAND if the signals can't reach his lower body (from the brian obviously)? What happends with the damn BLOOD if he is removing half his body and leaving the rest there? Why is it not flowing out? How the hell can he speack or see them if his face is not really there? I can keep going with this... How about gravity? Inertia? Asuming only half his body is influenced by 1 or both of this forces he would never be able to reatach himself. Of coruse you can just say "dude its a manga" and you would be right but still...

    Point is only an individual with the IQ of a MONKEY would get to this conclusion. This is no feat for Sakura, its a manga stupidity feat.
    That can be explained. A correctly used (not like when Kakashi tried to teleport Deidara but screwed up and Deidara got ripped off a hand) Kamui doesn't cut objects when teleporting them. There's still the conection between teleported surfaces, and blood and everything can still move between them.
    Erfworld

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    Meh can't have Bleach without fan raging, makes it fun.

  3. #48
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by 0Xellos View Post
    That can be explained. A correctly used (not like when Kakashi tried to teleport Deidara but screwed up and Deidara got ripped off a hand) Kamui doesn't cut objects when teleporting them. There's still the conection between teleported surfaces, and blood and everything can still move between them.
    Not cut but 1 side exists on 1 side and the other in the next. How is Tobi (for example) holding his upper part when his legs are missing? Even asuming there is a open Kamui just under his torso and you would have the problem with having the SAME terran in both sides(imposible as 1 side has rock square looking things) AND the same inertia. If for example his dimension is not traveling trough space (like our planet does) he would end up like a splat on the wall. Not only the same speed is needed but also the same direction. You also need to take into account the earth does not just move in 1 direction trough space but also twisting around its axis.

    Then how can he see if his eyes are in the other dimension? LIGHT does pass trough him so if the light does NOT get to his eyes HOW can he see? How can he speack IF his mouth is not really there considering gaz would pass right trough him? You have to take into account he is not having part of his bodo moved trough a wormhole like having a Stargate open (the tv show) and placing 1 hand trough it. Over here that thing is moved with no open wormhole. It just exists on the other side leaving behind some type of phantom. That is the problem with "Not cut". The object is not moved trough a warmhole, its more like phazed out of our dimension.

    Bah you have a lot of problem here but who cares.
    Last edited by xXan; December 21, 2012 at 09:57 AM.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Not cut but 1 side exists on 1 side and the other in the next. How is Tobi (for example) holding his upper part when his legs are missing? Even asuming there is a open Kamui just under his torso and you would have the problem with having the SAME terran in both sides(imposible as 1 side has rock square looking things) AND the same inertia. If for example his dimension is not traveling trough space (like our planet does) he would end up like a splat on the wall. Not only the same speed is needed but also the same direction. You also need to take into account the earth does not just move in 1 direction trough space but also twisting around its axis.

    Then how can he see if his eyes are in the other dimension? LIGHT does pass trough him so if the light does NOT get to his eyes HOW can he see? How can he speack IF his mouth is not really there considering gaz would pass right trough him? You have to take into account he is not having part of his bodo moved trough a wormhole like having a Stargate open (the tv show) and placing 1 hand trough it. Over here that thing is moved with no open wormhole. It just exists on the other side leaving behind some type of phantom. That is the problem with "Not cut". The object is not moved trough a warmhole

    Bah you have a lot of problem here but who cares.
    Lol don't look too much into it, its a manga where an eye can cheat death or where some cells can let you control a God after all

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  6. #50
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessie View Post
    Shikamaru was always the smartest. His intelligence stat was already maxed out in the first databook. His grades were explained as being too lazy to even move the pencil and being bored with everything. He just didn't care despite having an over 200 IQ.

    Like Uchiha_Blood said, Ino was actually the best female student. Sakura didn't cheat on the chuunin exam. But the whole idea of the test was for you to cheat! To use your ninja abilities to get the answers.

    Sakura cannot be the "Smart Guy" among Naruto's generation because that role is Shikamaru's. So she has to stand out in other ways. Which she did during the Sasori fight. And then entered a black hole as a character after that.

    I have no problem giving Sakura props for anything. She deserves it. No Naruto character, gets bashed as much as her for no reason. And I can't think of a more neglected "main character" in any manga. Her two teammates can probably destroy the moon now and she can smash a few rocks and heal people. Even Kakashi is getting his due now. But not Sakura.
    Being smartest does not equal being the best. Ino was the best female of the class but Sakura was smarter than her.

    Sakura and Shikamaru's intelligence is not comparable.

    Shikamaru is a Field General, a tactician, perhaps the best the manga has alongside his father. He has a very analytically mind that allows him to easily break codes and is very good with both inductive and deductive reasoning.

    Sakura too has a good analytic mind, but her intelligence is more knowledge based which in turn can be applied to something like the medic field. Let us not forget, that she found a cure for Sasori's poison in a day, whereas Chiyo, his grandmother, had never been able to find one.
    "The line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    That's ibiki's fault. They/he give an examination that beyond of a genin's logic. The purpose of that difficult exam, is just like you said, to make the students/genins to extract or to use their ability to collect an info or the correct answers. But sakura doesn't need to collect or to use his ability to gather the best answers/info at that exam, because she already knows it. Her logic/intelligent is far greater than any of the genin who took the exam at that time. It only shows how awesome sakura's IQ /intelligent really is.
    that's not true. it was not beyond gennin's logic. if you can remember, every known character was using some kind of trick to steal the information, everyone, except Sakura.(yes, you are reading it right, even Naruto had figured it out, not in the right way, but still). so telling it a logic beyond gennin's would be incorrect. Ibiki is not at any fault here.

    and again i will say it, with link this time, that the purpose of this exam was not to write down the answer, the purpose of this exam was collecting the info.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    Shikamaru, sasuke and neji knows that the examination are beyond to their knowledge. They came into the conclusion that the purpose of that exam is to show how to gather/collect the correct info/answers because that exam is clearly beyond on their understanding and it's too difficult for them as a genin to answer those stuff. They cheat or used their ability because they knows nothing.

    Sasuke used his sharingan's ability to cheat because he knows nothing.
    Neji used his byakugan's ability to cheat because he knows nothing.
    Shikamaru rely on ino's ability because he knows nothing.
    As simple as that.
    now, again with the point of gennin's figuring what to do. here, here, here and here you can see several of those gennin figuring out what to do. Shikamaru, Neji or Sasuke weren't the only ones.

    anyway, i will try to say it again, with something more than my own words this time.

    the questions were purposefully made hard. if it was easier, many of the students would have answered the question and thus the main purpose would have failed. to make their point clear, the Proctor made the question too hard so that everyone can understand what is the actual purpose of the exam.

    now with Ibiki's own word again, with stating the purpose of the exam.

    now if you still believe that writing the answer in the paper was everything, nothing else; then i think our opinions vary in this regard.
    Last edited by darkprince0521; December 21, 2012 at 10:44 AM.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jessie's Avatar
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by Delbi View Post
    Being smartest does not equal being the best. Ino was the best female of the class but Sakura was smarter than her.

    Sakura and Shikamaru's intelligence is not comparable.

    Shikamaru is a Field General, a tactician, perhaps the best the manga has alongside his father. He has a very analytically mind that allows him to easily break codes and is very good with both inductive and deductive reasoning.

    Sakura too has a good analytic mind, but her intelligence is more knowledge based which in turn can be applied to something like the medic field. Let us not forget, that she found a cure for Sasori's poison in a day, whereas Chiyo, his grandmother, had never been able to find one.
    You're forgetting that Shikamaru's dad put together a medical book in his spare time that amazed the greatest medic ninja to ever live. Even in a field he wasn't skilled at, his intelligence allowed him to shine. That is the difference between having ridiculously high intelligence, which Shikaku and Shikamaru have, and being book smart which Sakura is.

    Shikaku and Shikamaru could be great in any field they choose. Not just as strategists. Their mind isn't geared toward one talent. Ulysses S. Grant was an amazing field general and tactician, but also had average intelligence and was a terrible president. He was limited to what he was great at. Shikamaru doesn't have those limits.

    So yes, Sakura and Shikamaru's intelligence is not comparable. She simply should never be brought up in comparison to him since it would be like comparing a medical doctor to Stephen Hawking, Leonardo da Vinci, or other universal geniuses. She is diligent and book smart. But her one great strength, is her intelligence, and that is badly overshadowed when you have a guy with an over 200 I.Q. as part of your generation. She can never be The Smart Guy. So her role has become as The Chick. And that is never a good thing for a female character.
    Last edited by Jessie; December 21, 2012 at 12:25 PM.

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  10. #53
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessie View Post
    You're forgetting that Shikamaru's dad put together a medical book in his spare time that amazed the greatest medic ninja to ever live. Even in a field he wasn't skilled at, his intelligence allowed him to shine. That is the difference between having ridiculously high intelligence, which Shikaku and Shikamaru have, and being book smart which Sakura is.

    Shikaku and Shikamaru could be great in any field they choose. Not just as strategists. Their mind isn't geared toward one talent. Ulysses S. Grant was an amazing field general and tactician, but also had average intelligence and was a terrible president. He was limited to what he was great at. Shikamaru doesn't have those limits.

    So yes, Sakura and Shikamaru's intelligence is not comparable. She simply should never be brought up in comparison to him since it would be like comparing a medical doctor to Stephen Hawking, Leonardo da Vinci, or other universal geniuses. She is diligent and book smart. But her one great strength, is her intelligence, and that is badly overshadowed when you have a guy with an over 200 I.Q. as part of your generation. She can never be The Smart Guy. So her role has become as The Chick. And that is never a good thing for a female character.
    Can Shikaku or Shikamaru create ninjutsu at the level of Sasuke or Orochimaru? No, because they lack skill in that field. All the intelligence in the world can't help him understand ninjutsu the way some of the characters in Narutoverse can. He lacks not only the knowledge, but the ability.

    Shikamaru's clan is known for making medicine from the horns of the deers in their forest, they've done so for years to off-set the poison in the Akimichi clan's pills, don't twist the facts to support your argument, they have plenty of experience in the medical field for that certain situation.

    And please PLEASE show me where I was comparing the two. I simply stated that Sakura had the highest grades, as in test grades in her class which is fact. She wasn't ranked the best in her class because she was sub par in combat. I've never debated that she is smarter than Shikamaru, only that she is smart and her intelligence is superior to his in a certain field of study, a.k.a the Medical Field.

    Could Shikamaru have made a cure for Kankuro on the spot like Sakura did? No. And even if he could, he lacks Sakura's chakra control to perfrom the technique required to remove the poison from Kankuro or to examine him in the first place.

    And while Shikamaru and his fathers IQ make them incredibly valuable from a military standpoint, the only reason they are that valuable is because they have years of experience fighting wars and other ninjas. You couldn't just drop Stephen Hawkings into a war zone and expect him to devise strategies to win battles.
    "The line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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  12. #54
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Not cut but 1 side exists on 1 side and the other in the next. How is Tobi (for example) holding his upper part when his legs are missing? Even asuming there is a open Kamui just under his torso and you would have the problem with having the SAME terran in both sides(imposible as 1 side has rock square looking things) AND the same inertia. If for example his dimension is not traveling trough space (like our planet does) he would end up like a splat on the wall. Not only the same speed is needed but also the same direction. You also need to take into account the earth does not just move in 1 direction trough space but also twisting around its axis.

    Then how can he see if his eyes are in the other dimension? LIGHT does pass trough him so if the light does NOT get to his eyes HOW can he see? How can he speack IF his mouth is not really there considering gaz would pass right trough him? You have to take into account he is not having part of his bodo moved trough a wormhole like having a Stargate open (the tv show) and placing 1 hand trough it. Over here that thing is moved with no open wormhole. It just exists on the other side leaving behind some type of phantom. That is the problem with "Not cut". The object is not moved trough a warmhole, its more like phazed out of our dimension.

    Bah you have a lot of problem here but who cares.
    The manga doesn't have any problem at all. All the things that you said doesn't exist in kishi's manga. You don't need to use the real logic in this manga because this manga itself isn't real.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    The test with questions that should be beyond a Genin too answer were a smokescreen yes. So is the whole spying/cheating part of it. ALL of it was just context to make them believe Ibiki's scenerio. Ibiki's purpose was to make them leave the room, if you can avoid the interrogation specialist from getting in your head and make you leave then you pass the test, that's all.

    Anyway, Sakura filling out the answers while Shikamaru didn't is not proof of anything at all. Asuma SPECIFICALLY stated that Shikamaru was too lazy to pick up a pencil, even for a test. And we have hardly seen enough of Shikaku's ninjutsus too definitively say what he lacked the ability, skill and knowledge to create.

    And Orochimaru, Kabuto and the Akatsuki are not in a class of their own sheerly by their skill and talent. Most of their crucial ninjutsu are Kinjutsu, Forbidden ones. The kind that requires human sacrifices and mutilating and experimenting on one's body. Yeah, guys like Shikaku doesn't go for that stuff.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by RandomShikafan View Post
    The test with questions that should be beyond a Genin too answer were a smokescreen yes. So is the whole spying/cheating part of it. ALL of it was just context to make them believe Ibiki's scenerio. Ibiki's purpose was to make them leave the room, if you can avoid the interrogation specialist from getting in your head and make you leave then you pass the test, that's all.

    Anyway, Sakura filling out the answers while Shikamaru didn't is not proof of anything at all. Asuma SPECIFICALLY stated that Shikamaru was too lazy to pick up a pencil, even for a test. And we have hardly seen enough of Shikaku's ninjutsus too definitively say what he lacked the ability, skill and knowledge to create.

    And Orochimaru, Kabuto and the Akatsuki are not in a class of their own sheerly by their skill and talent. Most of their crucial ninjutsu are Kinjutsu, Forbidden ones. The kind that requires human sacrifices and mutilating and experimenting on one's body. Yeah, guys like Shikaku doesn't go for that stuff.
    Shikaku doesn't go for that stuff? Or simply he can't? Shikamaru and his father are powerless. Yeah, they just deserves to be an advisor/strategist/tactician.

    And saying that shikamaru is just too lazy to pick up a pencil isn't a good reasoning but rather it's just an excuse. It's pretty obvious that those exam is beyond of shikamaru's knowledge.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    And saying that shikamaru is just too lazy to pick up a pencil isn't a good reasoning but rather it's just an excuse. It's pretty obvious that those exam is beyond of shikamaru's knowledge.
    What is obvious exactly ? Here it was clearly stated that he is too lazy to pick up the pencil and always sleep through exams. Who are we to say he is lying ? Are we just gonna assume that everything we don't like is a lie ?

    Furthermore, it was stated by Kishimoto in the Databook that Shikamaru is smarter than Sakura as he has higher intelligence state than her. With this I suppose no one can say she is smarter than him anymore.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member RandomShikafan's Avatar
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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    Shikaku doesn't go for that stuff? Or simply he can't? Shikamaru and his father are powerless. Yeah, they just deserves to be an advisor/strategist/tactician.
    Shikamaru's on the freaking battlefield isn't he? He's sure as hell doing better then Sakura. And yeah, he doesn't. He's not going to bodyswap with people, cut his body open, experiment on himself until his true form is a giant snake, and so on. Like Tsunade, Shikaku wastes his time of helping other people.

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    Lol don't look too much into it, its a manga where an eye can cheat death or where some cells can let you control a God after all
    Quote Originally Posted by marshall313 View Post
    The manga doesn't have any problem at all. All the things that you said doesn't exist in kishi's manga. You don't need to use the real logic in this manga because this manga itself isn't real.
    Read my post just before the one you quoted. I did say you could just go with "its a manga" and you would be right but its still stupid...

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    Re: Can we all agree to give the props to Sakura?

    Quote Originally Posted by RandomShikafan View Post
    Shikamaru's on the freaking battlefield isn't he? He's sure as hell doing better then Sakura. And yeah, he doesn't. He's not going to bodyswap with people, cut his body open, experiment on himself until his true form is a giant snake, and so on. Like Tsunade, Shikaku wastes his time of helping other people.
    Huh? Let see....

    Shikamaru did a great job to defeat the ginkin brothers. ( well, t'was really ino but watevahh)
    Shikamaru did a very good job on stopping obito's movement even though it's just merely a seconds.

    Now for sakura.

    Sakura may already healed a hundred/s ninjas.
    Sakura is the one who found out about those white zetsus who had yamato's DNA/mokuton to make them stronger. And obito/madara had hashirama's DNA.
    Sakura found out that zetsu had the ability to copy everyone's chakra.

    For me, sakura is more use full than shikamaru in this war.

    He doesn't? Or he can't?

    Shikaku can't bodyswap with people because he doesn't have that ability or talents.
    Shikaku can't experiment himself because he doesn't have the talent or skills or knowledge.
    Shikaku can't create a barrier or a seal or a powerful jutsu because he doesn't have the skills/talent and knowledge.

    So, shikaku is just a tactician/strategist. That's his ability. He's one of the genius and possess one of the highest IQ in the konoha, but his amazing IQ/intelligent is just for strategy and tactics. His brilliant mind can't create a powerful barrier, his brilliant IQ can't create a powerful jutsu, his brilliant and amazing brain can't create a forbidden jutsu. That's the truth about shikaku. He's just a planner and an advisor. Nothing more, nothing less.

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