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Thread: Bleach 519 Discussion

  1. #196
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member hollowdemon's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakuteiken View Post
    If Aizen was going to replace the Soul King, he could well be the next linchpin Urahara was talking about, though.
    I wonder why Urahara didn't trust Aizen for that role.
    Simply because Aizen wouldn't stick to the original plan (whatever it is) that the king made and has all these times, which Urahara seem to be fully aware of what it is as well. If he didn't know, he wouldn't be able to say as much to Aizen before the sealing.

    I'm a bit 50-50 now on the possibilities of who's the actual good and bad folks here ever since the RG introduced themselves...


    *The sad story behind the smile of the mask....*

  2. #197
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Cyber34's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyInversion View Post
    I still think we're gonna see Soul King as the final opponent in BLEACH. It looked almost as if he was sealed within his sleeping chambers. Perhaps his reatsu is that obscene? I think if Urahara's right Soul King is the stabilizing force of the Soul Society, Human realm, and possibly Hueco Mundo.

    If the Quincy kill enough humans it interfere's with the Soul King's duties and worlds will literally collide.

    My problem is why didn't Aizen just wait for visitation rights or a promotion. He seemed to be in good standing as a captain until he faked his death, stabbed Momo, and ran off in spectacular fashion.

    Aizen HAD to know what a longshot his plan was defeating the Gotei 13, Squad 0, and Soul King.

    This implies AIZEN WAS ON A TIMELINE. Something motivated him to risk everything to kill Soul King. Aizen is not usually a reckless character by nature (until he traded sanity for power with the Hougyoku). I hope whatever ended up motivating Aizen to strike is important. I couldn't be more hyped to find out.



    My original theories of why Aizen hates "that thing" the Soul King:

    Soul King is some kind of hollow that ate his little sister alive in front of him.

    Soul King ordered the extermination of the Quincy and little Quincy Aizen died as a child and escaped to become a lonely little sociopath shinigami who hates SS and has a penchant for stylish white clothes.
    Aizen probably did not have the patience to receive visitation rights or a promotion, especially if there is not some known method to attain the rank of a Royal Guard like there is when becoming a Captain of the Gotei 13. Had he shown what he was truly capable of he might have gotten invited, however he placed great importance on keeping his abilities a secret. I believe the reason why he moved so hastily after managing to play Soul Society for fools for over a century was Ichigo being born. He recognized the significance of his birth and waited until Ichigo was old enough to incorporate him into his plans. He thought that by absorbing Ichigo and stealing his power and potential while also being fused with the Hogyoku he would be able to kill the King but as we all know he completely underestimated Ichigo and overestimated himself.

    As for the reason why Aizen hates the King, he is an egomaniac idealist who cannot stand the fact of someone being superior to him or having the potential to be a threat to him. Remember how he acted when he found out Ichigo surpassed him in power, and the little speech he told Ichigo before he found out. He is just the typical run of the mill scum that is infatuated with himself.

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  4. #198
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Hakuteiken's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by hollowdemon View Post
    Simply because Aizen wouldn't stick to the original plan (whatever it is) that the king made and has all these times, which Urahara seem to be fully aware of what it is as well. If he didn't know, he wouldn't be able to say as much to Aizen before the sealing.

    I'm a bit 50-50 now on the possibilities of who's the actual good and bad folks here ever since the RG introduced themselves...
    Makes sense. Urahara certainly seems to be on Soul King's side, because, quite possibly, he believes the king to be good natured. There is nothing indicative about this perception being perfect or flawed, but apparently, Urahara knows what Soul King is doing, as you said.
    He doesn't necessarily have to have met him in person, though.

  5. #199
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member hollowdemon's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakuteiken View Post
    Makes sense. Urahara certainly seems to be on Soul King's side, because, quite possibly, he believes the king to be good natured. There is nothing indicative about this perception being perfect or flawed, but apparently, Urahara knows what Soul King is doing, as you said.
    He doesn't necessarily have to have met him in person, though.

    Good natured only because they're being portrayed as the people helping the protagonist (Ichigo) when he's down, clueless and helpless but overall I'm not quite sure yet until some background past story is revealed. I have a feeling Urahara does know though, not everyone in the gotei 13 knows exactly what the king and RG does and ones that do know are very limited (I'm guessing Kyouraku, Ukitake, Unohana, Byakuya (because of Genrei), Yoruichi and Urahara).
    How come Urahara knows and how did Aizen find out?


    Aizen has been portrayed as an antagonist right off the bat as I mentioned in one of my earlier post, use Vegeta as an example. He wanted to gain eternal life and be stronger than anyone else to prevent the same outcome as his dad and their planet. Fair to say Aizen might have eavesdropped and ended up discovering something that he felt the need to take matters into his own hands by whatever means necessary to prevent from anything worse to happen (yeah yeah I'm fully aware this is the same guy that wanted to destroy KK town and bla bla, but I'm just seeing it from both sides for now).


    Take every detail and try linking it together even if it's hypothetically, Yama might've been offered to be one of the RG yet why isn't he?
    Yama could very well know what the true agenda and objective the King decided on, therefore Yama made his own choice to stay in the Gotei 13 to do things his way.
    I mean, this is the guy who CREATED all 13 divisions and started out as a group of ruthless shinigami's as Juha stated then turning soft maybe because he didn't want to end up the same way as the RG for the King.
    Just look at the guy...a Butterflaizen looking dude but exists for the greater good...? ummm....
    Last edited by hollowdemon; December 07, 2012 at 07:35 AM.


    *The sad story behind the smile of the mask....*

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  7. #200
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Hakuteiken's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by hollowdemon View Post
    Good natured only because they're being portrayed as the people helping the protagonist (Ichigo) when he's down, clueless and helpless but overall I'm not quite sure yet until some background past story is revealed. I have a feeling Urahara does know though, not everyone in the gotei 13 knows exactly what the king and RG does and ones that do know are very limited (I'm guessing Kyouraku, Ukitake, Unohana, Byakuya (because of Genrei), Yoruichi and Urahara).
    How come Urahara knows and how did Aizen find out?


    Aizen has been portrayed as an antagonist right off the bat as I mentioned in one of my earlier post, use Vegeta as an example. He wanted to gain eternal life and be stronger than anyone else to prevent the same outcome as his dad and their planet. Fair to say Aizen might have eavesdropped and ended up discovering something that he felt the need to take matters into his own hands by whatever means necessary to prevent from anything worse to happen (yeah yeah I'm fully aware this is the same guy that wanted to destroy KK town and bla bla, but I'm just seeing it from both sides for now).


    Take every detail and try linking it together even if it's hypothetically, Yama might've been offered to be one of the RG yet why isn't he?
    Yama could very well know what the true agenda and objective the King decided on, therefore Yama made his own choice to stay in the Gotei 13 to do things his way.
    I mean, this is the guy who CREATED all 13 divisions and started out as a group of ruthless shinigami's as Juha stated then turning soft maybe because he didn't want to end up the same way as the RG for the King.
    Just look at the guy...a Butterflaizen looking dude but exists for the greater good...? ummm....
    Urahara copying RG techniques doesn't help the situation, either. Urahara spent a short time as a captain, so, it's not like he could do enough to earn trust. I wonder if it was the king again that summoned him for a purpose.
    Maybe the Hogyoku creation idea came from the king. King wanted it, and then Urahara developed it. The original story is too vague. Urahara creates Hogyoku and then discovers how dangerous it is. Destroying a being's existing borders is dangerous at any case. How come Urahara think of this only after all the research was done?

    And if Aizen wanted to become the king himself, why did he accuse Urahara of not acting? He didn't say a word to Ichigo or Captain-Commander. Clearly, Aizen thinks of Soul King not as highly as some others do, and assumes that only those with great intellect can get a hold of his perception.

    It all comes down to what happened 1,000 years ago. I don't think it was limited to SS and the Quincy. Probably, Royal Guard interfered in this matter or maybe, Squad Zero was assembled after the incident. I don't suppose we will find a clear picture until we get to know what Butterflaizen King does. But yeah, until then, the king looks sort of.. evil.

  8. #201
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner ShadyInversion's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyber34 View Post
    As for the reason why Aizen hates the King, he is an egomaniac idealist who cannot stand the fact of someone being superior to him or having the potential to be a threat to him. Remember how he acted when he found out Ichigo surpassed him in power, and the little speech he told Ichigo before he found out. He is just the typical run of the mill scum that is infatuated with himself.
    Aizen is a lot of things but I don't think typical is one of them. Kubo's danced around his motivation for a long time now and frankly I hope it'll be worth the wait. To me the legitimacy of a bad guy depends mostly on his motivation. If Kubo never reveals anything then you're right that in the end Aizen was a typical megalomaniac but there's opportunity for much more.

    On topic, is it possible Soul King is sealed in that chamber? Does Squad 0 really protect Soul King or do they protect everyone from him? Even if he's not trapped in there, his reatsu might not detectable because his power could be on the Yama, butterfly, Mugetsu level. If so he could go around destroying people with his very presence. Hence why he is isolated behind dimensions, barriers, and physically from the rest of the palace.

  9. #202
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member bleach fan 101's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    I think that Urahara analysed the pool before he was a captain because him and yoruichi trained in the underground cavern and if as some people say he got the 3 day bankai thing from the SP then it show that he went there before being a captain (because he used it himself to get bankai)
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    Unless I grip the sword I cannot protect you, while I’m gripping the sword I cannot embrace you ~ Tite Kubo

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  11. #203
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyInversion View Post
    Aizen is a lot of things but I don't think typical is one of them. Kubo's danced around his motivation for a long time now and frankly I hope it'll be worth the wait. To me the legitimacy of a bad guy depends mostly on his motivation. If Kubo never reveals anything then you're right that in the end Aizen was a typical megalomaniac but there's opportunity for much more.
    Well, after Aizen was sealed away, it was hinted that his whole thing was loneliness. Actually, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but in the last databook I think Kubo explicitly said that he wanted to become the new god of the world partly to achieve recognition and understanding from everybody else. I can't say I'm fond of that notion - Aizen was the last guy who needed to be made sympathetic. But ignoring that, when he first met Baraggan he asked - "Don't you feel the world isn't as it should be?" or something to that effect. I guess he had a certain dissatisfaction with the world and set out to change it. "The victor must think only of how the world should be!" and all that. But still, he wasn't out to make things better for anyone else, imo. It was for his own personal satisfaction. He was a selfish sociopath, and I kind of like it that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyInversion View Post
    On topic, is it possible Soul King is sealed in that chamber? Does Squad 0 really protect Soul King or do they protect everyone from him? Even if he's not trapped in there, his reatsu might not detectable because his power could be on the Yama, butterfly, Mugetsu level. If so he could go around destroying people with his very presence. Hence why he is isolated behind dimensions, barriers, and physically from the rest of the palace.
    Yeah, the Soul King seems to be suspended in some type of giant gem. I wonder what that means, if anything. Like you say, is it about his protection or everybody else's? Or maybe it's just his 'replenishing chamber' or something like that. He's said to be the "lynchpin" holding the world together, maybe the gem is his link to the world. Or maybe it's there to preserve him - after all, if he dies the whole world apparently collapses.

    Regarding his strength though, he may well be in Butterflaizen realms of power, or even higher. But I actually suspect his powers don't work that way. I think it's possible he doesn't actually possess any offensive power at all, and his abilities all lie in controlling the world around him. So he can bestow powers to others, like the power of Ouken he gives to the Royal Guard, and he sets the rules that keep the spiritual side of the world in order, but he doesn't have reiatsu or anything like that.

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  13. #204
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyber34 View Post
    As for the reason why Aizen hates the King, he is an egomaniac idealist who cannot stand the fact of someone being superior to him or having the potential to be a threat to him. Remember how he acted when he found out Ichigo surpassed him in power, and the little speech he told Ichigo before he found out. He is just the typical run of the mill scum that is infatuated with himself.
    Aizen doesn't like how the world is so he wanted to change it. There's something obviously wrong with that thing that calls itself God. He isn't evil, he's an extremist. And no, he's not typical at all. He's an unusual type of villain.
    This might come in handy. Maybe one in more analysis to come:

    The Thousand Year Blood War buildup and recap:
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...=1#post3091160

  14. #205
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner ShadyInversion's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    I think Kubo's left us a hint of Soul King's possibly obscene power potential: Squad 0 said Soul king basically gives them the key and it becomes a part of their bones. In order to make a key Aizen had to use some technique to fuse 100,000 souls and spirit enriched land to either create a separate Squad 0 level lifeform or make himself into one.

    The Question: How strong do you have to be to be able to bestow a gift on someone that requires that much power and sacrifice? How much of a drain does it place on Soul King? Can he just wave his hand and make anyone a Squad 0 member or is 5 or 6 (counting Yama's) the maximum number? How much reiatsu = 100,000 random souls and all that spirit land?

    In terms of power is Soul King > 100,000 souls and mass spirit land?

    Do the 100,000 souls presumably human pluses all have very little power or do they have potential power. If somebody died in KT could they possibly become a Captain class shinigami upon realizing their innate potential?

  15. #206
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member cracker's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    If he's that damn powerful, why the hell does he even need RG -___-

    He should be like this
    http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/483/3

    It's likely more complicated than simply just power...I hope it's not some endearing quirk lol

  16. #207
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Yeah,I too doubt the SK has any offensive power by itself.Taking into consideration Urahara's words that the SK is a lynch-pin holding everything together and Aizen's conception that the SK is evil,I think Urahara deemed the SK as a "necessary evil",knowing that killing/destroying it would mean the end of every world.

    I wonder how Aizen/Urahara actually got in the Royal Palace in the first place.Since we know that they needed to be with one of the Royal Guards,I would say Aizen made his way with KS...but Urahara,that I do not know.

    The way the SK is just giving me a Hollowish-vibe,he looks alike to the Butterfly-Aizen version,that's the first thing that ran through my head when I first saw him.I wonder how the Royal Guards have got information on Ichigo and everything that is going on though.My theory would be that Urahara is feeding information to the Royal Guards regarding various things and in exchange he's allowed to visit the palace,though tbh I doubt this is the case.

    Meh,I still can't answer the question regarding Yama-jii's words that the location of the Ouken is being passed verbally from one CC to another.In hope that Kubo didn't screw with that,I think what Yama-jii meant was that when one CC would retire and another take his place,the older CC would take him to the Royal Palace where the SK would imbue the new CC with Ouken...this whole stuff with the bodies being the key itself is rather weird.I mean,the bald guy said that Aizen was trying to create a Royal Guard basically,but from what we know,RG are actually Shinigami's promoted from captains,so I don't see how Aizen intended to create life from nothingness.

  17. #208
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member bleach fan 101's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    my interpretation of the "our bodies are the key" is basically our bodies are the container that the key is in, maybe when he said "the key is in our bones" he meant it literally like the key is like/replaces marrow or that it is in all shinigami and they need to get it awakened.
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    Unless I grip the sword I cannot protect you, while I’m gripping the sword I cannot embrace you ~ Tite Kubo

  18. #209
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Cyber34's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Torran View Post
    Aizen doesn't like how the world is so he wanted to change it. There's something obviously wrong with that thing that calls itself God. He isn't evil, he's an extremist. And no, he's not typical at all. He's an unusual type of villain.
    It's a matter of opinion, whether the Soul King is a bastard or not based upon his actions Aizen has an inflated ego to me. He is just a more sophisticated version of Vegeta in my opinion, which is why I refer to him as typical.
    Last edited by Cyber34; December 07, 2012 at 04:47 PM.

  19. #210
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    Re: Bleach 519 Discussion / 520 Predictions

    So five cities huh? ....I'm guessing a lot of high nobility live up there not surprised why would the King of Souls live alone

    ---------- Post added at 06:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:43 PM ----------

    Also, how the hell did Urahara get inside the Royal Palace? When did he have unlimited access to analyze that guy's pool over and over again....
    My comic suggestions: Ecchi, Martial Arts, Historical, Harem, Adventure!

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