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Thread: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Teeba's Avatar
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    Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Spoiler Thread

    Chapter's OUT! Hahahaha! And it's so random! XDDD

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Everything completely unexpected.

    RomCom chief (nice nickname) with demoniac power again... it can't be Koma, right? I mean, Koma is supposed to be helping Kunieda.

    Se entendeu essa frase, entre nessa bagaça

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Somehow I am starting to be disappointed in Kunieda. I mean her "love" for Oga seems to be nothing more than just small crush.

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Teeba's Avatar
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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by solomon585858 View Post
    Somehow I am starting to be disappointed in Kunieda. I mean her "love" for Oga seems to be nothing more than just small crush.
    I've always thought of it as being a crush. Being in love is a tad too strong of an emotion for Beelzebub to handle. I mean, yes, Kunieda's feelings for Oga have changed her, but even then I'd say its always been a bit self-centered. Not that Kunieda is a self-centered person. How can I put it...Kunieda having a crush on Oga develops her character in a way being in love with Oga wouldn't be able to do. I also think its more realistic this way and provides the right amount of humor for the storyline.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member thatguy3331's Avatar
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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Teeba View Post
    I've always thought of it as being a crush. Being in love is a tad too strong of an emotion for Beelzebub to handle. I mean, yes, Kunieda's feelings for Oga have changed her, but even then I'd say its always been a bit self-centered. Not that Kunieda is a self-centered person. How can I put it...Kunieda having a crush on Oga develops her character in a way being in love with Oga wouldn't be able to do. I also think its more realistic this way and provides the right amount of humor for the storyline.
    I agree, I thought it was obvious i was a small crush that may have turned into something else over time, as well as what I've said multiple times; no matter what other sorts of issues beelzebub tackles, Humor s first. This development(wether I personally like it or not due to covert shipper rage) is a good one.

    I really enjoyed this chapter, I don't care what the committee says They ran out of material! XD anything else is covering for their ass!

    I'm bittersweet on aiba coming back but at the very least ryuhei can finally give these guys the even fight they need, and I wasn't disappointed by kuneida either, This will surely be short but awesome as well!

    XD way to go beel, we couldn't have continued this without you!
    for anyone who likes my HxH mots, find em all here! and here too! My blog


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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Ahahahahahaha, Paako and Kanzaki are funny and cute at the same time. XD
    By the way I really liked this chapter and the return of Aiba was nice (as well as his tchnique).
    Now we will see a good match between the two "couples".

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    I'm sorry but I couldn't resist.

    Spoiler show
    for anyone who likes my HxH mots, find em all here! and here too! My blog


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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    I like Beelzebub but I think that the pace is not that good. Ratio between "Filler chapters", "story chapters" & "fighting chapters" is just not good. Yes, it's funny but the current arc seems to me like a complete filler arc.

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by zelllogan View Post
    I like Beelzebub but I think that the pace is not that good. Ratio between "Filler chapters", "story chapters" & "fighting chapters" is just not good. Yes, it's funny but the current arc seems to me like a complete filler arc.
    While I can't quite say it feels like filler myself due to subtle things here and there and aiba showing up, I myself can't disagree that even I feel like this from time to time. Not that I didn't like the previous arcs, I enjoyed the feild trip arc for what it was, beels car and the amusment park mini arc were both awesome and of course I don't think I need to say anything about Furuichi's time arc. while it isn't my favorite persay the demon painting arc appears to be extreamly important so you couldn't call that filler, but for this arc, while it is indeed funny and has subtle touches that could be used for the future, this arc seems to be moving the slowest of them all with no real momentum that I'm used to with this series.

    As far as important things I think should be kept of note:
    -The fact Satome, at the very begining of this arc mentioned that the Isyhama students will have to leave soon for real that time.

    Considering the previous arc I truley belive this to be important, despite the fact that I feel the series could work the episodic feel, time is in fact moving and some characters should be going through a major change, so I don't find it that hard to at least speculate that something is comming around the corner really soon.

    -Aiba showing up and stronger than before.

    All jokes to how many parrallels I'm begining to notice from here to togashi's works, as I mentioned with the possible major change Aiba my be infact crucial towards that movement (wether I like it or not). Lets be real here, we KNEW Aiba was comming back he had too much of an impact to be tossed aside under a bus (plus I want more Bichyo and futaba squabbles) especially towards Aoi who is begining to essert herself with her feelings with Oga more. No, I don't think beelzebub will suddenly turn into a romance but I do belive that we may lightly touch some ground with it (with a toothpick) and this could very easily go over and avalanche itself into a completely different mess Oga will have to punch through.

    -Hilda, Hilda, Hilda...

    At this point the amnesia/'super moe time' to me seems to only be a plot device made to get Hilda into this situation long enough to stay involved even when she turned back (I like to tell myself Oga will still have to go to demon world though XD) When Oga had to suffer an endurance match it we could acctually see Hilda appearing to care about what Oga was going through. I will say no this isn't exclusive to this mini arc, it was sprinkled around all over the place since the end of the demon high/jabberwock arc but I personally thought it was a nice touch.

    If I could make a ratio I'd say about 15.6% of this arc is foreshawdowing and such while the other 84.4% of it is pretty much rom-com shenanigans.

    thats merely by take on it, I'd wait for kendama to make his usually fancy posts
    for anyone who likes my HxH mots, find em all here! and here too! My blog


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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    I miss Furuichi and Nene.

    Also, I normally love how randomly Beelzebub does these sort of arcs; where it skip parts that you thought were going to be more drawn out. But I didn't like it this time because it went from a couples contest to a battle tournament. And I was enjoying the "couples contest" part a lot more.

    And now bringing Aiba into it is just...it's made it less "fun" for me, I guess.
    Jammin's Recommended Reading
    The Gamer [Esp. for Everybody]
    I Don't Want This Kind of Hero [Esp. for Superhero/Comedy fans]
    Girls of the Wild's [Esp. for Romance/Martial Arts fans.]
    Ultimate Legend: Kang Hae Hyo [Esp. for Delinquent/Comedy fans]
    Otogi Taisen Fantasma [Esp. for Harem Fans]

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    I completely agree with you about this part, because I think the first half of this chapter is much better than the second half.

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    yeah, I didn't like having head-on battle for the final match, but I strongly believe it will serve a point. I would have liked something more "original", though, as I usually expect from Beelzebub!

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    but im kinda disapointed in this chapter... becouse it shows that kunieda is ok with everyone at her side.... I mean if she wins she and aiba will get the title "best couple" and I doubt it will help her anyhow with her crush on oga... and this will backfire on her... since Aiba will be more persistant and selfish constantly using this title.... and spread rumours that he and aoi are a real couple.... so kunieda is kinda digging her own grave right now.... why does she want to win this much...to prevent oga and hilda getting the title ?

    where is the Aoi that was worried for Hilda who took the spear blow for her sake... aoi knows the story between oga and hilda with beel....yet she doesnt have the currage to say streight to oga about her feelings... or at least stop lieing about the cousin thing (becouse she is worried that oga will hate her for lieing).... I guess if aoi said the truth that this girl with who he was all those times is in reality herself..... maybe oga would realize that aoi is really a normal and nice person compared to hilda ;]


    well oga mostly felt the punch becouse of the earlier fight with toujo... as aiba hit him in the same place.... maybe next time aoi realizes that oga might get really hurt becouse of that previous wound... she will kinda save oga by jumping streight in front of that punch before it connects with oga and take it on herself... which would be a good move since oga would take a notice of Aoi more... and show her some carring side just like he did with hilda some time before...


    still bringing Aiba to the finals for me it was a bad move as it shows how aoi doesnt care for her reputation and is jut like oga says Random if only she gets what she wants...

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    Re: Beelzebub Chapter 185 Discussion/186 Predictions

    @zellogan:

    Well, I don't know the criteria for "fancy", so I hope thatguy3331 will excuse me if this falls short of the standards.

    In the case of Beelzebub, my view is that the lines between what is "filler" and what is "plot-oriented" have always been blurry. The reason being that Tamura-sensei has managed to accomplish something with little parallel or precedent.

    He managed to create a series in which everyone agrees there is a plot, but we don't know yet what the plot is. And what is more, we accept that (at least most fans do).

    Because you know, a plot can be defined as "the series of events that takes the main character from a departure point to a destination point in the story time".

    So, there are, broadly speaking, three types of series:

    (i) linear series, in which the plot becomes quickly self-contained and imposes constraints on which events are credible. The main character is normally on a specific mission, or working against an evil agenda, so events progress always towards some resolution. Fullmetal alchemist is a great example. Death Note, also follows the pattern, with the only difference that it is the other characters who are working against the protagonist. These series tend to be limited in the number of chapters, because it soon becomes easy to recognise what is filler because it doesn't contribute to the advancement of the plot.

    (ii) modular series, in which there are no specific route to reach the destination, and thus new steps in the main character's progression can be added by the author without causing damage to continuity. These series tend to be quests or adventures: because the only goal is to find something which can be anywhere, one can always add a new place to visit, or a new detour to take, and the plot is not harmed because it is just that flexible. One Piece is the prime example of this, I am told: nothing can really be considered filler in this kind of series, because readers accept from the beginning that in a search for something, new story modules can be added at will.

    (iii) episodic series, in which there is no plot because time and characters are rebooted after every individual episode and are always departing from a same point towards a different destination. Circumstances change quite a lot between episodes and there is no continuity thread uniting them. These can go on forever, for as long as the mangaka's creativity and physical existence last. Kochikame, Golgo 13, Gintama and Sket Dance are examples of this.

    This can be better understood if one recalls the dialogue between Alice and the Cheshire Cat in Alice in Wonderland. She asks him which way she should take, he answers that it depends on what her destination is; she replies she doesn't have a definite destination, and so the Cat says any way works; she retorts that it only works if it takes you somewhere, to which he points out any way takes one somewhere if only one keeps going forward.

    So where does this leave Beelzebub?

    Well, this series is a curious case. It is not episodic, because the arcs are linked and characters advance in time. It is not modular, because the characters are not in a quest and there are real constraints on what is acceptable (zombies, ETs, time travel would be out of sync, for example).

    So this leaves linear and linear it is, but there is a catch: we don't know what the destination is.

    The key to undestanding this is to realise that the main character, Oga, doesn't have a goal (other than surviving). He has a vague notion that he must raise Beel not to destroy the human world, but to become a good successor to his father. But these are so far off in time that he doesn't need to do anything about them right now. So he spends most of his time warding off demon attackers. But when there are no attackers, then what? Well, he just lives on, and living on can be hardly called a plot.

    So we always keep talking of the plot in this series, but can we really tell what is plot-centered and what is filler?

    How can one tell which arc contributes to the advancement of the plot if we don't know what the destination of the plot is?

    What makes the Saint Ishiyama Arc more important for the story than the Christmas Arc? Right now, can we tell which one of them brings Oga closer to the fulfillment of his goals, when we don't know what these goals are yet?

    Of course, we suspect that the Saint Ishiyama Arc is more important because it reveals aspects of demon power, introduces characters presumed to be important and sets the stage for Lord En's arrival in the next arc. In Beelzebub, about the only clue to the importance of an arc is how it contributes to character development and to the development of alliances between characters.

    So, what is filler in this series?

    Well, although I have been calling the current arc filler, rigorously speaking this is not a given. For all we know, the Akumano arc was just as much filler, because we don't know what contributes to the plot and what doesn't. This is a clever trick on the part of Tamura-sensei: by not worrying too much about telling us what the destination is, he can avoid the pitfalls of episodic (e.g., lack of character development) and modular (e.g., the need for a wide universe for adventures to take place, as well as a horde of side characters one can hardly keep track of) stories, without getting too constrained in what he can do with his characters.

    That's why I just enjoy the ride for now. Unless the author does something that makes the characters inconsistent, pretty much anything is acceptable. Anything can be considered filler, and anything can contribute to the plot - whatever the plot is. We will only find out what was important later. thatguy3331 has given us examples of developments we suspect to be important in almost all arcs.

    This is not meant to convince you of anything. Ultimately, it is your personal taste that dictates your appraisal of this series (by the way, I've been recommending my recent addiction, Shingeki no kyojin, to anyone who wants a tight plot; why bother to follow Beelzebub if its defining feature annoys you?). But complaining about a filler-to-plot ratio in Beelzebub is devoid of meaning.

    Wow, it has been a long time since I last wrote such an essay…

    P.S.: After I had finished this, I realised there is a genre of manga in which there is a plot without a clear destination. It is the so-called "slice of life" genre. Its characters are not in quests, nor hoping to achieve something of major consequence to the world as we know it. The enjoyment comes from reading about their routine life. What is interesting about Beelzebub - and I know of no other series like it in this respect - is that it uses the a plot structure similar - but not equal - to a slice-of-life manga but is an action comedy. The routine is there, but it is insane. The final result is good, in my opinion, especially because the author is very good at adding hilarity to mundane situations.
    Last edited by kendama; December 14, 2012 at 07:10 AM. Reason: Adding a piece of information

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