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Translations: Bleach 595 (2)
Massive Spoilers Below!! Read at your own peril!
Last edited by En Yang Ji; January 17, 2013 at 04:35 PM.
As far as I remember, the Ouken and the Hougyoku are not the same thing.
The first allow to enter in the Spirit palace dimension and the latter litteraly grant wishes.
In any case it was Aizen who sacrificed people to create the Hougyoku, while Urahara used a different method.
In little words I don't think that he is evil in any way and his relation with the Spirit King is still unclear, so we will have to wait in order to give a proper judgement.
Last edited by Zasz; December 09, 2012 at 03:05 PM.
No they're not the same, they have different purposes...
As for the process of the creation of Hogyoku, it is still a bit unclear... Aizen said that in order to complete the Hogyoku, he sacrificed a lot of souls who bore Shinigami talents, yet it wasn't satisfied... Now, what Aizen said here only apply to the completion of the Hogyoku, not the " creation " of it, maybe to create it you need a different process (be it worse than sacrifying people)
But, Urahara's Hogyoku wasn't complete either, according to Aizen too, hence why he decided to stole to present it to his own Hogyoku (makes me wonder if Urahara is aware of the fact that Aizen create his own Hogyoku way before him)
But yeah... Urahara is still a shady guy, Kubo never showed as being totally " good ", heck there's no character (except for the main character and his friends) that are good, I think nearly all of them are more like " grey ", not bad and not good either
You must remember ...INOUE TOO ! Toshiro and Inoue should just hook up,lol!Originally Posted by Sanadan
But seriously...we don't know how one creates a Hogyoku,and what truly is strange is that they are sentient beings lol.If it needs to be fed souls,I wonder what is required for it's creation.Probably must be something nasty,and Urahara falls in the shadows yet again.
Urahara is not as bad as Aizen.At least,he wasn't shown to be,but he is a helluva shady guy...
Anyway, regardless, there is an ongoing discussion about the theories on final villain and if it could be Urahara or not. You may all check that thread if you still didn't;
If the orb could be used as a royal key then aizen wouldn't have needed to make a royal key to enter the palace, he would have only needed the orb. It seems there are a few comparable points. The orb was made from the fusion of the prototypes of aizen and urahara and it seems aizen also fed the orb a huge number of souls. To make the key aizen needed power in karakura town along with the souls of 100000 people. I don't think the similarties go beyond that, in terms of purpose the orb and key differ radically. I guess the royal key can be said to be sentient too if the royals are actually the key.
I do wonder if actually transforming into a royal key has a direct effect on the royals. If the royals and aizen's key are similar then the royals are basically infused with a huge number of souls (which could come from the flow of souls between world or are created by the king) so perhaps that would result in a change in the power the royals have to some degree.
Vicious (Cowboy Bebop)
Magneto (Xmen) etc...etc
As it concerns this thread, if the soul jewel needs to fed souls what was used in it's creation? And if it's humans I don't know if I'd be surprise that Urahara went down that road. We hardly know anything about him and Kubo loves his twist soooo...
cracker: Let me add Gin (Gintama)
But there's hardly such a thing as "bad" in Bleach.
As far as the manga told us the orb was exactly what it was supposed to be though. I would think that the royals being fused with orbs would cause a few weird plot points. Any one of them could at random turn into something like what aizen was which is weird enough as it is. Not to mention that it was never said the orb was something actually necessary to make the keys.
no way is urahara anywhere evil... to compare him to aizen is just short sighted.
Urahara is more akin to Yoda, or like Obiwan,,,, the older version,, not the younger version.
He cares about his friends, he has shown proper judgement, loyalty to SS, loyalty to the king,,,, he has gone out of his way to try and save those that were hollowfied by Aizen,,, and his research is for the most part... ethical... now if we compare him to mayuri then I think it becomes even more clear that he does not wish to overtly do harm by his actions....
Also, he offers a choice to those he helps and mentions the risk... it may be a crappy choice,, but at least it is one.
There is no need to go that much off topic and start spamming.
Urahara evil? No way in hell, do you want the plot to turn into total shit with two mighty, scientific and at first good characters to change sides? The idea that he would repeat that pattern is disturbing, to me it would be the death of creativity.
PS: Where are the spoilers? That's just an assumption and a wrong one at that. If anything the Hogyokou and the SK are similar, but not the key itself.
Honestly though why would Urahara being the main villain be absurd or of the table? It would be the twistiest twist of all, M. Night Shyamalan style but kind of after it was all so obvious everyone figured it out.
It doesn't have to be the death of creativity though, what matters is how it is handled. Take the recent Naruto "Twist". Very predictable, that was ok though, the problem was how it was done, very disappointing and suddenly something that was very predictable and believable became more and more unbelievable.
Urahara needs a good motive for this, also this twist would have had to be planned for a long time for us to tie the bits and pieces together.
Anyho, I have not been able to drop the possibility of Urahara being the main baddie since I saw it in the thread posted by Hakuteiken.
One thing that I find strange is, why is Urahara meeting with Karin? Unless he's doing it for Isshin's sake. What does he gain from that?
They must be pretty tight, and it'd be nice to find out why.
Urahara as a bad guy could work, the guy obviously has a shady side to him...but in a way, it would be awkward and a little Obito-style. It'd feel like kind of a retcon.
Ukitake was also presented in a shady light in the FB arc, Kenpachi is insane, Mayuri is both shady and insane.
So with this logic, anyone that's kinda in the grey-zone is a potential villain.
Last edited by Notak; December 11, 2012 at 05:54 AM.