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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
The reason I'm making such a big deal about this is because recently i've discoverred two key things that i've taken for granted in this manga. #1 would be how specific the dialogue can be (learned this in chapters 213 and 217) and #2 would be Hoshino's reliance on pictographic communication of certain details that are difficult to express in words or would sound contrived and slightly stupid if expressed in words if you see where i'm going with this. I've noticed that in most action adventure series, mangakas rely alot on words to bring across most of their info and that explains why they are so many word bubbles in most action/adventure series in contrast to D gray man. For example if you read any of the battle shonen/seinen where fighting and powers/special abilities are high stress factors mangaka often use speach bubbles to describe certain things, like a really trippy and complex power/ability. I often find myself laughing at how stupid it looks for two guys to be trying to kill each other through a strategic battle and yet they feel so obliged to give their enemy a detailed description of what they can do which alternatively reveals their weakness. I think Hoshino has done this also in the Noah's ark arc, but given the nature of how broad and almost limitless the powers are in d gray man, the descriptions are usually much shorter and the powers are almost UN-thwartable from a strategic point of view. But lets not go too astray here...
The point i'm trying to make is that i'm starting to understand why some people are confused with even the most simplistic of chapters. And no its not just about the inconsistent release dates and bad translations, but I think it has to do with #1 lack of attention to detail on the part of the readers even in the dialogue and #2 pictographic communication is very open to misinterpretation. Now don't get me wrong, I actually enjoy these aspects because I hate to be "spoonfead" plus I like reading mangas that have a tasteful balance between pictures and words, where one isn't suffocating the other. To me it allows the manga to feel more cinematic so I can feel like i'm watching a show instead of reading words and I guess i'm just curious if anyone else feels the same way...
Last edited by capricorn; December 31, 2012 at 03:24 PM.
@Capricorn: Very much agree with you there. Every time I reread any DGM chapter, I always notice visual details that I hadn't before that have had a bearing on the plot. It's the same with the dialogue too. Oftentimes I come across a sentence that sounds kind of out of place and chalk it up to awkward translation, only to find out later that it hinted at the whole next turn of events. The amount of foreshadowing in the manga is insane, you just have to look very carefully for it. I get every new chapter only to realize I've missed so much in the previous ones.
And then we have so much contention over the most simple of points. We can't even decide amongst ourselves whether Road is holding Mana or his mother. But even though some say that Hoshino's style is too ambiguous, she does leave us a whole lot of visual cues. In that particular picture, Mana is wearing the same style of pajamas as he did as a little boy in Chapter 214. And I'm pretty sure that what some people are thinking is an extremely girly puffed sleeve in the second to last panel is actually just the pillow. xD It's clearer if you look at him from behind in the next panel. And he's got the same awkward half-sticking-up-half-lying-flat side bangs as he always had. It's just like how so many of us thought Mana was Tyki in 212 even though he was missing the mole and the bangs were all wrong.
Welp, off to scour the entire series over again for clues.
Just dropping by to tell you that I just got up-to-date with D.Gray Man, and that I love it!
I can't wait to read your theories and to share mines with you!
I think that when the earl was screaming "who are you" he was aiming it at Johnny, and when he starts going on about him being Mana, it is still aimed at Johnny. I think that simply because it flicks from a scene where Mana is cradling Nea to a very similar scene of Johnny holding Allen. Perhaps the Earl is seeing the the scene in the alley as Allen and Johnny being Nea and Mana. Ya know, because he has gone craaaaaaazy! http://www.mangareader.net/dgray-man/218/12 and http://www.mangareader.net/dgray-man/218/13
^That is what I thought as well though I imagine the earl to be more jealous like one of those control freaks. It seems like he's upset that another person was interfering and Allen/Nea was acknowledging Johnny but not him.
^ Agreed, that flashback was made to be similar between the Allan and Johnny/Mana and Nea hapenings. I just wonder who the Earl is. Kinda looks similar to the older Mana, a relation to their family (Walker of Campbell who the heck knows haha) perhaps
i think the one we see at the end of the chapter is 14th since in this page in the first panel we see Nea's face and this panel shows that Nea is taking over Allen's consciousness.what i think about the flashback is that it was something in Earl's mind that Allen and Nea were seeing and the part about Nea's mother's death was something that happened after Nea's death that's why he was sad and surprised after seeing that flashback because he didn't know what had happened to Mana and his mother.by the way in recent chapters don't you think that Allen's left eye isn't reacting to Akumas around him? even in the Alma Arc it just showed Alma's soul around the end of the arc.
Last edited by mahsanaru; January 02, 2013 at 07:46 AM.
The Earl was definitely saying "who are you?" to Mana. And at the end, when he says "you're Mana," he's talking to the hallucination of Mana that he saw previously (there's no plot twist that Allen is secretly Mana, unfortunately).
I'm surprised Allen didn't react to the fact that he could see the Earl's real face. Maybe next chapter. I've been imagining this moment since the Earl's real face was revealed, and I always imagined Allen looking at the Earl with a horrified expression while saying "Mana!?", end of chapter
It's also likely that it was Nea at the end of the chapter, so Allen would not have seen the Earl's face, I guess. But Johnny definitely saw it.
Last edited by Jaymie; January 02, 2013 at 07:57 AM.
His eye didn't react to akuma at some points in the Alma arc because the Millenium Earl set up a magical barrier that prevented Allen from using his cursed eye and the white noah ark ability. He first used the same barrier in the sub arc where we were introduced to Timothy. The only reason that Allen was able to use his akuma eye eventually was because of the 14th awakening that alternatively caused Timcampy to go Godzilla mode to destroy the barrier. That's how Allen was able to see the soal trapped in Alma Karma.
... Not sure if the Earl wants to kill Nea, or if he just wants to give him a good ol' hug.
Omg, Bloomerwedgies, you made the whole week! The best way to step into a new year ever! xD Thank you
SO! There are so many interesting theories here about everything! I can't really come up with any theories myself at the moment.. but I'd like to add that at least it looks like the "Mana" that Allen cursed was the "Mana D. Campbell"-Mana:
Told ya there was something more about that "D" But - I have no theories about this at all at the moment
The syncro-thing between Allen and the Earl could be related to many things... that they're both Noah, that Nea wants to take the Earl's place,
that they're twins! 83.. maybe even some supercrazy twist that they're actually the same person
Though it reminded me of the panels when Earl noticed Allen was in trouble, and even when Road saw Allen as the Earl lol
And it seems like the Earl had some kind of Vendetta against Mana? My take on the scene where Mana is looking back going "please stop already..." is that it's when Nea is finally killed... I don't think that the flashbacks are in chonological order.. I'll have to come back to this in a smaller post...
I'm totally hooked again though!
Just to start off, I wanted to share an insight sonnenkoenigen shared in a post on Tumblr, that DGM is probably following a kishotenketsu plot structure, which I think sounds like it fits the bill and fuels my desire to hold off on theorizing for fear of really big twists, but I have to say I'm absolutely floored by KitforKat's theory! @___@ I'll be cheering for that one when chapters come out! @3@
I was unsure of if I thought the old man was Bookman or Sirius/Cyrus, but now I'm leaning towards Bookman. The tipping point for me was goldenfreezeover's post. o3o
I just can't deny that the earring and nose match him perfectly. ;v; Look at those luscious locks, though! >v>
So many fragments of exposition, ahhHH, what a great way to end the year! And another chapter next month, too, I just can't wait. ;~; The more and more Hoshino keeps Johnny up and close to Allen, the more I get that niggling thought in the back of my head that either he's the Heart or he's going to die
@practically: Thanks a lot for the compliment! ^___^ I'm just shooting off some possible explanations as to how the whole thing might have gone down.
After making that image, I might now be leaning toward him being Bookman...
Last edited by KitforKat; January 02, 2013 at 07:37 PM.
Here is my opinion about everything so far:
-The older gentleman is Bookman
-The person standing over "Mana", and Road is Neah (He might blame the death of his mother on Mana)
-Before the Earl killed "Neah", Neah, and Mana had switched places, so Mana was actually killed by the Earl rather than Neah. Neah was able to transfer his "Noah Memory" to young Allen 35 years later (or perhaps his consciousness had been put to sleep for 35 years by Apo, and when Allen needed him, Apo woke Neah into a reality 35 years later). From when he had met Allen to the time that he had died, he had taken the identity of Mana Walker (probably as a spin-off from his deceased brother's name)
-Bookman will probably start talking about the 14th soon (Because he cannot afford to find a successor to replace Lavi)
-"Allen" was actually Allen at the end if the chapter, and he just happens to have some sort of ability to see people's memories (this has been seen before with Suman Dark, and Apo... Perhaps this is a hidden ability of his innocence?)
-Allen has not really seen the Millinium Earl's true face (have we actually seen Mana's real face either though?)
All of these theories could probably be classified as crack though...
Last edited by Kaite1211; January 10, 2013 at 09:41 PM.