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Thread: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

  1. #16
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    @M3J


    Diference is all the people you listed had 2 eyes. Obito is stuck with 1. We don't know what the limitations are there. Take Susano for instance, no 2 eyes and no Susano.
    Now about his Pein... Did you see them using ANY rinnegan jutsus? He was just controling them like PUPPETS and making them use JIN moves. No rinnegan moves at all.

    Again to the points its confirmed... We do have some insinuations about Tobi using some rinnegan power but why did he never used some? Perhaps its because of the GM statue but that is asuming to. Not even with his bijus. It was also claimed by Kakashi that when controling the Peins he was not pulling them as he needed the eye power for control. Thing is we need to see him do SOMETHING before claiming he can. How about Madara? Are we to asume he can ST, CT and so on but he decides not to just because?

    Take Naruto, he can do Rasengan, Minato can do rasengan are we to expect Minato to do FRS(ignoring the lore)? Hell he has all the requirements but he can't as he does not know how. Nagato for all we know had to learn those.

  2. #17
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Nothing indicates that he needs both Rinnegan to use any power, especially when he was able to use six paths. Tobi himself confirms that the reason why he didn't have any of his paths use any Rinnegan jutsu was because it'd waste his chakra since Naruto, Kakashi, and Gai had counters thanks to Nagato, since it took up a lot of chakra just to control the jinchuuriki paths. Kakashi made this guess, and Tobi verified it. So yeah, Tobi's path not using Rinnegan jutsu is irrelevant as it was out of choice as far as we know. Maybe that's why Tobi didn't use any of Rinnegan's jutsu, especially when he kept being caught off guard. Madara saw FRS coming so he could get his chakra absorption field up in time, but nearly all attack Tobi took, it was out of nowhere.

    Considering Kakashi himself states that Minato was unable to complete rasengan, and we don't know his affinity, then no, we can't expect Minato to do FRS. Considering we saw Tobi and Madara use at least one Rinnegan jutsu that Nagato himself used, who isn't even the original owner of the eyes, as well as hinting to know other Rinnegan jutsu, we can assume either can use any Rinnegan jutsu. Especially when Tobi admitted that he didn't want to waste chakra using Rinnegan jutsu that could be countered.

    And yes, we are to assume that, considering he used chakra absorption twice when he had plenty of chances to do so. And the fact that he didn't bring out perfect Susano'o at the start or at all against Naruto, Kakashi, and Gai.

    Nagato may have, but he was still able to use it. There's really no reason why Tobi can't use any Rinnegan jutsu we've seen in this fight. Didn't we wonder about Nagato being able to use Asura? He was still able to use its power.

  3. #18
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    @M3J

    So Tobi decided to eat a Amaterasu to the face then activating his shield? Ok then. He is such a big moron he is not going to use it because he is that big of a moron. Madara stoped a attack from his behind. Its not about timing. Even mind wiped Nagato could absorb a Amaterasu formed in his face but Tobi noticing Naruto charging at him with a rasengan and going OO shit did not had the time to do that.

    Quote Quote:
    Considering Kakashi himself states that Minato was unable to complete rasengan, and we don't know his affinity, then no, we can't expect Minato to do FRS. Considering we saw Tobi and Madara use at least one Rinnegan jutsu that Nagato himself used, who isn't even the original owner of the eyes, as well as hinting to know other Rinnegan jutsu, we can assume either can use any Rinnegan jutsu. Especially when Tobi admitted that he didn't want to waste chakra using Rinnegan jutsu that could be countered.
    Try reading what i post. I said aside from the lore, what it was said in the manga. Asume we don't know Minato was unabel to finish it and just know he has rasengan, do we asume he also has FRS because he has rasengan?

    Tobi never used a rinnegan tech even when it would be a life saver but you whant to asume he can pop them. Belive what you whant. Gues he is as stupid as people belive him to be. He prefers to pop wood element then st people away... How about BT and then warping the target? Nop why would he do that. No sense in winning.

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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Quote:
    Even mind wiped Nagato could absorb a Amaterasu formed in his face but Tobi noticing Naruto charging at him with a
    Nagato didn't absorb Amaterasu,he ST it.
    Quote Quote:
    Tobi never used a rinnegan tech even when it would be a life saver but you whant to asume he can pop them. Belive what you whant. Gues he is as stupid as people belive him to be. He prefers to pop wood element then st people away... How about BT and then warping the target? Nop why would he do that. No sense in winning.
    Tobi hasn't did any Rinnengan techs all cause of plot, not that he can't. Tobi would be unstoppable if plot wasn't his biggest enemy.

  5. #20
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    When did Tobi get hit with Amaterasu while having Rinnegan? Neither he nor Madara has ever been hit with Amaterasu while having Rinnegan. Madara also stopped attacks in front of him... he was LOOKING at the FRS and I think Oonoki's Jinton. And it was Kabuto who pushed away Amaterasu after a minute or two of being hit with it.

    You can't ignore the manga, considering the manga states stuff or shows it. It states Minato not completing rasengan, and it shows Madara and Tobi using Rinnegan's power. You have no proof to counter that Tobi and Madara can't use every Rinnegan jutsu, or since only Tobi has Rinnegan here, that he can't use every Rinnegan jutsu.

    Obviously. Tobi's been dumbed down and won't use Rinnegan since it'd give Naruto and his team a major disadvantage. So until proven otherwise, as far as I'm concerned, he does have all Rinnegan jutsu. As result, he and Madara are likely to win this fight as Naruto's power comes mainly from Kyuubi's chakra against someone of Madara's caliber. And Mokuton can get pushed back as well with Shinra Tensei.

  6. #21
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Quote:
    o you can argue that MS gives different power to different Uchiha family or branch. Does not work with Rinnegan.
    the problem is that Nagato's , Tobi's and Madara's rinnegan are belong to Madara eyes .......
    خداحافظ

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  8. #22
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Which is another reason why we should go with the assumption that Tobi can use every Rinnegan jutsu we've seen so far. And since it's Madara's Rinnegan, and Nagato was able to use nearly all Rinnegan jutsu, then Tobi should be able to use the same. And since there's no plot shield, Naruto and Hashirama are in deep trouble.

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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    Which is another reason why we should go with the assumption that Tobi can use every Rinnegan jutsu we've seen so far. And since it's Madara's Rinnegan, and Nagato was able to use nearly all Rinnegan jutsu, then Tobi should be able to use the same. And since there's no plot shield, Naruto and Hashirama are in deep trouble.
    First, LOL

    Second, They have Plot shield no Jutsu.

    Do you know Rinnengan can absorb chakra with that ability, They can also absorb jutsu. since Jutsu = Chakra.

    Maybe u forgot something. Harashima have Dragon Wood Jutsu. It absorb chakra.

    GG ^_^ Madara stated it himself only Harashima can defeat him on 1 on 1. That Dragon Wood Jutsu surpass Madara..

    Since the Dragon Wood jutsu is big, anything that Tobi or Madara throw a jutsu get absorb.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shafagh's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Quote:
    GG ^_^ Madara stated it himself only Harashima can defeat him on 1 on 1. That Dragon Wood Jutsu surpass Madara..
    Madara only said Hashirama was his only rival ..... not to defeating him .... any way , we still don't know the full story ....
    خداحافظ

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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by shafagh View Post
    Madara only said Hashirama was his only rival ..... not to defeating him .... any way , we still don't know the full story ....
    Strongest Shinobi !

    Only he can defeat Madara.

    He said this himself.

    He never once said Hashirama was his rival, if anything he keeps going on and on about him being his superior.

  13. #26
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan
    He can do that to Hashirama's clones. Naruto's SC are up in the air.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/611/6
    See? He did NOT know.
    Madara states more than once when he can tell where a clone is, but this is the most damning evidence that there's no trick to it: just pure eyesight. http://www.mangahere.com/manga/naruto/v60/c601/4.html

    Madara had just arrived, and never got a chance to see Naruto perform the handseals for Kage Bunshin. And yet, he knew full well that this was a clone he was looking at. Why do you think that is? The one you linked to showed Madara looking at Naruto in Bijuu Mode WHILE the Sage Mode clone was being killed so it's different. The one I showed shows only one body and Madara still correctly deduces that it is a clone (remember, he hadn't seen the other Naruto over by Gyuuki).
    Last edited by ninjabot; December 19, 2012 at 01:29 AM.

  14. #27
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    @ninjabot

    It can be a translation problem. Also you have 2 there Naruto's. 1 is a clone or Naruto has a twin. Naruto holding his main body behind and using a clone makes perfect sense. It could just be Madara doing what Sasori did and belive there is no way Naruto would use his main body as a distraction... Just before Sasori got hit by a FRS.

    I did say its up in the air and not that he can't do it. There is no firm evidence to point 1 way or the other.

    EDIT: Sasori = Kakuzu.

    @M3J

    Quote Quote:
    When did Tobi get hit with Amaterasu while having Rinnegan?
    Damn i meant Rasengan, from Naruto. The one that blew his mask off. I usualy post from work and now with the holydays coming i am really bussy.
    Quote Quote:
    Madara also stopped attacks in front of him... he was LOOKING at the FRS and I think Oonoki's Jinton.
    He also got a Jinton from behind, from his blind spot when focusing on another enemy. Its just before asking Oonoki if he has gone senile i belive. Anyway to lazy to look it up.

    Quote Quote:
    And it was Kabuto who pushed away Amaterasu after a minute or two of being hit with it.
    I think you meant Nagato. Well anyway i was refering to Rasengan. Kabuto was the one controling him but it was still Nagato doing the pushing.

    Quote Quote:
    You can't ignore the manga, considering the manga states stuff or shows it. It states Minato not completing rasengan, and it shows Madara and Tobi using Rinnegan's power. You have no proof to counter that Tobi and Madara can't use every Rinnegan jutsu, or since only Tobi has Rinnegan here, that he can't use every Rinnegan jutsu.
    I am not. Aparently you can't comprehend what i tell you. Its ASUMING we did not know the details about Minato not getting to finishing it. If we just knew he had Rasengan, are we then to asume he also has FRS? It was a damn example.
    Tobi used some very specific rinnegan stuff. Like control and sync with the GM statue. Never even 1 rinnegan jutsu, not even 1.
    I am also not going to asume Madara can ST, BT or CT before he does it. There is a reason why they did NOT use it. Not even once. It could be plot or it could be something else.
    Thing is curent chapter is enfocing your point. Obito did state he can use that resurecting jutsu. Still not going to asume he can spam all the rinnegan techs before i see it. Only those that they direcly display i am going to belive they can use. Nagato could just have more time to train and get some jutsus that they did not. In Tobi's case it could be that ST is in 1 eye and BT in the other like with the EMS (its evolved from EMS afterall).
    Also i am aware summoning the meteor can be considered something of a BT.

    What if you where asked if Sasuke can use Susano when he showed only Amaterasu. Would you say you belive he would eventualy get it and not that he has it? Just because you have the eyes it does not mean you have the techs. It could be something as simply having to practice and learn. Madara was hiding in his cave and not fighting.

    Quote Quote:
    Obviously. Tobi's been dumbed down and won't use Rinnegan since it'd give Naruto and his team a major disadvantage. So until proven otherwise, as far as I'm concerned, he does have all Rinnegan jutsu. As result, he and Madara are likely to win this fight as Naruto's power comes mainly from Kyuubi's chakra against someone of Madara's caliber. And Mokuton can get pushed back as well with Shinra Tensei.
    The posibility of Tobi forgetting jutsus is DEFENETLY there. I mean he forgot he can Katon, trow huge firewalls, use wood element and so on. Thing is we can't know that for sure.
    If they had CT they would have CT'ed them all... If they has Super ST they would have used it (aside from the plot). Seriously it could be like Tobi not having Kakashi's Kamui because he is missing that eye. Even asuming he has some rinnegan jutsu (and he obviously has) you don't know what he is missing (if he is).
    You can of course belive what you whant but to the point i see him do a tech i am not going to belive he can, or at least state something about his ability to do it.
    Last edited by xXan; December 19, 2012 at 03:30 AM.

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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @ninjabot

    It can be a translation problem. Also you have 2 there Naruto's. 1 is a clone or Naruto has a twin. Naruto holding his main body behind and using a clone makes perfect sense. It could just be Madara doing what Sasori did and belive there is no way Naruto would use his main body as a distraction... Just before Sasori got hit by a FRS.

    I did say its up in the air and not that he can't do it. There is no firm evidence to point 1 way or the other.
    Kakuzu, not Sasori poor guy

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  17. #29
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    @Uchiha_Blood

    Damn, right you are.

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  19. #30
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: EMS Madara & Obito /w Six Paths vs Hashirama & Naruto

    Considering we know that not all ninjas have the same element, it would not be a good idea to assume Minato can use FRS. However, if Naruto and another person could do FRS, then it'd be safe to assume so.

    And once again, you provide no reason as to why we shouldn't believe Tobi can use all Rinnegan jutsu when he's shown to know Rinne Tensei and has used Six Paths. If Nagato, who was using Madara's eyes, can use those same jutsu, then Madara and Tobi can.

    Tobi himself said that awakening Susano'o was rare among Mangekyo users. With this, we don't know if Sasuke would have gotten Susano'o or not. But considering Itachi did have Susano'o, and Sasuke's eyes were said to be more powerful than Itachi's, then we can assume he could use Susano'o.

    Considering all the implication that both Uchiha can use more than one or two Rinnegan jutsu that they showed, it's safe to assume they can use all. And the only way you can prove otherwise is if either of them says that they can't use the jutsu because they don't have the ability or knowledge to.

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