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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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  • Marco

    22 36.67%
  • Gol D. Roger

    38 63.33%
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Thread: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

  1. #16
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Going with Marco. At this point, it is unfair because Roger wins every fight, regardless of his opponent, unless user recognize that the sense of this tornament is completely pointless if he pawns everyone with his title.

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  3. #17
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    It's all senseless, after all. Why would Roger be Pirate King if he is not strong/the strongest? In a 1 v 1 fight, this would be expected. Roger all the way.

  4. #18
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Man arguing like this is pointless. Lets compare one piece with football (soccer, how it is logically called in america, foot and ball = soccer)
    Have you ever seen Pele in a match? I suggest no. You only heard of him that he is the best player of all time. Now you got someone like Messi or Christiano Ronaldo. Someone like Ronaldo or Zidane.. They all won every title you could win in the world.. Okay, except of C.Ronaldo and Messi. So now, does this make them weaker than Ronaldo, Zidane, Pele or Maradonna? HELL NO!
    Only because Pele and Maradonna were once the best strikers in the world, they arent automatically better than Messi or C.Ronaldo. I even think that Messi and Ronaldo surpassed them. Same goes for Roger. He was once the pirate king, but nowadays, there are pirates who surpassed him. And Marco is WBs right hand, and deserves to get the chance to advance to the next round against a relict of an old era!
    And unless like Pele or Maradonna, we havent seen anything of Roger, earning his title... Be fair and give Marco the chance, I appeal to your sanity!

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  6. #19
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Kazu-Sama's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Amigo View Post
    Man arguing like this is pointless. Lets compare one piece with football (soccer, how it is logically called in america, foot and ball = soccer)
    Have you ever seen Pele in a match? I suggest no. You only heard of him that he is the best player of all time. Now you got someone like Messi or Christiano Ronaldo. Someone like Ronaldo or Zidane.. They all won every title you could win in the world.. Okay, except of C.Ronaldo and Messi. So now, does this make them weaker than Ronaldo, Zidane, Pele or Maradonna? HELL NO!
    Only because Pele and Maradonna were once the best strikers in the world, they arent automatically better than Messi or C.Ronaldo. I even think that Messi and Ronaldo surpassed them. Same goes for Roger. He was once the pirate king, but nowadays, there are pirates who surpassed him. And Marco is WBs right hand, and deserves to get the chance to advance to the next round against a relict of an old era!
    And unless like Pele or Maradonna, we havent seen anything of Roger, earning his title... Be fair and give Marco the chance, I appeal to your sanity!
    I think the point is brilliant, well thought out, and well described. Only problem is, as a massive football follower (and yes, I do mean the football that is more than 17 minutes of action) I have seen Pele play. I'd say Diego Marradona - hand of god aside - was a truly sensational footballer, but Messi I'd rate as better than Pele. Cristiano Ronaldo doesn't strike me as an incredible footballer, he's far far too arrogant and is convinced he's flawless.

    Ronaldo and Zidane were both great footballers, but had the benefit of a brilliant team to play with. Think of Real Madrid's team at that point - Casillas, Salagdo, Helguera, Samuel, Roberto Carlos, Beckham, Guti, Figo, Raul... All of them are legends in their own right. Gol D. Roger had crewmembers like Shanks, Buggy (who despite what people say, is an incredible leader) and freaking Rayleigh. Gol didn't do it alone.,,
    Last edited by Kazu-Sama; January 12, 2013 at 09:25 AM.

    Epic Brofist!

  7. #20
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Amigo View Post
    Man arguing like this is pointless. Lets compare one piece with football (soccer, how it is logically called in america, foot and ball = soccer)
    Have you ever seen Pele in a match? I suggest no. You only heard of him that he is the best player of all time. Now you got someone like Messi or Christiano Ronaldo. Someone like Ronaldo or Zidane.. They all won every title you could win in the world.. Okay, except of C.Ronaldo and Messi. So now, does this make them weaker than Ronaldo, Zidane, Pele or Maradonna? HELL NO!
    Only because Pele and Maradonna were once the best strikers in the world, they arent automatically better than Messi or C.Ronaldo. I even think that Messi and Ronaldo surpassed them. Same goes for Roger. He was once the pirate king, but nowadays, there are pirates who surpassed him. And Marco is WBs right hand, and deserves to get the chance to advance to the next round against a relict of an old era!
    And unless like Pele or Maradonna, we havent seen anything of Roger, earning his title... Be fair and give Marco the chance, I appeal to your sanity!
    Nah, you just want to vote Marco because you want to. You don't want to vote Roger because you don't know enough of him. Yes, Marco is good but I don't think he don't deserve it yet. And no, I don't know those silly soccer players. Since I only understood a bit, let's switch it to music. Nowadays, we like Pop because it's what we always hear but the old generation would prefer Rock because they knew how awesome it was. Therefore, we could say that Roger = Rock, Marco=Pop because of it's awesomeness.
    Last edited by SuperPeon; January 12, 2013 at 09:50 PM.

  8. #21
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Kazu-Sama View Post
    I think the point is brilliant, well thought out, and well described. Only problem is, as a massive football follower (and yes, I do mean the football that is more than 17 minutes of action) I have seen Pele play. I'd say Diego Marradona - hand of god aside - was a truly sensational footballer, but Messi I'd rate as better than Pele. Cristiano Ronaldo doesn't strike me as an incredible footballer, he's far far too arrogant and is convinced he's flawless.

    Ronaldo and Zidane were both great footballers, but had the benefit of a brilliant team to play with. Think of Real Madrid's team at that point - Casillas, Salagdo, Helguera, Samuel, Roberto Carlos, Beckham, Guti, Figo, Raul... All of them are legends in their own right. Gol D. Roger had crewmembers like Shanks, Buggy (who despite what people say, is an incredible leader) and freaking Rayleigh. Gol didn't do it alone.,,
    Not to start a football argument, but in what ways would you say Messi is better than Pele? Especially as a striker... You can mail me the answer, just curious.

    I still dont understand how these tourneys work, i mean seriously, shouldnt there be a rule against using characters with little to no showings in the manga on fantasy fights? Especially people like Roger etc who we can only speculate theyre true strength... Which logically means everything we say is bascially not cannon :/

    Marco should logically win this, but fandom and hype will get the better of the votes
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

  9. #22
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Leonsagara's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    If it were an admiral or WB or Shanks against Roger, I would probably vote for them over Roger. Marco might have shown some feats, but not enough to make me think he's Roger's level.

  10. #23
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Leonsagara View Post
    If it were an admiral or WB or Shanks against Roger, I would probably vote for them over Roger. Marco might have shown some feats, but not enough to make me think he's Roger's level.
    Marco is very easily Admiral level... Doesnt make sense not to vote for him because he is not an Admiral.

    And it is not about him being Rogers level, dont think anyone is saying that, its that Roger has shown nothing in the manga therefore his powers are non existent until shown. He cant Magically beat Marco and if anyone thinks he can they should provide proof of how that happens. Just because it is Roger doesnt mean he gets the win out of hype. Hype might scare some pirates away, but i doubt Marco the phoenix is going to forfeit because of hype.
    Last edited by jaymizzo; January 12, 2013 at 07:33 PM.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

  11. #24
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member darkprince0521's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    i am finding it very funny. people are saying that they shouldn't vote for Roger because he hasn't shown anything; yet they say Garp is strong because he cornered Roger several times....
    Naruto Forever


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  13. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Sachsenhesse's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Quote:
    Garp is strong because he cornered Roger several times....
    well no, that guys they argue like that, are the same ones going for roger(or dragon)

    garp has shown some feets by himself, be it mastery of haki(hitting luffy all day long), tankstamina (got a friggin axearm to his chest while sleeping and still laughed about it) etc.

    roger himself.... well he was seen with a pistol once

  14. #26
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member darkprince0521's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Sachsenhesse View Post
    well no, that guys they argue like that, are the same ones going for roger(or dragon)

    garp has shown some feets by himself, be it mastery of haki(hitting luffy all day long), tankstamina (got a friggin axearm to his chest while sleeping and still laughed about it) etc.

    roger himself.... well he was seen with a pistol once

    uh well..... see the final post here

    "Something I was thinking about today - When Shiki was captured by the marines, they sent 2 guys to do it. Sengoku, who's top brass, has an incredible DF, and is one of the most powerful marines there is, and Garp. Not Kong, not Akianu (or any equivalent admiral), not a Shikibukai, Garp. Shiki was deemed a rival to Gol D. Roger, he escaped from Impel Down, and was only beaten by a very, very lucky Luffy. So the fact they chose to send Garp over anyone else says a lot about his power..."
    Naruto Forever


  15. #27
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Sachsenhesse's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Jeah. But unfortunality fpr you, we know about Shiki abilities quite well and saw him fight in the movie. ^^

    Anyway i really dont really need to defend kazu but some posts before:

    Quote Quote:
    I'd be inclined to say that in an all-out battle, Dragon would win it, but that's all speculation, and based on what we've seen Garp is definitely the favourite. I'm not voting in this, there's no way of knowing who'll win.
    See? He even says dragon is possible stronger, but we have seen more from garp, so he will not vote dragon. Same as here with roger. From both we have seen nothing but a glimpse, so they loose against a worthy opponent. (atleast thats what i hope, because we got some fights we are really nice and fun to discuss... jus take enel and blackbeard, from both we know the abilities and strength --> 6 Pages. Here it is "roger hasnt shown anything yet" or "roger is pirateking". That isnt fun at all. xD

  16. #28
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member darkprince0521's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Quote Originally Posted by Sachsenhesse View Post
    Jeah. But unfortunality fpr you, we know about Shiki abilities quite well and saw him fight in the movie. ^^

    Anyway i really dont really need to defend kazu but some posts before:



    See? He even says dragon is possible stronger, but we have seen more from garp, so he will not vote dragon. Same as here with roger. From both we have seen nothing but a glimpse, so they loose against a worthy opponent. (atleast thats what i hope, because we got some fights we are really nice and fun to discuss... jus take enel and blackbeard, from both we know the abilities and strength --> 6 Pages. Here it is "roger hasnt shown anything yet" or "roger is pirateking". That isnt fun at all. xD
    first of all, i also said in that very thread that Garp is strong, may be past his prime, but still one of the strongest. but what does that mean? Garp hasn't shown anything much; actually all we know about him is comment of other manga characters; not more than that. the feats he has in the manga, doesn't reflect his true strength. at the end, Garp's strength is speculation as well.

    and i know what Kazu-Sama said. that Garp is one of the most powerful marines there is; and as one of the facts he has stated When Shiki was captured by the marines, they sent 2 guys to do it. why Shiki is so important to prove Garp as strong? he has stated two reasons one of them involves escaping from Impel Down and the other one is Shiki was deemed a rival to Gol D. Roger.

    anyway, this thread isn't about Garp, but about Roger and Marco. so i should return there. and i can understand your reasoning as well. that speculation on unknown powers isn't a good thing. well i may agree with that. but there are few things.

    let's say, it was Marco vs Ben Beckman. we don't know anything about Ben Beckman, so anything about him would be a speculation. but i have an idea what might be his level and then i would have voted for Marco without any doubt. i would even say it myself that we shouldn't declare Ben Beckman the winner based on assumptions.

    but if it was Ben Beckman Vs Buggy? even though i know many things about Buggy and i know very little about Ben Beckman, I still would have voted for Ben Beckman. the logic about speculation shouldn't be a concern here.

    and if the match up was Roger Vs Whitebeard? then i would have voted for Whitebeard, and not Roger.
    Naruto Forever


  17. #29
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Kazu-Sama's Avatar
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Well, since we're all quoting me, this is what I had to say on Shiki's power in the battle Royale

    Quote Originally Posted by Freddichio
    I fail to see how this isn't a matter of reputation. The fact that people like Rogers, Shanks (+ crew) and even Big Mom were even in this to me seems wrong. How can we compare what we can't see? Reputation and force alone don't necessarily account for wins - Luffy was definitely weaker than Enel in the Skypeia arc, and even in this tournament Killer had a much better reputation than Buggy, however the fact of one piece is that the stronger pirate doesn't always win. Now, I'm not saying Roger would lose this fight - he WAS the pirate king, after all - but voting Roger/Shanks mindlessly seems pointless. I enjoy debating strengths and weaknesses, being able to analyse how two abilities would match up, and Rogers/Shanks are basically an automatic win button. It just ruins the whole point of this tournament. Ask anyone who watches/reads One Piece who they think the strongest pirate ever was, and odds are they'll say either Whitebeard, Shanks or Rogers. We already know that - why have a tournament to show what we already know?

    Now, back to the fight - I think Luffy was fortunate against Shiki - during the first encounter he effortlessly defeated Luffy, Zoro, Usopp, Sanji and Chopper, at the same time. Following that, he beat Luffy again, using water this time. Now, were it not for Billy the baby Zapdos electric bird, the trick by Usopp and Nami to draw Shiki into a storm cloud, AND the fact Shiki, upon seeing Luffy place his foot into a storm cloud was anticipating Luffy being electrocuted as opposed to using it to power a kick, Luffy would have lost again. The mere fact that Zoro survived Enel's attack shows us that Enel wasn't being 100% serious, as he definitely expected to be able to kill Luffy with electricity, and may I point out that the kick that beat Shiki was a lightning-imbued axe with enough power to destroy an entire floating island! Remember that lightning Enel used to strike down Zoro? When he grasped the swords and ran a current through them? Yeah, that didn't even leave a scratch on the floating island they were on. Saying 'Shiki must be weak because he was beaten by Luffy's kick when Enel didn't kill Zoro' is like saying 'Shanks must be weak because he lost his arm to a sea-king and even pre-SH Franky managed to beat one of those!' While the incidents mentioned are technically true, there was a lot more going on than the gross over-simplification that you've used. Shiki is - at the very least - similar to Crocodile in terms of strength - both beat Luffy twice, easily, before underestimating the SHs and losing. Now, the only reason I think Mihawk is stronger than Shiki is that Shiki's main weapons - swords and very very large things - are both the areas where Mihawk excels. Just the Don Kreig arc alone showed that - an entire battle fleet was taken out in one swing, and Zoro - who even then was a famous swordsman - was taken out with immense ease by Mihawk, who wasn't even trying AND using a dagger he normally uses for cutting up his food. Both are incredibly strong - in my opinion stronger than most characters we've seen in one piece short of the Yonkou, Rayleigh, and possibly some of the admirals - and as strong as Vista is the mere fact alone that Mihawk has the title of 'strongest swordsman' shows who'd be the victor in their battle... As for Pekoms, he's strong, has Haki, and good defences. He is one of the top of a Yonkou's crew, but at this level of the tournament that doesn't mean a great deal...
    By the point I said Garp was strong for being sent out vs Shiki, I'd already posted this in the Battle Royale bit. The point being, Shiki was strong. Not strong based on what was said, strong based on what was shown. Yes, I mentioned his hype for fighting Rogers - the sole reason was to appeal to reputation voters. While some of the people here - Sachsenhesse and Jaymizzo, to name a couple, although there are lots more - argue with logic and based on what we've seen, the same can't be said of everyone. Mentioning Shiki vs Roger was a way of trying to convince those who are more awed by what someone says than what they do, nothing else.

    Wait, why am I even defending myself? What does this have to do with the fight?
    Last edited by Kazu-Sama; January 13, 2013 at 12:02 PM.

    Epic Brofist!

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  19. #30
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
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    Re: Last 16: Match up 6!: Marco vs. Gol D. Roger

    Roger easily.. since weakened Whitebeard >> Marco.. Prime Whitebeard == Roger if not Roger >= Whitebeard. Some misinterpret RIVAL as EQUAL, they are not. To reason out. Only Whitebeard can be compared to Roger in terms of overall strength. Though there are silver medalists like Garp, Shiki. They were really never that strong enough to be equal with Roger. Otherwise Whitebeard would never be proclaimed the strongest in the manga. Remember he got that title only after Roger died.

    Shiki was known for his armada, which Roger and crew destroyed(with a little luck). Garp was on constant chase and had numerous battles with Roger, was never really able to defeat Roger. Even Shiki was surprised when Roger was captured/killed. He knows of how strong Roger was and came up to the conclusion that Roger would not have been captured/executed.

    Marco is strong, and whoever voted for Marco should also defend that Marco can defeat Whitebeard. Else, all arguments for Marco becomes nonsense. lol

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