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Thread: Bleach 524 Discussion

  1. #151
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Schabrak's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Amargeddon View Post
    About the Zaraki/Unohana relationship. Anyone remember this one?
    Seems like even Kubo forgot, or better conveniently forgot to change his plot a bit.

    Quote Originally Posted by avantasian View Post
    Stabbing through her sternum must have caused a magnitude lot more agony than a simple stab through the neck Imo. He will suffer through much more until they reach the goal of at least equate their powers.
    Last edited by Schabrak; January 24, 2013 at 01:32 PM.
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  2. #152
    MangaHelper 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Beatrice's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Amargeddon View Post
    About the Zaraki/Unohana relationship. Anyone remember this one?

    Yeah I remember that.

    More importantly:
    Spoiler show
    Last edited by Beatrice; January 24, 2013 at 07:30 AM.
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  3. #153
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Sky Render's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Schabrak View Post
    Seems like even Kubo forgot, or better conveniently forgot to change his plot a bit.
    Wut.

    The fact that it was never mentioned that Kenpachi and Unohana shared a common past doesn't mean it's an asspull. The roots of this relationship go as far as the chapter in which Kenpachi names Yachiru after "the only person that meant something to him". Everyone has been wondering who that person was since then, and it's been years. How is it bad that this person is Unohana? Would it have been better if it had turned out to be a new character or something?

    It's like saying that Kaien Shiba is an asspull because Rukia never mentioned him during the early Bleach, or that Ichimaru being friends with Matsumoto didn't have any foreshadowing and yadda yadda. Kubo didn't forget about anything, rest assured.

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  5. #154
    MangaHelper 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Beatrice's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Render View Post
    Kubo didn't forget about anything, rest assured.
    Precisely, Vandenreich Insignia goes back to chapter 85, Masaki revelation even back to 25.
    We were even told about a "Shutara Scale" before she even had her appearance.
    Or hence my other post, Zaraki saw Unohana within Nnoitra losing his guard.
    If one knows where to look, Kubo has input tremendous foreshadows.He never forgets, one just needs to read.
    Last edited by Beatrice; January 24, 2013 at 07:38 AM.
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  6. #155
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Kid Chameleone's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    3 things i noticed in this chapter

    1.http://mangastream.com/read/bleach/74257036/16 from this flashback it looks like kenpachi got his one handed fighting style from yachiru

    2. kenpachi crying shows a deepr connection and seeing as he doesnt know his past maybe they are realted of past lovers... theres no way unohana would put a curse or ''sin'' and give someone immortality if she didnt know them it seems kinda pointless, or maybe she did it cause he was the first person to injure her and she respected that who knows... all i know is so far shes the deadliest fighter ever to block kenpachis strike with a simple push of her hand... my god.my reaction = i didnt think shed be this strong to the point where it looks like she could knit and still whipe the floor with him lol and i think he got weaker by lowering the bar, he fights so many people that cant compare to him he probably didnt realize how rusty he was gettting cause a rusty kenpachi is still stronger than everyone apparently haha

    3.http://mangastream.com/read/bleach/74257036/20 she still has blood on her face so he did get stabbed. maybe kenpachis is like izangai or izanmi(whichever from naruto) that looks like you died but are brought back to life. he was clearly stabbed through the neck http://mangastream.com/read/bleach/74257036/19 ass you can see from the back so it begs the question is of what is unohanas powers, i think this may be cause of her bankai? maybe it gives immortality? maybe thats why he doesnt realize whats happening. what if he dies and in the time hes dead he just does things unconsciously? it make sense how he got his sword and when hes revived he gets all his memory back... OMG! what if unohana killing him the first time cause him to lose all his memories!it makes sense cause he doesnt know what happened and he doesnt care so him not looking into this ability makes perfect sense since he doesnt know he has it and simply thinks he blacks out each time pluys all he rememebrs is her and all he rememebrs is getting stabbed in the last chapter so what if she whopped his ass so bad the first time he just forgot everything except of course her

    im guessing that kenpachi found the small pink haired yachiru after their fight, maybe he got amnesia during their fight and shes all he can rememeber cause shes that boss. i also think if she was gonna make him immortal its cause the fact he did injure her and she respected it so much that subconsciously and without fully thinking used her bankai hoping she would get a chance to fight him again cause he seems to be the only one who has enough potential to give her a thrill in battle when hes not rusty
    Last edited by Kid Chameleone; January 24, 2013 at 07:45 AM.

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  8. #156
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    I think, zaraki was really stabbed at the throat and blood splatters on unohana's face. Remember, Unohana said: "oversight you impose" , the oversight, impose? Now that's zaraki's shikai. He thinks it's just a daydream, but notice how the splashed blood is still on unohana's face.

  9. #157
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Sky Render's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Beatrice View Post
    Precisely, Vandenreich Insignia goes back to chapter 85, Masaki revelation even back to 25.
    We were even told about a "Shutara Scale" before she even had her appearance.
    Or hence my other post, Zaraki saw Unohana within Nnoitra losing his guard.
    If one knows where to look, Kubo has input tremendous foreshadows.He never forgets, one just needs to read.
    Didn't know about the Shutara scale thingy. Cool. It's from the same arc, though, so it's an inferior level of foreshadowing.

    I fail to see how Kenpachi sees Unohana in Nnoitra. Their hairstyles looks similar, but that'd be overdoing it.

    About the Vandenreich symbol being shown in 82: if you mean the star-like symbol the ryoka made when they went through the shakonmaku, I think that's overdoing it. It might just be Kubo toying with the Quincy symbol idea, not the Vandenreich itself.

    Tite Kubo did not plan the whole thing from chapter 1. Not a single shonen author does. No, not even Eiichiro Oda (do you really think he planned every single arc and character since the beginning?). They can't do that.

    Bleach has been running for 10 years. If people think you can keep such a story perfectly coherent while working against the clock 24/7, I invite them to go right ahead while I sit back and laugh.

    Enjoy the revelations and praise the fact that Kubo spent his time into developing little clues he left YEARS ago, because not many authors do this. This is a mesage to every "Kubo is a troll" person roaming around here

  10. #158
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member EMS's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    we probably get some flashback in chapter 525 or 526 about how Zaraki/Unohana got their hiwhen they fought back in the days while kubo might give an small break from ichigo and neji fighting asauchi
    living in the darkness and now with a new light, i will raise to a new beginning...

  11. #159
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Schabrak's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Render View Post
    Wut.
    I was talking about the name of the zan, thanks for misinterpreting my comment and falsly assuming my thoughts. What I meant was that Kubo has mentioned his connection to his zan spirit again since that moment.

    I know fully well that he had named Yachiru after the person he admired in the past, I even argued with it in the past weeks. Why would you even assume I had thought so... :'( a bit disappointing to think I would think so, while I had no reason to, as it wasn't contradiciting with the plot at all.

    Got to go, let some steam off before I turn this discussion sour.
    edit: Well sorry for putting the first sentence of the post into the quote, only meant the lowest part of the picture.
    Last edited by Schabrak; January 24, 2013 at 01:33 PM. Reason: too many repetitions doh
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  12. #160
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Render View Post
    Wut.

    The fact that it was never mentioned that Kenpachi and Unohana shared a common past doesn't mean it's an asspull. The roots of this relationship go as far as the chapter in which Kenpachi names Yachiru after "the only person that meant something to him". Everyone has been wondering who that person was since then, and it's been years. How is it bad that this person is Unohana? Would it have been better if it had turned out to be a new character or something?

    It's like saying that Kaien Shiba is an asspull because Rukia never mentioned him during the early Bleach, or that Ichimaru being friends with Matsumoto didn't have any foreshadowing and yadda yadda. Kubo didn't forget about anything, rest assured.

    Yeah, agreed. I don't see how Kenpachi saying he cared about or admired Yachiru contradicts anything we're seeing now. In fact I'd say the fact that we've never seen him and Unohana interacting until now, even though we know she's personally healed him at least once, shows that Kubo's been planning this and saving the convo up until now. It's not like it doesn't make sense in the context of the story, plus the clues were all there - her fearsome reputation with the 11th division, the fact that her name "Retsu" means "violence" or something similar, and we already knew she was good with a sword (I think it was mentioned in one of the early character books). He likely determined she was going to be a former Kenpachi back when he was creating the character, so he probably had the relationship between her and Zaraki pinned down from the start.

    edit: Doesn't look like anyone actually was calling the reveal an asspull, so I guess my comment was pretty much useless. But hey, the point still stands I suppose.
    Last edited by NoOneInParticular; January 24, 2013 at 12:32 PM.

  13. #161
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Notak's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkBankai View Post
    some interesting thoughts floating around the boards. I have some spare change Id like to throw in-

    $.01 - Zakari Kenpachi is not immortal. he does not self resurrect, his experience of getting stabbed in the throat, reminded me of tsukishima the fullbringer. when he would stab people they remembered getting stabbed but it faded. The event is like him dying, but he learned about the attack that killed him.

    $.02 - Unohana referenced some sort of personal involvement with kenpachi dying and getting resurrected. she called it her "sin" in the translation I read.
    Interesting point about his experience, what if his zanpakuto works similarly? It could remember damage and make him more immune to it. Like some sorta shield.
    Whatever his zan does, I bet it has something to do with allowing him to be a beast in battle.
    I'm sooo curious on what his zan does.

    And yeah I bet Unohana killed/severely wounded Zaraki back then and brought him back. And that was the start of the berserking beast we all know today!

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  15. #162
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    kenpachi was owned pretty quickly,and so goes for the speed of his tears. it's disappointed although we weren't eager to have more chapters focused on this fight before this moment. it looks like we are finally gonna know what happened between those 2. I wonder when they fought: during the pendoloum kenpachi wasn't a captain yet,but unohana had already her maiden look...

  16. #163
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    so...is he weaker than he used to be? it should be the opposite,as yamamoto improved his style. and what does unohana mean?

  17. #164
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by mattiaildivino View Post
    so...is he weaker than he used to be? it should be the opposite,as yamamoto improved his style. and what does unohana mean?
    Many things can make a fighter weaker, not only in manga, but also in real life. It could be something so simple as his motivation shaking slightly, but still maintaining his adrenalin rush and excitement in battle, but with lower motivation in regards to the "outcome" of the battle. Zaraki never was the greatest thinker, not cause he's dumb, but because he's denying himself his own possible intelligence.
    He's driven by excitement, fun, and adrenalin rush... But what about other human values? Such as a family? Yachiru? and many more.
    Zaraki may never realize these other values, cause he's denying himself to "think" deeply in many ways, therefore it could be hidden, suppressed values within him, causing him to loose focus and motivation while fighting without himself realizing it.

    Alternatively it could be he has values that contradict themselves, thus causing conflict in him, whether to be destructive, or protective as for a very non-detailed example.

    Quite frankly, it's impossible to predict for certain what is wrong with Zaraki imo, but it's logically possible for him to be weaker than his past self, in fact, it's very logical when you realize how complex humans are, even Zaraki in a fantasy manga.
    A human who deny him or herself to think deeply, will eventually become weak, by building up emotions & values that are suppressed, thus shaking your inner core.

    Not knowing yourself, is the greatest enemy, and perhaps this is what is wrong with Zaraki, compared to his past when he was more simple with simple values, which to a greater degree matched his simple life style.

    It looks like the foundation for a change for Zaraki, he'll have to realize something to get stronger, perhaps to protect something he deeply cares for (Yachiru for example).
    Whatever it is that is holding him back, he needs to get past it first, one way or another, imo, for this to be realistic.

  18. #165
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member exacta's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 524 Discussion / 525 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Schabrak View Post
    Seems like even Kubo forgot, or better conveniently forgot to change his plot a bit.
    This would only make sense if Kenpachi and Unohana had interacted at any point before in the manga, which they haven't. It seems like Kubo had a good reason for Unohana not fighting until chapter 524, and for not having Kenpachi and Unohana ever talk before this chapter.

    ---------- Post added at 06:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:13 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by mattiaildivino View Post
    so...is he weaker than he used to be? it should be the opposite,as yamamoto improved his style. and what does unohana mean?
    Not at all, he only fought with two hands for like two seconds anyway lol. Kenpachi's greatest weakness is his enjoyment of fights, he gives himself openings and disadvantages just to make them more enjoyable, and recklessly charges in, tanking attacks without giving a fuck(even though they do damage him). However, fighting Unohana was the first time Kenpachi says he wasn't bored with his opponent. This may have led him to start enjoying fights, which gets in the way of him utilizing his potential.

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