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Translations: Bleach 600 (2)
I'm not talking about orochimaru, kabuto, sasuke and anko. We're talking about the characteristics of the snakes in this manga. And the fact that kishi just said that the snake sage is the most evil sage. So what's the point in debating this fact?
Doesn't change that Orochimaru was originally a good person. And we are talking about them, since the original argument was that snake being used by evil people made them evil too. If snakes were evil, then why would Orochimaru originally side with them and why would Anko still use them?
Kishi referred to Kabuto using Sage Mode as the most evil, not snake Sage Mode as a whole.
did you see Naruto commenting on how the hell Kakashi could divide his chakra in half twice and then use Kamui 3 times ( when, against Sasuke, after 2, at full chakra capacity, couldn't even move) ?
He's vague because its infinitely more easier that way, make characters spam jutsus and then conveniently make them drop to the ground when everything's over.
Mythology aside, you should have noticed something from canon material. Juugo's clan power source is the same as where the snakes are. It turns out whenever Juugo get a power up, he becomes a serial killer. Why? Why is Juugo normal and kind in his human form, and then becomes a killer when his power is activated?
My answer is that the power is infused with a murdering intent. THe power from the snake land is a malevolent power, and we have seen even with the sound for, Sasuke, Orochimaru, Kabuto. It is true that Sasuke was able to master the heaven seal, but we noticed that wheneever the seal activated, Sasuke became a cold blood killer. Let me elaborate.
1. When Oro gave the seal to Sasuke freshly and Sasuke did not have control.
Sasuke not having control means that the consciousness that was working came from the seal. The force there was plain evil with a bloody intent, and breaking human bones without any feeling of love. Unlike toads sage mode that give you the feeling and emotions of everyone around you, the snake power draw your focus only on yourself, and give you an arrogant air.
2. Sasuke vs Naruto
Here, Sasuke has started to controll, but not quite yet. You can recall that he treated Naruto worse than before the seal activated. It was pure evil, and this was only a little chakra sealed in him.
These are the evidence that the power of the snake or from Ryuuchidou is infuse with evil, and unless Sasuke has a good intent to defeat the darkness in the power in the same way Naruto defeated his own darkness and the Kyuubi's, Sasuke will dive in darkness. And if you follow this argumentation, you will notice that if Sasuke drop the vengence and destroy his darkness, then he can turn the snake evilness into pure power he can use. If he does not, meaning he will become bent even more on vengeance, then he will be himself filled with hatred and the snake power will feed on that hatred to consume him.
In the case he renounce vengeance, there will be no Naruto vs Sasuke. In the other case, there will be also no Naruto vs Sasuke, but Naruto vs a Sasuke that has lost his own self. Therefore, I keep telling everyone who want Sasuke to fight Naruto that the only way this can happen is the latter - that is Sasuke will be lost in darkness and Naruto will fight to save him. This will be consistent with Kyuubi's warning when he said that Sasuke will live long enough to regret if he were to kill Naruto.
Note: Before you flame on me, read carefully my post. I always think there is no reason for Naruto to fight Sasuke unless Sasuke turn evil and lost his mind. Orochimaru will make this happen.
Also Madara said that if Hashimara were to fight it, it would be necessary to redraw the map of the entire planet. This suggest even that Madara never used it because the greatest damage their fight could do was changing the valley of the end. In addition, when Madara talk about perfect Susanoo, it was more like it was his first time to see it. He said something on the line of "it is said that everyone who has seen this never survive." How could he say that if Hashimara had survive perfect Susanoo. How will he speak in a narrative way.
Finally, unless Kishi show it, there is no evidence that Madara could use the Jutsu he used after his revival except for regular Susanoo, genjutsu etc. A fair analysis would rather assume that only Hashimara's cell allowed him to activate Rinnegan, and fusion with Hashimara's body updgraded his EMS power.
This conclusion is even confirm by Kakshi's comment on Kyuubi upgrading his MS. One of the Zetsu also commented on the fact that Hashimara cell could allow Obito to unlock great power with his eyes.
Last edited by so6pww; January 23, 2013 at 01:27 PM.
Anyway, if Madara could speak of it as "It is said that everyone who has seen this never survive", it must be because he used it before. It's likely to assume that he'd also use it when confronting his archrival, if he used it on someone else, too.
Not that this is related to the topic by any means, let's just pass.
In addition, Sasuke doesn't have to be evil for him to fight Naruto. Antagonist doesn't always equal evil. All Sasuke needs is a reason to oppose Naruto, and so far, Naruto's defense of those responsible for the massacre is plenty. Given how the Elders were implied as corrupted as Danzo, Sasuke's not gonna be prevented killing them most likely and no one would care, just like with Danzo's death. And the Kyuubi's comment was out of self-preservation, not any sort of mystic foresight. Nor will Orochimaru have any major role anymore, given how late it is in the series.
Kyuubi was evil, and Naruto has darkness in him. Whenever Naruto yielded to his own Darkness, Kyuubi grabbed it and did whatever he wanted towards Naruto's enemy. If Naruto could control himself and chose the write thing, Kyuubi's power became couldn't do any arm.
Similarly, I gave you the example of Sasuke in the forest with curse seal. First, notice that the curse seal is based on Juugo ability. Juugo said that those who have curse seal are kind of his clone and this is a canon fact. From that fact, you can connect the power in the curse seal directly to Ryuuchidou. It turn out that this curse seal also contain Orochimaru's chakra, which is a snaky chakra as well.
When Sasuke woke up, he couldn't control the seal. Therefore the power we saw was the power of the seal, and it was evil. From this fact, we establish that the power of Ryuuchidou is evil. It is up to you to accept this logic or not.
Anko can control the power, thus she does not go berserk. Kabuto is tricky because we don't really know, but I think he is also evil. I told you that unless Sasuke can control the power, he will turn dark. The reason is that if he does not control it, the power will drive him same way has Naruto could be driven by Kyuubi.
On the contrary, the toad SM does not affect Naruto's mind. It is a passive power that does not even add any toady effect on Naruto. Naruto remain human being while even Sasuke controlling heaven seal had to become an animal to use it.
Snake Sage mode does not gain it's power from Ryuuichidou. Orochimaru simply found out the source of Juugo's clan's ability at Ryuuichidou. When he first learned of Juugo's clan, he didn't know what natural energy was. It wasn't until he went to Ryuuichido that he learned of such a concept and deduced that it was what was transforming Juugo and his clan.
What you're implying would be like, if Lex Luthor didn't know Kryptonite was Superman's weakness, and then he found a random shard of Kryptonite in Alaska. When he uses it against Superman and says "I found out the source of Superman's weakness in Alaska", it doesn't mean his weakness is solely in Alaska, because that's not the sole place where Kryptonite can be found.
It's the exact same scenario here. Orochimaru may have learned of Natural Energy in Ryuuichidou. But he also learned it's Natural Energy that causes Juugo's transformation. That's why Kabuto says Orochimaru found "the source of Juugo's clan's power". Because it's literally the exact place where Orochimaru learned of Natural Energy (which he also learned can be found ANYWHERE).
Stop trying to alter the actual statements in the manga to your liking.
EDIT: In all seriousness, how old are you? And is English your first language?
Last edited by ninjabot; January 23, 2013 at 11:52 PM.
Correct me if I'm wrong, does kabuto said that the ryuuichidou is the same place as mount myabukuzan(?) And humid forest? So it means that the ryuuichidou is a place where the snakes/snake sage lives.
Anyway, natural energy is not unique to the Ryuuchidou. Considering Juugo and Kabuto were shown fully capable of absorbing natural energy wherever they were, it's clearly not unique to Ryuuchidou.