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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
this was a response to another post but i thought it should be a thread, what do you guys think? imho these are the reasons naruto sucks as a main character and whats holding him and the story back
1. narutos fights are all easy( well easier for him) - everytime he fights someone they get amnesia or turn into fodder nin and dont do half the things theyve shown before, simply because naruto is too stupid and under developed to face an enemy at full strength so they get dumbed down
naruto vs kakuza - naruto beat him by using the same bait and switch tech even though he was fighting kakashi, ino and chouji at the same time not to mention he fought the first and lived for almost 100 years meaning his battle experience alone should make narutos heart stop
naruto vs pain - they all attacked him 1 by 1
Naruto, bee vs obito/6 jinchuriki - 6 jin plus obito cant take out naruto? for real...?
naruto vs kyuubi - kyuubi is said to destroy mountains and cause tsunamis in one tail swing but naruto beats it with simple kage bushin, rasengan combo
2. naruto is ninja jesus without effort - why does he get all these power ups? uzumaki, son of the 4th, child prodigy, jinchuriki, sage like wtf its too much and the thing that pisses me off the most is that he doesnt make the most of these forms he simply rushes off and gets a new one. he never fully masters that power he rushes off, loses, then gets thrown a 2 second training arc that takes no effort and is dumbed down for him
lives with jiraiya for almost 2 years, comes back with bigger rasengan
wind chakra: instead of finishing his wind training he gets new rasengan and rushes off. kishi couldve easily had him finish it off screen but wever
sage mode: he hasnt shown half the abilities jiraya showed and jirayas wasnt even finished, not to mention hes only shown frog fu and again new rasengans
kyuubi mode: didnt fully master kyuubi mode just ran off and became bffffffgfffgsomglolz with the kyuubi in like 0.5 seconds giving him the biggest power boost with no considerable effort even though the kyuubi hated him and wanted revenge last time we saw him
you dont have to be the child prodigy, chuck norris and bruce lee all into one to be the main character, he has too many power ups and needs to have some taken away cause its getting ridiculous no one else has that much packed into them
3. his fighting style/ brain - his base stats are garbage, not to mention the fact he needs someone to hold his hand in every fight, he cant think for himself and never trains fully he just rushes off into a new battle in hopes of seeing the one that got away...sasuke-kun
when has he ever worked on hand to hand, ninjutsu or chakra control outside of a time when plot demanded it? part 1 he was always busting his ass but now he has a game shark and the cheat codes to power up whenever he wants
he cant hold his own and always needs someone to think or save him
ALL OF HIS FIGHTS END IN KAGE BUSHIN BAIT AND SWITCH RASENGAN COMBO
naruto vs itachi - http://www.mangareader.net/93-266-1/...apter-261.html
naruto vs kakuza - http://www.mangareader.net/93-346-10...apter-341.html
naruto vs pain - http://www.mangareader.net/93-447-18...apter-442.html
naruto vs kyuubi - http://www.mangareader.net/93-53820-...apter-499.html
naruto vs obito - http://www.mangareader.net/naruto/598/15
naruto fights are all recycled to the point where i dont even read his fights anymore, i just give them a quick scan and hope something new happens and where the fuck are his new techs? can i get a tornado of atleast a gust of wind ffs. come on kishi even pidgey learns gust at lvl 6
4. narutos motivation - naruto just wants to save sasuke and get his fudge packed. early in the manga it was about defying destiny and carving your name into history, now its all about sasuke. sauske this, sasuke that. get over it already! its at the point where i cant even remember when naruto did something on his own and not having his driving motivation being sasuke and honestly its kinda gay and his dedication to someone who has made it clear they dont want or need to be saved and is completely capable of taking down kage level nin is kinda really gay. i have no problem with gay people but its not right how far naruto is going for him, even if he is his best friend theres a point to call it quits people have to come to their own decisions.
5. naruto stupidity - this shit need to end, i know hes stupid but theres a limit to how stupid people are and simply saying hes stupid doesnt mean you can simply forget about teaching him new jutsu and have him develop a thought other than his hard on for sasuke.
kishi simply covering up narutos faults with hes stupid is garbage. i know a lot of so called ''stupid'' people and they arent as hopeless as naruto.
the problem isnt with sasuke its with naruto. naruto is potrayed as a fuckin idiot who cant do things for himself while sasuke is taking on kage level nin all by himself.
we dont hate naruto, we prefer sasuke becuase sasuke has interesting fights and does things for himself as opposed to this so called ''child saviour'' who cant learn a new fucking jutsu or think for himself even though hes the ninja equivalent of jesus
naruto hate comes from his lack of skills and him being a boring 1 dimensional character
sasuke hate comes from sasuke doing all the things naruto is supposed to
Last edited by Kid Chameleone; January 21, 2013 at 05:03 PM.
I'm not going to do step by step quoting here, I'm just too carefree to do it.
But there is a contradicting point here.
By the way, I assume you are referring to the Kage Summit by Sasuke taking on Kage level opposition, where Raikage didn't come at Sasuke with killer intent, a punch that has been only dodged by Minato, and later by Naruto in history.
Or perhaps, Sasuke teaming up with three others to fight Bee alone and his Sharingan saving him from a certain death by Bee's swordsmanship, when Bee wasn't even serious to begin with. He then uses his Amaterasu (a completely trash power-up, since it was given to him by Itachi, thus, something he had access without giving it zero effort) to defeat him or Bee wanted them to think so, whatever.
I'm not a big fan of either character, but to be unbiased and objective, it was needed to be said from my side. Naruto was initially introduced as an idiot, and Sasuke was the genius of his class. Though, no matter how much of an intellect he possessed, which was still inferior to Itachi in that sense, Sasuke wasn't the main character and if he was to be, the main character would be a genius with excellent perceptive skills plus a Bijuu boost or Sage Mode, whatever you might add, then the manga would be even worse than it is as of now.
Just throwing in my two cents.
Deva was on cooldown and Pain used a defensive stance.
Yes, Animal Path attacked by "herself" but seeing the amount of Summons, it wasn't 1 on 1.
And even then, right after Animal summoned, Preta went against Naruto so it was Animal Summons AND Preta against Naruto, Animal relies on the summons so she can't attack herself.
Animal summoned, Preta was gone.
Human was the last one to protect Deva so he couldn't attack.
Naraku isn't a fighter at all thus was kept as the very last, used to resurrect.
Naruto even comments on why Pain used such a formation, strategy instead of relying on brute force.
Afterall, Deva is Yahiko so the very most important Body.
Last edited by Beatrice; January 21, 2013 at 05:36 PM.
Looking at the facts, Naruto did indeed fight an almost dead Kakuzu. The point of that fightQuote:
probablydefinitely was merely to show off Naruto's new jutsu, Rasenshuriken. In Naruto's defense, he's been shown to fool more than one enemy with just Kage Bunshin.
The real fight in that battle was Naruto vs. the Kyuubi/avenging Jiraiya. Naruto won, and as a result many characters are still alive. Imagine what the manga would be like right now if Nagato had never used Rinne Tensei (because Naruto killed him).Quote:
Naruto wasn't fighting alone for any portion of that fight. Also, I believe someone mentioned Tobi's Rinnegan control over the 6 jinchuuriki wasn't where it should have been.Quote:
Simple? Are you serious? What in the world is simple about Tajuu Kage Bunshin and dozens of massive Rasengans (not to mention a couple of Rasenshuriken). Naruto is probably the only person who could've pulled that off. Any other person would die from chakra exhaustion.Quote:
Also, he did have help from his mother, which may be proving your point. In any case, Naruto worked pretty hard for that.
Uzumaki: his ridiculous stamina and chakra pool is part ofwhy he's still alive.Quote:
Son of the 4th, child prodigy: Intelligence and ability aren't really genetic, I don't think.
Jinchuuriki: Has Naruto not been able to 1)not be influenced by the massive ball of hatred that the Kyuubi is, and 2)actually gained control of the Kyuubi's power?
Sage Mode: The battle with Pain displayed that Naruto knew how to use Sage Mode in more ways than one. Having clones store up Sage chakra? Turning the chakra-stealing Pain's ability against him? Come on, now.
Also, Naruto as he is now is pretty much the same as he was 200 chapters ago. He still uses Kage Bunshin and Sage Mode.
Is Rasenshuriken not one of the most ridiculous jutsu in the series? What more could you ask for?Quote:
I'm not sure why people want Naruto to be something he's not. In my opinion, that would take away from his character.
So......you want more from him, but at the same time you think he has too much?Quote:
I'm very confused.
Ah, so there it is. What it really boils down to is that Naruto doesn't show off cool techniques that you want to see.Quote:
And now we've come to the real meat of this topic. Naruto is apparently too gay for you. I'm going to stop replying at this point. Also, if you don't have a problem with homosexuals, I would refrain from saying "getting his fudge packed". Oh, and btw, Naruto's not actually gay.Quote:
I would suggest moving past a middle school interpretation and maybe look a little deeper. Granted, this is a "shounen" manga, so don't expect uber-deep existentialism or something (though, what do you know, there is some of that).
k i read all ur post and please dont see this as bashing the manga let me explain my theoires in a bit more detail
1. the fights - i understand what you guys are saying but when compared to how the other fights were fought naruto facing some of the main villains they got dumbed down tremendously i mean like the pain fight, i know they were protecting the yahiko pain but the way it was portrayed was garbage imho when naruto ran out of chakra yahiko pain ran at him and attacked him with taijutsu, why didnt he do this before? i know his moves were on cooldown but if he can still fight hand to hand why not all attack him at once and wait for openings to land hits on naruto instead of the whole wait lets go 1 at a time? they all bum rushed jiraiya and i know they have to keep naruto alive but they knew he was a powerhouse so they should atleast have gone balls out since the fight started not just that i wanna see naruto win a fight where someone doesnt have to save him or he uses kyuubi chakra or sage mode, i jsut wanna see naruto be naruto
also im tired of the rasengan finish, the simple bait and switch is old
2. him being ninja jesus is too much
im not saying i want more but less lol what im saying is hes everything and doesnt even use one fully and gets a new power up! e gets power ups to cover that his stats are garbage and solely so he can keep up with other ninja's. look at his abilities:
base skills, taijutsu, ninjutusu, charka control? all garbage
wind chakra: completely mastered? no
sage mode? completely mastered? kinda...i wouldnt say he mastered it, just being able to use it properly doesnt mean hes using it to its full potential
kyuubi mode: just thrown at him out of the blue
i do and dont have a problem with the power ups. i dont because hes the main character and its not like these boosts are gonna go to sakura lmfao its the fact that he doesnt master them and runs off with just a new rasengan every time.
i wanna see Naruto fight as Naruto! i dont care for sage mode, kyuubi mode, jesus mode! whatever he has next! its the fact that he cant win a fight without these power ups. he rarely wins by using smarts its always a power up and rasengan. lets see naruto win a fight without that shit. you dont have to be all those things to win a fight but naruto it looks that way. in part 1 they said a pro with a rock can beat a rookie with a knife, well guess what, naruto is a rookie with a knife! his base stats are shit, hes an idiot and he only has one method of fighting, clones and rasengan bait and switch. i wanna see naruto reach his full potential, not kyuubi naruto, not sage naruto, just naruto!
3. narutos moves
bro i have no problem with the rasengan its how he uses it. last time i checked rasengan was a finishing move, not a start, middle and hope it hits, misses, shadow clone switch, hit finish fight move lmfao he spams the shit out of it you cant deny that, if he didnt use it as often i wouldnt mind but he uses it like he breathes man its always the first and last thing he does not to mention it has one of the biggest weaknesses of all jutsu, grabbing his wrist lmfao i dont know how no one has been able to stop it since he uses it so much not to mention its a fuckin ninja world where people make their own moves and you can learn moves from scrolls so hows about naruto pick up a scroll or practice a new technique? its not hard it can be done off screen and making him stupid is the shittiest cover up ever. ''hes stupid so he doesnt learn'' wtf is that? im not saying he needs to be kakshi and have 1000 jutsu but maybe more than 2 would be nice. not to mention as i said earlier hes ninja jesus.
but yet he only has two moves....
OMG HES NOT? SO HIM CHASING SAKURA ALL PART 1 WAS CAUSE HE WANTED TO DATE HER?
fudge packed came out of frustration sorry if i offended anyone its just a dirty expression kinda like '' beating ur meat'' or ''pitchin a tent'', i dont hate gay people, i saw the south park movie in grade 2...my teachers hated me and the first time i heard fudge packed was from a gay guy lmfao but seriously naruto though does look gay, i know hes not gay but hes does look that way. the only time you hear of main characters going to this great lengths is for damsels in distress.... i understand the bestfriend thing but still like its too much, narutos whole drive and purpose for living right now is sasuke. he said ''how can i become hokage if i cant save a friend'' so if sasuke dies what then? naruto hits a depression and hits the sake every night? naruto does kinda look gay to me like wtf sasuke is his own person and as his bestfriend he should let him do what he wants. when sasuke killed oro and itachi that shouldve been the end of it, hes no longer in danger so why go to impossible lengths for someone who has said repeatedly they want their revenge. naruto need to think, if sasuke is gonna come back hes gonna do it on his own, as his bestfriend he should know how stubborn sasuke is and leaving him to find his own path is what a real best friend would do not constantly following you when youre clearly trying to figure life out
naruto needs to jump back on the ''my way of the ninja'' and ''i want the village to recognize me'' cause back then it was his own motivation and his own driving force he didnt have sasuke steering the wheels, being the deciding facter in almost every decision he makes. he needs to be his own person and hes not hes sauskes bitch and sasuke doesnt even want him as his bitch, right now as naruto is hes worthless. he needs his own drive his own spirit, his own reasons for life not solely saving sasuke, thats whats gay about it.
middle school interpretation? is it wrong to want substance in a story? is it wrong to want heart? is it wrong to want creativity and new things rather than repeated garbage? im a naruto fan who has his his boiling point. im tired of where the manga is heading i want HEART, STORY, LOVE, ACTION, ADVENTURE, CREATIVITY, SUSPENSE! DO YOU KNOW WHAT WE GET INSTEAD?! MOTHAFUCKIN HASHIRAMA CELLS! honestly im getting a tumor in my no justsu gland. [art 2 has been lacking in these departments for time its undenyable. and im a middle schooler for wanthing more? ha! thats insulting. maybe you shouldnt settle for a story that has clearly fallen from grace
i know its a shounen manga but as a fan im insulted, no other manga has built me up so much just to drop me like naruto has
---------- Post added at 07:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:08 PM ----------
lol what you say is a middle school interpretation is actually the story in base form lol im looking at it as it is as its shown to me, im not blindly accepting all the garbage thrown at us weekly. at least i have an opinion and im not a blind sheep accepting all the flaws acting superior solely on the fact that he has more posts. if it was anyone other than naruto they wouldve been killed 5 times over in the story so how about no making naruto so worthless and giving him a mind of his own? proper motivation? proper development? giving him a power to call his own instead of constantly borrowing?
honestly hes still in part 1, he hasnt matured at all since the start of the story and i think he needs a crash course on what its takes to be a good nin from kakashi or maybe tsunade casue as he is now hes no where fit to be hokage or child saviour, regardless of all the power ups he has power and flashy forms, those dont make you a good main character. lets see him make a decision on his own or come to a conclusion without a voice whispering in his ear guiding his next step. lets see him dedicate his time to something new and fully master it. lets see him finally get sakura or hinata, you saved the village naruto! reap the benefits LMFAO. i wanna see life man LIFE!, i wanna be able to connect with the story and the characters and i cant even do that anymore because im not uchiha or senju
part 1, a kid damned by destiny, a failure, a drop out trying to make a name for himself, we can all relate to that cause we all felt it at some point in our life regardless of how big or small.
part 2: ''IM THE SON OF THE FORTH!'' '' IM THE CHILD SAVIOUR'' what in the fuck? the story has strayed far from what it used to be. i cant relate to anyone in the story anymore and its sad, part 1 everyone had their own motivation, part 2 if you arent uchiha, senju or of famous decent or bloodline you arent anything special... FEW CAN RELATE TO THAT! not uchiha? not senju? k youre pretty much irrelevant to the story now naruto is no longer naruto, hes uzumaki christ, ninja born on a level no one else can touch simply cause the plot demanded it cause hes apparently too stupid to learn on his own, so destiny of course throws him another power up cause a low iq apparently means being a helpless vegetable
---------- Post added at 09:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:30 PM ----------
im nit saying sasuke has to be the main character i like naruto as a character he just isnt developed properly. i wanna see naruto trainm i wanna see him reach his full potential. become the ninja we all thought he was gonna be. he showed so much heart and promise at the end of part 1 but now its like hes gone back to his childish ways. i wanna see naruto be battle smart, new strategies, new moves, different endings to the fights, proper motivation cause sasuke is his life at this point,Quote:
Honestly i want naruto to be his own person. he always has someone looking out for him, someone protecting him and helping him be it kakashi or the kyuubi. whens he gonna stand on his own two feet? whens he not gonna have to resort to using a power up straight off the bat and can draw out an enemys full power with HIS OWN ABILITIES! not sage mode, not kyuubi mode none of that shit. i want a straight up naruto victory, no teammates, no power boosts, just all strategy and technique like part one just to show he can do it, i dont care if he does it for part of a fight or the whole thing, just one clean fight. if he powers up, naruto powers up. shot for shot, eye for an eye not:
Fight! ''SAGE MODE, DESTRUCTO DISC'' miss fail right off the bat, then clone fighting, then kyuubi chakra, then comes out of it, finishes with new rasengan. my heart is bleeding
Last edited by Kid Chameleone; January 22, 2013 at 01:24 AM.
actually it was more than 5 times :Quote:
he get saved in these fight :
1- vs hakue ( sasuke )
2- vs sasuke ( Qb saved him for 2 time )
3- vs kakuzu ( kakashi and Yamato saved him )
4- vs pain ( QB/Hinata saved him )
5- after QB take control of his body 4th hokage saved him
6- vs qb ( his mom saved him )
7- vs nagato ( Itachi saved him )
8- vs madara/Jubbi ( Ino/hinata saved him )
9- in recent chapters ( Neji/hinata saved him )
and I forget so much thing as well ...... any way , Naruto's fans will come and call you " haters " , " idiot without any imaginative " and etc ...
kishi always saying kage bunshin and Rasengan are his favorite jutsu .... so he won't change it ... after all drawing more naruto with a sphere in hand is easier to draw complex jutsu ...Quote:
actually , Naruto character is fit for Shounen manga but sasuke is suitable for senin manga .... and kishi writing a shonen manga ...Quote:
simply , just like Senin manga , Sasuke doen't need to change all people or understand them or even being super good with best choice but Naruto is completely opposite .... and honestly , kishi overdose it and NAruto become Jesus ninja who has to change all people .... this is lame ......
Last edited by shafagh; January 22, 2013 at 04:25 AM.
So? Does it matter if naruto is a broken main character? Kishi created him like that. We don't have any choice but to accept it. If kishi wants naruto to be an idiot main character then that's OK with me. Honestly, I for once, really hate sasuke and the entire uchiha. They're not really ninjas. Their power and skills came from their freaking eyes. They can defeat someone just because of their sharingan. Yeah, that's boring like hell.
But I never hate sasuke just because I want naruto to be like him. Naruto is a genius on his own little way. And for me, someday, naruto would definitely become an awesome ninja who can pull/use any jutsu he want. I'm pretty sure naruto learn some jutsu of jiraiya, so you just wait, maybe kishi will let naruto to use that in this war.
And btw, there's still other reason why I hate sasuke....... it's his fans. They're overstimating him too much, too much in sense that minato/jiraiya isn't an issue to sasuke at all.
He s stupid and it would be nice to see a new strategy other than bait and switch. Unreasonable? No
He could learn a new jutsu. He doesnt need 1000 but you need more than kb and rasengan to win a fight hes facing ninja like madara and the raikage now you need more than two moves and a playground battle strategy to be winning these fightz. The bait and switch shouldve died in part one but hes constantly using it and constantly spamming the rasengan which is a close range tech, how is he supposed to get close to someone like madara or sasuke who have op moves like amaterasu and susanno? Youre telling me hes gonna do the same old bait and switch on someone like madsra or sasuke? Get the fuck outta here that shit didnt work on sasuke in part 1 hes always destroyed narutos clones with ease so sayjng his hand to hand needs improvement isnt a strech
His motivation is solely sasuke! If that isnt weird or suspect to you than thats your own thing but making naruto so dedicsted to someone who can clearly take care of themselves and is known to be hard headed is weird. As i said theyre "bestfriends" and as a best friend he should let sasuke fijd his own path and come back on his own. Him trying to force him back home simply shows hes still has mind of a child and csnt see thjngs from other prespectives limiting the amount of chsrscter growth and acutally hindering his relationship with sasuke. His constant obsession has blinded to the truth that he is nowhere near kage level and its as sasuke stated at oros hideout "if you got time for chase me you should be off training"(or something like that). Naruto needs to build on his own strengths and find his own path again cause now hes simply doing things and living for the sake of sasuke. He needs to be his own man and go back to the ""my way of the ninja" naruto that we came to know and love
Itd be nice to see naruto do some oher thing, im not bashing being hinest but of course naruto fan boys are gonna gank me like exodi. Thats the problem with forums and discussions today. People see opinion and observation as an attack without fully understanding what people are trying to say. I didnt say naruto was a bad or terrible main character i simply said he is broken because when you compare him to other njn hes simply strong becuase of kyuubi and sage mode take those away and theres no way in hell hed still be alive or able to fight sasuke on par. He needs to work on his base skills and strengthen his mind and stop relying on othrrs so much.
If you really think everything i said about naruto is wrong than please prove otherwise. I am not bashing just pointing out his flaws. If i wanted to talk about his good qualities i would say hes loyal, hardworking, never gives up, funny, reliable but the thread is called "why naruto is a broken character" if youre a real fan of natuto you can admit he has flaws, you dont need to pounce on someone if they make an opinion or voice a thought and one joke isnt enough to make you cometely shut down a thread even though it hhas valid points (cough, cough, exodi cough) if yiu have an opinion please state it but if your gonna put on a cape and jump to narutoz rescue please dont comment. Have an open mind naruto isnt perfect and does need tweaks to his chsracter like every character. Nobody is perfect so dont act like naruto is cuase without kyuubi or sage hed be 6 feet under by now. As i siad i want him to be his own man but its too close to the end...
---------- Post added at 07:43 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:39 AM ----------
Saying naruto doesnt need improvment is like saying a 600 pound guy doesnt need to lose weight simply becuase he gets things done. Even if he gets shit done theres always room for self improvment
---------- Post added at 07:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:43 AM ----------
People excuse the fact nsruto is an idiot simply cuase he can do cool things im saying fuck all that jazz and learn to stand on your own feet naruto like honestly guys he cant even do a one handed rasengan after 3 years. What does he work on besides power ups?
Last edited by Kid Chameleone; January 22, 2013 at 08:02 AM.
I'm pretty sure the original post could've fit into any number of other threads that already exist, some that have been quite active rather recently included. There's absolutely zero reason to start a new thread to spout your points, especially considering the manner in which you decided to do so. You dislike Naruto, and you like Sasuke. You wish Naruto was Sasuke. Got it. And you think that individuals not particularly fond of Sasuke feel that way because they wish for....Naruto to be Sasuke. OK. Your characterisation of Naruto is ridiculously inconsistent and pretty incoherent. What you imagine Sasuke to be is a little outside of reality, but that's already been pointed out. And your conclusion seems to be slightly off with regards to the reasoning behind the criticisms of Sasuke's character. With these things said, I think we can refer to years of posts to get any lingering concerns sorted out.
This thread was just flaming..Nothing constructive at all.
@ naruto can only do rasengan and kagebunshin:
you hate it, I love it.
instead of having 132189 different jutsus, naruto focuses on his two base favourite jutsus and use them in different ways.
but I agree naruto could have had some more fuuton jutsus, it kinda bugs me that the only windstyle technique he can use is rasenshuriken
Another thread that tries to justify asspull that Naruto supposedly is. Ridiculous and idiotic. That is all.
I think I get where you are coming from, although I'm not sure you explained it in the best way possible. (Long post coming but if you have the time read it)
Naruto, like many Shounen heroes, is a simple character. He is simply, because he is supposed to be relate-able. This not only reflects in his personality, but also his fighting style.
Aside from making him more of blank canvas so he can relate to a large amount of people, he is also made simple for other reasons:
1) Making Naruto simple makes him easier to draw for the artist. Kishi doesn't have get all complicated with Naruto's jutsu because he's essentially drawing different sized circles.
2) Make's his fights easier to dictate, as there is a sort of suspension of disbelief as far as what he can do.
3) His lack of a diverse arsenal keeps his underdog thing going no matter how powerful he becomes because he lacks techniques (or he used to) to get around things.
Now, by making Naruto simple, Kishi must also makes some of his intangibles and other abilities monstrous. And the easiest one's to do would be stamina and his "heart".
The fact that Naruto never gives up and has a never ending motor means he can wear ninjas down and basically beat them over an extended period by using trial and error. He does this in nearly all of his fights and it's his MO. Did it vs. Neji, Kakazu, Pain, etc.
As the story goes on, Kishi has made Naruto into Superman. Giving him super-human strength, speed, and senses, and increasing his destructive power. He's keeping him simple yet making him God-like. This has made him broken because even though he's a Demi-God he's still a complete moron who needs saving.
Now, there are of course two things that people always bring up:
1) Naruto's enemies are always dumbed down so he can defeat them.
2) Naruto himself always needs a crutch to win fights.
Both are true. This is done both purposely IMO, and because Kishi just simply is a bad writer. There is no way around it that for every one act of brilliance Kishi has when he writes this story, he has nearly 10 acts of "WTF ARE YOU DOING!". Good writers have that ratio reversed.
Naruto's enemies are always dumbed down so Naruto can have his under dogged win. Kishi attempts to do this by having Naruto out smart his opponents or out muscle them, but often times this doesn't seem believable.
2 perfect examples:
1) His fight vs. Neji. He is able to hide 5 feet under ground despite the fact Neji can see through walls.
2) His fight vs. Kakazu; Kakazu, a 92 year old ninja falls for the bait and switch.
Now, Kishi also has Naruto often times saved by others. IMO, this is much more forgivable for a few reasons.
1) Naruto himself has saved others on quite a few occasions.
2) In cases with the Kyuubi saving him, Naruto is often times fighting opponents out of his league (see Orochimaru, Pain, and Sasuke at VOTE) and thus needs the pick-up otherwise he'd die. Also, considering the Kyuubi has hurt him just as much as it's helped him this is acceptable.
3) Naruto has doubted himself for much of the manga and thus often needs a pick me up more so from a confidence and spiritual stand point that a physical one (See Minato helping him vs. Pain).
Now of course does this get annoying after a while? O yes it does, a perfect example being Naruto taming the Kurama, something only made possible thanks to TWO other people helping him in Kushina and Bee. This delves into Kishi being a horrible writer IMO.
So yea, IMO that is why Naruto is the way he is.
Now, as for where the Sasuke hate comes from, this is a very easy 3 point answer.
1) Sasuke is hated because he's a prick who opposes the hero. Plain and simple, Sasuke is not a likable character in the traditional sense. He's cold, he's brooding, he kills people without a second thought, disregards those who aren't in a position to help him attain his goals. He's an asshole.
2) Most people can't relate to Sasuke. Sasuke is perhaps more misunderstood than he is hated, and I think this is not a problem, but a reason why people hate him. Most people can't fathom the trauma he's been through, and thus are unable to empathize with him because the pain he has been through has been so severe it is near unimaginable. Combine that with the fact people are also unable to understand how mentally and emotionally unstable that would make someone, and thus they see his actions as more unlikable.
3) People are jealous.:
Random Bro: "People jealous of a fictional character, what! No way man! No way!".
Me: "Way bro."
While this might be hard to fathom for some, for the same reason people consciously and subconsciously relate to characters like Naruto, they consciously and subconsciously hate characters like Sasuke. And the reason why is simple.
Sasuke is an elitist. He is everything most of us are not. He is highly intelligent, has natural physical abilities, is very handsome (as much as a fictional character can be), was very popular, comes from a good back ground, was given leeway he didn't deserve, etc. etc. etc.
In short, Sasuke is damn near perfectible (minus the psychotic tendencies and dickhead attitude). And him being damn near perfect makes people uneasy, and makes him unlikable.
Ask yourselves this. Why are most athletes like Lebron James, Tom Brady, and Derek Jeter hated so much by people who don't root for them? Because they are great at what they do, and always win. People don't like winners they can't root for, and Sasuke is a prime example of this, hence why he is hated so much.
Last edited by Delbi; January 22, 2013 at 08:33 AM.
@Delbi - I don't even think Sasuke is a winner (he has not got the mentality to be one) and I think he has been saved several times and also by yours truly (Naruto). I personally don't hate Sasuke what I dislike is people hating on Naruto yet turning a blind eye to Sasuke (why? because they think he is a genius?)
Sasuke has always been weak-minded and always will be. He is easily manipulated. May be after his trip to find the one who knows it all, he will become emotionally stable. My simple diagnosis is this...If Jiraiya's definition of what makes a nin is true, then Sasuke is as far from a nin as he could ever be!
People like Lebron James are winners and have the mentality to back it up not just inbred talent!
Actually, I think there are far more Naruto haters than Sasuke ones, which is why this thread is even more pointless. Each person has a different taste, so debating about that has no meaning nor end. That was proved numerous times in chapter discussions so these kind of topics should be, like, locked or deleted. It inspires flaming.