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Thread: One Piece 697 Discussion

  1. #301
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    I repeat myself
    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    To provoke confusion/chaos so that, for some reasons yet to be told, Kaidou becomes more vulnerable.
    That's what Law comment suggests even in your link.
    Law goal has been established but he also said that there is only 30% of victory. He also says it here, that the actions in punk hazard are just to create an opportunity that might help defeating Kaidou.

    That when he will be defeated, new world will even be more in chaos is another story...

  2. #302
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted zerocooldx's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamotoMusashi View Post
    Being business partners does not imply equality at all, it just implies that both get something out of the deal, namely Smiles and money. You seem to be hung up on the word "partners" but that´s just an expression for 2 parties in a business transaction. Furthermore, DD is not just a middleman. CC is the only one in the world who can produce SAD but DD is the one who turns those SAD (seems to be some kind of liquid) into Smiles since he has a factory for that purpose.

    Concerning Law´s plan, we still do not know who the other customers of DD are, we also do not know how they and of course Kaidou are gonna respond but CC already foreshadowed what´s gonna happen:

    Spoiler show
    Well being business partners doesn't imply that one partner can do as he pleases to the other partner if he doesn't get what he wants. Thats not a partnership, its one person working to provide a service to another in return for something else. I've never heard of any partnership where one side fears for their lives if the other partner isn't satisfied. Regardless of the translation, no one will believe that what Doflamingo and Kaido have is a business partnership for the simple fact that on a pure definition a business partnership involves both parties sharing, to a degree, in both the profits as well as risks of their business venture.

    I don't see Doflamingo going after Kaido's head because he lost CC and cannot produce SMILE. Nor did Law mention Kaido helping to protect Doflamingo or getting CC back to him. The opposite was explicitly stated. Also where was it stated that Doflamingo personally creates SMILE? All that was stated was that Doflamingo owns the facilities and supplies that allow CC to create SAD which go through a process in Doflamingo's factories to become SMILE. No where was it stated that he was the one who put in the work to produce SMILE just like he doesn't put in the work to create SAD.

    Yet he is the one that essentially funds CC's entire operation to produce SAD and owns everything related to SAD, including CC himself. But he himself isn't producing anything, just things and people he supplies do that for him. Big difference. And again, the basic definition of a Broker is someone who ensures through his assistance that products/goods go from point A to point B. Not that the Broker himself is the one working to produce said products/goods. So he is a middle man in every single sense of the word as long as he is called a Broker.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    Dofla has already chosen to join a Yonkou. He has an established relationship with Kaido. if he doesn't meet the terms of that relationship (sell smiles to Kaido) then he will be killed. Allies does not mean equals. Think about real, historic political and military alliances. They rarely are between equals. Alliances often are dominated by one or two strong states. An alliance can be between two equals, historically this is rarely the case.
    It was never stated that Doflamingo has allied with Kaido, nor was it ever even remotely implied. Mind you all of this you are talking about took place during a time where Oda was incredibly specifically in pointing out and naming the Alliances that were seen before us. Yet he just so happens to omit the fact that Kaido and Doflamingo, two of the biggest name in the manga, are in fact allies? Yeah right. If that was the case he wouldn't have gone to such great lengths to point out how Kaido will rip Doflamingo to pieces if he doesn't get what he is owed.

    In lamens terms Doflamingo is the essentially the upper class drug dealer who deals a very potent drug, that he obviously has someone create for him through his assistance, all so that he can sell it to a wealthy/powerful client every week on a Tuesday. Well if Tuesday goes by without the client getting his drugs, that client then sends out a few guys to find the dealer and break a kneecap or two. Which is the exact scenario that Law pointed out to Doflamingo, hence the reason why Doflamingo crapped his pants. Thats the very opposite of how Oda portrayed the concept of an alliance during this arc. Doflamingo isn't even betraying Kaido, hes just scared shitless of him because of what he will do to him if he doesn't get his product.

    "Upon the back of his body not a wound of retreat scars it."
    One Piece is a series created by a genius, it's a masterpiece, it's like a fine wine, it only gets better with time.

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  4. #303
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member MiyamotoMusashi's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Spoiler show


    Then you should make yourself knowledgeable in business transactions (i hope that does not sound condescending). Like i said, you are way too hung up on the word "partner". A business deal never requires to equal parties, nor does it require fair circumstances for both parties. It only requires that both get something out of the deal. Business partners does not imply equality, an alliance or whatever you are associating with it.
    DD producing Smiles is mentioned in the panel. DD does not own PH, he also has a business partnership with CC who gives DD the SAD and in turn gets protection and children but it is mentioned that DD personally owns the facilities in which SAD is turned into Smiles. He obviously is not turning them personally, he is a business man and a broker after all but he still "does" it himself.

  5. #304
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Ehm,guys....why noone discussed about this: http://mangarulereader.hostoi.com/MA...garule#page=13 ? doflamingo is running on a way made in the sky,which was interrupted,so he is not using his puppetteer power. I bet aokiji was the one interrupted that: they have to meet and to fight!!!

  6. #305
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Razh's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by mattiaildivino View Post
    Ehm,guys....why noone discussed about this: http://mangarulereader.hostoi.com/MA...garule#page=13 ? doflamingo is running on a way made in the sky,which was interrupted,so he is not using his puppetteer power. I bet aokiji was the one interrupted that: they have to meet and to fight!!!
    I don't expect people to read all the pages of every discussion thread, but saying nobody discussed it is a little presumptuous, dont you think?

    I think he ran on that sky path part of the way and then when it got cut off, he continued using geppou (there are even jump sounds under his feet). Although he seems to be using his df entire time.

    And what cut off the sky path is probably Law's slash vs Vergo. Probably. Nothing else comes to my mind.

    Heh
    Prediction: Dragon will appear on Fishman Island!
    Challenge Gilferbeast!!!


    (thank you pupil "fuck you razh" -> made me lol)

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  8. #306
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Razh View Post
    I don't expect people to read all the pages of every discussion thread, but saying nobody discussed it is a little presumptuous, dont you think?

    I think he ran on that sky path part of the way and then when it got cut off, he continued using geppou (there are even jump sounds under his feet). Although he seems to be using his df entire time.

    And what cut off the sky path is probably Law's slash vs Vergo. Probably. Nothing else comes to my mind.
    Whaddaf-OMG!!!! I didnt even think about such a possibility! Sir,your post is a treasure! First of all,Doflamingo using geppo,I couldn't imagine another pirate using it,but vergo might have surely taught him how to use it! And then with law's slash,it's obviously the most likely reason,though aokiji would suit better the role

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  10. #307
    MH's Best Username 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member GomuGomuNoBigBoner's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Razh View Post
    I don't expect people to read all the pages of every discussion thread, but saying nobody discussed it is a little presumptuous, dont you think?

    I think he ran on that sky path part of the way and then when it got cut off, he continued using geppou (there are even jump sounds under his feet). Although he seems to be using his df entire time.

    And what cut off the sky path is probably Law's slash vs Vergo. Probably. Nothing else comes to my mind.
    Now that you've mentioned it, I seem to recall Scratchmen Apoo escaping from those wild boar on an invisible "sky path". While Dofla cud probably just have walked across it as well, his tarzan-like method is likely to be faster. Thanks for the clarification Mr.Razh.

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  12. #308
    Harasho 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Kaiten's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    That's what Law comment suggests even in your link.
    Law goal has been established but he also said that there is only 30% of victory. He also says it here, that the actions in punk hazard are just to create an opportunity that might help defeating Kaidou.

    That when he will be defeated, new world will even be more in chaos is another story...
    Do you mean confusion and chaos for Kaido, or for the entire New World? Those are two very different things. If what you meant was the former, than yes, I very much agree. His goal in kidnapping Caesar was to create a little turmoil. I can't imagine capturing Caesar would cause "a little turmoil" for the entire New World, it would cause a little turmoil though for Kaido. A good first step if his goal is to first take down a Yonkou, possibly meaningless if global disorder is his first goal. As for this page, Law was not sharing his plan with Luffy. He was making a dramatic speech. His goal was to maximize the impact, and convince Luffy to join his alliance. He saved his most dramatic proclamation for last, that they would together take down a Yonkou. That does not mean he intended to first use the important key to throw the New World into chaos, and only then take down a Yonkou. He probably said things the way he did to ensure his speech built to a dramatic conclusion, both for Luffy and the reader.

    Kaido is a Yonkou, one of the greatest living pirates. Of course Law's plan does not guarantee success. In the grand tradition of heroic epics, the odds are against our heroes. They will win anyway, of course. Otherwise Kaido will kill them and the story will end. But that's besides the point. Law's plan can not guarantee victory, only give them the opportunity. It took a war to defeat Whitebeard, and even then victory came at great costs. Luffy and Law can't simply storm Kaido's island (wherever that be), defeat his crew, then beat the crap out of him. They need to do something to give themselves a chance.

  13. #309
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    What are you doing of Vergo quote then, he is not speaking of a little turmoil. The destruction of the SAD room seems to be something big judging by the brokers reactions. DonFlamingo resignation would equally be something big.
    Kaidou being defeated in the end is only 4th wall knowledge, Oda never breaks it so let's set that out of the discussion, it is not the point. Vergo has no idea that Law may even imagine wanting to defeat a yonkou so you can't explain his words by your interpretation.

  14. #310
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member MiyamotoMusashi's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Spoiler show


    The chaos ukimix and k-dom and thus also Vergo are talking about is not referring only to chaos for Kaidou. It refers to the big players starting to move which would imply a chaotic time. Law´s complaint is that nobody of the big players, which refers to the Yonkou and the Marines, started to move in the 2 years after the war. They only watched as BB immediately took WB´s territories and put the balance back, after that they have only been maintaining the peace and the balance. Law compares this peace and the stalemate to a machine, says at the same time though that the new generation will smash those gears, meaning the peace will probably be over and it´s gonna become chaotic. Now you can still say that the chaos Law speaks about, refers to the time after Kaidou´s defeat but we have already seen that it does not even take that much to make the big players move. The Yonkou who have been maintaining the peace for years, heck who even did not meet each other for a very long time (WB and Shanks) started to move because of a linchpin called Ace. WB waged a war against the Marines, Kaidou immediately started to attack WB, Shanks got involved and stopped him + the latter also came to MF. Those are incidents only triggered by a small thing, namely Ace losing to BB. Now, who is to say that Law is not trying to achieve the same thing, namely to make the big players move and exploit the following chaos. I think CC´s abduction and DD´s withdrawal have the same potential to be such a linchpin.

  15. #311
    Banned 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    @mattiaildivino and GomuGomuNoBigBoner
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...t=#post3275808
    Look at my posts from first pages of this thread. You guys should read thread before posting


    BTW This week we will probably get chapter one day earlier so expect some spoilers/chapter by tomorrow

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  17. #312
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Marche's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Here I will write what could happened to Don Flamingo (I really want to know your opinion, what choice he should do):
    I am really curious to what Don Flamingo will decide, if he will decide to quit the Schichibukai and face the WG or if he will decide to follow Kaido.
    In the truth there is the possibility that even if he will withdraw from the schichibukai nothing will happen, because he had an interaction with the “big men” of the WG, even bigger that the admiral (but in the truth I believe that they would not protect him if he will withdraw from the schichibukai, because infact Don Flamingo was scolded of the fact that he left Moria go, he said tha he was a pirate and that he could leave his position as schichibukai anytime that he wants).

    In the truth I think that he could not be haunted by the navy because that he could make an agreement with them, infact he could say them that after rescued CC he will give them part of the SAD.
    In this case there is the possibility that the marine itself could go after Law.
    Anyways for Don Flamingo would be very risky to give up his schichibukai, even because he will not be sure that Law will give him back CC, if this will happen Don Flamingo would be haunted by both the Navy and Kaido (in the truth I believe that after that he will quit the Schichibukai he will give back Bufalo and Baby 5 body, but perhaps he will ask others things for give back CC).

    Anyways if Don Flamingo will quit the Schichibukai is it true that he could not be a nuisance for Law’s plan, because he will be haunted by the Navy, but at the same time Kaido would be his last protection, so he could fight together with Kaido.
    Anyways I believe that if Don Flamingo will quit the Schichibukai there will be a meeting (in the truth I think this will happened anyways), then I am really curious if Law will participate to the meeting (I think he will because he make an agreement with Smoker that he will not tell to anyone about him and Don Flamingo http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/677/11) there is the possibility that Law will tell about alliance with Luffy to Hancock.
    I really would like if this will happen because then Hancock could help them against Kaido (but to tell the truth I would like better a fight between Hancock and Big Mama), and then met with the other member of the Strawhat.
    There is even a high possibility that even Big Mama will came to help Luffy, because she would not accept that others will take her prey.

    P.S:Vagabond 87 you said that we should have the chapter tomorrow, is perhaps because the next jump will be released some days before his usually time???
    Last edited by Marche; February 04, 2013 at 07:43 AM.

  18. #313
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Ninja_Pirate's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Just came across this... It seems when the time comes Doflamingo may quit... So you never know


  19. #314
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Rody naruto's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    I wonder why Law would tell Smoker his next destination enless they are pals now(which i doubt)!Also i'm curious to know what is going to happen to Law's Shichibukai title.The way i see it,him and Smoker probably got into an agreement on that matter and i'm also pretty sure he agreed to leave Luffy alone for now which would explain why he was so quiet in the last chapters(maybe too quiet).

    Talking about being quiet,is it me or Robin is being left behind.I mean in this arc she had no fight,no opinion,she is almost absence in every chapter and when she make an appearance,she is just laughing on the background.Does Oda not know what to do with her anymore or what!?Damn even Nami and Chopper had their time on the spotlight.She is one of the strongest on their their team and she is on my Strawhats top 5 least so i hope she will have a better treatment on the next arc.

    About the "Sky path", i did a painting of that panel
    Spoiler show

    Hope you like it
    Last edited by Rody naruto; February 04, 2013 at 10:10 AM.
    "Fear is only an idea success is an awareness"
    Check out my DeviantART

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  21. #315
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ukimix's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 697 Discussion / 698 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Marche View Post
    ... if Don Flamingo will quit the Schichibukai is it true that he could not be a nuisance for Law’s plan, because he will be haunted by the Navy, but at the same time Kaido would be his last protection, so he could fight together with Kaido.
    I wouldn't be surprised by a dialogue like this:
    "Kaido: where are my smileis?
    Doflamingo (former shichibukai): That trash of Law fooled me. He has Caesar and the SAD...
    Kaido: No Smileis, huh? Then, what do you have to do with me, eh?"

    followed by a panel with Kaido smashing Dofla ...

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