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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
Perhaps you're right and that in order to actually become a Slayer, you need to murder people out of anger and revenge.
Yes, there's a problem there. If Baam and all of his friends eventually rose to the heights of top High Rankers, they could actually fight FUG and Baam wouldn't have to attack Zahard or something. Anyway, in order to access Zahard, you'd have to invade the palace, defeat the guards, and overcome multiple top 20 High Rankers, so it's kind of a questionable end game.
---------- Post added at 03:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:56 PM ----------
You seem to want Rachel to end up being innocent. Technically, as Baam was the one chosen by the Tower and not Rachel, he's not really the stalker. :P
Yes, but if Rachel kept climbing, do you really think that Baam would've stopped climbing? If he wanted to be with her, then he would've followed her up the Tower.
That she just killed Dan in cold blood ends any chance of her being "innocent".
You very much seem to want Rachel pushing Baam out of the bubble to be justified. Maybe you're trying to say something else, but that's how it's coming across.
Hwa Ryun told Rachel that she'd succeed by getting rid of Baam, so Rachel thought that she was killing Baam.
If Rachel was so creeped out by Baam chasing her, then why didn't she say anything to him? She did not express her dislike of him chasing her at any point. Also, why did she not want Baam to take on the steel eel on the first floor? Seems a bit weird to be scared for your stalker's life.
Leave a team because it sucks and is holding you down? Sure, but there hasn't been a single situation in which it has been advantageous to betray someone outside of the 2nd floor position tests.
For there to be a reason to betray someone, tests have to be such that not everyone on a team passes. (e.g. you have an 8-member team but only 4 people pass. Once again, what happened during the position test.)
"Killing" Baam is in a gray area. She wanted him to leave her alone and he refused. What else is she supposed to do? Let him follow her forever because he wants to? What in the hell gives him the right to make that demand of her?
Killing Dan is out of convenience, so it is pure evil.
---------- Post added at 01:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:42 PM ----------
Last edited by Reclaimer; February 10, 2013 at 04:44 PM.
[QUOTE=Reclaimer;3296715]I'm saying she is more complex than simply being pure evil/crazy.
At first thought FUG were rough in chasing their dream of taking down Zahard, but now it appears they are more of the fight fire with fire type. The tower seems permeated with a culture of betrayal and the most likely reason for that is because that is how Zahard's government stays in power (just speculating because there hasn't been many examples of loyal government), they are the example of what works the best in the tower.
Fight fire with fire is a sound tactic, but rubbish in a battle of philosophies. If FUG does succeed in transforming Baam into an opportunistic betrayer and bring down Zahard by being more Zahard like then nothing is solved. Rather FUG will just make the reality they abhor more abhorrent.
Doubt Baam going down that path though as the author is against too much gloom in his afterwards, and even Koon dying instead of having some trick (high class armor was revealed so that probably saved him) would be pretty gloomy
No, when you're running away from someone who won't leave you alone, you don't wish that they avoid getting into a situation which would most likely result in them leaving you alone, especially given what we've seen of Rachel's character so far. Well yeah, he would rather die than not be with her, but you're making it out to be a bad thing. She saw someone who was willing to die for her and she used him, you're making it out as though Baam is the bad guy in all this.
Last edited by abc1233; February 10, 2013 at 06:22 PM.
I want Baam to kill everyone on FUG.
How they DARE to touch Koon.
Besides, Dan never messed with FUG. "Dan didn't do anything wrong. Mr. Koon dragged him into this and his only fault is doing something he didn't really want to. He's innocent." That kinda goes against what you wrote. I don't think they would just let him leave if he refused normally, but even if he ran away immediately or later, I don't think tracking and killing some innocent guy who practically knows nothing that could endanger FUG would be some kind of a priority. If you're gonna discuss with me, at least type more than 2 sentences.
Im pretty sure rachel was the one that ordered fug to kill koon and his team, cause i mean if she plan it and Fug itself planned the killing they would have killed dan regardless of what rachel said because it was their plan.
Also I dont get why they would try to kill koon... I mean koon being safe is the only thing that is making viole stay with fug, so if koon is dead then viole would have no reason to stay with them and they dont want him to leave. I dont understand the logic lol
1) You have artificially created teams.
Was Koon betraying his team by having Laure raised up the bridge? Or was he trying to make sure his real team passed the test?
2) It is the only test we've seen where it is not a team victory or defeat.
I'd love to see the characters put into situations where betraying each other during tests actually makes sense, but outside of one extreme outlier on a floor that is completely different than every other floor, we aren't getting it, so them acting like you have to betray people to climb the tower is absurd. Maybe it is true in the series, but we aren't seeing it.
And Rachel wasn't a coward for balking at taking the test. Headon was telling her to die. Not wanting to die does not make you a coward. Baam was also not brave for taking the test. If your life literally means nothing to you, it is not bravery to risk it. Note Evan's comments while observing Baam.