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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
Hijacking the OP...renamed the thread to cover a wider array of discussion. Can we compare the concept of heaven and hell against HM and SS? |toc
Well we know that there are two more "Dimensions" left. Hell and the dimension where the King lives. We've already seen SS, earth, and hueco mundo. it is depicted that earth is neutral, SS is relatively "good" and Hueco Mundo is relatively evil excluding a few examples in both HM and SS. HM is supposta b real "evil." The Hollows are always trying to consume humans and spirits alike. But will Hell be even more evil that HM? Also it was shown that SS has Shinigami and HM has hollows so do you think Hell also has shinigami because literally shinigami translates into deathgod so i guess hell could have there own shinigami. Also Shirosaki seems to become stronger in places of higher spiritual power, but how will spiritual power and the enviornement effect shirosaki. Also who do you think are stronger. shinigami from SS, Arrancar, or Shinigami from Hell cuz if we ever do go 2 hell(no pun intended) than natural progression of the manga would lead us to include that they have to be stronger than SS shinigami just cause it doesn't make sense to go fight ppl weaker than you. Also do you think Ichigo will have a hell shinigami because he has a human part, a hollow part, and a shinigami part(all the places we've visited). If hs do exist y havent we seen them yet. all we've seen is the door and the SS shinigami opened it
Last edited by thornofcarrion; March 06, 2012 at 11:29 PM.
There would be no need for shinigami in hell because ordinary shinigami send spirits to hell. They do likely have their own creatures though. We know the very least that there is the big sword carrieing creature that exist down there to stab hollows through the heart and drag them to hell.
I think they can have shinigami although it would b kinda pointless cuz SS deals wit the dead but both heaven(SS) and hell can have death gods and maybe SS has an agreement with Hell in which they control the souls of the dead 4 say 10000 years(ard the same time Yamamoto organized the shinigami skool) and the reason why he organized the school was because one day he knew the time would come 4 Hell to control the spirits and he wanted a fighting chance.
ive been wodering about thsi aswell of late and what i think is that maybe in hell they have shinigami similar to thoose shown in death note who use death notes decideing when and how sombody dies now i dont mean exactly the same but somthing like that demonic versions of the soul society shinigami say like the same style of clothing but a totaly demonic apperance
So theese Hell shinigami decide how a person is going to die the SS shingami come and send the soul to where ever its going either hell or SS and the hollows are like a parasite that feeds on the souls that shinigami dont get to in time i dont know but i think it would be cool for there to be hell deathgods
that sounds interesting but the reason y i didn't say that was because it wouldn't esplain y Ichigo has never seen n e of the hell shinigami
well i just thought aswell there must be some kind of opposite to how a shinigami works but then again i was also thinking that there was maybe like a more elite version of a shinigami that works around the king so say in the different scale of things that there are the hell shinigami then hollows/arrancar then humans/quincy then shinigami then the kings shingami in a scale of things i dont know just some thoughts about the whole bleach world
well i would say that the king would b first and humans/quincy after hollows/arrancar and shinigami after human/quincy. think abt that. quincy and shinigami are trained to beat hollows and we have seen some shinigami take down arrancar. we've also seen humans/quincy take down arrancar. NOw i dont know abt the hell shinigami but i guess there are shinigami who can beat them. i think its just the talent of the specific character. Plus where do vaizard fit into this scale? But back on topic. what do you mean they are opposite? like they "kill" the dead instead of save them? that could b understandable but why hasn't Ichigo seen n e of them yet? i think its moreso like i sed be4 with the agreement between the hell and SS. where SS controls the spirits of the dead 4 10000 yrs then Hell then vice-versa. I also think Hell isn't necessary at all because when we look at the differents sections of SS. we see that certain parts were like Hell(where Kenpachi came from) making hell really useless. Maybe the spirits became evil after they entered SS but they seem like they belong in hell.
I wouldn't be surprised if KT decided to continue Bleach after Winter War because hell can be very well adapted into the story after that. SS and HM hadn't seemed to be fond of each other before Aizen's betrayel so a war might have been only a matter of time and Aizen had given more than enough reason for a war. It would be only natural if hell and the other dimensions also didn't have a permanent and stable peace. A war between three worlds(living world, SS, HM) might affect the so-called peace between Hell. Then, the hell gets angry at both SS and HM because of their "naughtiness" and decides to take over the mission of SS and eliminate them. Actually I think it would be so awesome and wouldn't be a far fetched story since we know there is a world called "hell" which is a huge mystery. But God knows how many years would it take... Another 5 years or more?
Last edited by nell; March 20, 2007 at 08:10 AM.
whew reading this topic reminds me thath the arc right now wont be the end
imo, i think hell is probably just a battleground most likely
where only "evil" souls are left wandering in hell
no peacekeepers or anything, most likely just random creatures wanderin around
because if its another place like SS or HM then im pretty sure at some point, they would at least mention of a group like shinigamiz/hollows so its probably either not important or its just nothin there
maybe the vaizards are the hell shinigami
Ever since the Vizards came along I have wondered about this other realms and crossovers of people. So far we have being presented with the Shinigami, the Hollow, the Quincy, the Soul, the Human, the Arrancar, the Vizard, and the many others peppered during the Filler Arcs. As well as the many realms like Soul Society, Hueco Mundo, the Human World and the Severing World.
But there are many others that have being hinted and yet never presented. I feel the time for their appearance is coming.
Unlike Naruto, Bleach tends to move at a much faster pace, both in the manga and the anime, and the fillers tend to be of small duration and more action packed. Not that I'm bashing Naruto, it's my 2nd favorite anime (after Ranma), just look at my user name.
The manga has stated that during the winter, the final battle will come, and so far in the manga is summer. In the following chapters Aizen and SS will duke it out and it will probably be a draw. Then both sides will return to their corners and regroup.
But what will happen in between? What other conflicts are there to be decided? What will Ichigo and company do until the final battle?
Here is where I think Heaven and Hell will make an entrance. You see, both Chad and Orihime posses abilities that only Aizen has recognized to be beyond the known realms between SS and HM, and everyone else deems as supernatural.
As Aizen has pointed out Orihime's ability of controlling time and making events change in a control space is concider sinful by heaven, which would probably mean Inoue is a fallen angel or a decendant of Heaven, just like Ichigo decends from a Shinigami. Then you got Chad, whose powers remained unchanged in SS but received a power-up in HM. HM is closer to Hell and it is very provable the closeness to the source of Chad's powers inherits him to awaken further, probably to the point of becoming a full armored demon, just like Ichigo, Inoue, and Ishida, he is a decendant of another race stranded in the human world.
But why would Heaven and Hell care to intervene now of all times?
Let's look at the unseen realms.
Heaven: a place where the destined souls that Shinigami have transfered, having passes the trials of Souls Society by living in an impoverish state outside the walls of the Seretei, will arrive and rest in peace. Yamamoto has refered to it as "True Heaven" and has hinted you need a key to enter which only he posseses, but can also be duplicated under the right conditions.
Hell: a place where all souls from the Human World decent after having commited sinful actions, such as killing humans (not human souls), they will be drawn into the Gates of Hell after being killed by a Shinigami when in Hollow form. We have seen the gates open for a hollow and a huge arm reaching for it and dragging him inside, probably the devil.
Aizen plans to blow Karakura Town to bits and from the inmense amount of released spirit energy create his very own key and cross over to Heaven. Heaven has probably realized by now SS is not going to cut it and probably send their best people (perhaps the mentioned Royal Guard) to aid them against Aizen.
In my opinion Aizen may strike a truce with whomever is in charge of Hell and convince him to side with him against the other realms, in which case this will all become an all out war from all sides and we will have ourselves plenty of Bleach for years to come. This will also arise many questions as to the identity of Inoue and Chad and their alliances to other realms. And I hope we are introduced to devine beings and demons, in a manner that would help Ichigo further power-up for a final battle.
Is just a thought, but I hope the plot leans towards that direction.
Last edited by The Last Uchiha; July 28, 2008 at 05:51 PM.
How do we know sould society is heaven? For all we know SS is anything but paradise and people and shinigami there die and go off somewhre else.
Where do shinigami go when they die? I remember reading somewhere that when shinigami die they are reborn as humans, but I dont know if that is true or not.
Maybe the kings dimesions is heaven, but considering that it is a place within ss, I doupt it.
Maybe bleach world is diveded in HW, HM, Hell, SS, KD, Heaven.
To lengthen the topic and to make things a little more interesting..
A Shinigami's zanpakutou clears up all the sins a Hollow has committed during its period as a Hollow with a single slash.(If the Shinigami's weaker,a few more slashes then.)That's how spirits who were once Hollows get into Soul Society.But spirits who have committed many terrible sins in life,and then continue to become Hollows are doomed to enter Hell the moment it gets chopped up.
It's interesting how the guard of Hell is then introduced.
Notice how its appearance completely differs from that of the Shinigamis,the Arrancar or Vizard?Intricate tattoos,multi-plated arm and is that a spear or sword like zanpakuto?Definitely more interesting than the norm Shinigami.
@ The Last Uchiha:
Really like your words there, every last one of them!
The thoughts of Orihime and Chad was that cought my attention the most! How their powers can become stronger/greater if their in the right realm. Orihime in "pure" Heaven and Chad in "pure" Hell.
Would be great (or not, depends on how it would told by Kubo) if it where to be Aizen and the "King of Hell" teaming up against everyone else.
Maybe Ichigo & co would find new allias/friends that has the same powers as Orihime and Chad, and with that help them become stronger.
An arc on that would get to me. Like it would be a completely new Bleach though ofc following the same characters but with a different mainstory.
Then it would really be Good vs Evil / Heaven vs Hell.
Maybe then we would have every question sorted out about every realm and character
@ The Last Uchiha:
The Kings Dimension has never been stated as heaven, the only mention of heaven i can recall was by Aizen. I cant remember the quote so that would be appreciated. Also i do remember it being mentioned that the dead of SS become the spirit particles that make up SS. Once again i do not have the quote but i think it was in the recent flashbacks. Other than that its quite a good idea but if Aizen is as powerful and fearless as he says then why would he enlist the help of hell?