I guess it get over shadowed by butter knife easily going through August and a wooden stick going through gildartsofc but you cannot explain that to some people
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
After Wendy hit her. She didn't even flinch when Erza placed a sword strike on her dome while she was defenseless.
Jellal is the weakest person in this match
And Skullion was completely wrong. This is the same Skullion that thought he. Kyria and Madmole could handle Dragon Gods.
War was a wreck but its canon. Spriggans clearly can't wreck FT lmao since whenever a FT high tier member got serious or bloodlusted they instantly stomped their opponent.
Dude, at least refute my claim properly. I said Ajeel was an insect compared to Laxus, and he is since August thought Laxus would have killed him with a nameless nuke.
That doesn't make any sense. All she did was detach the Magic. Irene herself makes no mention that she damaged Nebel or killed a Dragon:
I wasn't arguing differently, I'm saying that so far Erza's Enchanted swords have had the best in-combat feats.
Its a good thing Irene only faced POF Erza after Deus Sema was called in.
Natsu can just aim his attacks towards the sky then? Both Laxus and Natsu have AoE big enough to hit her, Laxus did this with a nameless spell:
I don't really get the purpose of this point but...
Her feat against Dragon Acnologia wasn't POF, Acno got pushed by Christina, Meteor Jellal and (IIRC) Tenrou Makarov. Her entire armoury being able to force Acnologia down isn't surprising at all, he evaded Christina's bullets for Christ's sake. And Erza did that to a mindless Acno that was just following Magic.
Once again you're ignoring the fact that Erza has clearly improved since Alvarez. And DF Natsu only going for finishers means fuck all when Irene has nothing to say she can avoid the AoE of his attack.
Broadly, I agree.Boys murderstomp in Round 1
Round 2 is a stomp too, Laxus is the main hitter and Jellal + Gildarts provide any support that's needed.
________________________________________________________________________________________
This is going to be my last 'full' reply since its looking like we're not going to convince each other. That said I may reply on one or two points. I'll try and kep this concise.
And Skullion was completely wrong. This is the same Skullion that thought he. Kyria and Madmole could handle Dragon Gods.
Also, as I asked before and you never answered, why are you taking Skullion's word as gospel when you fervently refuse to accept August's statement that Laxus would have one-shot killed Ajeel? Its hypocritical.
So we have:
1) Wendy in DF going to attack Kyria
2) Kyria dodging, with Wendy still in DF
3) Gag moment where Wendy is drawn in base
4) Kyria's Roar cutting her up
5) Base Wendy KO'd over Erza
If I'm to believe you, then DF Wendy decided to immediately revert in to base after one attack was dodged to make a "SmAlL bOoBs fUnNy" moment and then got cut up? Personally I don't buy that because Wendy would have to be an idiot to do that. Even if you want to go the extra mile and say she reverted because she thought Lucy could handle it, that's still stupid for two reasons:
1) Its Lucy up against someone Wendy just saw tear straight through one of her strongest attacks (Aqua Metria)
2) Kyria is a Dragon Slayer and all of the Slayers have Roars, Wendy not expecting her to use it and instead reverting to base would be dumb as hell
War was a wreck but its canon. Spriggans clearly can't wreck FT lmao since whenever a FT high tier member got serious or bloodlusted they instantly stomped their opponent.
The only ones that don't fit this is are August, Irene and Larcade. Even with that being said, Irene was getting a severe challenge from Erza and Wendy. and Larcade got downed by WSD Rough Silk.
Brandish is a weird one because she somehow managed to stop Gray from turning to ash (tbh that made no sense, why would shrinking him stop the ash conversion?). I want to see more feats from Brandish because she might also be an exception
Overall though the Spriggans are trash, especially considering their hype. Wahl was getting dominated for most of his fight against a terminally ill Laxus and only got major hits on him because he started having MBP-related fits. Neinhart got one-shotted by Grand Chariot and then two-hit KO'd by nameless punches from base Natsu. Bradman's attacks couldn't even put down Levy. Ajeel got beat by Elfman and Lisanna and only had such an easy time with Erza because he was intangible and his Sand World eliminated any counter Erza had to him. Invel got stomped once Gray got pissed. Jacob without Transport couldn't put down Lucy.
DiMaria is also a weird one. Word of God says Age Seal traps everyone who isn't E.N.D. Personally I disagree with this and tend to leave that out in my power rankings (since DiMaria should be above Larcade and on-par with August/Irene if this is true). To me its just Hiro making stupid fucking statements like he made Alvarez such a stupid fucking arc.
So for me - aside from August/Irene/Larcade/Brandish* - the Spriggans have been outclassed.
* (Even then the jury is out on Brandish. Skullion would have outright one-shot killed Gray so I find it hard to rank her among the DE's, especially since Gray wasn't even aware of her presence and we know power can surpass her hax due to Enhanced Neinhart being completely unaffected)
Dude, at least refute my claim properly. I said Ajeel was an insect compared to Laxus, and he is since August thought Laxus would have killed him with a nameless nuke.
And no, just stop with this ridiculous claim of Elfman hitting harder than FDK Demo Fist. His feat against Madmole is a complete outlier. There's nothing to suggest he has ever had an attack that rivalled one of Natsu's finishers. And don't even bother raising his fight with Ajeel, using an off-panel fight to justify an off-panel fight is dumb as hell.
Oh, and also stop trying to make it sound like Ajeel and 100YQ Laxus faced the same Erza. Erza in 100YQ has obviously improved, much like Laxus has. You're also ignoring the fact that Ajeel's intangibility meant she could only use her Water and Wind swords, which Sand World rendered useless. In comparison Laxus fought a stronger version of Erza, tanked multiple attacks from her and she was the one to go down first (whether it was a tie or not doesn't matter, Erza went down first). Keep in mind Laxus had already had a skirmish with Kyria before this and used a Secret Art on her, so Erza was the fresher combatant at the start of their fight. At worst that hints Laxus is slightly stronger, at best it hints he's fairly stronger because Kyria was capable of giving Erza a good fight.
Ajeel's AoE of Sand World only matters if he doesn't get one-shot by his opponent immediately. And considering what happened with Laxus and Ajeel the last time they met...
That doesn't make any sense. All she did was detach the Magic. Irene herself makes no mention that she damaged Nebel or killed a Dragon:
There was no Dragon to kill, once she removed Nebel's Magic the Dragonisation just reverted because the Seed disappeared.
I wasn't arguing differently, I'm saying that so far Erza's Enchanted swords have had the best in-combat feats.
Irene: Couldn't put down Wendy or Erza despite it looking like a powerful blast
Body swapping is pretty cool but its highly restricted since Irene implied she could only do it with Wendy because she was both a Dragon Slayer and an Enchanter - meaning its a move that as of right now can only be used on Wendy.
Wendy: I can't actually remember her using Enchant offensively since she usually uses her Sky Dragon Slaying Magic for that, but I suppose she should get some credit for Enchanting the sword that damaged Dragon Irene severely enough for Irene to immediately revert to her Human form
Erza: Enchanted swords damaged Laxus
Considering Laxus is incredibly tanky himself, Erza's DeS/DS swords are definitely the best offensive use of Enchant (unless I'm forgetting something).
Its a good thing Irene only faced POF Erza after Deus Sema was called in.
For the rest of their fight Irene was getting challenged by Enchanted Erza and was clearly struggling until she took over Wendy's body, at which point Erza wouldn't attack her. Once Irene was back in her body, she began having trouble again and transformed into her Dragon form.
She tried it once and failed. Wendy was only incapacitated when Irene attacked her while she possessed her body.
Natsu can just aim his attacks towards the sky then? Both Laxus and Natsu have AoE big enough to hit her, Laxus did this with a nameless spell:
And I've already show you scans of Natsu's DF/FDK spells.
Both of them should catch Irene in their spells' AoE with ease.
And they don't need to stand there and tank a slash from Erza, they're fighting Irene, not Erza. As long as they can take attacks that failed to put down Wendy and Erza they should be fine and dandy.
I don't really get the purpose of this point but...
1) You have no proof she can do that, Nebel was running straight at them and made no attempt to move out of the way. Someone as fast as Laxus should be able to evade it, and I have no idea why you're saying she could do that to Wahl when Laxus is faster than him and Wahl isn't who she's fighting
2) Laxus doesn't need to overpower Etherion, Wahl only brought it out when Laxus collapsed due to an MBP-related fit and the time it needed to charge was slow enough for Laxus to create a Jutsu Shiki barrier. Wahl can't just whip it out and use it quickly, otherwise he would have done it sooner since Assault Mode Wahl was focused on terminating him.
Her feat against Dragon Acnologia wasn't POF, Acno got pushed by Christina, Meteor Jellal and (IIRC) Tenrou Makarov. Her entire armoury being able to force Acnologia down isn't surprising at all, he evaded Christina's bullets for Christ's sake. And Erza did that to a mindless Acno that was just following Magic.
Feats that you don't like ≠ POF
As for the point about slashing/stabbing/piercing being more effective than punches, Slayer advantage should more than make up for it.
Besides, we're talking about a strike from broken bones Erza with a sword Enchanted by a crippled Wendy vs all out punches from DF/FDK Natsu and Laxus. Hell, the attacks they throw might not even be punches, Laxus could use Red Lightning or Heavenward Halberd, and Natsu could just as easily use an FDK Roar.
And I think we can both agree that the aforementioned attacks would grievously injure both Human and Dragon forms of Irene.
Once again you're ignoring the fact that Erza has clearly improved since Alvarez. And DF Natsu only going for finishers means fuck all when Irene has nothing to say she can avoid the AoE of his attack.
Also where the actual hell are you getting Irene traversing a country with ease? If you're talking about her clash with Acno on Mount Zonia, Acno flew to her. And if you're talking about her getting to Mira, the country was compressed to 1/20th of its original size and we have no idea where she came from, though it would make sense if she came from nearby considering how close Mount Zonia is to where the Northern battleground was. Regardless she's never shown that speed in combat anyway so there's no reason to factor it in.
Jellal did blitz Acno:
Acno was still looking at the trail of Meteor when Jellal hit him. He also surprised and pushed him back in human form:
"jElLaL'S fEaTs aRe aS aBoUt As GoOd As mAkArOv's fEaTs lMaO"
Bruh, I know you like to downplay Jellal but its not even getting irritating anymore, its just funny. What Jellal did was comparable to Irene's feats.
Skullion's statement has yet to be contradicted.Boys murderstomp in Round 1
Round 2 is a stomp too, Laxus is the main hitter and Jellal + Gildarts provide any support that's needed.
________________________________________________________________________________________
This is going to be my last 'full' reply since its looking like we're not going to convince each other. That said I may reply on one or two points. I'll try and kep this concise.
And Skullion was completely wrong. This is the same Skullion that thought he. Kyria and Madmole could handle Dragon Gods.
Also, as I asked before and you never answered, why are you taking Skullion's word as gospel when you fervently refuse to accept August's statement that Laxus would have one-shot killed Ajeel? Its hypocritical.
So we have:
1) Wendy in DF going to attack Kyria
2) Kyria dodging, with Wendy still in DF
3) Gag moment where Wendy is drawn in base
4) Kyria's Roar cutting her up
5) Base Wendy KO'd over Erza
If I'm to believe you, then DF Wendy decided to immediately revert in to base after one attack was dodged to make a "SmAlL bOoBs fUnNy" moment and then got cut up? Personally I don't buy that because Wendy would have to be an idiot to do that. Even if you want to go the extra mile and say she reverted because she thought Lucy could handle it, that's still stupid for two reasons:
1) Its Lucy up against someone Wendy just saw tear straight through one of her strongest attacks (Aqua Metria)
2) Kyria is a Dragon Slayer and all of the Slayers have Roars, Wendy not expecting her to use it and instead reverting to base would be dumb as hell
War was a wreck but its canon. Spriggans clearly can't wreck FT lmao since whenever a FT high tier member got serious or bloodlusted they instantly stomped their opponent.
The only ones that don't fit this is are August, Irene and Larcade. Even with that being said, Irene was getting a severe challenge from Erza and Wendy. and Larcade got downed by WSD Rough Silk.
Brandish is a weird one because she somehow managed to stop Gray from turning to ash (tbh that made no sense, why would shrinking him stop the ash conversion?). I want to see more feats from Brandish because she might also be an exception
Overall though the Spriggans are trash, especially considering their hype. Wahl was getting dominated for most of his fight against a terminally ill Laxus and only got major hits on him because he started having MBP-related fits. Neinhart got one-shotted by Grand Chariot and then two-hit KO'd by nameless punches from base Natsu. Bradman's attacks couldn't even put down Levy. Ajeel got beat by Elfman and Lisanna and only had such an easy time with Erza because he was intangible and his Sand World eliminated any counter Erza had to him. Invel got stomped once Gray got pissed. Jacob without Transport couldn't put down Lucy.
DiMaria is also a weird one. Word of God says Age Seal traps everyone who isn't E.N.D. Personally I disagree with this and tend to leave that out in my power rankings (since DiMaria should be above Larcade and on-par with August/Irene if this is true). To me its just Hiro making stupid fucking statements like he made Alvarez such a stupid fucking arc.
So for me - aside from August/Irene/Larcade/Brandish* - the Spriggans have been outclassed.
* (Even then the jury is out on Brandish. Skullion would have outright one-shot killed Gray so I find it hard to rank her among the DE's, especially since Gray wasn't even aware of her presence and we know power can surpass her hax due to Enhanced Neinhart being completely unaffected)
Dude, at least refute my claim properly. I said Ajeel was an insect compared to Laxus, and he is since August thought Laxus would have killed him with a nameless nuke.
And no, just stop with this ridiculous claim of Elfman hitting harder than FDK Demo Fist. His feat against Madmole is a complete outlier. There's nothing to suggest he has ever had an attack that rivalled one of Natsu's finishers. And don't even bother raising his fight with Ajeel, using an off-panel fight to justify an off-panel fight is dumb as hell.
Oh, and also stop trying to make it sound like Ajeel and 100YQ Laxus faced the same Erza. Erza in 100YQ has obviously improved, much like Laxus has. You're also ignoring the fact that Ajeel's intangibility meant she could only use her Water and Wind swords, which Sand World rendered useless. In comparison Laxus fought a stronger version of Erza, tanked multiple attacks from her and she was the one to go down first (whether it was a tie or not doesn't matter, Erza went down first). Keep in mind Laxus had already had a skirmish with Kyria before this and used a Secret Art on her, so Erza was the fresher combatant at the start of their fight. At worst that hints Laxus is slightly stronger, at best it hints he's fairly stronger because Kyria was capable of giving Erza a good fight.
Ajeel's AoE of Sand World only matters if he doesn't get one-shot by his opponent immediately. And considering what happened with Laxus and Ajeel the last time they met...
That doesn't make any sense. All she did was detach the Magic. Irene herself makes no mention that she damaged Nebel or killed a Dragon:
There was no Dragon to kill, once she removed Nebel's Magic the Dragonisation just reverted because the Seed disappeared.
I wasn't arguing differently, I'm saying that so far Erza's Enchanted swords have had the best in-combat feats.
Irene: Couldn't put down Wendy or Erza despite it looking like a powerful blast
Body swapping is pretty cool but its highly restricted since Irene implied she could only do it with Wendy because she was both a Dragon Slayer and an Enchanter - meaning its a move that as of right now can only be used on Wendy.
Wendy: I can't actually remember her using Enchant offensively since she usually uses her Sky Dragon Slaying Magic for that, but I suppose she should get some credit for Enchanting the sword that damaged Dragon Irene severely enough for Irene to immediately revert to her Human form
Erza: Enchanted swords damaged Laxus
Considering Laxus is incredibly tanky himself, Erza's DeS/DS swords are definitely the best offensive use of Enchant (unless I'm forgetting something).
Its a good thing Irene only faced POF Erza after Deus Sema was called in.
For the rest of their fight Irene was getting challenged by Enchanted Erza and was clearly struggling until she took over Wendy's body, at which point Erza wouldn't attack her. Once Irene was back in her body, she began having trouble again and transformed into her Dragon form.
She tried it once and failed. Wendy was only incapacitated when Irene attacked her while she possessed her body.
Natsu can just aim his attacks towards the sky then? Both Laxus and Natsu have AoE big enough to hit her, Laxus did this with a nameless spell:
And I've already show you scans of Natsu's DF/FDK spells.
Both of them should catch Irene in their spells' AoE with ease.
And they don't need to stand there and tank a slash from Erza, they're fighting Irene, not Erza. As long as they can take attacks that failed to put down Wendy and Erza they should be fine and dandy.
I don't really get the purpose of this point but...
1) You have no proof she can do that, Nebel was running straight at them and made no attempt to move out of the way. Someone as fast as Laxus should be able to evade it, and I have no idea why you're saying she could do that to Wahl when Laxus is faster than him and Wahl isn't who she's fighting
2) Laxus doesn't need to overpower Etherion, Wahl only brought it out when Laxus collapsed due to an MBP-related fit and the time it needed to charge was slow enough for Laxus to create a Jutsu Shiki barrier. Wahl can't just whip it out and use it quickly, otherwise he would have done it sooner since Assault Mode Wahl was focused on terminating him.
Her feat against Dragon Acnologia wasn't POF, Acno got pushed by Christina, Meteor Jellal and (IIRC) Tenrou Makarov. Her entire armoury being able to force Acnologia down isn't surprising at all, he evaded Christina's bullets for Christ's sake. And Erza did that to a mindless Acno that was just following Magic.
Feats that you don't like ≠ POF
As for the point about slashing/stabbing/piercing being more effective than punches, Slayer advantage should more than make up for it.
Besides, we're talking about a strike from broken bones Erza with a sword Enchanted by a crippled Wendy vs all out punches from DF/FDK Natsu and Laxus. Hell, the attacks they throw might not even be punches, Laxus could use Red Lightning or Heavenward Halberd, and Natsu could just as easily use an FDK Roar.
And I think we can both agree that the aforementioned attacks would grievously injure both Human and Dragon forms of Irene.
Once again you're ignoring the fact that Erza has clearly improved since Alvarez. And DF Natsu only going for finishers means fuck all when Irene has nothing to say she can avoid the AoE of his attack.
Also where the actual hell are you getting Irene traversing a country with ease? If you're talking about her clash with Acno on Mount Zonia, Acno flew to her. And if you're talking about her getting to Mira, the country was compressed to 1/20th of its original size and we have no idea where she came from, though it would make sense if she came from nearby considering how close Mount Zonia is to where the Northern battleground was. Regardless she's never shown that speed in combat anyway so there's no reason to factor it in.
Jellal did blitz Acno:
Acno was still looking at the trail of Meteor when Jellal hit him. He also surprised and pushed him back in human form:
"jElLaL'S fEaTs aRe aS aBoUt As GoOd As mAkArOv's fEaTs lMaO"
Bruh, I know you like to downplay Jellal but its not even getting irritating anymore, its just funny. What Jellal did was comparable to Irene's feats.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---
I was talking about her getting hurt.what does August has to do with this
that just means her damage in human form doesn't translate to dragon form.
But her Dragon form damage transferred to her human form so that means her Dragon form is her real form and the human form is the transformation otherwise the damage she took to her human form should have transferred over to the Dragon form.that just means her damage in human form doesn't translate to dragon form.
when she was knocked out of her dragon form, she still had the same injuries she suffered in her human form
human form is NOT = Dragon form.
Erza hit her below forehead with her head while her sword hit her on top of her head as she sliced her hat in half.
point is, she can suffer damage in her human form and can feel pain and I'm pretty sure Hiro didn't thought about it. also, her dragon scales may cover her wounds that she suffered in human form so they don't show in dragon form (for example, when Frieza transformed into his 4th form, he had no injuries but his natural form is his first form)
Only time she was really hurt was when Wendy was damaging her. We saw her take Erza's sword to head without even a budge.
Are you serious ?
That sword was the same sword imbued with DS magic.Are you serious ?
What kind of dragon gets killed by a metal sword lol ? If you're implying human form is just a cover which means her durability of a dragon should be still there. So you're basically implying her dragon scales are so weak that they get pierced by a metal sword lol.
Human Irene and Dragon Irene are obviously not the same.
but she was clearly cut and hurt and she said AAAAAGH.
That was bcs of Wendy. She took Erza's attack she took to the head without pain and it was from a more severe attack yet she felt pain from a lesser attack? That doesn't make sense.
