Theory Final Tournament Line-up Discussion/Predictions

[Kaoz]

Does he need a match for his character? Every time he opens his mouth he gets softer, he started as a pos and is now a very supportive leader. So far he has baited us against Volk, Amadeus and Ryoma, maybe that is the whole point of having him around.

Sure, that's possible. Maybe Tokugawa plays Volk and neither him nor Byoudouin appear in the finals. But that's a different line of reasoning than saying Byoudouin won't play because he has already played. My issue there was more with the justification than the concept.

 

[LetalHawk]

I have two alternatives, like Kaoz said, I guess the Msers that will play vs. Spain are Ryoma, Kintaro, Atobe, Fuji and Kite. The Hsers will be Tokugawa, Byodouin or Irie depending who faces Volk in S1.

1. If Irie plays vs Volk:

S3: Kintaro vs Spain's No.3 (which I suspect he's the hooded guy that appears at the end of ch. 318)
D2: Fuji/Kite
S2: Byodouin vs Medanore
D1: Tokugawa/Atobe
S1: Ryoma vs. Ryoga

2: If Byo plays vs Volk:

S3: Kintaro vs Spain's No.3
D2: Atobe/Kite
S2: Tokugawa vs Medanore
D1: Irie/Fuji
S1: Ryoma vs Ryoga

 

[André Vinícius]

So Kintaro loses yet another match. The dude can't catch a break beating only Dorgias right?

In this situation I think S2 and S1 goes to Japan and Kite haven't won anything at all so his double needs a win more than Kintaro.

I think that as well. However, if I'm not mistaken, Coach Mifune yells at other coaches and says who would play aginst Volk then after they suggest Byo plays in D or something like that.

I personaly think Toku has a higher chance of playing Volk because the captain of the team should play in the final right ? and I don't think Mifune always go with what is the best since he put a MSr agaisnt Tezuka knowing it would be a loss, put Duke agaisnt Camus (knowing it would be a loss, I don't think there's someone here who thinks Duke could do it).

Line-up Japan vs Spain (updated with "ages")

S3: Kintaro x XXXX (3rd HSr) Spain win

D2: Kite and Atobe x XXXX (3rd MSr and 3rd MSr) Japan win

S2: Ryoma x Ryoga Japan win (can swap with S1)

D1: Fuji and Irie/Ochi x XXXX (2nd HSr 1st MSr) Spain win

S1: Byodoin/Tokugawa x Medanore Japan win (can swap with S2)

I think its better for Kintaro to lose to a HSr and Kite doubles beat a MSr double, D1 we can have a genius MSr like Fuji

 

[Atobe Keigo]

Hi everyone,

I'm seriously wondering if Atobe will play a single game during the World cup ?
We are now at the end of SF and only 4 potential singles games are remaining (S1 vs Germany, S3/S2/S1 vs Spain)
Almost all best MSers from POT have already played at least 1 single game

Tezuka (vs Japan)
Yukimura (vs Germany)
Ryoma (vs France)
Sanada (vs France)
Jin (vs Switzerland)
Kintaro (vs Australia)

I can't not imagine him facing Volk as S1 vs Germany. Neither face Ryoga (it shall be Ryoma) nor Medanoré in the finals. They are all way too strong for him.
S3 vs Spain is (for me) the only possible option we still have to see him play a single game but without certainty (it's the final !)

Anyway, if it should be like this, it would be too bad for Atobe (MSers Captain) to only play doubles. He sees himself as a rival(friend) to Tezuka who is largely making progress and turning pro.

What are your feelings regarding this ?

 

[Hardy]

Hi everyone,

I'm seriously wondering if Atobe will play a single game during the World cup ?
We are now at the end of SF and only 4 potential singles games are remaining (S1 vs Germany, S3/S2/S1 vs Spain)
Almost all best MSers from POT have already played at least 1 single game

Tezuka (vs Japan)
Yukimura (vs Germany)
Ryoma (vs France)
Sanada (vs France)
Jin (vs Switzerland)
Kintaro (vs Australia)

I can't not imagine him facing Volk as S1 vs Germany. Neither face Ryoga (it shall be Ryoma) nor Medanoré in the finals. They are all way too strong for him.
S3 vs Spain is (for me) the only possible option we still have to see him play a single game but without certainty (it's the final !)

Anyway, if it should be like this, it would be too bad for Atobe (MSers Captain) to only play doubles. He sees himself as a rival(friend) to Tezuka who is largely making progress.

What are your feelings regarding this ?

I mean... Fuji, Kite, Shiraishi, Kirihara, etc haven't. Only Yukimura and Sanada aren't seen as Singles only in that list imo, so the rest was to be expected.

There's only 4 singles matches left, but you have Ryoma, Kintarou, Tokugawa, Byoudouin and maybe Irie as more prominent singles players than Atobe. I really don't see him playing unless Konomi throws a curve ball and Byoudouin doesn't play at all and Irie focuses on doubles or Kintarou is sent to play doubles against Spain which would be odd to say the least.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Dec 12, 2020 ---

Shocked your username wasn't taken already btw

 

[Kaoz]

I largely agree with Hardy regarding Atobe's singles prospects, although with the caveat that if there's two HSers in the finals line-up, we should probably expect both of them in doubles. Just historically, the only time Japan didn't use a HS/MS doubles was against Australia, where the team was comprised almost entirely of MSers. That said, even in that case I'm not sure if Atobe would get the final singles spot over Fuji.

I personaly think Toku has a higher chance of playing Volk because the captain of the team should play in the final right ? and I don't think Mifune always go with what is the best since he put a MSr agaisnt Tezuka knowing it would be a loss, put Duke agaisnt Camus (knowing it would be a loss, I don't think there's someone here who thinks Duke could do it).

I don't want to go into detail in this thread (feel free to start a new one if you're interested in this discussion), but let the record show that I do disagree regarding Duke.

As for your broader point, there's a few other factors to consider in my mind. For starters, you could also argue the captain should play against the strongest opponent and we don't know the assessment on this. The only thing we know is that Medanore could've surpassed Volk if he hadn't been injured, but there doesn't seem to be any up-to-date data on him to validate the assumption that he's stronger right now.

Beyond that, this presumes that Byoudouin playing against Volk means he won't play against Spain. This is an argument we can reasonably make at a meta level, but I don't know if it holds in-universe. I reckon that even if Byoudouin had played against Camus, Mifune would've wanted to field him again later on. So it makes more sense to me to expect Byoudouin against Volk and then prevent him from playing Spain due to an external factor.

 

[TFJ]

I for one see Atobe and Kintarou as equally likely single 1.

I dont see Kintarou as a necessary single player. I mean, Kintaro is a big player but Konomi has no idea how to use him. So I could easily just see him saying F IT and doubles.

That said, I would place Atobe singles over him more.... except Atobe has shown a lot of doubles interaction this series. So he could easily just be stuck in the double role with a HSer.

 

[Atobe Keigo]

I mean... Fuji, Kite, Shiraishi, Kirihara, etc haven't. Only Yukimura and Sanada aren't seen as Singles only in that list imo, so the rest was to be expected.

There's only 4 singles matches left, but you have Ryoma, Kintarou, Tokugawa, Byoudouin and maybe Irie as more prominent singles players than Atobe. I really don't see him playing unless Konomi throws a curve ball and Byoudouin doesn't play at all and Irie focuses on doubles or Kintarou is sent to play doubles against Spain which would be odd to say the least.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 12, 2020, Original Post Date: Dec 12, 2020 ---

Shocked your username wasn't taken already btw

Kirihara at this stage (in the World cup) doesn't have the potential to play Single. Based on what we know, he isn't this kind of player that can evolve in the middle of a match. Same thing for Kite. Fuji and Shiraishi maybe it's more questionable. But If I remember well when Shiraishi was supposed to face Zeus, he totally losed calm and Tanegashima finally tooked his place...
For me it's important to take into account all these elements because all characters are presented with different potentials, level spirits and leadership...

Concerning Atobe, from the U-17 Camp he is shown as a leader who's continuously growing up. the 5th court was leaded by him. he faced Irie who is in a reality a Japan representative (same level as Oni according to the translations I found) and it ended with a no game. He was also described by the coaches (Tsuge, Kurobe, Saito) like someone who has a an unusual growth up among the rest of the MSers... he was the only one wining a game against the G10 (with Niou in double) and Konomi represented him sitting in the stands with the 1st stringers... after that Mifune naturally awarded him MSers Captain. Then he lost game against Tezuka (Irie was purposefully holding back) during the Exh Match and came back even more determinated vs Australia...
I won't remember what he said to Tezuka before his departure, but the construction put in place by the author is like Atobe will have a real important role in the Japan success...

Thats why I said it would be too bad if he doesn't play single, the storytelling is going in the way we can not imagine something else.

 

[Hardy]

Kirihara at this stage (in the World cup) doesn't have the potential to play Single. Based on what we know, he isn't this kind of player that can evolve in the middle of a match.

He got upgrades against Fuji, Krauser, Matsudaira/Miyako and got one just before the current match. That's half of his matches.

He is going head to head against a TnK user. That's huge.

Concerning Atobe, from the U-17 Camp he is shown as a leader who's continuously growing up. the 5th court was leaded by him. he faced Irie who is in a reality a Japan representative (same level as Oni according to the translations I found) and it ended with a no game. He was also described by the coaches (Tsuge, Kurobe, Saito) like someone who has a an unusual growth up among the rest of the MSers... he was the only one wining a game against the G10 (with Niou in double) and Konomi represented him sitting in the stands with the 1st stringers... after that Mifune naturally awarded him MSers Captain. Then he lost game against Tezuka (Irie was purposefully holding back) during the Exh Match and came back even more determinated vs Australia...
I won't remember what he said to Tezuka before his departure, but the construction put in place by the author is like Atobe will have a real important role in the Japan success...

Thats why I said it would be too bad if he doesn't play single, the storytelling is going in the way we can not imagine something else.

I mean, I know. But at no point did you explain why it's so bad he doesn't play singles. If anything he can also be a leader and an important player in doubles. Storytelling at no point indicated otherwise.

 

[Shogun Ryoma]

I legit can't wait to who's gonna face ryoga, is it gonna be Japan or Germany! Tezuka vs ryoga would be lit!!

 

[mathematicianrcg]

I legit can't wait to who's gonna face ryoga, is it gonna be Japan or Germany! Tezuka vs ryoga would be lit!!

If somehow Germany Beat Japan. It would probably QP Vs Ryoga

 

[Adamska]

I read on wikiFandom that Little Volk is Pro B and Dankmar was previous Pro B and now Pro D. I assume Monster Volk is Pro A, LV Pro B, and D Pro D. Who's Pro C? a new hidden character? since QP and Bismarck are yet to be Pros. Could that, if there's one mysterious Pro C, play S1?

 

[Kaoz]

I read on wikiFandom that Little Volk is Pro B and Dankmar was previous Pro B and now Pro D. I assume Monster Volk is Pro A, LV Pro B, and D Pro D. Who's Pro C? a new hidden character? since QP and Bismarck are yet to be Pros. Could that, if there's one mysterious Pro C, play S1?

I don't think that's accurate. The "B" and "D" simply refer to their first names, Bertie and Dankmar. So there's no ranking associated with them and probably no hidden character "C" either.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

I originally said Germany should beat Japan.

But with the way things are happening.

If Japan will lose, it is more likely to be against Spain.

Ofc, higher chance for japan to win. Ryoma is there, the protagonist

 

[mathematicianrcg]

This is my Updated Prediction lineup if Byodoin beats Volk

Japan lineup (Vs Spain)

D2: Irie/Atobe
D1: Ohmagari/Fuji
S3: Kintaro
S2: Tokugawa
S1: Ryoma

PS: I can also switch Fuji and Kintaro. Tokugawa and Ryoma depends on where will Medanore and Ryoga play. Ryoma needs to match up against Ryoga, While Tokugawa needs to match up against Medanore. And I really like for Atobe and Irie to have a serious doubles game, Irie was not serious vs QP/Tezuka because he knows they didnt have a chance to win anyway. And for all Genius 10, Only Ohmagari have no spotlight yet.

 

[Hardy]

This is my Updated Prediction lineup if Byodoin beats Volk

Japan lineup (Vs Spain)

D2: Irie/Atobe
D1: Ohmagari/Fuji
S3: Kintaro
S2: Tokugawa
S1: Ryoma

PS: I can also switch Fuji and Kintaro. Tokugawa and Ryoma depends on where will Medanore and Ryoga play. Ryoma needs to match up against Ryoga, While Tokugawa needs to match up against Medanore. And I really like for Atobe and Irie to have a serious doubles game, Irie was not serious vs QP/Tezuka because he knows they didnt have a chance to win anyway. And for all Genius 10, Only Ohmagari have no spotlight yet.

Keep in mind we are back to Nationals' order. It probably changes who you see winning/losing.

Right now I think it's something like:

S3: Irie
D2: Marui/Atobe
S2: Kintarou
D1: Fuji/Kite (British Castle pair '-')
S1: Tokugawa
R: Ryoma

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Keep in mind we are back to Nationals' order. It probably changes who you see winning/losing.

Right now I think it's something like:

S3: Irie
D2: Marui/Atobe
S2: Kintarou
D1: Fuji/Kite (British Castle pair '-')
S1: Tokugawa
R: Ryoma

So Ryoma and Ryoga are both reserves????

 

[Hardy]

So Ryoma and Ryoga are both reserves????

Yeah. Like, Ryoga is meant to play S2 but declines because his opponent isn't Ryoma. This way Tokugawa plays S1 but isn't in the last match.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 19, 2021, Original Post Date: Nov 19, 2021 ---

This is much more likely however:

S3 Atobe
D2 Irie-Fuji
S2 Kintarou
D1 Tokugawa-Kite
S1 Ryoma

The last four really need to win imo so I put them all at the end for the 0-2 comeback... Even though Kite at D1 bugs me a lot.

 

[mathematicianrcg]

Yeah. Like, Ryoga is meant to play S2 but declines because his opponent isn't Ryoma. This way Tokugawa plays S1 but isn't in the last match.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 19, 2021, Original Post Date: Nov 19, 2021 ---

This is much more likely however:

S3 Atobe
D2 Irie-Fuji
S2 Kintarou
D1 Tokugawa-Kite
S1 Ryoma

The last four really need to win imo so I put them all at the end for the 0-2 comeback... Even though Kite at D1 bugs me a lot.

Ouch. Atobe, Fuji, and Irie gonna lose. But I expect a big power up from them.

But if this is the lineup. I also expect it will be similar to Rikkai Vs Seigaku.

The Final Boss Team (Spain) will win first 2 sets.

PS: I think Spain will be a lot stronger than Germany. Hot take, but I think it is

 

[LetalHawk]

I think it’ll be like this:

S3: Kintarou (L)
D2: Atobe/Kite (W)
S2: Tokugawa (W)
D1: Irie/Fuji (L)
S1: Ryoma (W)

I just can’t see Atobe in Singles over Toku or Kintarou, the former needs a big win since he lost every match he played so far and Medanore it’s probably his most likely opponent as nobody but Ryoma will face Ryoga, it’ll feel a bit odd if his last match is in doubles tbh. The latter will probably face Spain’s No.3.

As for doubles, Kite needs a win yes or yes so if Konomi will show new pairs that he hasn’t made before, Atobe/Kite and Irie/Fuji are the only options, or Konomi could throw a curveball here and put Kin-chan in doubles, and make Atobe play Singles. Kintarou in doubles strikes me as very unlikely but it wouldn’t surprise me if Konomi ends up doing it.

Then, we could also get:

S3: Atobe
D2: Kintarou/Kite
S2: Tokugawa
D1: Irie/Fuji
S1: Ryoma

Kintarou could swap between doubles (i.e Kintarou/Irie and Fuji/Kite, or Kintarou/Fuji and Irie/Kite could also be possible pairs).