1.- They are in the new world.
2.- They are an organization above CP9 which was in itself an unofficial CP to begin with.
3.- Their name, CPAEGIS0. The aegis part is IMO relevants and perhaps non intuitively to a secret secret shady organization which is supposed to work in the shadows without others even knowing what it does reveals something about their function.
An aegis is a sort of shield, in other words it is reasonable to assume the CP0 works as a sort of shield to the world government. Being the top intelligence organization in the government it is not that unreasonable to think of them as the last shield perhaps. Now, CP9, an organization beneath them can't possibly be weaker than them, it would make no sense at. CP9 would already be too weak to be relevant as it was in the new world, CP0 necessarily has to be above them 2 years ago. As an intelligence unit they would have to get involved with relevant people in the new world which means in itself that the danger they have to face would be exponential greater than anything in the first half of the grand line. At the very least anyone relevant would be surrounded by extremely powerful people. It is worth noting that the range of strength is wide though. It is entirely possible any one of them is strong enough to give CP9 the fodder treatment while at the same time they would not match up to any one in the monster trio. I would think their key members will be on the level with the likes of the monster trio though. I don't think robin would have been so concerned about them if they were merely on the level with CP9 for that matter. Robin should have grown significantly stronger over the timeskip and even then she is with law and ussop with law in particular being exceptional and without a doubt able to give the fodder treatment to the CP9 from 2 years ago.
As for their presence in dressrosa, I would think with what we know there are enough reasons for them to be there. Doflamingo is a former shichibukai who ruled the kingdom and even if he abdicated it does seem as if he is still in control. Since this involved the highest government level it makes sense an intelligence unit would be involved. Doflamingo seems to be damn powerful and his unique position would definitely warrant investigation by the world government. It wouldn't even be strange if they at least suspected of his dealings in the underworld. More importantly, something happening to a shichibukai shifts the balance of the world by default and right now the new world is exceptionally dangerous. The world government will want to be as involved as they can with what is going on.
CPO is def. not on the same level as cp9 if even law is worried and robin is sweating.. lol
Last edited by danzouismadara; May 05, 2013 at 12:43 AM.
I think Enel was VA level. I don't think Lucci was that strong. I just think Luffy was seriously weak at that point in comparison to the Top tier characters.
You can't be a VA without Haki btw so Lucci would be Rear Admiral level.
I'm expecting there is somebody there who can give Sanji a proper fight.
CP9 were so wack and only Lucci, Kaku, Jabra and Blueno were of notable ability individually.
The rest were no higher than what would be roughly Captain level in the Marines
(Although Marine ranks aren't fully based on strength its the best I can grade them at)
Enel VA Level lol
If you mean garp power by that ok
He atleast close to admiral
But if you saying he is average VA
Than all new world captain WB ally was enel level power
And if VA so godly strong buster call is just wast of ammo.
They will send just on ship with VA and work is done.
Luffy win with him only becouse his df
Many say mr. Crocodile was weaker than luffy too
and he fight on pair with dd and mihawk
Last edited by PLfighter; May 05, 2013 at 01:17 PM.
Yes Lucci is VA level... Luffy was knocking out VA Giants before the timeskip, Lucci is at least low level VA considering some of the ones we have seen have been utterly trashed... though that wasn't the main point of my original post
So its only common sense to assume Garp & Sengoku as Admiral level characters.
Crocodile was not equal or on par with Mihawk the man who trained Zoro for two years, or Doflamingo.
---------- Post added at 10:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 PM ----------
Lucci doesn't have Haki, and how many VA Giants was Luffy "knocking out"?
I don't think there is enough to suggest Lucci was VA level. The Luffy he lost to, wasn't necessarily too strong.
He had only just begun to use Gear2nd+3rd in that arc, its likely his mastery of it improved in arcs after.
---------- Post added at 09:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:41 PM ----------
Well, to be fair those are exactly the sort of enemies oda has introduced right now. Hodi was cannon fodder to the point where he was defeated underwater by zoro. Even after his transformation he was not a proper opponent for luffy. Luffy defeated him even though he was the worst choice to actually fight him. Imagine how he would do in an underwater fight against sanji under similar circumstances.... Sanji has his blue walk, he would have clobbered him. Easily at that. Ceasar was weak too. He was at most in a similar situation to enel, not much physical capacity to speak of but in turn had an exceptionally hard fruit to deal with. Well, the moment CP0 are capable of giving the likes of sanji a true fight we are talking about people with a huge amount of power on their hands. Some people are against CP0 even being relevant so far although I do think they will be relevant against the monster trio.
We have to consider that as far as the VAs go oda has actually made a point of not showing how strong they are. I guess it makes sense, it helped to avoid showing us just how weak luffy was before the timeskip and it keeps some mystery now as to the true strength of the marines. Eventually luffy and co will have to fight VAs with true power and it is definitely going to be tough on them.
Considering CP9's current abilities, if you put them in the New World they would die extremely fast.
If your strongest member is Rear Admiral level in your team, and your second strongest is Commodore at best, then it doesn't look too good for you in New World.
I'm just expecting the Government to have Sanji level fighters hidden away.
They must have some VA level guys. You look at the Gorosei and they almost confirm people in the Government get involved in combat.
Considering CP7 had Wanze and CP6 had Jerry it absolutely means that Cipher Pol have fighters.
Whilst Jerry was seriously weak, Wanze made Sanji get a tiny bit serious for an enjoyable fight (Better in the anime tbh).
It infers to me that, Jerry in CP6 was weaker than Wanze in CP7 and that all units have members capable of serious combat.
Though at that time, those guys could be no stronger than the rank between Captain and Lt. in the Marines they were pretty wack.
I'd be really surprised if CP0 were an overall fodder unit, and I expect them to be able to give good fights going by Law's reaction.
Last edited by Fox666; May 06, 2013 at 06:58 AM.
However in the war, Momonga and Dalmatian completely outclassed Luffy when they met him in the war. Onigumo managed to catch Marco like a bitch, and thanks to his Spider fruit can use a Hachitoryuu sword style.
Look at Vergo, the current Smoker, and more importantly the fact that all VA's have Haki.
Something which Lucci doesn't have. Lucci cannot compete with those mentioned.
Rear Admiral for him.
Lucci was awesome, but if he bumps into Marco or a Logia, he's dead due to no Haki. Easily dead.
You have to remember, Bounties don't reflect strength entirely, but reflect the danger that individual poses to the government.
I'm talking about Kaku, who once Zoro got serious, was finished instantly .
When Zoro brought out his Asura, Kaku was put to sleep.
So Rear Admiral/Commodore for him. Since he has no Haki too. I guess same for Jabra he wasn't weak either.
I expect Pre-Timeskip X Drake to have beaten Kaku and he was a RearAdmiral but I'll accept I'm underestimating Kaku and Jabra too much. Not the rest though.
Regarding Commodore Pudding, did you forget what happened? A group of fishmen created whirlpools. Nothing to do with combat.
Well, in regards to haki, the VAs and lucci there is one more consideration to make. Remember the boa sisters who luffy fought? Luffy went against them with no haki whatsoever and still overpowered the two even considering the two of them were at least adequate haki users. Haki mastery alone does not make you a monster or even a proper VA level fighter as far as we know. Haki is just one factor in the whole thing, an important one at that but not necessarily the only one. I don't think lucci would hold a candle to most VAs even if haki was restricted in the fight to be honest.
As far as we know, Lucci and Gear 2nd Luffy pre-timeskip were equal, speed-wise. Saying that Luffy improved at using it over time is mainly speculation. In other words, there's a good chance that VAs would have a hard time dealing with Lucci. It's also worth to note that the VA who appeared at Enies Lobby clearly respected Lucci a lot. Some of them even stated that they can't imagine Lucci losing to anyone. That, to me, sounds like something a weaker individual would say about a stronger individual. It makes little sense to me that a VA would say that if he could mop the floor with Lucci.
Naturally, this doesn't mean that Lucci would be able to keep up with the best of the VA. Smoker, Vergo, Momonga and the likes would probably defeat him. From what we've seen of others, like Kaizeruhige, who basically just stood and watched himself get chocked by another VA who was controlled by Doflamingo, there's a good chance Lucci could be on that level. Him vs. Dalmatian would even seem like a good and even match-up.
Last edited by Azuma; May 06, 2013 at 09:51 AM.
The Kuja use Haki, but most of them aren't very strong. Momonga and Dalmatian both attacked Luffy when he was already exhausted. We have seen plenty of Vice-Admirals being humilhated by Whitebeard, Doflamingo and recently by Bartolomeo. So I don't think that most of the Vice-Admirals are that strong.
Last edited by Schabrak; May 07, 2013 at 02:14 AM.