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Christ where do I start.
You've seriously misinterpreted EVERY single point and I'm wondering whether you're doing it on purpose or whether you're truly dense.
Okay. Analogy. You start going off all about water and electricity as if it has any relevance to Naruto. As you'll remember, I made the ANALOGY from Sasuke>Deidara, to Pikachu>Blastoise (I feel absolutely ridiculous having to explain it). Hence, even if a level 40 pikachu (ELECTRICITY) defeats a level 40 blastoise (WATER), it doesn't make the pikachu objectively stronger. He has type advantage. The "tackle, quick attack, and rapid spin" are pokemon attacks. If you misinterpreted that because you didn't play the game 13 years ago, honest mistake, no problem. Still if you didn't understand the analogy in the first place because you're not familiar with pokemon (couldn't think of anything else at the time), you shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss a perfectly valid analogy. I shall do it again.
Level 40 pikachu > level 50 blastoise (in pokemon, LIGHTNING>WATER), doesn't mean pikachu is stronger.
Sasuke > Deidara (in Naruto, RAITON>DOTON), doesn't mean he's stronger.
Why doesn't it mean they're stronger? Because pikachu is super effective against Blastoise's trump card, and Sasuke is super effective against Deidara's trump card. This is lucky. If pikachu would be matched up against an equally powerful Onix, he would be unlucky. To complete this new "unlucky" analogy: If Deidara's bombs weren't Doton, Sasuke would have been unlucky, because he would have been dead. But they were doton, so he was lucky.
If you truly understood the concept of analogy, you wouldn't have written an entire essay about water and lightning. Obviously THAT part of the analogy was related to the incredible world of pokemon.
And after not getting this simply analogy, you have the nerve to say: What the hell any of this has to do with Deidara is beyond me. Faceplam.
But you weren't finished. What you say next is truly remarkable: "I'm simply pointing out that ration advantage didn't allow Sasuke to defeat Deidara. It allowed him to survive against his C4, and that's it."
Surviving against someone's last trump card has nothing to do with winning the battle? I guess we're done talking then. If I have to explain why 1 and 1 makes 2, I'm done.
Here's another fun analogy: Tobi's Izanagi when fighting Konan, had nothing to do with him winning the battle. It just allowed him to survive the paper bombs
As for Kishimoto pulling things out of his ass. Once again, plain english, yet you misunderstood. He did not pull Raiton>Doton out of his ass, I didn't SAY that. He pulled the fact that Deidara's bombs were Doton out of his ass. It's all there in my previous post. When you read, don't immediately start thinking of ways to argue against it, you might end up pulling straw mans ALL over the place. It's a lot of mess for me to clean up.
So, again. In english. Kishimoto pulled the fact that Deidara's bombs were doton, out of his ass, DURING the battle. And the point I was making, was: he could have also not done that. He could have made Sasuke win in another way. Yet he chose to make Deidara's bombs Doton, which quite fortunately Sasuke is immune to (in case of C4). So I concluded: Kishimoto HIMSELF set ALL the conditions right for me to argue that Sasuke would NOT be the victor if he did not have type advantage. HE decided to make Deidara's bombs easy for Sasuke to neutralize, not me. He was the one who made Sasuke lucky. I'm just the one pointing it out.
Last edited by Xrayz0r; May 23, 2013 at 12:11 PM.
I think that's pretty questionable, given that Orochimaru was capable of limiting Hashirama once before. That along with what we've seen of Edo Tensei make it clear that was by no means a sure thing, Hashirama doing his own thing. Besides, whether or not he could have gone doesn't change that he and the other Hokages did go because Sasuke decided that was what they all were gonna do.
...you're serious? I'm the one misinterpreting things?Originally Posted by Xrayz0r
I know what the analogy is, it's just wrong. In Pokémon you use an element that hurts the Pokemon who's weak to that element. You do more damage to them than you'd do to an alternate type Pokémon. Unfortunately, Deidara isn't weak to Raiton. His bombs are. And Sasuke's ration only disables Deidara's bombs whenever he touches them. There were far too many instances where Deidara's bombs could've overcome their weakness and still outright murdered Deidara. You however, who have some sort of vendetta, keep limiting Sasuke's accomplishments to elemental advantage alone. Stop trying so hard.Quote:
I'll give you a better analogy, using Pokémon (since that's what you're relying on).
Pikachu and Blastoise (of the same level) are fighting. Blastoise uses a water attack that explodes (we'll call it Water Bomb for argument's sake). Pikachu shoots a Thunderbolt at the Water Bomb, and it destroys it because Lightning>Water. Blastoise uses his head and shoots the Water Bomb at Pikachu again while he's trying to charge up a Thunderbolt. The bomb explodes before Pikachu can time a Thunderbolt. The explosion hits Pikachu, KO'ing him. Blastoise wins, despite elemental disadvantage.
Get it now? Elemental advantage isn't half the handicap you're trying to make it out to be.
Not when surviving that trump card didn't end the fight, no. That's grasping at straws. And even when he realized that Sasuke had access to Raiton early in the battle, so he should've focused on using attacks other than C4. C1,2, and 3 would've still been effective as surprise attacks to prevent Sasuke from running electricity through them. There were a plethora of ways to win that fight without C4. But he used a second one right after the first.Quote:
Proof you're getting defensive about being wrong, since you've resorted to blatant lies.Quote:
We knew from Deidara's first fight that his bombs were made of clay, and that he was from Iwagakure. There are no jutsu made out of dirt or clay that's not considered Doton, and ninja from Iwa predominately use earth style attacks. His bombs being doton isn't an asspull at all. And when Sasuke's elemental advantage only helps him in one specific situation that didn't determine his victory his impressiveness in the fight can't be questioned (unless you really, really want to make him look bad).Originally Posted by you, in your last post
Last edited by ninjabot; May 23, 2013 at 04:34 PM.
In short, after summoning them, Sasuke had no influence on the Kages' actions whatsoever. It wasn't also that Orochimaru felt no need to try to restrict Hashirama, but that Hashirama felt no need to completely escape Orochimaru's control because Orochimaru wasn't doing anything.
Last edited by Azuma; May 26, 2013 at 07:11 AM.
Itachi beat Kabuto
Oro was revived
Sasuke wanted Oro to take him to the 'people who knew everything'
Oro took him to that temple
Oro used the death god reviving jutsu
Oro used himself as bait
Oro revived the Kage
Hashirama wanted to talk to Sasuke.
Then they went to battle.
In all this, I find that Sasuke was the instigator in only one case and that too worked because Oro wanted to help him.
It's also funny that you claim that he would have just killed Orochimaru, the one person who's been impossible to actually kill. We're talking about a guy who can take fatal wounds and juts pop out a new body, a guy who can literally exist as just chakra. Actually killing him would be no easy feat. Not to mention that being freed from Edo Tensei's control does not mean being freed from it's effect, as shown by Itachi.