I was meant to say, it's kinda mixture of both. He certainly had Hysteria in mind as one of the more powerful ones, I think you really can't escape naming the most memorable one first (probably because of the Rockwell Hill incident.)
Also interesting to note Roxanne gets a special comment.
In any case, I think they really must be something to get listed in those 8, and then saying "the particularly strong ones have probably been covered."
Btw I notice a mistake in my last post: all these dialogues are not spoken by Daae but by someone else ~.~ I didn't check the previous page properly.
Yeah it is odd how they give Roxanne a comment, could you translate the comment?( as i have found several different translations)
I always took it as they were listing them in order of power(known to the Org, as we know Teresa was stronger then hysteria), and the fact that Dae revived the ones he did was because the others were not in good enough shape/he did not have all there pieces, i always wanted to see Sistine of the Divine Oracle she sounds like she could "see the future". i kinda hope we get a extra showing us all the other Number 1's that were mentioned
do you know who was talking or was it just a random man in black.
and you are right the fact that they can remember those names after all that time proves that they are powerful.
Could you also translate from that chapter the "weather or not they can surpass them"(unless its literally the same thing )
Edit: in chapter 117(i believe) Roxanne said "You who has the strength of a number 5 without that technique" how good of a translation is that.
And i feel like i should be paying you for all the translation questions i am asking LOL
Last edited by number12michael; October 09, 2013 at 11:04 AM.
酷く = severely, awfully, terribly
手を焼いた = unable to manage/control, have difficulty with, be at a loss what to do with someone
Translation: "She was dreadfully difficult to handle"
I've reread the scene many times, I couldn't figure out who is speaking. The first few names could have been listed by the one who was speaking in the last panel in the previous page. It is possible multiple MiB are speaking throughout the list, i.e. it is possible the MiB shown on Cassy's panel is the one who suggested Cassy's name.
"Whether or not they can surpass..."
Yes it is literally as it is. It's a bit like dumping that idea aside when he starts to list.
lit: "The likes of you
without that, [your] ability ranks with/at No.5"
And haha, I'm just doing my part with what I have as a fan of Claymore
Claymore is awesome and you are really helpful with the stuff that may get "lost in translation", you have answered a ton of questions that i had been wondering for awhileQuote:
in chapter 125 Roxanne says "wow, your pretty good at evading" was she talking to Miria or Cassandra?
and i am wondering how good is the translation of Roxannes "last words" , "Hmph....Keep eating shit for the rest of your life"
In the same chapter could you please translate Hysterias final words , particularly " Blood and screams fill that hill, there was a strange figure of a warrior who caught and held my eye, amidst the warriors stiff with fear......she alone was faintly smiling"
The "Keep eating shit" (Page 14) bit is exactly as the Japanese reads. Just for your information, Roxanne is speaking in a very imperative tone (i.e. command.)
Hysteria's last words: I'll just quote Gernot's translation:
For the specific part you want, he even explained the literal meaning of the original phrase:
---------- Post added at 03:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:01 PM ----------Originally Posted by gernot
"strange figure of a single warrior..."
I would personally put it "single figure of a strange warrior"
Not a big deal though.
EDIT: Also, the "There,..." is literally "Within [the massacre]"
Last edited by Utsune; October 11, 2013 at 09:10 AM.
Thanks so much!
so she is not "insulting" her but rather telling her/commanding her to "keep eating shit"- kinda makes me love Roxanne even more.Quote:
Reading through this. Great stuff. Thanks!
---------- Post added October 14, 2013 at 01:36 AM ---------- Previous post was October 13, 2013 at 05:06 AM ----------
So I just want to say a bit about the nature of the 3 revived number 1s. That line about beings who borrowed their pre-death appearance stuck in my mind and since I have a philosophy minor the concept that popped into my mind was a type of philosophical zombie. Okay, so what happened? They had strong bodies lying around (and why were they preserved for so long anyway? You're studying a strong No. 1 for 20+ years?) Dae cut up Priscilla's arm into 3 bits and stuffed them into the stigmata where they revived the 3 of them.
Assume for a moment that all aspects of being human are physical. A philosophical zombie is physically indistinguishable from a human being but doesn't have sentience. Basically it reacts and talks and acts in all ways as a person would. In this materialist, physical scenario, the way you think is a product of your brain and the way it physically developed in terms of the shape of tissues, how many and where neurons and axons are located, when and how they fire etc. When you die, that biochemical activity ceases.
What I see happening here is Priscilla's army re-started those bio-chemical processes--force the neurons to fire, the heart to beat etc. through it's demonic power--but because these physical things are happening in the exact same way that they would in the living Roxanne/Cassandra/Hysteria (as a consequence of the structure of their physical brains) they act in large part to how they would have if they were alive. But they are very much not the same person because the power is coming from Prisciilla. In the Roxanne thread I already mentioned that I think Cassandra and Hysteria could have physical brain damage as a consequence of their deaths which could explain why only Roxanne is truly clear headed if she died in a way that left her physical brain more intact.
Think of it like a fire burning out, but there is still wood to burn. Dae uses a match named Priscilla to relight the fire. It pretty much looks like the same fire to us, it burns the same fuel, but would you call it the same fire?
So anyhow, that's my theory on that particular comment based on that translation. Maybe this speculation belongs somewhere else.
Last edited by SSJPabs; October 13, 2013 at 05:33 AM.
@SSJPabs. Nice theory, I dig it. I also think of the ZAOs as being existentially akin to the chindi of Navajo mythology. A sort of manifestation of everything messy, unfinished, or warped in the people they were based on.
Utsune, could you please check the original text of Sid and Deneve's conversation in this scene? I have a suspicion that the translator got it wrong and the person whose life has "become some trifling thing" who is "carrying on recklessly" is Clare not Raki.
Thanks for this thread, btw.
Last edited by Number A; January 03, 2014 at 07:00 PM.
That's why you shouldn't rely on a translation other than Gernot's: http://www.batoto.net/read/_/135219/...ch131_by_mib/9
Most of scanlations with his translation are on Batoto but if you want to have all of them you would have to go here: http://mibscanlations.blogspot.com/s...label/Claymore
For easier download use the links that are in this post: http://mibscanlations.blogspot.com/s...aymore%20batch
In this particular translation, on the previous page Deneve says "We couldn't get any reaction from you [..] and you come..." as if the you is referring to Sid. The thing is, in Japanese, personal pronouns are often missing in sentences (I, you, he, she, it, etc.) and in the original there is no specific mentioning of the word "you." She is likely referring to Clare, which would obviously make more sense.
On the next page (where your query lies,) Sid points out that Clare has taken responsibility in the existence known as "Raki" (panel 2,) and he then suggests "You'd better be careful // In the event this 'regret' is no longer, he/she might start to take his/her life lightly" (panel 3.) The word "he/she" is actually not gender-specific (Sid uses "aitsu" if you're familiar with the term from watching anime.) Developing logically from panel 2 to panel 3, I would say he's referring to "Clare taking her life as some trifling thing," and that you're absolutely correct on your interpretation.
Finally, the personal pronoun is once again missing on this page, but it would make more sense if she were referring to Clare rather than Raki.
Hope this makes sense lol, I know it's a mouthful
Utsune your name should say "heavenly member", instead of "hero member"- because you are a godsend .
While i was looking bad on the tabs on the first page, i noticed something and was wondering if you could help.
In chapter 117, you explained about the "sharing a pillow" and it being like a old saying/archaic way of saying "sleep together".
but then you said "i will leave it up to you to think if it was literal or not"
what i want to know is was it literal or not, is there anything in the translation that makes it sound like anything other then Yagi stating that Roxanne and Cassandra would sleep together(in a sexual manner) without being so upfront about it?
sorry if it seems like im kicking a dead horse.
I can't comment on the Japanese (alas) but I'd be surprised if there is anything explicit there. My theory is Yagi plays the sex card because he wants to make Roxanne and Cassandra's hatred of each other stick in our minds and has to do so quickly to avoid losing narrative momentum. The man's no fool and likely knows full well that nothing will get his readers' attention like a hint of yuri (and my god does he hint). Throwing a touch of psycho ex into the mix makes it easy for us to immediately accept that they loathe each other, allowing him to get them fighting and move back to Miria & Co. Keeping it ambiguous means we pay close attention to their relationship trying to figure it out so the few scenes they get have more impact. Personally, I'm inclined to accept it because I think Cassandra and her nameless friend make a really cute couple but that's just me being sentimental as there's no narrative grounding for that either (unless "embraced a variety of feelings" has a subtext that got lost in translation. . . ).
Changing the subject, I understand that men and women speak slightly different forms of Japanese. Do Claymores typically talk like women or men?
Last edited by Number A; January 04, 2014 at 06:40 AM.
That makes sense i could see that , just want Utsune to make sure, as it seems odd that Yagi would even think of saying something like that why did he not just say "they got very close" or "were very close friends" i think he had in mind a relationship that went beyond friendship. Cassandra blushed every time she seen Roxanne. But then again i could be wrong as Cassandra said "I swore to never show that technique in front of others, Not even the warrior number 5 who approached me and said she admired me, called me "Dust Eater" and left"- that to me makes it sounds like there relationship was brief and non romantic.
in regards to the other part with Cassandra and her friend i think she had a crush on N35(To me cassandra comes across as someone who was solitary for so long that she was almost Asexual then when she met Roxanne, a woman who praised her and make her feel good about herself, she grew feelings for her....but not enough to let her see how she fights(do to the fear of "losing" Roxanne once she finds out how "ugly" her ability is. But then she saved the N35 and there relationship started off with N35 knowing Cassandras ability and seeing it as the ability that saved her not a "ugly" "dirty" ability, thus her feelings grew even more.
But i would also like to know if the translation of "embraced a variety of feelings" is correct and exactly what dose that mean.
---------- Post added at 02:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:09 AM ----------
Also Utsune if you dont mind could you check a few things for me.
Chapter 116 page 12
Roxanne says "me alone against an awakened being....what an awfully poor lot to draw" what is the exact translation is she just saying she has "bad luck"?
Chapter 116 Page 28
Roxanne "the two resurrected ones dont even remember there own names....how boring" what is the exact translation of that?
This is no doubt one of the more cryptic dialogues in Claymore, and most likely suggestive beyond the literal meaning of the phrase. Keep in mind I'll be writing the following from my take on this, do point out to me if you think I have missed out or misunderstood anything.
Unfortunately, within my knowledge, there's nothing else I could add to the last answer I've posted here, but you can look at it this way: Upon searching this phrase on Google, every single result on the first 3 pages (I haven't looked further) suggests sexual undertones between a man and a woman. On the other hand, to put it bluntly, it appears as if this phrase required further confirmation between two female Claymores.Quote:
As an aside, there are several obvious examples of sexual desires displayed by the youma-related kind (just to 'prove' these emotions do exist within them):
Perhaps one of the first and most prominent signs of a Claymore's sexual urges is shown during Raki and Clare's first meeting with Helen, who provokingly suggests Raki as Clare's plaything (愛玩具 lit. "love toy,") to which Clare is subsequently taunted. More examples include Clare's youma-turned brother, Riful and Dauf, and Agatha's invitation to Sid. There are also other possible implications as Number A has pointed out above.
I can't exactly speak for the Claymores themselves but I can't see who else can satisfy them within their ranks if not by each other, if they were active in this aspect anyway.
Roxanne: The term here is "貧乏くじ," any En-Jp dictionary will give you "short end of the stick," so the translation is as accurate as it can be. The only thing I'll add is, the term suggests "an undesirable role [to take]" rather than simply having bad luck.
Lit: Geez there're only idiots here and there (example translation: Geez I'm surrounded by idiots.)
The resurrected two don't even remember their own names[!] <--- Speaking Japanese can offer differently expressive tones depending on word choices at the end of the sentence. Eg. Naruto from Naruto ends in "(da)ttebayo." Here, Roxanne uses "(da)mon," which adds a very girly touch to her sentence.
Many Claymores use gender neutral personal pronouns when referring to themselves (the 'eccentric' ones are exceptions.) It does vary from Claymore to Claymore in terms of their degree of politeness. Eg. Miria and Galatea are very proper in their language and gender neutral; Roxanne (as mentioned above) and Riful use girly language; Helen, Anastasia, and Clarice use slightly feminine language but not 'pink' at all unlike Roxanne (Clarice is more polite than Helen, Anastasia uses gender neutral personal pronouns with a very classy proper feminine tone); Rachel is stupidly rude and speaks like a man (she uses 'ore' wtflol, which is only used by men as you may know.)
IMO, even without reading the original text, it is possible to tell what kind of language they are using because Yagi has done brilliantly in drawing those in (eg. their actions, character designs etc. are all accurately complimented by their language.)
(Note: By 'personal pronoun' I am mainly referring to first-person pronouns i.e. "I.")
EDIT: One thing to point out, those who speak with a slight feminine tone doesn't necessarily mean they always have that feature in their language,. Depending on what they're talking about, they can be either gender neutral or coupled with a hint of feminine ways of speaking.
Last edited by Utsune; January 04, 2014 at 10:07 PM.