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Let's look at a few facts.
The 1000 arms boss, the Oni boss that Reika fought from issues 191-201 and Kei killed, and Nuri have a lot of similar abilities. I'm becoming more convinced that it's probable that the three bosses have been the same species.
1. They are all shapeshifters.
After 1000 arms' suit got damaged and the head of the suit got sent by Katou's Y-gun, he just crawled out of the shell of the headless suit and shapeshifted into a monster's body and something resembling the teacher's head. He pretended to be the teacher.
He's pretending to be Reika in this scene.
He's pretending to be Kei, then Takeshi in this scene.
Nuri changed forms dozens of times; I'm sure that nobody will argue that he couldn't shape shift. One notable possible shape shift of Nuri's: notice that both hands are visible and there's nothing in either of his hands.
Katou turns around to face him and there's half of Oka in his hands. It doesn't mean that Oka isn't really dead. But if it was just a shapeshifting trick, that would be worthy of both 1000 arms and the Oni's psych jobs.
2. They can all absorb and regenerate from massive damage.
People confuse the fact that 1000 arms' suit was damaged and quit regenerating after Sei kicked its own acid back into it, with 1000 arms itself's ability to regenerate. After Katou sent the head of the suit with the Y-gun, the real 1000 arms just crawled out of it and took a new form. It was totally undamaged. See the links for point #1.
The Oni was able to regenerate and change forms on the fly, regenerating from the literally dozens of X-gun shots that he had taken and changing from Kei to Takeshi in the length of 2 steps (see link in point #1). He changed from Takeshi into something that could fit down the rookie's throat in about a second, then into a fly, then into an elephant.
He could absorb massive damage, provided that he knew it was coming.
3. They are all weak to Gantz sword attacks.
1000 arms died when Katou used its own sword against it.
That sword could cut through Gantz suits like they were butter, so it was at least as powerful as the Gantz swords.
Kei killed the Oni boss with one hit from a Gantz sword after it had taken about a hundred shots from X-guns.
Same for Nuri. He could recover from being splattered by the H-gun in seconds, but it took him much longer to recover from one hit from the Gantz sword.
4. On each occasion, they died when they didn't expect the attack. Nuri and 1000 arms both evidently saw them too late to do anything about them, and the Oni boss didn't see the one that killed him at all.
5. They all like to psych people out by pretending to be other people. They evidently enjoy that aspect of their abilities.
6. They all have an acid attack. 1000 arms had a bowl in his suit, the Oni spat it out, and Nuri emitted an aura of acid that melted everything around him. It had the same effect as the acid the other two used; it was just a little slower.
7. For some strange reason, both the Oni boss and Nuri wanted to play more than they did to actually fight as hard as they could to kill the Gantz team. Ecchis? Having sex with Inaba and Kuwabara? Pretending to be Gantz members? Turning into a bee? Beating Kaze to a pulp then not bothering to kill him? Getting bored with the fight and taking a break? They just don't take the battles seriously enough for their lives to be on the line.
8. Both 1000 arms and Nuri had a laser attack. Since 1000 arms was wearing a statue suit, we don't know whether the laser came from an eye that he had placed in that part of the suit (he's a shape shifter; that could have been a comfortable place to put it), or if the laser was a feature of the suit. We know that Nuri's lasers were natural, and at least two of his forms could use them. For some reason, neither Nuri nor 1000 arms liked to use them, though. They may take too much power, or have some other unknown problem. The Oni boss didn't use a laser, but then again, he was facing multiple opponents in an enclosed area. Not exactly the best situation to use a laser.
9. Their forms were able to change size and weight. Look at the huge creature that 1000 arms became. The Oni changed from a flying insect into an elephant. Nuri changed from an old man into a giant.
10. They all knew things about the Gantz team. 1000 arms claimed that became the teacher because it picked up and absorbed the teacher's brain. The Oni boss claimed that it was Reika, then Kei. Nuri didn't actually turn into a Gantz member, but it's likely that he psyched them out concerning Oka. Notice this little sleight of hand: Nothing in either hand, especially not a 2-foot-tall torso. Look closely and you can even see that the right arm and even index finger of the right hand is outstretched. Both hands are empty.
Katou turns around, and voila: Instant Oka torso.
Remember when the Oni boss even copied Kei's gun? That would be a great way to demoralize an enemy.
11. It's possible that 1000 arms, the Oni boss and Nuri were all 100 points each. Don't laugh until you read the logic. Katou died before he could get the points for 1000 arms. There was something screwy about the points for the Oni mission. Reika got exactly 100 points for the Oni mission, even though she just spent most of her time fighting that one boss, and didn't even kill it. He was the main boss for the original mission, and Kei got the killing blow, but he only got 57 points for the whole mission, probably all from the little 3-point soldiers. It looks like Reika got the points for the Oni boss, and it was worth close to 100 points.
There are two possibilities:
a. Reika had shot it about 100 times, and Kei only got in one blow. Gantz may have some sort of rule to prevent kill stealing like that.
b. Reika had shot it just before Kei cut its head off. Simultaneous hits due to the delay?
Regardless of why, she got 100 points for the mission, the very maximum possible, and that was the only boss that she could have gotten the points for. We know Kei didn't get the points for it, because he was killing things right and left and still only got half the number of points that she did.
I think it is possible that they may have derived from a certain species, but are not once species.
as for all 100 pointer theory the odds are against you, its true that reika got the points for the oni boss(at least its an accepted theory) but you also kno that she did kill a bunch of the weak oni's.
Secondly there abilities seem to differ to some perspective, for thousand arms i always thought it was more of a revers time effect then a regeneration effect, it seems like he reverses time for himself and heals his wounds, i think this because his buddha armor always seem to go back to the way it first was. While this is less believable then the regenaration theory, come on its gantz. The oni alien reika fought and kurono killed seem to have a regenaration ability that wasnt on the same level as nuris, nuri's regen was pro he recovered from a lot a shit(h-gun blast, sword stomach up, and gettin his head cutoff by oka). While the oni boss seemed like he could be killed if he recieved a strong enough blow.
Knowledge of the gantz team isnt suprising for the oni boss he is closely related with the vamps and he most likely knew how an x rifle looked like. Nuri also seems to be on a higher level then the other 2, he worked with an 71 and 69 pointer who both serve him, while 1000 arms was surrounded by 1-5 pointers. Same applies to the oni boss if the vamps and the other elementals werent there he would be surrounded by 1-5 pointers. This leads me to believe that the oni boss and kannon are both worth somewhere around 80 points or so.
Guess we'll never know how many points 1000 arms was really worth, unless there is a new version of the Gantz manual someday. He was definitely weaker than the Oni boss. But it's possible that all of that particular species would have the same point value. We can be fairly certain that the Oni boss was within the 70-100 range.
Nuri was a LOT stronger than 1000 arms, and somewhat stronger than the Oni. But he was also a LOT stronger than the 70+/- point servants, elemental bosses and Oni boss. If there wasn't a point cap, Nuri may have been at a 150-200 point level.
I've always wondered why he sacrificed thousands of his own minions. Maybe that was a way to boost his power?
1000 Arms wasn't really that strong. The team just lacked strategy.
I don't see how that alien was similar to Nuri. It didn't regenerate itself, it used a stopwatch...
the stop watch effect was basically the same as regen, also it should be worth around 75 points, it wasnt that strong but it had alot of tricks.
We really don't know which of its powers were natural, and which came from the statue suit. If they were natural, it was probably the same species. If its powers were mechanical in nature and came from the suit, it was probably another species that just used mechanical means to imitate Nuri and the Oni's powers.
im guessing from the suit, aliens seem to hide into society the more i think about it. Maybe we can assume that aliens either shape shift to hide into society or have a suit that blends em in. Then again there are exceptions.
Also taking in account wat u said about oka's body, it does make some sense, i mean wasnt it kind of coincidental that a whole building came crashing down when it looked like he just sliced oka in half in one swing. Also considering that oka was that close to them he could of easily tried to take the kill at any time, he also knew that nuri was strong as shit and knew he couldnt just avoid it.
Last edited by Masterchief; September 16, 2008 at 09:39 PM.
I dont belive that reika got the points for the shape sifting oni. She killed tons of smaller ones that could of easily got her her points. Many people helped fight Nuri. I just dont think Gantz is organized enough to keep track of who did the most damage. He couldnt even see Kisimota was gonna live after her attempted suicide, theirfore making two of her. In my openion their just isnt enough facts and evidence to support the "kill steal prevention" theory
I dont think its the same species, I think its an evolutionary thing.
a lizard evolves to have the powers of a nuri
something with the powers of a nuri evolves to a lizard form
I don't think this lizard evolved tho, I think it was all in the suit.
just looking at it strength wise, it was very weak, he was more powerful with his buddah suit.
lets have a look at it for a sec, a one-armed dead-suit kato took 7 pages worth of punches from this monster before HITTING HIM BACK with a right hook counter that busted up 1000 arms face (you can see the dent it left if you look at the left side of the cheek) after which he got punched for another 3 pages before grabbing a sword.
punching a regular human for a total of 10 pages and not killing him doesn't register to me as strong (i say human and not gantzer cuz his suit was useless by then)
my take on it is that 1000 arms was a weaker race (not same species) only the suit made him strong. After he lost his suit, he lost his
-speed (zooms right past those 2 guys before they can even shoot, cutting off both their arms. that's some kenshin type shit right there folks) the reason why katou got hit so much is not cuz the speed, its cuz he had 6 times as many arms as katou, (6 arms vs 1, try blocking that shit lol)
-regen ability (coming out of the suit doesn't seem like regen to me, more like cocoon)
-strength (10 pages of punching katou) wtf right?
i think we are looking at this backwards for 1000 arms, the title being "true face" means getting weaker and not stronger, that's how I interpret it, this isn't dbz.
after katou cuts an arm off, wheres the new arm, after he loses his head, wheres the new one? I think 1000 arms knew once he lost his suit, he was at a disadvantage.
you can argue that he cant regen because of the sword's surprise attack, but katou cut off ALL his hands + his freaking head. he should of been able to regen the other hands if he knew it was coming, therefor I say it again, he had no regen abilities to begin with, ONLY THE SUIT.
I don't think he had shape shifting abilities either, my take on it is that he absorbed the dood and was able to merge with him, we didnt see him transform into anything else. if he were to transform into something else after the lizard, then id have to agree with your assessment.
most of your other points I agree with.
I'm convinced. Just the Oni boss and Nuri were the same species.
1000 arms initially had all the same abilities, but they were evidently mechanical. Once he lost the suit, he was pretty weak.
He went to a lot of trouble to make a suit that mimiced every ability that the Oni boss and Nuri had, though. He wouldn't have gone to the trouble of making himself so similar to them just for the fun of it. He didn't want to fight, either. Maybe he was trying to fake being one of Nuri's species because he came to Earth without permission and was more afraid that somebody of Nuri's species would find him than he was of the Gantz team?
The Oni boss and Nuri treated the hunt like a game, not a battle to the death. Therefore, they may have a way to rez, about like the Gantz teams do. The other creatures that Gantz hunts probably don't, as they all treated it like a real battle to the death.
The Oni boss showed Reika that he had a way of tracking the entire Gantz team, the same as they could track the aliens. Tengu (Nuri's second in command) confirmed it when he was talking to HS, too. It's even possible that both Gantz and his counterpart on the Oni side saw a little blip that showed an illegal alien had arrived, and they flipped a coin to see who would get to hunt 1000 arms.
I made another post on something related to this before, I mentioned the dino cannibalism from the T-rex. The t-rex was more evolved, it learned how to do the haduken fireball.
You may be right tho, Lizards are so scared of nuri's type because they are so low on the evolutionary chain, they must use technology to not get slaughtered by the higher of the species. "We are the last ones left" he says, so I think even other aliens kill the lizards to the point of extinction.
hang on a sec, i may be on to something!
The onion guys and Tanakas! man they were so weak, so they disguise themselves as humans to avoid aliens of higher rank (rank meaning evolution progress). The onion rented an apt, and the tanaka goes to the store and stuff and even tries to learn pop culture phrases.
In one of the pages while fighting with nuri, it said something about evolution, now we get the phrase catastrophe, i know its a pretty big leap but what if all of this means...
Higher evolved aliens are going to wipe out anything lower than itself! this includes aliens and humans! Huge extermination to advance their own cause, kinda like what nazi's or whatever trying to accomplish. purify the world? ridding the weak? yah its a big leap i know
I think its pretty well established by now that high beings don't give a damn about low 1 pointers, nuri's laser beam could of stopped anytime but ended up killing a lot of aliens.
Hmmm...i guess all the "Yokai Alien", "Buddha Statues" and "Oni Aliens" have some level of shapeshifting ability.
But being of the same species...i don't know. We need more info....maybe at the beggining they were all the same.
We've about decided that the 1000 arms isn't the same species as the Oni boss that Reika fought and Nuri. 1000 arms just wore a suit that made him appear similar.
Just Nuri and Reika's Oni boss appear to be the same race. But it's looking more and more like they may end up being the arch-villains of the series. They're smart, strong, fast, regenerate from massive damage, have lasers and acid attacks that can cut through a powered Gantz suit instantly, can shape-shift almost instantly from a child to a giant, from a fly to an elephant. They can absorb massive damage. Their only weakness seems to be surprise attacks. They are vulnerable to Gantz swords. That makes them formidable. An army of Nuris would indeed be an unstoppable army with an invincible arsenal. What more could you want from an arch-villain?
I doubt it, oni boss seemed too weak to me im convinced a h-gun blast woulda killed right there and then, as for nuri its kind of a mystery how he died really but I think that he only dies when using his lazer. Why else would oku show us reika about to die. And exactly how are they vulnerable to gantz swords? i mean ya nuri when oka sliced him from behind it took longer to regen, but wat about oni boss just cuz he died from a sword doesnt mean that he cant regen from it as quickly as an x gun. Also the way their regen seemed to work was diff, nuri took the blow then regenerated while oni boss seemed to nullify the blow before it hit him.