No ithink that kishi divide the naruto world in 02 parts the naruto's world and the sasuke's world.
the two have san start a painful childhood but the one choose the path of revenge the one choose the path of the will of fire so masashi show the 02 wolrds alternately. naruto after sasuke after naruto and it can make compare them, in begin of part II sasuke was strong than naruto , after senjutsu the opposite and now sasuke is better than naruto.
and maybe someones are boring that naruto is weaker than sasuke but it' the way that kishi has choose to show the difference of the 02 worlds
in the world of sasuke he obtain jutsu easily and become powerful in each time by his anger
in the world of naruto thesymbilic world is determination and he should train himself for o long time for obtain a great jutsu .
so it' like comparing the evil way and the good way and the good way is difficult but it'll triumph over evil.
And we now that the good way is naruto's way. i'm sure that we'll see a great naruto in a few or long time but surely.
Naruto is the only main character of naruto. and i can say that the base of naruto (the manga not the charachter) "bond, determination, never give up" who are the nindou of naruto so naruto is the story of naruto.
Last edited by Askia32; January 09, 2010 at 03:07 AM.
I explained there in detail why the "berserk" analogy is inaccurate, why Naruto will do no world-saving on-screen/manga, and why Naruto will be sidelined (standard modus operandi for secodary characters) until the end, when he will play his part in completing Sasuke's story.
Completing Sasuke's story? The revenge story...how the hell did naruto even contribute to that...and how do U think he will complete that story...by taking part in a war, which was started by madara?or by trying to stop sasuke who is slowly becoming the main tool of that war?
Retcon here retcon there...but the main issue is that like the Uchiha and Senju were reinvented, so were Naruto's goals...he'll try to bring world peace and to save sasuke...these issues are related closely, so sorry if I fail to see how it's just Sasuke's story...
Kishi says lots of things in interviews, but as long as U can accept the retconned nature of the manga, then U shouldn't base UR arguments on what he says right, cuz that could change on the whim of the editors, or on just his...
I don't know why people find Sasuke so interesting, I find him to be an eyesore when I want to see Naruto, I mean he's a main character I get that, I don't mind it however I do not enjoy how he is developed with each battle, I'd much rather he have some down time, Kishi needs to use days, nights, weeks even! to help pace things better I feel.
I'd much rather see Naruto developed in Various ways (Such as all his neglected "Ninja" skills to make him seem much more than a One hit KO character) I guess Naruto will get his time eventually but I totally think Kishi has it in him to write the story better, this is a war.
He can easily show brief down times between battles where Sasuke is thinking about new techniques etc.
Personally, I'd much rather Part 1 Story/action with Shippuden Ages, I loved part 1 but Naruto got on my nerves a little TOO much, he'd never learn anything. But I enjoy Shippuden mainly for the Character personalities (Except Ino)
Last edited by Xiraiya; January 11, 2010 at 10:44 AM.
^^Agreed...until we don't know how will Naruto develop or how will the war happen, we can't say anything for sure...
About Kishi's interviews - the past proved that they're pretty accurate. Even more; the 2010 one - the manga's plot development is consistent with it.
U say the manga is logically inconsistent, yet U use past for UR arguments...
Naruto nowadays is about saving sasuke...but regardin naruto...the last time naruto really did something was in the pein arc...if that can be considered nowadays, by let's say the manga timeline...well that fight wasn't about sasuke at all...now that sasuke is gonna be hunted and he panics?well that's not really a guideline for what will happen in the end...
But I understand that U might jump to conclusions regardin the end of the manga, since the pace of the story telling is really slow
"In Part 2, until 2008, Kishi didn't develop Naruto's character - that was probably because, at that time, Kishi intended to develop Naruto later.
However, Naruto became less popular in Japan, until, in 2008, on his own or at the advice of the editor, Kishi decided to make Sasuke the main character.
Naruto popularity polls: http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?t=355859
That's why, 2008 is full of retcon that transformed Sasuke's (probable) initial final villain (Itachi) into a saint and gave Sasuke a new final villain (Madara).
Since then, the manga focused on Sasuke (which makes Sasuke the main character - WE ARE TALKING ABOUT AN ACTION MANGA, NOT SOME PHILOSOPHICAL WORK OF ART).
There are two exceptions:
1 The Pain arc - this is probably because Kishi already planned in some detail (before 2008) Pain, the original final villain of the manga, and the Pain arc. Rather than completely cutting Pain out of the manga, Kishi turned him into a secondary villain.
2 Kakashi's half a year in 2010 - confirmed in the 2010 interview. That's because Kakashi is popular in Japan, too, these days (more popular than Naruto).
Recently, Kishi even changed his mind about the romantic subplot and declared unambiguously that Sakura loves Sasuke and NOT Naruto, deciding to throw away tens of pages of development that all but proved the contrary."
The manga will focus on Naruto in the future ONLY if Kishi decides to radically change its direction again (like he did in 2008, only refocusing on Naruto and sidelining Sasuke this time).
I regard this as a highly improbable event - I doubt Naruto will manage to go up enough in the popularity polls again (with his past, present, and likely future treatement).
Yes, my statements are not 100% certain - which makes them assumptions - but they're very probable to happen - they're near-certainties.
PS - I said that what Kishi said in the interviews is consistent with what is drawn in the manga; not that the manga's internal logic is consistent.
Both Naruto and Sasuke are main characters, one is protagonist, hero another antagonist, anti-hero they represent human natures and philocopies that are completely opposite of each other Extrovert-Introvert Love-Hate Harmony-Chaos Selflessness-Egoism Forgiveness-Revenge etc. naruto cares about sasuke, while sasuke couldn't care less about him. as the story progresses these characters become complete opposites of each other (light-dark, good-evil) and this will culminate in their final confrontation at the end of manga, there's nothing wrong with both of them being main characters
Last edited by AlB; January 11, 2010 at 02:03 PM.
Just for curiosity, does anyone knows if we have a popularity poll for the Pain saga?
I believe that if we have such information, we can get a better outlook of Naruto(the character)'s current situation.
we need a popularity poll again!
it would show how it might have influenced the story and why Naruto seems to have lost his popularity
or maybe he wants to make him more popular,which would give me the hope of GARuto in th upcoming chapters,after he wakes up again
I don't think the series has been retconned as much as it has last minute details added in that were never mentioned.
Whether or not its just the english version, we've heard about "That Jutsu" specifically "That jutsu". As a writer what does this do? It implies a new technique without having to show that one was actually learned it also leaves the comic open to left field things. Its pretty much the same as writing "I have something I want to test out" vague, suggests training happened.
The manga isn't inconsistent to me, it's erratic. We never have any character other than Say Kakashi and Shikamaru that develop techniques in a steady flow. Naruto's power level sky rockets after his training. Every time Sasuke appears he's pumped up.
For those that say Naruto is the main character, I disagree in some sense. Initially I felt in the first part it was more about Naruto, his struggle to be accepted, his struggle to advance. Then I think the story was pushed mostly by Akatsuki. Everything else in the world seems to be a reaction to Akatsukis plans.
Personally it feels like there should have been little or no time skips and Naruto just age over time, Sasuke could die sparking Naruto's wake up call to grow up, and then start this peace nonsense, where he fights Itachi with Sasukes spirit a long side him and that would be his first test on the road to ending hatred, then Pain would be the final villain of the manga.
I personally think it's more of an issue Naruto's gone on too long than anything, a good friend believes "Pain" was infact originally suppose to be Minato but since fans figured it out long before his revealing Kishi ended up changing it.
In a way this makes sense to me since there was no real need to hide the face of someone we didn't even know for so long.
Sasuke gets more screen time...Sasuke gets more abilites..Sasuke gets more development...I mean Naruto spent 3 years with Jiraya and didnt learn jack other than a big Rasengan and better kagebunshin control...Wow..Fucking great..Sasuke spent 3 years with Oro and was able to give Itachi a pretty decent fight...I think its clear that Kishi enjoys writing about Sasuke much more than he does Naruto which issad and one of the reasons i am starting to dislike the manga more and more..