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View Poll Results: Do you feel that Masashi Kishimoto is sexist?

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  • Yes

    199 44.22%
  • No

    251 55.78%
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Thread: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

  1. #736
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member union98's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    I wouldn't say so. The majority of female characters in Naruto don't stand out because of their looks unlike in other mangas. Alot of the female characters don't have huge boobs or anything like that and for a kunoichi, it seems like it'd be a hindrance, so it makes sense that kishi doesn't do this. Aside from the kunoichi from the lightening village, they're aren't too many others with huge boobs. It's no where near as bad as bleach...not that I'm complaining. I kinda like big boobs...lol
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  2. #737
    MH Senpai 神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    There's one female ANBU that we know so far - I forgot her name, but she was in Part I after Hayate (?) was killed by Baku (?). It was during Sandaime Hokage's funeral?

    Using ANBU as a reason to show Kishi is sexist doesn't work because we don't know the identity of most ANBU. Hell, we only know Itachi and Kakashi because they were former ANBU; and Yamato was assigned to Naruto's team, so he can't stay mysterious or keep his mask on.

    At least Kishi's trying to make women look strong or better. Konan was probably the only person to ever damage Tobi to an extent and make him resort to Izanagi. Kushina was able to manhandle boys when she was a child, and she had the balls to argue with one of the greatest genius of his generation. Mei and Tsunade are the kage of their villages, and Tsunade is the main reason why the village hasn't suffered a devastating loss against Pain. Even Hiruzen wasn't able to prevent deaths of many top shinobi.

    I still think the problem is that the manga switched to focusing on Naruto and Sasuke. Back in Part I, females were actually shown in a better light when Kishi was focusing on other characters, not just Naruto or Team 7. We saw Sakura grow and mature as the chuunin exam went on, we saw Anko be BDSM and willing to die to get rid of her master, we even saw Kurenai... be hot? Temari was pretty badass and smart, as well. Tenten had badass weapons. Even in early Part II, we saw Sakura change into a better shinobi.

    As Part II went on though, Naruto was given more focus and other characters slowly took the backseat. You had few epic moments like Shikamaru beating Hidan or Hinata defending Naruto. Sakura regressed into early Part I, for the most part, at least during Pain Invasion just to show Naruto's power (the confidence she had in Naruto, etc, and I don't mean Naruto's combat power). Though, Sakura did have a good moment in finding out about the Zetsu and owning him.

    Although Kishi may admittedly suck at making women look just as good, he has been giving too much focus on Naruto and Sasuke, in my opinion, that not just females, but most side characters haven't looked good. Kakashi being the main example.

    Same

  3. #738
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Dragging this from the depths of this forum. Now that everything has come to a close...

    Having seen the conclusion of the manga and its handling of female characters and the treatment of women in the databook, I'm forced to respond with a final answer of YES.

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  5. #739
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner ju gatsu mikka's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    I would say no, or at least not necessarily. You think of it with occidental point of view but don't forget that he is Japanese and so have a Japanese societal and Japanese cultural point of view: what you think as sexism is merely a values dissonance.
    For us, occidentals, it's common to see women work even after marriage and childbirth, housewifes have become some rare things and mainly in wealthy family. In Japan, if unmarried women work, married ones rarely do it except if they have uphold positions and, in that case, rarely have children.

    I see two reasons at least for that:
    1. if in occident, commuting time are commonly less than half an hour and rarely more than an hour, in Japan it take hourS ;
    2. while in occident we take pride and uphold spare-time and individuals well being, in Japan they uphold work and groups.
    For those to reason, businessmen and businesswomen have a nearly inexistent family life, rarely see their children and partners (at least wake up) and, if you are not wealthiest to engage a governess, you need someone to take care of the children and the house in Japanese society it's generaly women who do it.

    So don't see sexism where there is only creator provincialism: Kishimoto sticks to the culture he knows about.

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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by ju gatsu mikka View Post
    I would say no, or at least not necessarily. You think of it with occidental point of view but don't forget that he is Japanese and so have a Japanese societal and Japanese cultural point of view: what you think as sexism is merely a values dissonance.
    For us, occidentals, it's common to see women work even after marriage and childbirth, housewifes have become some rare things and mainly in wealthy family. In Japan, if unmarried women work, married ones rarely do it except if they have uphold positions and, in that case, rarely have children.

    I see two reasons at least for that:
    1. if in occident, commuting time are commonly less than half an hour and rarely more than an hour, in Japan it take hourS ;
    2. while in occident we take pride and uphold spare-time and individuals well being, in Japan they uphold work and groups.
    For those to reason, businessmen and businesswomen have a nearly inexistent family life, rarely see their children and partners (at least wake up) and, if you are not wealthiest to engage a governess, you need someone to take care of the children and the house in Japanese society it's generaly women who do it.

    So don't see sexism where there is only creator provincialism: Kishimoto sticks to the culture he knows about.
    I'd accept this as some semblance of a mitigating factor...if every other mangaka wasn't operating from the same 'cultural point of view'. They manage to produce better when it comes to writing female characters, I see little reason to offer him a pass. I'm only holding him to same standard as his peers.

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  8. #741
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member raoniluna's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Very simple answer: Who are the greatest shinobi of all time?
    1 - Hagoromo
    2 - Hamura
    3 - Indra
    4 - Ashura
    5 - Naruto
    6 - Sasuke
    7 - Hashirama
    8 - Madara
    9 - Obito
    10 - Some man, probably Tobirama or Black Zetsu

    Supposedly Kaguya would be the strongest of all but she was defeat TWICE by two men, in the second time there was a supporting woman among FOUR man (Naruto, Sasuke, Kakashi and Obito)
    Females are usually support or medic, even the strong Tsunade is but a cry baby for Dan and needed Naruto to overcome her blood trauma. Seriously?
    Kishimoto females are PATHETHIC! I could enjoy female characters in some scenes but it doesn't even compare to the males. Seriously, who are Hinata and Sakura? The ones in love, waiting for the prince charming. The other girls, I mean, the girls that are not hidden behind a man doesn't even exist! Ino and Ten Ten were completely underdeveloped! Even Tsunade the Hokage was put aside, the best she could achieve was "your regeneration is almost as goood as Hashirama's". Mei was totally overshadowed even by Udon. Samui = Sexualized. Chiyo = Dead. Temari = Couldn't scratch Raikage that had weakness against her element. Seriously I can't even organize my thoughts on this matter but yeah Kishimoto is VERY sexist, it is always the men saving the day.

    Of seven Hokages, 6 man, 1 woman.

    BTW Of these seven how would you rank Tsunade? I doubt someone would put her in the top three and I highly doubt most people would even consider she not being the weakest of the seven if not for Katsuyu. I guess 90% of the readers thinks she is a total loser for being half senju, half uzumaki and not being able to do any of these bloodlines stuff like sealing, wood release, huge chakra capacity and others.

    HELL MAN is so much sexism I can't think about it without raging...
    Last edited by raoniluna; November 10, 2014 at 02:23 PM.

  9. #742
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member meeedoooz's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by raoniluna View Post
    Very simple answer: Who are the greatest shinobi of all time?
    1 - Hagoromo
    2 - Hamura
    3 - Indra
    4 - Ashura
    5 - Naruto
    6 - Sasuke
    7 - Hashirama
    8 - Madara
    9 - Obito
    10 - Some man, probably Tobirama or Black Zetsu

    Supposedly Kaguya would be the strongest of all but she was defeat TWICE by two men, in the second time there was a supporting woman among FOUR man (Naruto, Sasuke, Kakashi and Obito)
    Females are usually support or medic, even the strong Tsunade is but a cry baby for Dan and needed Naruto to overcome her blood trauma. Seriously?
    Kishimoto females are PATHETHIC! I could enjoy female characters in some scenes but it doesn't even compare to the males. Seriously, who are Hinata and Sakura? The ones in love, waiting for the prince charming. The other girls, I mean, the girls that are not hidden behind a man doesn't even exist! Ino and Ten Ten were completely underdeveloped! Even Tsunade the Hokage was put aside, the best she could achieve was "your regeneration is almost as goood as Hashirama's". Mei was totally overshadowed even by Udon. Samui = Sexualized. Chiyo = Dead. Temari = Couldn't scratch Raikage that had weakness against her element. Seriously I can't even organize my thoughts on this matter but yeah Kishimoto is VERY sexist, it is always the men saving the day.

    Of seven Hokages, 6 man, 1 woman.

    BTW Of these seven how would you rank Tsunade? I doubt someone would put her in the top three and I highly doubt most people would even consider she not being the weakest of the seven if not for Katsuyu. I guess 90% of the readers thinks she is a total loser for being half senju, half uzumaki and not being able to do any of these bloodlines stuff like sealing, wood release, huge chakra capacity and others.

    HELL MAN is so much sexism I can't think about it without raging...
    i understand what you are saying, but at least it isn't like bleach or one piece where every woman needs an entire " rescue arc " . i was about to think that every manga was like that, but thank god for fairy tail and shingeki

    about kaguya, i'm one of those who think she is the strongest character in Naruto. so what if she was beaten twice ? one time she was fighting against both her sons who are STRONG but not as strong as her and all they could achieve was sending her away... the other time she fought 5 people ( counting obito ) and still she kicked their asses and if it weren't for some techniques they didn't even originally own they would be dead, and they were only able to do what her sons did

    EDIT : unless, you have a problem with her being beaten by " men " no matter who they are or how many are there in which case i have nothing to say
    Last edited by meeedoooz; November 10, 2014 at 03:03 PM.
    a story that can reach the hearts of people all around the world no matter what their culture or background is and be their favorite is truly and definitely a masterpiece . i hope you last a bit more Naruto. thanks Kishi for the most epic manga

  10. #743
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity KiSwordsman's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by meeedoooz View Post
    i understand what you are saying, but at least it isn't like bleach or one piece where every woman needs an entire " rescue arc " . i was about to think that every manga was like that, but thank god for fairy tail and shingeki

    about kaguya, i'm one of those who think she is the strongest character in Naruto. so what if she was beaten twice ? one time she was fighting against both her sons who are STRONG but not as strong as her and all they could achieve was sending her away... the other time she fought 5 people ( counting obito ) and still she kicked their asses and if it weren't for some techniques they didn't even originally own they would be dead, and they were only able to do what her sons did

    EDIT : unless, you have a problem with her being beaten by " men " no matter who they are or how many are there in which case i have nothing to say
    I disagree with the one piece bit. At least oda bothers to go in depth with his characters. Hinata, ignored for a good 90% of the series; leaps taken with her overall character because the series is about to end. Just like Ino. (Edo Asuma) Sakura, developed only to be extremely regressed and treated like garbage.

  11. #744
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member meeedoooz's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by KiSwordsman View Post
    I disagree with the one piece bit. At least oda bothers to go in depth with his characters. Hinata, ignored for a good 90% of the series; leaps taken with her overall character because the series is about to end. Just like Ino. (Edo Asuma) Sakura, developed only to be extremely regressed and treated like garbage.
    i know, hinata is my favorite female character in any anime or manga and i wish she had more screen time, but i disagree about her character development and i think she developed way too much since her first appearance to her slapping naruto out of his " freez " but i agree about sakura completely

    i'm not saying in any way women in OP aren't developed. they are just as useless and as defenseless and so dependent on men like most shounen manga to the point that each one had to have an entire "rescue arc" i guess this is a common thing in that industry
    a story that can reach the hearts of people all around the world no matter what their culture or background is and be their favorite is truly and definitely a masterpiece . i hope you last a bit more Naruto. thanks Kishi for the most epic manga

  12. #745
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member xallisto's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Having read Naruto week in and week out for the last 10 years, i can say that Kishimoto's female characters are woefully underdevloped, and under utilised, but i cant honestly say i ever got the impression that he wsa being sexist. After all naruto is a shounen, and the demographic is largley young men, and there are certain tropes that go with the territory that may have been suggested to him by his editor as known quantaties for whatever reason. i think that trying to draw conclusions about the man through only his writing is inappropriate.
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  13. #746
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member raoniluna's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by meeedoooz View Post
    i understand what you are saying, but at least it isn't like bleach or one piece where every woman needs an entire " rescue arc " . i was about to think that every manga was like that, but thank god for fairy tail and shingeki

    about kaguya, i'm one of those who think she is the strongest character in Naruto. so what if she was beaten twice ? one time she was fighting against both her sons who are STRONG but not as strong as her and all they could achieve was sending her away... the other time she fought 5 people ( counting obito ) and still she kicked their asses and if it weren't for some techniques they didn't even originally own they would be dead, and they were only able to do what her sons did

    EDIT : unless, you have a problem with her being beaten by " men " no matter who they are or how many are there in which case i have nothing to say
    Yes I have a problem because she was the ONLY female character to figure among the strongest and was defeated by men, in this case it doesn't matter if it was Goku or Dr. Manhattan it is still sexism. If the top 10 ninja were like 5 men and 5 women or perhaps even 6 men and 4 women then ok, even a tadpole could defeat her and I wouldn't give a damn but hey the strongest woman besides Kaguya probably isn't even in the top 20 (I said PROBABLY), so the ONLY strong women is defeated by man, come on, it is impossible to get "sexister" than that. When we analyze this kind of subject we have to concentrate on the symbols, meanings and archetypes and less on raw logic, we gotta ask ourselves who Kishimoto sees women, what this story say about women, what being a woman in the ninja world means.

    This is precisely why I got so mad at Kishi, he had thousando of opportunities to show readers that in ninja world women could and should be strong but instead he went all "mr. Traditions" and have shown us that Kaguya-Eve, the only strong woman is EVIL and that all good woman are submissive and need a man, seriously, my only hope was Tsunade but she lived and was saved by men all the time, even against Madara, COME ON, it was her spotlight (a poor one but...) and then "oh I'm gonna die unless my ghost prince charming saves me!"... trid to kill myself (mentally)

  14. #747
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member meeedoooz's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by raoniluna View Post
    Yes I have a problem because she was the ONLY female character to figure among the strongest and was defeated by men, in this case it doesn't matter if it was Goku or Dr. Manhattan it is still sexism. If the top 10 ninja were like 5 men and 5 women or perhaps even 6 men and 4 women then ok, even a tadpole could defeat her and I wouldn't give a damn but hey the strongest woman besides Kaguya probably isn't even in the top 20 (I said PROBABLY), so the ONLY strong women is defeated by man, come on, it is impossible to get "sexister" than that. When we analyze this kind of subject we have to concentrate on the symbols, meanings and archetypes and less on raw logic, we gotta ask ourselves who Kishimoto sees women, what this story say about women, what being a woman in the ninja world means.

    This is precisely why I got so mad at Kishi, he had thousando of opportunities to show readers that in ninja world women could and should be strong but instead he went all "mr. Traditions" and have shown us that Kaguya-Eve, the only strong woman is EVIL and that all good woman are submissive and need a man, seriously, my only hope was Tsunade but she lived and was saved by men all the time, even against Madara, COME ON, it was her spotlight (a poor one but...) and then "oh I'm gonna die unless my ghost prince charming saves me!"... trid to kill myself (mentally)
    i see what you mean, and i understand your frustration as i too share some of it. women were handled poorly here as almost all of the shounen manga i read which is more frustrating considering this is what is known as " the tradition ". again thank god for Erza and Mikasa

    please note that i don't think kishi is a sexist for reasons i and xallisto mentioned, but i've come to understand the counter argument more since i first started reading this thread
    a story that can reach the hearts of people all around the world no matter what their culture or background is and be their favorite is truly and definitely a masterpiece . i hope you last a bit more Naruto. thanks Kishi for the most epic manga

  15. #748
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Exodi's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quote Originally Posted by raoniluna View Post
    Very simple answer: Who are the greatest shinobi of all time?
    1 - Hagoromo
    2 - Hamura
    3 - Indra
    4 - Ashura
    5 - Naruto
    6 - Sasuke
    7 - Hashirama
    8 - Madara
    9 - Obito
    10 - Some man, probably Tobirama or Black Zetsu

    Supposedly Kaguya would be the strongest of all but she was defeat TWICE by two men, in the second time there was a supporting woman among FOUR man (Naruto, Sasuke, Kakashi and Obito)
    Females are usually support or medic, even the strong Tsunade is but a cry baby for Dan and needed Naruto to overcome her blood trauma. Seriously?
    Kishimoto females are PATHETHIC! I could enjoy female characters in some scenes but it doesn't even compare to the males. Seriously, who are Hinata and Sakura? The ones in love, waiting for the prince charming. The other girls, I mean, the girls that are not hidden behind a man doesn't even exist! Ino and Ten Ten were completely underdeveloped! Even Tsunade the Hokage was put aside, the best she could achieve was "your regeneration is almost as goood as Hashirama's". Mei was totally overshadowed even by Udon. Samui = Sexualized. Chiyo = Dead. Temari = Couldn't scratch Raikage that had weakness against her element. Seriously I can't even organize my thoughts on this matter but yeah Kishimoto is VERY sexist, it is always the men saving the day.

    Of seven Hokages, 6 man, 1 woman.

    BTW Of these seven how would you rank Tsunade? I doubt someone would put her in the top three and I highly doubt most people would even consider she not being the weakest of the seven if not for Katsuyu. I guess 90% of the readers thinks she is a total loser for being half senju, half uzumaki and not being able to do any of these bloodlines stuff like sealing, wood release, huge chakra capacity and others.

    HELL MAN is so much sexism I can't think about it without raging...
    I think the fact that you reduce Tsunade to nothing but a cry baby says more about you than it does about Kishimoto.

    You claim Kishimoto is sexist, but you refuse to look at all of the positive his females characters have accomplished and instead focus on the negative to support your idea that Kishimoto is indeed a sexist. Nevermind that a story by an actual sexist would include females characters the way they are portrayed in Naruto. Also, most of the main females are teenagers, who actual do experience things like ridiculous boy-crushes.

    Quite frankly, Tsunade is one of the physically strongest ninja in the series, but even she has psychological and emotional problems, much like so many of the males in the series. I specifically recall Naruto hyperventilaing over Sasuke, which really isn't much less "pathetic" than having a fear of blood (which, btw, she had for a good reason if I recall correctly.)

    Quote Quote:
    Chiyo = Dead
    For example, this. Let's just forget that Chiyo was a boss-ass puppeteer even in her old age. The fact that she had to die means Kishimoto hates women and seeing women succeed.

    Quote Quote:
    Mei was totally overshadowed even by Udon
    This doesn't even make any sense. Two characters that probably never interacted or were in even the same panel together. Wat.

    Quote Quote:
    Samui = Sexualized
    True, her appearance is pretty attractive, but this point really only makes sense if every one of Kishimoto's females were like that.

    Quote Quote:
    Temari = Couldn't scratch Raikage that had weakness against her element
    Again, true. She couldn't beat the man that was said to be physically unbeatable who could only actually be beaten, literally, by his own self.
    This proves Kishimoto is a rampant sexist.

    Quote Quote:
    BTW Of these seven how would you rank Tsunade? I doubt someone would put her in the top three and I highly doubt most people would even consider she not being the weakest of the seven if not for Katsuyu. I guess 90% of the readers thinks she is a total loser for being half senju, half uzumaki and not being able to do any of these bloodlines stuff like sealing, wood release, huge chakra capacity and others.
    Again, reducing Tsunade and her character to just "HOW STRONG IS SHE GUYS?!?"
    Nevermind that she's done incredible things and overcome several obstacles.

    Kishimoto is only a sexist because you want him to be.

  16. #749
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member xallisto's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    U have to try to keep on mind there is a massive difference in cultures between Japan and western cultures, u cant allow yourself to judge cultures based on your own culture. Gender inequality is a big problem in Japan, according to Japan Times there are still many things that happen in japan that would make us westerners scream sexism, but is considered normal in japan. Sadly u have to accept that this is also reflected in japanese literature like manga.

    Thruthfully, i have seen many many many anime/manga where by 4/5 busty attractive women throw themselfs at some pathetic joke of a male main protaganist for reasons that u might aswell pluck out of a hat. There are shows out there that are blatantly sexist, sorry but i dont look at Naruto and see sexism what i see is a culture thats used to and very comfortable with the notion that all women need to be married by 30, need to stay at home, not work and raise children.

    It is sad but it is what it is.
    And Progress is a debt we all must pay
    its convenience we all cherish its pollution we disdain.

  17. #750
    MangaHelper 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Impossibility's Avatar
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    Re: Is Masashi Kishimoto Sexist?

    Quite frankly, I take little issue with the males dominating the power rankings. It's a shonen. That's mostly an expectation of the genre as a result of reader demographics. I think some of the issues with characters when it comes to power rankings are mostly general writing challenges. My real issue is with the actual development of the female characters. Kunoichi were regularly defined by their male peers. Their motivations were embarrassingly male-driven. And the majority of female characters were reduced to fangirls regardless of their talent, intelligence, or ability.

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