Moderator message by: HegemonKhanThis thread is dedicated to Clare. Anything about Clare can be discussed and/or found in this thread.
some references or alternative threads about or involving Clare:
Claymore Clare vs Claymore Ophelia Battle: http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63941
Raki and Clare relationship: http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56664
Characters of Claymore: http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56930
Fantasy fights: http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63725
I've reread the entire manga several times and have enjoyed the insights that I gathered from your posts. It's clarified some the events that I misunderstood or completely missed (reading comprehension 101). Of all the chapters, I find the early chapters much more endearing and interesting. They're far more personal and have a human quality that the later chapters (post Invasion of Pieta) desperately lack.
Perhaps, it's because that the early chapters deal with Clare rediscovering a sense of humanity after her hell as a Yoma captive. In addition, we not only see Clare rediscovering herself but also giving a piece of the humanity she's found to those she encounters in her travels. Teresa of the Faint Smile is the obvious example, "this little girl who's not even half my size taught me that tears can flow from even these silver eyes." From Teresa to Ilena/Irene who later rescues Clare. For a short time training her (knowing that using the Quick Sword would mean her discovery & execution) and even easing Clare's guilt over Teresa's death. Even in Purgatory of the Deepest, there's a human element in the bond that begins to form with Jean and Galatea's act of mercy/clemency.
There's a sense of irony in the story at this current point. Clare, obsessed with avenging Teresa's death, may throw away the humanity that she gained from her time and relationship with Teresa. Are we going to witness Clare becoming the monster she desperately seeks to destroy? I'm hopeful to see more "dialogue" filled chapters as opposed to on going overwhelming violence.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 20, 2010 at 01:42 AM.
I personally don't think Clare cares, lol.
Clare never cared about humanity, that was Teresa's desire for herself, NOT Clare's, and Teresa faultily applied it to Clare as well, Teresa did NOT understand Clare at all, whereas Clare completely understood Teresa. Clare didn't care about "Live as a human, live with humans, and die as a human. This must be the greatest happiness in life", as Teresa so desperately did. No, all Clare cared about "I don't want nice clothes. I don't want nice shoes. I WANT TO BE WITH TERESA FOREVER!", but Teresa never really understood this, still leaving Clare even after Clare just told her what she wanted in the most visable way (nakedly), lol. Well, maybe Teresa did finally understand Clare's desire afterwards, but I'm not sure... this is the one place where Teresa has been flawed and imperfect, hehe.
Clare had known humanity and it was (censored) for her. Clare has more attachment to Claymores then she ever did with humanity (rescued twice by Claymores, abandoned by humans and abused by 2 normal yomas and humans, the bandit Rig). Clare was dead/lifeless as a human, just as Teresa was dead/lifeless as a Claymore, hehe. Then, they found each other and Clare's perception was spot on, and through Clare's determined stubbornness, she gave Teresa exactly what Teresa so desparately wanted, a sense of humanity, and Clare also got what she wanted eventually due to unfortunate circumstances, Teresa..well briefly anyways).
So Awakening (and losing whatever "humanity" she still has) doesn't bother Clare at all, and I'd even argue further that Clare wouldn't care if she became just a replacement or an even more powerful Priscilla, as all Clare cares about is taking Priscilla's head, just as she took Teresa's head. Clare truly exists solely for vengence!
Clare to Helen and Deneve in ch ~104-106: "I don't really care about Raki, I just wanted to be polite and say goodbye to him first, that's all. You two, Deneve and Helen, were good friends and you should get away from here so you don't die, but otherwise, I really don't care about you either. All I care about is vengence against the one whom took my beloved Teresa from me! All I care about is severing Priscilla's head from her body! Fully Awakening, without hesitation or regrets, to decapitate Priscilla!
if you want Irony... that's Miria, hehe.
Miria spent her entire time as Claymore after (Awakened) Hilda's death, to try to protect and keep alive her fellow Claymores. And so, how does Yagi have Miria get killed off? By those very same Claymores that Miria put her entire life into saving, hacking Miria to pieces, grins.
Miria was hacked to pieces by her fellow Claymores, whom she had spent her entire life trying to save. MUHAHAHA! OOOOOOHHHHH, THE IRONY! GRINS
if you want almost DEJA VU:
(after, Clare was being obstructed from killing Priscilla and from Partially Awakening....)
Clare was crying like a baby as she knew she not only failed to get revenge on Priscilla, but also was about to be helplessly decapitated by Priscilla, just like her beloved Teresa was so long ago. Oh, did Clare sure cry! (thankfully, Deneve and Helen were there to save Clare from having the EXACT SAME FATE as Teresa had.... ESPECIALLY DENEVE, HEHE. Heck Dauf even "helped" too, lol. Clare has some strange "bedfellows"/friends, lol)
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 17, 2010 at 06:09 PM.
I'm not entirely convinced that Clare does not care for her human side. Although, I do agree that she obsesses with avenging Teresa's death. She carries her own guilt but also shoulders the Ophelia and Ilena's burden. In regards to Raki, the line she gives Helen and Deneve appears disingenuous. Raki did save her life in Rabona. Her relationship to Raki bares resemblance to her own with Teresa. It would be a shame if she threw away the bonds she made on the name of vengeance. It would be as if her time with Teresa never mattered. I don't know if humanity is the right term in this case. Perhaps a sense of hope, a sense of loving and being loved would more accurately described what she rediscovered with Teresa.
In regards to Miria, as you say, it is truly sad. Those she ultimately wished to save ended her life (or so we are lead to believe by Yagi). "Remember Red, hope is a good thing." <-Shawshank Redemption. So I hope Yagi doesn't kill Miria, although the Chapter 107 would hint otherwise.
Clare cares nothing about her "humanity", but she has a "weak" (soft-caring) heart (like Rafaela, hehe). This is what makes Clare hate what she hates the most:
Clare could never forgive herself, for her lack of rage and anger at Priscilla, as she watched her beloved Teresa's head flying through the air and onto the ground.
And, in order to kill Priscilla, she'd have to steel herself up, just like Rafaela did. Clare was as cold and ruthless as Rafaela was, but then Clare met that Raki, and he brought back out her "weak" (soft-caring) heart, and Clare started to care aobut Raki and now her other fellow Claymores. Rafaela though kept her ruthlessness, even killing her own Claymores without a 2nd thought, all she cared about was her beloved older sister Luciela, and would do anything to save Luciela back, even "selling her soul to the Devil... Rubel", hehe, which is exactly what she did, hehe.
And this softness, DEVA JU - just like Teresa, nearly resulted in Clare having the exact same fate as Teresa had with Priscilla. Clare returned to being soft (no thanks to Raki), and because of it, she (or Teresa or Jean) was preventing Clare from trying to kill Priscilla and Priscilla would ahve decapitated Clare just as she had to the softened Teresa as well, if it weren't for Deneve and Helen.
Clare also rightly felt guilt/responsibility for Teresa's death as she was guilty/responsible, but her encounter with Irene, changed that with Irene's beautiful "cheer up" speech to Clare. Telling Clare how Teresa was finally happy, having finally found/experience a sense of "humanity" thanks to Clare, and was glad for it. That short happiness for Teresa was far prefered then a long life of never knowing happiness, never knowing her desired "humanity".
Thanks to Irene, Clare got over this. HOWEVER, Clare still HATES herself, even more then she hates Priscilla. The thing that Clare hates the most is not Priscilla, but herself! Clare can NEVER forgive herself, her kindness and softness.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 18, 2010 at 03:38 PM.
Man, I did an analysis about Clare some while ago to post on another forum and I just got surprised right now. What Hege wrote is almost the same I did on mine, lol.
I couldn't agree more with you.
10)Well, Raki is older now, maybe older than his brother was at the time he was shown. Or the environment where Raki grew was so different that he had to "evolve", lol. Darwin explains that with natural selection.
Last edited by Fê - forever alone; November 19, 2010 at 10:39 PM.
could/would you post yours here as well ?, as I and I'm sure others would like to read it, even if it might be same/similar to mine. (I actually have a longer character analysis of Clare, this was just a quick summary of it, hehe. so, if interested, let me know and I can provide my longer Clare summary/"profile")
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 19, 2010 at 06:05 PM.
Hi Forever Alone:
Yup, would like to read your analysis. I see the guilt but I just don't see the self loathing that you and HK describe. Do you attribute Clare's recklessness in battle (early chapters) as a manifestation of her and self hatred. She showed compassion in rescuing her comrades (Jean) and helping the task force to defeat the ABs in the northern lands. After the seven year gap, vengeance does appear to be her primary focus. Not trying to argue a specific point of view, just want to understand your grasp on the story.
it's directly said in the manga, by Clare herself (well her internal thoughts, anyways)
ch 24 page 23
here's my *old* posts about Clare:
that's Teresa's wishes/desires... for Clare to "live as a human, live with humans, and die as a human".
This was Teresa's own desire/wish. This is the one time Teresa FAILS at something. Teresa FAILS at understanding Clare. Teresa WRONGLY assumes Clare shares Teresa's own desire/wish (which i just described above).
Teresa's wish/desire/understanding (of happiness) was to be human again. Teresa yearned to be human again. ~"my beautiful black eyes and long black hair stolen from me as I transformed into a wretched monster, a Claymore".
Clare did NOT shared this same desire/wish/understanding (of happiness) as of Teresa's. Clare HAD KNOWN humanity.... and it was CENSORED! her whole family killed and eaten. she being a yoma's "pet" and no human cared/tried to help/save her. instead, she was saved twice by Claymores, from the 2 yomas whom were involved with Clare. Claymores were more of clare's "family" then humans ever would be. Clare had no attachment to humanity, unlike the "yearning-for-a-return-to-humanity" Teresa. (which Clare gave/provided Teresa, a sense of humanity again, albiet briefly, due to priscilla. Clare UNDERSTOOD Teresa. However, Teresa for the first time, FAILED at something; Teresa failed at understanding Clare.)
Clare's already experienced human life was awful. Clare had no desire to go back to being human. Becoming a Claymore was a wonderful thing for Clare, as she now had the potential power/ability to seek her vengence on Priscilla. Clare NEVER looked back upon her lost humanity, never had second thoughts about becoming a Claymore. Clare was dead, until she found Teresa, then dead again after Priscilla killed Teresa. Now, the only thing keeping Clare alive or interested with life, is the pursuit of REVENGE ON PRISCILLA. Clare lives ONLY TO KILL PRISCILLA. This is all that is left for Clare which she cares about. As nice as Raki+love is, and as nice as comrades+friendship is, it just doesn't compare/substitute for what Clare felt from being with Teresa. Teresa was literally Clare's life and happiness. Now that Teresa is gone, all that remains for Clare is vengence.
NO. Clare's idea of happiness was NOT returning to humanity, as what Teresa wanted. NO, it was Teresa herself. Teresa was Clare's idea of happiness. Being with Teresa was Clare's idea of happiness.
again.... i'll quote Clare's very words:
~"I don't want nice shoes. I don't want nice clothes. ( <- HK's interpretation: I don't care about humanity, I'm not like you Teresa... i just want... -> ). I want to be with TERESA FOREVER!"
we're talking about Clare, so who cares about what Teresa or irene or others want of Clare. What CLARE wants is what matters for CLARE. Teresa and Irene and others are merely EPIC FAILURES, at understanding CLARE'S WISHES/DESIRES/INTERESTS. they need to keep their own wishes, desires, interests to themselves, and LET CLARE SEEK THE THINGS SHE WANTS/WISHES/DESIRES FOR HERSELF!
"As for the weird Teresa power rant I'll just look the other way >_> " -BM
my DRAMATIZATION (lol) of the facts:
1. Rig puts his hand on Clare's shoulder. Teresa cuts his hand off instantly.
2. Rig punches Clare to the ground and stomps on her. Teresa after laying on the ground and willing/uncaring about to be raped by Rig, gets up, grabs Rig's own dagger/short sword, and puts it to his neck. Teresa gives her famous "FREEDOM speech" and rig runs away with his head up his bottom.
3. Rig is dragging an unconscious Clare and says to Teresa how Clare had called out for her, "Teresa.. Teresa.. ". Teresa immedately takes off his other hand and slices his head in half at the same time. (Teresa then gives another of her famous speeches. ~"you DAMNED humans. you're worse then yoma. I'll kill each and every one of you!". which she does. hehe.)
4. though strangely, Orsay did not lose his hand or life, when he held Clare hostage... (Teresa should have done the same to him for touching Clare... V.V). However, Teresa did rescue/take Clare back away from Orsay, whom was going to kill her.
CAN YOU SAY TERESA IS JUST A BIT PROTECTIVE OF CLARE, LOL. JUST A BIT. LOL.
(Teresa only sacrifice her life for Clare. only gave her very life for clare. only. lol)
here's my *old* posts about Clare:
Clare's path in life is solely that of Priscilla's death.
(incomplete. took too long. too much work)
(see bottom of my post for the ultimate confirmation of what I've said about Clare, as being correct)
1. chapter 24 pages 22-29
"I couldn't even hate the beast that killed Teresa. It was me, overcome by fear, that I couldn't forgive."
"I don't recall how I lived after that. I only knew I was searching for a stranger dressed in black."
"I want you to put Teresa's flesh and blood inside me!"
"And that's how I became the first person ever to knock on the Organization's door of her own free will!"
2. chapter 25 pages 12-19
"You never change. Always doing things the hard way..... Or could it be?"
"You were hoping for that......."
"Do you want Priscilla's head?"
"....It's too bad. It isn't you."
3. chapter 37 pages 1-30. chapter 38 pages 1-31
(too many lines. Entire chapter shows Clare's determination to kill Priscilla. Irene wants Clare to live. But, Clare just wants to kill Priscilla)
4. chapter 39 page 21 and pages 29-31. chapter 40 pages 20-37
"I just wanted to kill my brother's murderer! I just wanted revenge on the monster that killed my brother!.... It's that. That one horned monster's fault!"
"What are you? You."
"I'm Clare, number 47. I've taken on Teresa's flesh and Irene's right arm."
"I'm the one who's going to take the head of that one horned monster Priscilla. Forgive me. But, I have to take your soul, too."
(too many lines. Clare is clearly shown determined to take Priscilla's life, as seen in Ophelia's game, designed to test how much Clare wants to kill Priscilla and whether Clare has the potential to be able to do so)
5. chapter 45 page 31 and chapter 46 page 5
"Tell me the name of the man in the north, I am going to kill his woman."
7. chapter 101
Clare flat out confirms what I've said in my post about Clare and her "psychology":
chapter 37 page 19
"You said I should have forgotten everything and lived as a human, but there's no way I could do that. At that time Teresa was everything to me. Everything I lost. My life, my voice, even my joy in living. Teresa gave those back to me. Teresa gave me everything. So I had no choice but to move forward. I wasn't strong enough to forget all that and go on living."
here's my *old* posts about Clare:
My understanding of Clare's personality:
A normal yoma ate Clare's brother and took on his appearance as it then ate her parents. Little Clare just stood there and cried. The normal yoma then pounced on her, and Clare cried, ~"Nee-san, why?". Then an unknown Claymore showed up and sliced off the normal yoma's head as it was on top of little Clare.
We don't know if this normal yoma was going to eat-kill Clare, or not. It might even wanted to rape Clare, or not. Also, if it did want to rape Clare, we don't know if it had already done so or was just about to when the unknown Claymore arrived and sliced off its head.
Clare never displayed any fear through this whole tragic/nightmarish experience. She merely cried and then asked "her brother" (the normal yoma in his appearance), ~"Nee-san, why?".
Orphaned little Clare is strangely/unusually actually not "adopted" by the Organization and made into a Claymore.
Just like with Raki, Clare was banished/exiled from her home town, as they were afraid that she'd become a normal yoma. Somehow, amazingly, orphaned little human Clare survived for an unknown amount of time, until...
At some point another normal yoma "finds" orphaned little Clare, and makes her its "toy", at least dragging her from town to town and physically abusing her.
This is strange because usually normal yomas eat humans. Possibly, the normal yoma could have had a sexual interest in Clare. We can't rule this out. Also, what other reasons is there for a normal yoma to not eat a human? Not many that I can think of. The only other reason that I can think of is to make them non-suspicious, as what normal yoma would "have" a human child with it, and not eating it. This causes me to go back to Clare's first normal yoma encounter, whom had eaten-killed her brother and parents. It makes me suspicious of it pouncing on Clare. Was it merely going to eat-kill her? Or, was it not going to eat-kill her, and instead rape her, and keep her as its sexual "toy", like possibly this second normal yoma might be doing.
Also, it makes me wonder if there might be something special about Clare. Two normal yomas have "gone after" her. At least the second one, had no interest in merely eating her, as it didn't do so. Instead, it kept her as its "toy". Also, with the first normal yoma, we don't know if it was going to eat her or not as well. It might also had kept her alive like the second normal yoma had, as its "toy". We also have Raki too whom is unusually craved by yomas as being "delicious" smelling (though Priscilla never eats him, diespite her glutonous appetite for humans, but there was a reason why she didn't. She wanted to regain her memories, especially of Teresa, and Raki could/would hopefully lead her to "Teresa", aka Clare). Also, little human child Clare was able to sense Awakened Priscilla's yoki and even remember it's "signiture/thumb print" for ~100 chapters of manga. Not many humans are capable of sensing yoki, though they do exist, like with little human child Clare.
Anyways, little human Clare is quite enduring. Being dragged around from town to town by the normal yoma and at least physically beaten. Clare was "one tough cookie".
However, Clare was "dead". Her family was eaten, the Organization didn't want her, humans rejected her out of fear, she was another normal yoma's "toy", and she had nothing and no one left to live for or to look forward too. This probably contributed to Clare surviving and enduring being the second yoma's "toy".
Then, Clare was saved from this second normal yoma by another Claymore. A Claymore whom Clare instantly recognized as having the same despair and lifelessness/deadness in her as Clare had in herself. Clare saw right through Teresa's deception of arrogance, ego, snobbishness, "high and mighty", elitism, and etc to hide her deep despair/misery, and lifelessness/deadness. "Misery loves company", I guess. Well, Clare's life returned to her, and Clare was determined not to "lose" this Claymore, as she was the only one capable of possibly understanding Clare and taking an interest in her. This Claymore was obviously Teresa of the Faint Smile, the most powerful being of all time on the island. This is the one of only 3 things that Teresa failed at. Clare instantly recognized Teresa as being the same emotionally/mentally as herself (despair and lifelessness/deadness), and was trying to comfort, support, and help Teresa. But, it took Teresa a long time to realize this herself. Teresa, FAIL #1, lol. Well, as we know, Clare and Teresa became very close to each other.
Clare's determination/stubbornness to "stick" with Teresa, caused both of them to regain "life". They were both in deep despair, lifelessness/deadness, and "suicidal" (as in they didn't care if they were killed). Clare gave Teresa what Teresa wanted most of all, a sense of her returned humanity. Teresa hated becoming a Claymore. Teresa missed her beautiful black hair and eyes as a human. Well, Clare gave Teresa a sense of humanity (as well as I already mentioned, "life") back to her. Teresa found herself becoming as a "human foster mother", and for the first time, someone had seen/treated Teresa as Teresa. Teresa hated how everyone saw/treated her as Teresa of the Faint Smile. Teresa hated the hatred, envy, jealousy, fear, awe/admiration, and etc that everyone had for her. Teresa wanted someone to see/treat her as herself, as Teresa, the "person". Clare did this. Clare saw and treated Teresa as Teresa. Clare didn't see "Teresa of the Faint Smile", "Teresa the Monster", "Teresa the Beautiful and Powerful Goddess", and etc. Clare saw Teresa as "Teresa the Person". Clare gave Teresa an experience of happiness and humanity that Teresa would have never had known otherwise. Clare granted Teresa's wish. Unfortunately, this "dream come true" for both of them, was ultimately ended by Priscilla. This is why I and so many people hate Priscilla and can never forgive her.
Well, the same thing was happening to Clare as well. Clare's interaction and relationship with Teresa, brought her "life" back as well. Clare was happy and her happiness was simply being with Teresa herself. This was Teresa's FAIL #2, lol. Teresa never actually understood Clare, where Clare instantly understood Teresa and gave Teresa what she wanted most, her happiness of humanity. Teresa wrongly thought that Clare's happiness was a return to humanity as well. However, Teresa was very wrong. Clare knew humanity, and it was awful for Clare. Her family was eaten, the Organization didn't want her, humans rejected her out of fear, she was another normal yoma's "toy", and she had nothing and no one left to live for or to look forward too. Clare did not yearn to return to humanity like Teresa did. Clare's happiness was simply in being with Teresa herself. As Clare had tried to make clear to Teresa, as she stripped naked in front of the townsfolk of Rokut town saying this to Teresa: ~"I don't want nice clothes, I don't want nice shoes, I don't want to live as a human, I don't want to live with humans, I don't want to die as a human, I just want to be with Teresa forever!", but Teresa still didn't understand, and left, abandoning Clare to ~"live as a human, live with humans, and die as a human. That must be the greatest happiness in life. I wish I could know it too, but I can't, I'm Teresa of the Faint Smile".
Human -> Claymore:
Well, the death of Teresa, was the 2nd "death" of poor Clare. This impacted Clare too much to ever ultimately overcome again. Clare picked up Teresa's head, unable to separate from Teresa, and searched like a ghost, from town to town for a Black Coat. Clare wanted to become a Claymore with Teresa's flesh (so she could never be separated from Teresa), and to get revenge on Priscilla, for taking her beloved Teresa away from her, taking Clare's happiness and life away from her. Clare only lived on for killing Priscilla. Clare closed up her warm, kind, and soft heart. Steeling herself up to become a DARK AVENGING (not angel, but a scorpion..) DEMON.
Much like Rafaela had done when she had lost her beloved older sister Luciela to Awakening. Steeling and closing herself up so much, that she cared not about being blackmailed by Rubel or the Organization into assassinating her own fellow Claymores, whom the Organization or Rubel deemed "troublesome", because she cared only about her beloved Luciela. The blackmail concerned her not. Rafaela would "sell her soul to the devil" if it meant a chance of redemption with her failure to save Luciela or maybe just to be with Luciela again too. Well, in fact she did just that, "selling her soul to the devil", I mean to Rubel cough cough, or the Organization, lol.
Clare was the ~"first and only human to ever come knocking on the Organization's door".
(It's a good thing that Clare "found" Rubel or rather that Rubel "found" Clare, because had Clare encountered any other Black Coat, especially Orsay, Clare would have gotten a knife through her heart killing her, and Teresa's head would have been smashed into pieces. The Organization just sacrificed/lost their ranks 1-4, rank 1 Priscilla, rank 2 Irene, rank 3 Sophia, and rank 4 Noel, to kill Teresa. They aren't about to "restore" Teresa back into another human, turning that human into a Claymore with Teresa's flesh inside of them)
Clare's emotions went even deeper though. Clare could not hate and feel rage towards Priscilla even as she watched Teresa's head fall to the ground and Priscilla walking by her. This softness and kindness of Clare's heart, is what Clare couldn't forgive the most about herself. This traumatized Clare even more then her guilt of ultimately causing Teresa's death. Clare could never forgive herself for not having negative thoughts towards Priscilla as she watched Priscilla take the most precious "thing" from Clare, her beloved Teresa, her happiness and life in the form of simply being with Teresa.
Claymore (and then HA):
Clare had steeled, hardened, and colded herself up quite well.... until she met Raki. All that work and effort went to waste. Her soft and kind heart returned much to Clare's chagrin. Clare began caring about Raki, then about humans, and other Claymores.
(Though, Ophelia had helped Clare back to revenge by placing the burden of getting revenge on Priscilla for Ohelia and her dead-eaten brother, since Ophelia knew she was too weak to actually kill Priscilla and she had already lost by becoming an Awakened, so it was up to Clare to carry on Ophelia's revenge against Priscilla, as well as Clare's own revenge agaist Priscilla)
However, Clare was still becoming soft (caring too much about others), just like Teresa had with her.... Clare could never defeat Priscilla with this softness.. and would probably die exactly like Teresa had, deja vu. Well, that is exactly what had happened (excluding her death thus far). Clare had become too soft, too caring about Raki, humans, and other Claymores. When Clare finally met Priscilla, she tried to steel herself, to kill Priscilla, but unfortunately, Clare was still thinking/caring about Raki and the other Claymores (Deneve and Helen). So, Clare only partially Awakened herself, instead of just going all out and fully Awakening to extract her revenge. This allowed for the still not definately understood wedge/block/limiter thingy which prevented Clare from trying to kill Priscilla, and then prevented Clare from even being able to partially Awaken.
Now Clare finds herself a helpless "rag doll" being carried by Helen as they (Deneve, Helen, and Clare) try to survive Priscilla by racing towards the Destroyer, their best chance of coming out alive of this dire situation. Poor Clare must be in complete turmoil. She failed to get her desparate desire revenge on Priscilla and is now completely helpless. Clare really (explative 'ed) up, and now Deneve and Helen are in fatal danger as well.
Clare's personality in a "nutshell":
Clare is very emotionally, however she rarely shows it outwardly (much like many guys, lol). However, her actions do....
To describe Clare in a single word:
Clare is impulsive. Clare acts on her emotions. Rigardo fatally wounds Jean, so how does Clare respond? CHARGE! Riful mentions about Priscilla, so how does Clare respond? With serious hard-bottom attitude, ~"TELL ME THE NAME OF THE MAN IN THE NORTH, I'M GOING TO KILL HIS WOMAN!", RAWR!, lol. Riful then responds and Clare cuts her off, the Abyssal One Riful herself, ~"SHUT UP, JUST TELL ME WHERE HE IS, SO I CAN KILL PRISCILLA!", RAWR!, lol. Riful tells Clare that if Clare can hit her, she'll tell, so how does Clare respond? CHARGE! And many more examples of Clare's IMPULSIVENESS!
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 20, 2010 at 01:15 AM.
Well, here my analysis, and opinions about Clare. I had little time to translate it, so I'm not sure it'd make sense to you guy, but I hope you read, lol.
The girl with no life who could not speak.
Clare lost the ability to express herself, her eyes were dead, she lost the ability to speak, feeling, wanting, and finally, trying to survive. Clare had even lost the ability to hate youma that caused her much pain.
But all this was - somehow - broken by Teresa. Once Teresa appears in Clare's life, the girl devoid of humanity (read: desire to live) shows signs of life. Without speaking, without knowing how to communicate, she embraces Teresa. Even beaten, humiliated and threatened, the girl doesn't quit. Clare had finally found a goal for a living: Teresa.
Now we can see how determined Clare is/becomes after she met Teresa. Putting her life at risk, she continues to follow Teresa. Not that it mattered, since without Teresa, Clare would not have a life, then nothing more certain than follow Teresa, even if it meant her death.
Later on, after being accepting by Teresa, we have more traits of her character. Clare does not care if she gets injured, but not stand to see her beloved Teresa be abused. Reminiscences? I think so. Why? We know that Clare saw herself in Teresa. Teresa had the same eyes devoid of life, the same expressionless face, the same lack of will, the same desire not to live. Teresa, despite being the strongest, was as fragile as a little helpless girl. Clare saw clearly that, she knew that Teresa needed company because she needed. Clare knew that Teresa needed a nurturing hug because that was what she needed, Clare knew that Teresa was hurt inside because she was too.
So, in an unlikely way, the lost and lifeless girl becomes the savior of the strongest claymore. Teresa had returned her to speak, and Clare gave a sense to live to Teresa, and Teresa was the reason for her existence, one would complement the other and both should be together for they could really live.
But Teresa did not get it, Teresa was unable to understand Clare like her was understood by Clare. A little girl who knew only pain, suffering and could not even speak was able to see the essence of the soul of a grown woman, but this woman could not understand the lil' girl the same way, though she reciprocate the feeling.
This misunderstanding became very clear when Teresa bought nice clothes and found a good place for Clare to live as a human. She thought that was what Clare wanted, what Clare needed, and even when the girl said she did not want or need any of that, all she wanted was to stay with Teresa - and said it completely nude; is there a way of being clearer than that? - Teresa still couldn't understand.
Clare only cares about Teresa, nothing else.
Well, Teresa was only able to understand Clare after the thieves and org' incidents.. Now yes, she understood Clare as Clare understood her. One completes the other, one gives the other what she lacks, protection, care and love. They found the meaning of humanity in them, without one, the other could never be human. As a mother and daughter, as sisters, as friends, as lovers (in the pure sense please, lol.).
Teresa, for having finally found her peace of mind, finally finding a way to live, eventually had her "heart softened”, and that brought the inevitable death.
And now that Clare has lost her reason to live, has lost her humanity, has lost everything and the only thing that was precious to her – she's not even capable of hating the being who had taken hier most beloved, but she's capable of hating and blaming herself.
Clare knows that if it were not for her, Teresa would cut Priscilla's head when she had the opportunity. Then, carrying the guilt and a deep hatred for herself, she decides to become one with Teresa, and so she would be forever connected by blood, soul and Youki with her true life.
My name is not important, it will soon be forgotten.
Clare, trying to get rid of guilt and remorse, attaches Priscilla to the burden of the villain, after all, it was she who cut the head of Teresa.
The girl has grown and is now an attractive claymore, skilled and trained in disguise to have multiple personalities, depending on the situation. Clare "abandoned" her humanity at the time Teresa was murdered, and therefore acts cold and calculating. More attentive to the eyes, it appears that she tries in every way to imitate the distant and imposing personality of Teresa.
Realize that Clare acts exactly like Teresa acted just as arrogant and cold, just as “lifeless”, but one thing she was different: Teresa didn't have feelings, but Clare has hate, and contrary to the Itachi's philosophy, she still was weak despite the hate consume her whole being.
For a human, the No.47 doesn't care about her body, nor with their welfare. Who was like this? Who has not bothered to get her body injured because of a human?
Anyway, Clare live the life of claymores, marginalized and alone. Even the only friendship that she made isn't important. She gets the black letter of the friend who helped her endure the pain of training, and almost without emotion performs her task, but the presence of Raki, slowly begins to shape her attitudes, and return her other feelings, other than sadness and hatred.
This gets clear in Rabona, and even clearer when Helen makes a joke. After traveling with Raki, Clare is no longer cold and distant as Teresa was before she met her. Coincidence? So different, but similar, and Raki finds his “Teresa” and changes her, but this time it's not cold and lonely warrior softens and becomes weaker, in fact, strengthens Raki Clare. Yes, strengthens Clare Raki, because unlike Teresa, Clare understands Raki.
She gets stronger because the kid wants to protect her, and she needs to get stronger to protect the boy - whom she designs her own image. So, Clare decides to change a little her way of life for the sake of the boy for her own good, for the sake of Teresa.
Sorry, but I'll take your soul...
I think it is not necessary to speak of how Clare will acquire skills more akin to Teresa, nor most of her fights, or how her new friendships and Raki had strengthened.
But Clare is different. She isn't acting so cold and distant, despite keeping her composure. She still seems calm on the outside, but inside the woman is just a storm. We can say that is because of the clash of her inner emotions and feelings. This is what Galasexy implies when she comments about Clare's state of mind.
Clare, who after losing her humanity had always been alone and had acted indifferent, now finds herself in the midst of the people that has affection of her, enjoy her, who wish her well. But if she continues with her new friends and live, she'll never be able to complete her real goal, she'll never be able to kill Priscilla, as they have other goals, and for some reason, more “noble” than hers.
Then Clare finds herself in conflict with innerself, what should she do? Follow her original plan, or let it go? The biggest problem is that Clare needs to get revenge, she can't commit suicide, since this would kill Teresa again. Clare must kill Priscilla to feel relieved of guilt, but her friends are also important.
We note that Clare cares to follow her own rules, follow her own instincts. It may be a memory of Teresa betraying org. to live the way she wanted after finding a reason for it. Well, we know that Clare used the org. only to get the strength to complete her goal. Miria's story had only given her one more reason not to follow orders blindly, and perhaps gave her another goal, but less important.
Anyway, against Ophelia, her character is once again put to the test. Clare has no chance of victory, then tries to escape, finally showing herself preoccupied with her life, with its promise, or revenge?
She ends up being saved by Irene, who consoles her, saying that Teresa was happy, and she died happy. But that's not the console, actually is just a fleeting comfort. Clare also feels responsible, and wants revenge. This becomes clear soon after, when Ophelia reveals that Priscilla was also responsible for her pain.
And the fact that Clare "took her soul" proves that deep down the real culprit isn't Priscilla, but herself. Why? Clare feels that because if not for her, the blue fairy would never have existed, and all the pain and destruction caused by it would be avoided. Yes, the words of Irene had a temporary effect that lasted only until Clare hear the name Priscilla.[SILVER]Obsession is cool, right? Lol.[/SILVER]
As seen before, Clare clings to her rules and accept the terms imposed by Ophelia in the same way thats he accepted the terms put by Miria and Irene. They serve to strengthen her and prove to herself that she can and will get stronger to cut Priscilla's head. That's why she needed to train her new ability in Ophelia's awakened body , that's why she can go beyond her limits and come back, that's why she fights so desperate and reckless, because if she is unable to survive on weaker enemies, she certainly can't take revenge.
Your life is your life, do what you want with it.
We have seen how stubborn Clare is and why she “gets so many miracles” that no other could. Her determination is greater than the anyone's, so she's capable of challenging the concepts established by org. and defy even death.
Here we see an emotional and worried Clare, who cares about her comrades, just as Miria. What will happen? Clare will enter a fight that is not hers, risking her life to save warriors who she doesn't even know, and who can become her enemy?Yes, of course. Besides being a great workout to strengthen, Clare listens to her own feelings and ignore hatred for a while. After all, one can not but feel touched by the scene she saw in the city. Claymores are marginalized, Teresa too, but they should not be, after all, they are fighting for human's sake. Clare will help them, they deserve, and also she will get rid of youma, preventing the birth of new monsters. Indeed, it must have been the biggest reason for her to go.
When she finds Jean in a critical condition, and knowing the awakening, Clare tries everything to bring her back. This time, she would not allow the birth of another “Priscilla”, and manages to bring No.09 back from awakening, as a miracle.
But Clare is still trying to act cold and distant. Not good for most people to stick to her, in fact, is not good that other people makes her their reason to live. Clare knows what happened to the last one who did it, and doesn't know the fate of the latter. So she tries to act tough, so she stays away and tries to get people not to approach. In this world, feelings are painful, and dangerous.
In the north, cold and suffering, in the west, destiny and despair.
Clare is convinced to join the war by the organization for only two reasons: finding Raki, and knowing more about Priscilla, her main goal.
Well, needless to say what happened in this war, except for the fact that Clare found herself right again, to create bonds, affection and feelings is extremely painful, sustained, and will always hurt more those who stay. Thus, Clare decides to finally act on her own and become increasingly independent. She doesn't want to get involved that much because in the end, she'll end up hurting her friends and herself.
She just needs to search for Raki to meet him and let him know she cared and kept her promise. Just as she'd like to hear Teresa saying that, Clare needs to talk to something like Raki, since both have a relationship similar to the one she had with Teresa.
In the west, Rafaela who was connected with Teresa, who was linked to Clare, who met Irene who knew the two of them and may have been killed by Rafaela, who later met up with Clare, called her by youki. Or maybe the Teresa's asleep youki in Clare has reacted psychically with the newly tweaked Destroyer's youki, and then created a strange connection, which eventually led them to Clare. A “simple” way of trying to explain what happened.
We saw what happened to them, mixed up mentally, shared memories, desires and feelings, their bodies also were mixed, one almost becomes another, almost lost in one another, but in the end, Clare was able to get off in “one piece”,taking with her the whole essence of Rafaela, and perhaps also of Luciela. And this implies that the Destroyer has only stuck to the unconscious desire of the three of them, which was to end all, end all life because it blamed for all the misfortunes that have occurred thus far, it blamed for all lives ruined by their own weaknesses and lack of power to protect those who they wanted to protect the most.
Yes, the Destroyer is nothing more than the Clare's will, mixed with the wishes of the sisters. Despite the Clare's concern about the well being of her friend, she never got over the hatred for herself, she was never able to overcome her weakness and be forgiven for failing to protect what was more important: Teresa, and in a lesser scale, Raki.
That – in a poor way - would explain why Raki successfully prevent the advancement of parasitization, and the Destroyer's attraction on Priscilla, the rods's fear, and the search for Clare's unconscious body. Thus, since the three were reconnected, would be able to stop ble fairy, and end the mass destruction of innocents.
Anyway, all this analysis seemed coherent after Clare said she would abandon her humanity, and leave everything that was important just to get to kill Priscilla, and indeed, Clare was only capable to kept herself alive until then for this sole reason.
The irony is that Clare has lost her humanity to Priscilla, who in turn lost it because of Clare. And one was looking the other for so long, and now they met again - became one, and one thing that does not remember the two of them. The irony is that their obsession has united them into one, it took them everything, deprived them of everything, and now all they have is each other, all they are is one and another.
Priscilla wanted so bad to find the source of has caused her to lose her memories and retrieve them, and Clare, who wanted to find the source of her woes, and they finally meet. And the only way to Clare - who blamed herself for everything that Priscilla had done, who hated herself so much because of it - stop Priscilla is to seal herself together and become part of the hated object.
Clare, who hated herself and Priscilla, and cared about that more than everything else, became what she hated the most, and held herself indefinitely with her hatred.
In the end, Rafaela was right? The error was Clare' hatred and the extreme importance she gave to it, that she had to learn from her own body when she loses/abandons/leaves behind all the rest? Is that her mistake?
Last edited by Fê - forever alone; November 24, 2010 at 01:18 PM.
Absolutely Awesome! WOW!
I actually don't have much to say, as it speaks for itself.
you made a lot of insights and connections that I never realized.
simply top notch!
I do have some (minor) disagreements, but as a whole, I agree with it strongly.
Clare is a caring "person", she saw Teresa in the same pain she was in, but instead of wanting to help herself, she wanted, tried, and succeeded in helping another, Teresa, and would continue to help others, at the sacrifice to her own needs, wants, and desires (revenge, killing Priscilla).
This is what Clare hates about herself, she's too caring and soft. She couldn't hate Priscilla even as she watched her beloved Teresa's head fall to the ground. Clare's caring and softness caused the death of Teresa, by infecting Teresa, making her caring and soft, which resulted in her death. Clare's caring and softness, has caused many others to become attached to her, infected with Clare's caring and softness, and end up dying as well. Clare hates herself, hates all of the death and destruction she's caused. Both the Destroyer and Priscilla came to be from Clare. Teresa, Elena, Jean, Miria, Ophelia, Irene, Rafaela, Riful, Dauf, and etc.. have died because of Clare. And Raki could lose his humanity or his life to Clare.
Clare blames herself for everything, for everything/everyone bad being created and everything/everyone good being destroyed.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 23, 2010 at 01:47 PM.
I agree that Clare hates herself because of the events surrounding the death of Teresa of the Faint Smile. Teresa of the Faint Smile’s warrior abilities diminished as her maternal instinct surfaced and evolved. She could no longer act as the cold and efficient killer that she once did. This inability to exact death when needed ultimately caused Teresa of the Faint Smile’s demise. She had caused the death of her adoptive mother and stricken by overwhelming terror could not assist her in the final moments.
However, I can’t help but think that there is more to her guilt than this. The manga clearly illustrates that Clare does not care to live a human life and would prefer to lead an uncertain, if not dangerous, life in the company of a Claymore. We also know that Teresa of the Faint Smile wished, above all, that Clare lead a human life. Does Clare resent herself for lacking the strength/conviction to carry through Teresa’s wish? It’s as if Teresa had died in vain. I get the sense that she would have accepted her execution had Orsay ensured Clare’s safety and proper conduct (life a human). Some of the forum members believe that Orsay would have killed Clare. I disagree in that regard and he most likely would have turned her into a Claymore, something Teresa would never have allowed.
The Org "redacted" or covered up the whole Teresa's Era and its events.
Galatea did not know whom Priscilla was, and Ophelia did not know whom Irene was. Miria did not know Teresa's flesh was inside Clare, nor knew whom Clare's new arm belonged to (Irene), as well.
(the Claymore trainees who knew that Clare had Teresa's flesh inside her, were all killed by the normal yoma except for the one Claymore trainee Clare saved)
and so, couple the above with Orsay's and Teresa's words, actions, and body language, I still firmly feel that Orsay was indeed going to kill Clare, and had he weren't going to kill Clare, Teresa would have instead accepted her execution. Teresa lived on, ONLY to protect Clare from the Organization, and everything else and everyone else that came up as well, lol.
The Organization just lost their ranks 1-4 (Priscilla-1, Irene-2, Sophia-3, and Noel-4), in killing Teresa, so they want Teresa dead, and certainly not having her flesh inside of Clare, to be (figuritively only at this point still) "reborn", lol.
However, I'm going to argue, that Rubel on the other hand, wanted to implant Teresa's flesh (and her power) into a more "docile/obedient/controllable" host, like little human child Clare... hehe.
And, unsurprisingly, Rubel manipulates/coerces the Organization to allow it, despite how much they wanted to kill Clare and smash Teresa's head to pieces. hehe.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; November 22, 2010 at 05:13 AM.
ok u explained everything, there is nothing more to add, any ideas what will happen next? ghosts are gonna atack HQ and Raki is in there, he has seen Deneve and Helen they know where Clare is, is he gonna save her again ? if so what will happen next? Clare will be the most powerfull being on the island are they gonna atack the Dragons?
it does seem likely that the Ghosts will find, rescue, and bring back Raki, whom will be taken/go to Clare. Unless, Yagi has something happen to Raki, instead. As to what then, no idea!
But, who knows, what Yagi will actually do. we should be finding out though soon enough
and i have to say u did great job guys, there is one thing i would like to ask about. U say: Clare makes a mistake, she cannot kill Priscilla and survive at the same time the only way is to seal both of them inside the Destroyer. I dont really know how strong Clare is now, ( well we know she is almost as strong as Miria or the other way around ), also we know she has Teresa's body inside her that is giving her PSY ability so we can say that Clare can be as strong as Teresa in the end, if Clare was so strong she would be able to kill Priscilla hand to hand without Destroyer's help.
My idea ( i dont know where to post this):
When i think about putting yoma's body inside Claymore, one thing seems strange. Teresa had the PSY ability, then Clare has as well, there are other kind of Claymores with different special abilities, all we can say is that Claymores die and the next ones has the same ability ---> numbers 10 as we were said vs Claymores,
Teresa -> Clare PSY, yoki sensing abilities ( org. awalys has 1 so called "eye", and when the old one doesnt listen or has to be replaced they know how to "make" another one ) its not like they have new recruits and they are kind of upgreading after battles or gaining new abilities during combat, no, they are made to be like that, so i think they have dead bodies of Dragons and every time they want to creat a new kind of Claymore or need a new one they use a different Dragon, look at Priscilla and Teresa why they were so strong? ( lets say they werent HA ) Maybe org tried to creat a very strong Claymore using one of the strongest dragons? after Teresa's case they realized they cannot control such a strong Claymore and started other projects, what u think about it? ( maybe someone posted something like that before ), and when i think about it teresa was strong as a kid, the same that mental girl (Miata?) and Priscilla
sorry for my english, im not drunk ;]