Okay alot of people been talking about how other characters are stronger than guts. Like sure DBZ are too powerful for anyone but the poll about that dude whos in baki the grappler is stronger than guts, i say no, guts may not be a martial artist but his a hardcore fighter who knows how to fight and thats being dirty and hang in there till you kill.
Gut's is really strong, he took down 100 men by himself and he can fight the aspotles like we all saw the others get own by aspostles and guts is there ripping out one of their horns and using it as a weapon. Guts has that thing when you knock him down he keeps getting up and asks for more.
Hm... hmm.... well...
So, first of all Guts is somewhere "near" a plausible, realistic amount of power so totally supernatural guys like Dragon Ball or people from other universers with weird rules (Bleach with it's spirit level, Naruto's chakra/ninjutsu system etc.) don't really count. Guts certainly exceeds normal human level, but not by an really extreme amount.
The next problem would be the kind of competition how to measure it.
In combat? Guts is a sword fighter and his expertise with swords and to be able to fight in heavy armor are what he gained because it suits his world of medieval warfare. So he wouldn't be really comparable to characters of modern scenarios who might be specialised on modern firearms -technological advantage would obviously solve for most of those- nor really with most characters who fight without any weapons, as even with martial arts skills it wouldn't be a good idea to face a guy who is able to swing such a big sword at such speed.
Prohibiting any weapons at all would distort the competition as well, as Guts obviously focused on sword fighting since he isn't a sportsman but a warrior.
As I didn't read many manga suiting this, the only real comparison I could make would be with the Samurai of Shigurui as they also live in world on an equal tech level and without much of supernatural elements.
He'ld fair very well against them I'ld say... not due to skill though, but due to equipment. A massive plate harness and a huge two handed sword against unarmored fighters with their quite "weak" Katanas which have less range and couldn't block a massive two handed sword well either would easily mean victory I guess, especially since he also uses a cannon, a crossbow and small bombs.
i could think of only two people who could be considered as badass as guts
thor from vinland saga
kenshin from rurouni kenshin
ogami itto of lone wolf and cub (dont know whether to include the son cause the son and father live meifumado)
but inspite of my best efforts i could not objectively say who amongs these four would win against each other. obviously i considered guts without his berserk armor.
i did not consider any shonen character cause like rolfkop3r said shonen belong to an entirely different category.
guts is the strongest human in berserk but idk about that outside of beserk.
my list of who i would like to see vs guts
musashi: musashi from vagabond would probably beat guts in a fight and his as normal as it gets in a manga.( his far better then guts when it comes to swordsmanship and would take advantage of guts right eye ,going for his blind spot. all he has to worry is about dodging guts huge sword , and if he can dodge a katana thats alot faster then what guts could ever swing his sword , i think he would be okay. ) also when he gets to fight sajiro , we will get to see how he does againts someone with a long sword.
manji from sword of the immortal would be make a good fight
akira inugami from wolf guy ( i want to see if guts sword would break on him, and nothing more since well it would be an unfair fight.)
and kenshin from samurai x
=3 those guys are normal enough from guts to fight
i doubt guts would swing his dragon slayer faster then musashis katana ( not to mention he can cut someone in half with one handle swing so he does have a lot of muscle ,and guts dragon slayer is to heavy( its to heavy for a normal person but with guts muscle it should be as fast as a normal soldiers speed ) for him to counter musashis sword swing when his in range ) and both manji and musashi are both heavily built )
I didn't read Vagabond yet, but a Katana has serious trouble against a full plate armor as Gutts is wearing. Putting the supernatural Berserk effect aside, he still has the muscle power of wearing a heavy plate harness. One handed weapons of the size of a Katana (approx. 1kg if I'm not mistaken) don't have a real chance of penetrating it, put aside to actually make a cut. Medieval European weapon developement was alot about how to injure a fully armored knight as far as I know, as it takes serious and often heavy weapons - war hammers (also with a piercing tip), special armor piercing swords (Estocs) and diverse piercing weapons.
Berserk certainly does not treat the effect of armors and weapons realistically either, but a Katana looks pretty weak compared to a plate armor as it's not designed for piercing attacks at all nor has the weight or stability to damage it.
Last edited by Roflkopt3r; November 17, 2010 at 12:50 PM.
Guts is interesting, sure his a human and all, but he is incredibly strong. The guy kills demons every night. The queen fairy fight proves how gut's can handle a fast aerial opponent, he had few seconds to attack or dodge. The epic fight that proves how good gut's is when him and serpico first fought on the ledge of the cliff. For gut's to have everything against him and still be able to do good (it makes serpico really smart trapping him like that) That little fight was epic, i love how serpico dodges gut's attack by dropping down then grabbing a spike bomb and throws it and climbs back up to flee.
Kenshin is awesome but would be no match for guts but it would be sort of like a guts vs serpico kind of match, i don't think many could be able to fight guts when he is serious. except dbz lol.
The supernatural characters, i reckon gut's could own naruto (it's nothing he hasn't dealt with before. Prob beat ichigo, ichigo is fast but guts is a swordmaster, he would read him like a book.
read sword of the immortal and veganbond then we can get into it further.
don't get me wrong guts epic but he doesn't do well against fast opponents, especially one thats fast and has the ability to cut a human in half with one handle swing.
heres a picture that can help you Imagen it. the dragon slayer would be close to impossible(even tho we seen him done it before) to stop midway giving musashi the chance to step into his range and cut guts head off clean ( like how his about to do in the picture with his wabiki or however you spell that ) and im comparing guts with out the berserk armor ability
P.S im not saying they will win against guts but they do have a high chance. i would love to see giichi or makie fight with guts
Last edited by Crisis.; November 20, 2010 at 04:28 AM.
Looks fast, doesn't it? He also managed to get himself into position behind that guy afterwards and to kill him.
Against any kind of Samurai or other japanese sword fighters: No matter how skillful the fighter, with a "natural" Katana he would not be able to hit Gutts anywhere beside at his head or his unarmored arm, and Gutts will very well know so.
It's also not like Gutts would be a random spear carrier #19515 who lets his life in battle because he didn't use the range advantage of his weapon to his advantage. Gutts, with his skill and knowledge, would definitly know that he has a range advantage and use it to it's best. Apart from that he also has a crossbow and a cannon, just in case there might be a possibility to use them at one point, and an iron hand with which he crushed quite some skulls already when it seemed like he couldn't defend himself anymore.
He also managed to catch Serpico's quick sword with his bare hand and bend it so his hand was safe. Just as an example of how quick and skillful he is.
Apart from this:
-He's in a perfect age for fighting probably
-Even so, he has incredible experience: After all he's the boy who hugged his sword at the age of six. His sword was pretty much the only constant in his life and some kind of friend to him. He's also fighting since very early childhood and never stopped doing so ever since - real fighting, not just some practice matches mostly.
-And something which isn't very useful for a duell, but makes him even more complete as a warrior: He knows every kind of war and fighting: He can fight in any kind of armor, on horseback, knows about huge scale battles, besiegement, probably some about military tactics and acted as a leader for the raiders. Probably he can use many other weapons besides swords, such as polearms, bows and crossbows.
Last edited by Roflkopt3r; November 20, 2010 at 04:33 AM.
I reckon in that kind of quick draw fight gut's would not do the first attack with his sword. He would use the dragon slayer as a shield from the draw attack then shoot with his canon or arrows lol.
Anyone wonder how dante from devil may cry would go? imo i think he would be creamed but he is so cool lol. Then again how would gut's handle a gun?? Like his armor would protect him but what about a headshot, well guts would use his sword to cover his head or something.
It makes me think guts and dante seem alike with powers and stuff. I wonder if Guts is half human (i am bs on k) we saw his dead mother but never knew anything of guts father, he could of been on the tree or raped the woman or was a aspostle who raped that woman, but then again sheike or someone would be able to tell guts isn't normal....well they say his not normal.
Last edited by 102jayday; November 21, 2010 at 09:09 AM.
I reckon Musashi could reach his level, heck maybe even Kojiro...but that's pretty much it, probably because I don't really know what manga to pick...somebody mentioned Thor from Vinland Saga...Well that could work as well, though I think Guts is pretty much more powerful then everybody mentioned before, and his swordplay doesn't really fall far under either...it's Guts for me...
If we're talking about Gutts in the Berserk Armor then that's another thing. He's not restricted by pain and wounds and his bones and body parts and spin back into place.. Berserk Armor Gutts would eventually take down Kenshin.
I see it like this:
Golden Age Gutts << Kenshin
Gutts < Kenshin
Berserk Armor Gutts > Kenshin
As Thors only has been shown eliminating some standard guys and outsmarting (plus outpowering) Askeladd, it's really really hard to estimate his powers besides "strongest guy in Vinland Saga". Could he probably pull of something amazing like avoiding Gatsu's sword and moving into a range too close for his sword to be used well? Can't be answered imo, although I tend to say that Gatsu is stronger.
(However, the way Thors died made him a hell of a badass character and deserves him a nice place in badass character rankings imo, though nobody could replace Gatsu on place #1 )