Why did Shinji put on his mask to take on a half-dead Grimmjow? Moreover, why was he on the run while unmasked?
Shinji on the run while unmasked from a half-dead Grimmjow
There is a massive gap in power/speed here.
Your argument is very weak.
I am not sure if your mind refuses to believe it, or your eyes refuse to see it: but Shinji was on the run from a half-dead Grimmjow and was forced to don his mask
Shinji was on the run and dodging a half-dead Grimmjow's attacks. Not to mention, I'd say Grimmjow was at 10% of his full potential there, factor in:
1) One arm
2) Already injured and half dead from the beating that Ichigo had inflicted on him
3) Was frozen once by Rukia
4) Was unreleased
It is a fair statement that Base Shinji while masked = 6th Espada
Last edited by LucyBenard; April 07, 2011 at 02:32 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Base vs Base Shinji would undoubtedly lose
Masked Shinji vs Base Kyoraku he could gain an advantage, possibly.. Not banking on it though
Shikai vs Shikai is where Shinji takes it for me. The dangers of Kyoraku's games being reflected on himself while also having Sakanade in play leads me to believe Shinji can land his blows alot easier than Shunsui could, and thus win the fight
Shunsui could win if he activates his games without telling Shinji about them, but this is IC, and he likes to drop hints about his abilities, and Shinji has shown to be quite analytical
Shinji takes it for me
Fact is, Shinji was a Captain 100 years ago, and has a hollow power boost. However much power this gives him, it's enough. With Sakanade, no one but Yama by virtue of raw power or someone with extraordinary quick thinking skills (Aizen) could possibly counter him. Strength doesn't play that big a part, although I believe him to be Shunsui's equal in power anyway.
Last edited by ShootToKill; April 07, 2011 at 02:40 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
That's just your Shinji over hype at work here. Shunsui is more than intellectual to toy around with Shinji's kids toy. For someone as senior and experienced as him, not to mention, someone who is held as one of the greatest by Yamamoto, to not be able to overcome such a child's game is simply a ludicrous idea.
Shinji was not holding back against Grimmjow (Grimm was at 10% of his full power) and was forced to use a mask. He was on the run constantly while sealed. That explains why he had to put on his mask (seeing how he'd reveal his ability to Aizen too after 100 years). There is no one or two ways about it: Shinji had to use his mask.
Shinji's cero did nothing to Grimmjow, he just got up instantly and was ready to release. In fact; it was FIGHT ON! from that moment on, if anything.
Yamamoto is right until proven wrong. Shunsui >>>>> Shinji. Anything else is just pure fan-hype since the manga says otherwise.
Also, you're clearly neglecting Grimmjow's handicaps here:
1) One arm
2) Already heavily injured and fatigued
3) Was unreleased
Shinji on the other hand, was 100%, Grimmjow was like 10%.
Last edited by LucyBenard; April 07, 2011 at 02:47 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Perhaps Shunsui is not as dumb as a rock but Shinji and the rest of the masked moron patrol are and Shinji is the best of them (at being dumb, its an art to him, The art of being dumb).
Let's see, 100 years of prep vs Aizen and you:
1. fight him with no mask on.
2. belive that your crep shikai can do shit to KS.
3. Belive that your crep shikai can do shit to Aizen with no KS.
4. Unable to take down even 1 of the espada.
5. 2 of them owned vs 1 espada.
6 Underestimate Aizen to a horible degree (before and after the 100 years)...
and more but meh no point... Yes Shinji and the rest of this guys are morons. 100 years and no plan in fighting Aizen but let's show up and try to punch the guy ... Patetic.. Not even 1 Kido expecialy design to take down Aizen or tactic (Yama Ji and stabbing himself to find Aizen or Urahara and his prep). Really 100 damn years and no plan? WTF? Shinji is probably going to try to trow rocks at Shunsui... Sry but considering Shinji's intelect he has no hope here.
Shunsui wins this just like Ken should have won this.
Actually above there was a clearly good example from Databook that his intellect is 90 from 100, so he is intellectual enough to counter Sakanade. And there is nothing that can imply otherwise.Quote:
Acually the example with the mirror was a bit of comic relief, but still it's really mostly like this.
Also Shunsui has two swords, so of course he has counter to Shinji's ability.
Also he can just use his Shikai first and that would be Shinji's death. Shunsui is the best in his game.
1. There are different Captains. Some are like Mayuri or Tousen and some are like Shunsui and Ukitake. And he clearly wasn't at Shunsui or Ukitake's level when he was in Gotei. And during the battle in FKT his head was practically choped by sealed Tousen (Tousen is considered one of the weakest Captains on the forums), so it's pretty good fit for sealed Shinji.Quote:
At the same time sealed Shunsui was on par with sealed Starrk (the second strongest Espada) and that's a good feat.
Shinji has a boos with his Mask, but it is only for two minutes and he didn't show anything while sealed and without Mask to be even better than Byakuya, so even with his Mask I doubt he would be better than Shunsui, until it would be prooven by manga.
I think it's pretty obvious. Yama doesn't speak much and only tells some usefull info like Ukitake and Shunsui being the strongest Shinigami that graduated from Shinigami Academy or that he himself is the strongest Shinigami for the last 1000 years. It was prooven to be a fact.Quote:
How exactly is this doing "nothing?"
Nowhere else have we seen Grimmjow so distraught, and after one attack no less. Another key point is that that wasn't even a direct hit, that was simply Grimmjow getting thrownback by the force of his own cero colliding with Shinji's. A direct hit would have likely killed him.
Grimmjow knew after a single attack he was f*cked if he didn't use his resureccion. That's already more than can be said for Ichigo's bankai hollowfied getsuga tenshous.
As for Shinji's intelligence, yeah he did grossly underestimate Aizen, but at least over the last 100 years he wasn't eating out of the palm of his hand like all the dimwits up in Seireitei. In fact, who was that moronic captain again? You know the one that was Aizen's alibi during Kisuke and Tessai's trial, effectively allowing Aizen to get away with framing them? Oh yeah...
Last edited by El Samurai Guapo; April 07, 2011 at 03:00 AM.
El Samurai Guapo
Grim was already beaten pretty much by Ichigo and more important he didn't have one of his hands and got lower reiatsu, because of it, so of course it isn't a fit to beat half dead person with your strongest attack.
Prove to me Shunsui can work out and react in time to Sakanade. I would love to see you try.
Did you see an expression of concern on Shinji's face? He was dodging Grimmjow's attacks with ease, under no threat whatsoever. Perhaps Grimm was at 10% for all I know, but that's irrelevant since he had absolutely nothing on Shinji. Shinji put on his mask either to make things even easier (like Yama vs Hallibel's fraccion) or simply as a display to the enemy showing what side the vizards were on.
Oh, and you say that dodging = on the run? Remember this? Was Shunsui on the run from Chad?
As for all the other stuff, I've replied to it many times yet you insist on repeating yourself ad nauseum, so I'm going to stop trying to convince you that Yama isn't omniscient etc.
Grimmjow was massively handicapped in that fight, whereas, Shinji was at 100%.
Not to mention, I am not sure if you are trying to imply that "Grimmjow couldn't release because of the cero" ..... Ulquiorra simply stopped him.
Ulquiorra there would have massacred Shinji, let me point that out.
As for intelligence, Shinji is as dumb as they get; Shunsui is clearly a genius compared to him.
As for the Sakanade issue, Grimmjow had already demonstrated that if you rush Shinji from the instant the fight begins, he will not have the time to stand and spin his sword for a minute; as we already saw against Aizen (Aizen was chilling).
The probability of Shinji having the time to release his Shikai uninterrupted is exponentially smaller than Shunsui simply shunping in (he's a lot faster) and trying to hack his head off.
Also, it is pretty obvious that Aizen WANTED TO SEE what Shinji's shikai was all about, seeing how Shinji had hid it from him all that time. Aizen let Shinji do the ceremony. Shunsui will not wait a second.
Last edited by LucyBenard; April 07, 2011 at 03:06 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Both sealed and with no mask, I would however say that Shunsui has the edge. Both sealed and with mask, they are about equal with Shinji being slightly ahead, and when it comes to Sakanade vs Shunsui's Shikai, Shinji takes it with ease - Shunsui doesn't have what it takes to counter it, and unless it can be proved otherwise, I believe that this should be regarded as fact.
About Yama's comments, just because one was true, doesn't mean the other is.
The same implies to you. If you believe that I'm wrong and you are right I won't be able to convince you. I don't believe that sealed Shinji is even compared to Shunsui. He might be at Byakuya's level while sealed, but not better until it would be prooven by manga.
Also comparing Chad to Grimjow... it's a strong offense to Grimjow. In healed state with his full Reiatsu he is a considerable opponent for a Captain.
I'm just trying to show that he is quit intellectual person. Intelligent enough to counter everything Shinji can throw at him.Quote:
I was trying to make an argument a bit easy. To make it less hot-tempered. Still I do believe that Shinji's ability is a bit bigger version of my comic example.Quote:
Shinji can go only in one direction, so if you see him before you - slice behind you, if he is on the left - slice to the right.Quote:
I believe that it wasn't Shikai that had mood problems, but Shunsui himself who had mood problems.Quote:
Shinji knew that Tousen was coming, cause every Captain can feel other's reiatsu.Quote:
Also Tousen cut Grim's arm, bewcause Aizen was the one who let him do it.
Exuse me, but it's the same opinion as you see my interpretation of this situation. And I see it completely on reverse.Quote:
Yama is right until he is proven wrong.Quote:
Last edited by Jorge D. Dragon; April 07, 2011 at 03:20 AM.
If you think I was comparing Chad with Grimmjow, you weren't paying attention to my post - I was just showing an example of a stronger character (Shunsui) dodging the blows of a weaker character (Chad), as a comparison to the Shinji / Grimmjow fight.
I made an example above how Shunsui can counter Shinji's attack. Also I do believe that Shinji isn't strong enough to take Shunsui down with one strike even if he lands a first strike.
Also I can't see Shinji's speed being better than Love's or Rose's. I'd even dare to say that Shinji was weaker as a Captain than Kensei and Love and he is obviously weaker as a Vaizard.
I can agree with the example of Chad and Shunsui, but I can't agree on Grim bein weaker than Shinji. Or at least that weaker than Chad to Shunsui.Quote: