How can he quickly get out of the swamp with the chakra arm or clones if they're not up in the air? They'd be stuck too, no? Plus, Jiraiya can sink Naruto if need be. He failed against Orochimaru because he was drugged. I don't see Naruto being able to escape being sunk or even avoid the jutsu when he wouldn't know it. Apparently it's pretty fast, so Naruto wouldn't have the time to react to something he wouldn't know is coming or know what it is.
He can do six rasengan in Rikudou Mode (though the time is debatable, methinks), but he can't be that quick in base mode or in Sage Mode. Jiraiya can also defend with his hair jutsu, the same jutsu that can apparently block Amaterasu. If it can block Amaterasu, it can block rasengan as well.
SM Naruto can throw summons, but those were the summons that ran to him without using their brains. The toad/s can actually move and use jutsu, making it harder for Naruto to touch them.
SM Jiraiya has shown to be pretty good at taijutsu and have more and better ninjutsu though.
And before anyone calls me a fanboy, Naruto's among my favorite as well and the main reason I read and stuck with this manga, even after Jiraiya was introduced. Can't really accuse me of bias here.
---------- Post added at 11:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:34 PM ----------
Also, know that we know Naruto can summon the toad he wants, if he summons Ma & Pa, which he can likely do faster than Jiraiya, Jiraiya's sage mode is sealed.
Why would he summon Ma and Pa though when he wouldn't need them? Wouldn't he counter Jiraiya's big toad with his own, if Naruto even bothers to?
How would they seem more useful against a large toad? Naruto most likely won't summon anyway as Sage Mode would be enough to deal with the toads (it really depends on who since Bunta can use jutsu, but I don't recall other toads being able to use jutsu). He hasn't shown the ability to summon more than one toad at a time, so he and Jiraiya can actually summon one toad each so not all toad will be on Naruto's side.
http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v47/c442/10.html. J-Man will use a Swamp of the Underworld big enough to cover less than half Naruto's body and a bit wider like he did to one of Nagato's Paths, I can't see him putting in hundreds of Naruto's clones. Yes, some clones will fall in the swamp, but those same clones would grab Naruto and the clones on the ground surrounding the swamp would pull those clones...or maybe Naruto can just start climbing on top of his own clones to get out.
I never bought that hair argument to begin with, BUT what they used to say is that J-Man would protect himself from Amaterasu with his hair AND THEN cut his hair...I doubt J-Man can just cut his hair to escape from a jutsu that the incomplete version managed to kill 2 hearts of Kakuzu in FRS.
Naruto enters Rikudo Mode, get's alongside the Frogs without being even noticed, changes to SM (since he's shown he can change between modes in a second) and grabs the frogs and throws it. With his RM speed, he won't be noticed until after he's already grabbed the summoning and then it would be too late.
Meh, I don't really care a lot about those sort of excuses, cause at least you bring up believable arguments (until you brought up the hair jutsu).
Isn't it lame to let one opponent summon their opponent's creatures, causing them to not be able to use them? I feel like that takes away from both combatants fighting at full power (not that it really matters, since in a matter of...less than a day? Naruto became wtfhax)
That argument made no sense whatsoever though. However, people said Jiraiya can turn his hair to steel, and we dunno if FRS can break through steel like it can to human flesh and trees, so Jiraiya may have protection there.Quote:
Though between you and me, I do not buy this argument at all either. Jiraiya's hair jutsu would not block FRS or Amaterasu, both jutsu are too powerful for that.
Honestly, he wouldn't need Rikudou Mode. If he ran from top of Kichi's head to rasengan Asura, then he's plenty fast in Sage Mode. The frog/s would notice Naruto running though and jump up in time, but that depends on how close Naruto is. If he's close enough, they won't be able to see him until it's too late. I can also see Naruto jumpkicking the toad in either mode, which would be enough to push back the toad and possibly disturb Jiraiya.Quote:
The hair jutsu was basically the prevalent argument I saw against Sasuke and even against Kakashi. I just find it annoying that no one is bringing it up here though or making it look better than it really is. It's mostly because of Jiraiya's jutsu that I give this to Jiraiya, otherwise I think Naruto would win.Quote:
Naruto. I thought he was stronger than Jiraiya when he beat Pain <and mastered Sage Mode better than Ji-man> Now he has RM, so.. I don't see Jiraiya in any way to beat Naruto.. the new Naruto <3
Theres a difference between between what Amaterasu can do and what FRS can, both do damage on a totally different level, one being much much superior to the other. Ofcourse the power of the jutsu doesnt matter here, but the way they work and cause damage is extremely different. FRS is like a Jinton, while Amaterasu is like an Extremely overheated Katon, so it wouldnt be farfetched to think that FRS would actually destroy Jiraiyas hair rather than gradually burning it dont you think?
Jiraiya and Naruto are plenty strong in Sage Mode and they can summon any toad at will, IMO if both are in Sage mode, summons are a non factor (aside from Ma and Pa)
And the Sasuke thing, Sasuke should have won that fight as much as Madara should have won against Itachi or Orochimaru over Hashirama, Fanbase spoke and the results came, but about the Amaterasu thing, those are different situations, we cant really compare how Amaterasu works to how FRS works, i mean i can cut my hair if it started burning (if i had crazy long hair) but i cant do anything against something that can vaporize me and my hair..
If Naruto goes into Rikudou Mode and tries a speedblitz Jiraiya will just cover himself in hair and Naruto will shred his whole arms and upper body. The hair is fast enough to guard against Amaterasu, which means its also fast enough to guard against any incomming body or projectile, no matter how fast it is.