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I go by what is given to us, as there's no sense in speculating about the unknown. If it's an unknown, it's irrelevant.
While ZP's logic is certainly correct, as how does Clare know that she is the ~"first and only Claymore to ever come a'knockin on the Org's door"?, it is what we've got. So, for me, this is a fact, as what's unknown (is there another orphaned human who CHOSE/SOUGHT OUT the Org or not?) isn't relevant, until Yagi decides to inform us otherwise.
So I personally side with Vengeance on this, just-merely because of my own personal and unique way of analyzing something: disregarding the unknown as irrelevant, using only what is given to us, and everything that isn't given to us, doesn't exist. I'm not saying that there's not context, that can determine unknowns, but I just don't personally use logic to determine unknowns, like ZP is using, I need context, something more than just logic to substantiate a concrete speculation and/or theory.
However, there is a point that favors ZP, which he didn't make:
We have to remember, Claymores who disobey, get "cleansed". The Claymores are NOT soulLESS weapons, they are "real" women, but they're not stupid either, so they follow orders and obey, as they have no choice but to do so.
Only a very few have dared to risk defiance, and most of these only dared to do so in secrecy, as even these Claymores feared the Organization.
The Org has been controlling their Claymores for 100+ years, it's only recently, that we've finally seen the first substantial rebellion by more than just a single lone-wolf defiant Claymore.
Clare is truly one of the very very few who has openly defied the Organization with total disregard, (and she's lucky thank Rubel has interest in her, because if he didn't, she'd be "cleansed" for her brazen defiance), the only other Claymore that we know of to do this, is Trainee Teresa. Yes, Ophelia acted up but she was doing what the Org wanted her to do, and Miata - the BCs have given her the "benefit of doubt" of being a feral child, but an usefully powerful "feral child", and thus she hasn't been "cleansed". Miria and Galatea have been cowards, secretly defying the Org, due to their fear of the Org, until recently.
So, Clare's got some serious testorone/bravery/stupidity/attitude, that does make her quite BAD-ASS, compared to all the other Claymores, except for Trainee Teresa. I mean seriously, we haven't even seen Trainee Teresa herself, going up to Rubel, demanding him to make her into a Claymore, that takes some serious... guts... by our Little Human Child Clare !!!!! And that's not even without getting into how BAD-ASS Trainee Clare was... she was SCARY!!!! And then we've got Claymore Clare obviously too... having the guts to fight against Priscilla whereas Irene was scared ******** !!!!! Clare's a serious BAD-ASS, and a serious contender for being a "Bad Girl", I'm quite surprised she hasn't been getting more votes...
---------- Post added at 11:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:16 AM ----------
the same that I said about Clare, can be applied to Priscilla as well... Human Child Priscilla had some serious guts... talk about a BAD GIRL, axe-decapitating a NY !!! And then how about the guts to take on Teresa of the Faint Smile, herself !!! Riful+Dauf, Isley+Rigardo, Alicia+Beth, and etc !!!
Last edited by HegemonKhan; October 27, 2011 at 01:20 PM.
Teresa is just awesome, she's Nietzsche's overman. But depending on you're definition of the word 'badass' she does have lots of close contenders. Clare and Priscilla might be awesome but the series dwells on their (especially Clare's) inability to live as Teresa because they fight monsters that they have within themselves (the yoma) and risk becoming monsters because of it, rather than embracing their yoki.
Riful comes pretty close to Teresa and she dies nobly in the same way. Some people wish she was still alive but if she was it would be a disservice to her, the same as with Teresa.
It was written that way because Norihiro Yagi wanted to explain/point out to the reader that up until that point in the manga no other Claymore actually did something like that. It was mentioned in the perspective of Clare because it's her story that's being tolled. Basically she was narrating that particular point within the story. Based on the information we were given within the manga it is simply a fact that no other Claymore before Clare has simply walked up to the Organization & request to become a Claymore.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; October 31, 2011 at 03:55 PM. Reason: removed 1-2 possible confrontational lines
Roxane... I have never seeen such a witch......... Lol nice Clair argument however she did it for the revenge sake, and didnt become claymore just for the fun of it.
I'm going with these three: Ophelia, Roxanne, and Priscilla.
Honestly, they're all bad at their own ways, but I think Ophelia takes the crown. She's just plain evil. In comparison with Roxanne, who comes 2nd for me, she's not just some damn bastard but a narcissistic fool that likes to mock people that she believes is not within their reach. Just plain insane, I guess.
As for Priscilla, she seems almost... pure? I can't really say that much, almost like a kid that doesn't know what she's doing. It's most likely because I haven't seen her for a while now that I have seem to lose some "feelings" for her, but still, I think Priscilla's actions aren't entirely to blamed when her personality is already disfigured at such a young age.
Well, that's about that, and I could only think of the 3 of them.
Priscilla is very similar to Clare, its just that one of them is the protagonist and the other is her enemy, the antagonist. So yep, she's pure if Clare's pure.
When Roxanne came into the picture she redefined what evil, twisted & powerful really is.. plus she looks deceptively cute at first glance it's creepy.. I simply cannot wait for her to get serious in the on going battle so we can find out who will prevail..
Roxanne of love and hate = borderline personality disorder lol
By the way Priscilla is antisocial but she also has a combination of melancholic and avoidant personality traits making her the self-deserting subtype of avoidant.
Actually, Clare is diagnosable as antisocial herself and she's essentially the character of Ikuno Shirataki from Angel Densetsu in Claymore - who any psychologist should recognise as antisocial. Clare has avoidant and schizoid traits, just as Priscilla is avoidant. The whole point of the relationship between Clare and Priscilla, is that they are nearly mirror images with a similar personality and background.
Last edited by faintsmile1992; November 15, 2011 at 05:20 PM.
I pick Ophelia, since imo she's the most naughtiest and dirtiest claymore, ever. do you guys remembered any other claymore tried to grope Clare's boobs?
Bleh, those people this days never add Rakia to the lists
Roxanne - never. There's a difference beetween having no functioning brain and being bad. That's why I chose Ophelia (even though I am pretty sure that she lacked at least a part of a healthy mind) since she was a warrior who lived to fight and didn't care about rules and stuff as long as there was no one to report what she had done.
Riful is kinda bad, too, torturing warriors to make them awaken and all. But at most she's a little girl that wants to play. In germany there is a saying "Kinder sind grausam", in english it would be about "children are cruel". After we've seen Riful that's really true.
As for Priscilla, from what I consider a girl, she is no girl. Everything bad she has done she did after passing her limit. Up until then she just did what she was told is right. Nothing bad about her.