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@Drylick: I'm pretty sure that all of the "King" level Riders should be able to do the Tricks any of the Eight Kings have, they just need to know enough about the Road. Otherwise, Nike wouldn't have been able to use Gaia Road Tricks even though he'd managed to steal the Gem Regalia from Kilik. But he knew enough about the Gaia Road to fuse it into the Wing Road to get the Jade Road. To me, that means that if Ringo knows enough about the Wing Road, she'd also be able to use its Tricks, same for the Hurricane Road if Ikki has bothered telling her enough about it (but at its core, it, too, is still the Wing Road, really, it's just combined with the Over Road--all of Ikki's Tricks, including his wind barriers, belong to the Wing Road, though, except for his "Astral Magus" Trick which as a bit of the Over Road in it). She just hasn't had training in catching the wind like Ikki and Takeuchi Brothers.
[The following is only directed at the people who still may not get this--those of you who do, please don't mind me.] Keep in mind that, like I keep saying, the Ring, Rising, and Over Roads require their respective Regalia for all of their Infinity Atmosphere Tricks, while the other Roads only require their respective Regalia for the signature Tricks of their respective Infinity Atmosphere, meaning that Ikki, Nike, and Sora being shown to be able to use just their hands to make wind shields or barriers means that it's a Wing Road Trick; the Over Road's wind barriers are different from those of the Wing Road, and all of the Over Road's Tricks require the Rumble Regalia. Ikki, for the Astral Magus, has so far used the power of the people near him in place of his Regalia, like Buccha's, Agito's, and Kazu's "winds" powering up his own wind in the Sleipnir battle and using Sora's "wind" in this current battle, but with the Storm Regalia, he wouldn't need to do that. The interesting fact here, though, is that "Astral Magus" is the signature Trick of the Hurricane Road's Infinity Atmosphere, which means that even if the Over Road's Infinity Atmosphere Tricks didn't all require the Rumble Regalia, the Astral Magus Trick still would.
The term "Infinity Atmosphere," as you should be able to tell from the explanation Yoshitsune and Agito give to Aeon during the time Ikki was attempting his jump for the Devil's 30-30 (or "33," whichever is the correct term), is used by the "Kings" to refer to how their respective Roads use the wind/air for their Tricks. The Flame Road uses it by heating it up to produce "flames," for instance. All Fire-elemental and/or "Time" Tricks are part of the Flame Road's Infinity Atmosphere. Notice how Rika was able to produce "Thorns" without having to use ATs, let alone the Thorn Regalia, against Ikki and Sora. She wouldn't have been able to do that if what I'm saying was wrong, since "Thorns" are part of the Infinity Atmosphere of the Sonia Road. They just need the Thorn Regalia to be able to perform the Trick "Infinite Chain - Turquoise Sonia" because that's the signature Trick of the Sonia Road's Infinity Atmosphere. All that the Regalia do for the other Infinity Atmosphere Tricks besides the "signature" ones is power them up and make them more effective. [Ringo apparently pulled the Turquoise Sonia Trick off with Ikki's Storm Regalia being disguised as her Thorn Regalia, lol.]
@Suarhnir: Yeah, I agree with you.
Last edited by DragonOsman2; April 15, 2012 at 11:18 AM.
Last edited by Brandnewkid; April 15, 2012 at 02:20 PM.
. . . Yeah, they really are strange. [Can't Raijin also be used to mean "Thunder God," by the way? He's the Japanese Shinto god of storms, thunder, and lightning, no?]
Sorry if this is too much trouble, but could either of you two look at the Japanese raws and tell me if Wikipedia's right in saying that the name of the Infinity Atmosphere of the Wing Road is "Infinity Airdoor"? Because on their site, that's what they have. Which would make the signature Trick be "Infinity Airdoor - Moonstruck Numberless Grappler". And I think that makes a lot of sense in Air Gear terms, since the Infinity Atmosphere names and Tricks all seem to have "Infinity" or "Infinite" in them. Like "Infinite Chain - Turquoise Sonia," "Infinity Cage" (Bloody Road), "Infinite Scale, the 'World of Sound'" (Ring Road), etc.
And how can they translate sora as "wind," when it actually means "sky," with "wind" actually being kaze? I don't get this. Could it be that the characters they use for those (whether it's kanji, hiragana, or katakana) are similar? I think I remember someone on another forum saying that if the characters for any two words are similar, the translation could come out as different/funny (or it would just make it confusing). [I'm referring to how, whenever they said "wind" when explaining to Aeon about the Infinity Atmosphere and why the Wing Road is so important; Suarhnir said that the raws have it as "sky" instead of "wind". Someone else also told me before that that it's "air," so I'm kinda confused. Maybe the kanji for "air" is also similar to that of "wind".] I do know that, in Urdu (my native tongue), the words for "air" and "wind" are actually the same, so that we actually end up using them interchangeably. So I'm wondering if Japanese has it the same way.
First off, let me talk about the Infinite Atmosphere, as taken fromt he Japanese wiki:Quote:
The Infinity Atmosphere (Endless Sky), is simply put, the proof of a King's power. The Regalia of AT's rely on the sky, namely the atmosphere for usage. "Wind," "Fang," "Rumble," and "Windmill" (???*) use the air for operation, "Flame" uses heat, "Rising" uses the air for conduction, and "Pledge" uses the oscallations in the atmosphere. Because of their reliances on the atmosphere, the name "Infinity Atmosphere" was given. It's a King's greatest and most final secret weapon.
That said, here are all the Infinity Atmospheres as listed on the Japanese wiki and translated by me:
無限の風（インフィニティ・エアード）- Infinity Airdoor, the Endless Wind
無限の牢獄（インフィニティジェイル）- Infinity Jail, the Endless Prison
無限の煉獄（インフィニティインフェルノ）- Infinity Inferno, the Endless Purgatory
無限の轍（インフィニティフェイラー）- Infinity Feiler (???), the Endless Rut (?)
無限の荊鎖（インフィニティ・チェーン） ターコイズ・ソニア - Infinity Chain: Turquoise Thornia, the Endless Thorn
無限の音階（インフィニティスカーレ）- Infinity Scale, the Endless Musical Scale
無限の地層 グラビトサフォカーテ - Gravito Suffocate, the Endless Stratum
泡爆滅殺（バブルガムクライシス）- Bubblegum Crisis, the Destructive Bubble
They (as in, Yoshitsune and Agito when they were speaking to Aeon during that scene) use the kanji for "Sky," but they mean "sky" in the atmospheric sense, so it's read as "Air" or "[Upper] Atmosphere."Quote:
Last edited by Brandnewkid; April 15, 2012 at 06:48 PM.
i think OG nailed this one, i really did not expect that which is a good thing btw arent those kazu's ATs ikki is wearing?
What's the "Feiler" one, the Over Road? And The Water Regalia wasn't one of the eight, it was one of the other 20 Regalia, right? Do they not give the kanji readings for all of the eight original Roads' Infinity Atmospheres? [Okay, let me clarify something: I'm aware that Sora and Nike made up the whole stuff about the Kings and Regalia after taking the other 20 Regalia for the sake of the codes, and for wanting to get their hands on the Sky Regalia, but the 28 rune codes that make up the bars of the "fence" in Norse Mythology that it's said was used to hold Odin on the World Tree Yggdrasil come from the rune codes of the "original eight Regalia," Wind, Thunder, Thorn, Fang, Rumble, Pledge, Gem, and Flame. So that's why I ask this. Sora is after Ikki's ninth line because the "fence" they talk about in Norse Mythology had nine bars in it, meaning that without all of the nine lines in the code, the "Sky Regalia" is incomplete, as Sora has so far only been able to input those other eight lines into it. Ikki has all of those eight lines plus the ninth one, the one from his Storm Regalia, and that's what Sora is after.] And do they have the official kanji reading for the Hurricane Road's Infinity Atmosphere? The Signature Trick is "Astral Magus," but what's the name of the Infinity Atmosphere itself? But yeah, anyway, thanks anyway for the info.
Last edited by DragonOsman2; April 16, 2012 at 07:22 AM.
Kazu gave him the Flame Regalia core, so that that Ikki would be using Kazu's ATs wouldn't really surprise me at this point. Though, is it really Kazu's pair of ATs? [Technically, it's Sptifire's pair of ATs, since Kazu's got burned off before he put on Spitfire's ones with the Flame Regalia equipped.]
Looks like he'd have stomped Nike out without even trying, to think that there was a point where we thought that 300 was strong.
I thought those looked like ikki's old pair of a-ts... Before he broke the fake bagram cores of hako's. He then switched to the white with black stripes. Though I should have seen this coming of ikki not even wearing the regalia when facing sora, even moreso when sora showed that he wasn't wearing the sky regalia either. Ikki has seemed the type to prove himself from his own efforts and skill vs using regalia, the only exception was against ringo but only because his normal a-ts broke and wanted to try out bagram since kururu installed it. However, after experiencing the regalia firsthand like that, he reverted back to being fine with regular a-ts.
Those appear to be the very first pair of AT's Ikki had.
I think they are, yes. And Suarhnir, you're right, but I still hope Ikki does use the Storm Regalia after this battle. He's the Storm King, so he should wear the Storm Regalia. Last time, the Infinity Atmosphere went out of control because he wasn't fully ready to use it yet. Now, though, it should be different, so he has no reason to be afraid.
There is a theory Suarhnir and I share (though we disagree on some points), but anyway, I'll explain it after I say something else first: You know there were 28 First Generation Gravity Children, right? We talked about in that thread where we talking about the Regalia, Roads, and the Gravity Children. Anyway, aside from the "main eight," there were 20 "sub" Regalia, whose Roads branch off from those main eight. The Lather Road seems to be one of those. Then there were another 4 Regalia, part of the "main eight," that were copies of existing ones. If you notice, both Sora and Nike, being Wing Road Riders, had a Wind Regalia each. Nike must have given his own to Sora. When they fought Gazelle, they were both wearing a Wind Regalia each. Either they had one part of the core each (Sora had one wheel and Nike the other) or they both had the whole one, but they'd only activated one wheel each. O!G drew it in a confusing way. But still, there were two of the Wind Regalia. And the Pledge Regalia were also either three different ones, one actual Regalia and two copies, or there were pieces of the whole Regalia, given to three separate Ring Road Riders. Sora and Nike killed one, and Rune and Simca were left alive. If you look at the diagram of all of the different Regalia branching off from the Sky Regalia being in the middle, you'd see 24 Regalia in total branching of from the Sky Regalia. The main eight Regalia, and then from those 2 more branching off from each of the eight, with the Ring and Wing Roads being exceptions apparently since their Regalia seem to have copies. So there were 24 different Regalia, 4 being copies, to total 28 Regalia for the 28 Gravity Children, and 28 rune codes. [Suarhnir and I disagree on some of this, but on the most of it, generally, we do seem to agree.]
Dr. Minami combined the 20 cores of the "sub" Regalia into the new Bagram he gave to him with the words "Welcome to Nightmare" written on them; those Bagram have those 20 cores combined into them, so it's a Wind Regalia with a total of 21 cores, including that of the Wind Regalia itself. Sora already had all of the codes for those and needed the six others (I'd bet Nike had already given him his own code), which was why he created Sleeping Forest. He got the codes and entered them to awaken the Sky Regalia, but like I said, it's currently incomplete, since those 28 rune codes only make up eight of the lines from that "fence" that hold Odin onto the World Tree Yggdrasil in Norse Mythology, the eight lines that come from the codes of the "main eight" Regalia. He needs the ninth line, which Ikki has, along with all of the other eight. [Ikki and Sora both have all of the eight lines, but Ikki has the extra ninth line, which Sora needs, so they're fighting for it.]
Yeah, they could have interchanged the cores on chapter 340 (that's what I really mean, not AT but core). I think Ikki just gave the core to Ringo to use and activate the regalia in dire need because of Ikki's condition in the fight.
@Dopeycheese: I think there is no way for Ikki to be wearing the Flame Regalia core since Kururu has already broke it down to assimilate the regalia's core into the Storm Regalia.
@DragonOsman2: Nike was able to use the Gem optimally because he stole it from Kilik 6 years before the manga began. That means, he has more than ample amount of time to study the principle of the Gem Regalia. Ringo on the other hand, only got the Storm Regalia during the fight. It would be in utmost difficulty for her to control the Wind. Plus, Ringo really never had training in catching the wind. I think Ringo would still be able to use the destructive power of the Storm. But, for the pure wind tricks, I think not. I still wanna see Ikki controlling the Wind produced by the Storm Regalia remotely. It will really make Ikki pure bad-ass.