Interesting. I don't like rankings in OP because they seem pointless in a system where you reach certain scale power and then the matches are decides by circumstances, but still I want to read your point on it. I'll wait for you to finish to make any judgement :P
let me tell u with easiest way i can say why it will never be enel 9 and luffy 0 win
one piece is manga
luffy is hero/main character of one piece manga
enel 1 time bad character (we may never see him again)
luffy have beat enel
can u tell me any manga where when hero/main character have beat his opponent and that same opponent come to fight hero again and hero always loss
u join mangahelpers jul 2006 that means u have atlest 6 years of experience of redding manga even then u say main character will never defeat his opponent didnt that make u as dense as lead or/and arrogant. its logic for hero to defeat his opponent whom he already defeat before
and please stop taking about 100 mil , 300 mil because if even luffy fight against enel it will be 400 mil or 400+ mil and not in past
u say English is not my language u r right then u say English is not ur language but didnt united state is ur country and as far i know in US every one know English or u r from another planet where in US they dont use English
why dont u add poll to this thread and ask others about luffy 0 and enel 9 win lets see how many others support u
Last edited by suraj5898; September 18, 2012 at 11:07 PM.
suraj5898- we are getting way way way off topic, so i will addressed you one last time. And learn how to use the forum, you can create a thread on one subsection of the One Piece forum if you want to do a Davy back fight between Enel and Luffy. And you can create a poll too.
I lived in the USA but I from Vietnam. Don't assume stuff. Coming from Asia, this meant I grew up with manga, I taught myself how to read by reading the likes of Doreamon, Detective Conan, Dragon Ball, etc. So 6 years is way off. Probably reading since before 1st grade with is like 1995 or 1996.
Lastly, "and please stop taking about 100 mil , 300 mil because if even luffy fight against enel it will be 400 mil or 400+ mil and not in past"
That is the f*cking point of my ranking, if you don't like it go somewhere else and make a new one. The sort of ranking that you talking about. You can just google it and a zillions come up. I don't do that here. I want to put everything into perspective. Zoro from East Blue is differ from Zoro that learn 36/108 pound canon. Nami with clima tact is differ from Nami with perfect clima tact. That is why the ranking is incomplete because I am going through the series. I have read one piece probably 10-20 times over and over already. Urghh, trying really hard not to make this into a flame war or offending you. Considering how ignorant you are about the way I did this thread. You make assumptions, and then you argue the stances in which I did not take. Please don't post in this thread anymore. Go make your Enel vs Luffy thread to your heart content.
Enel then was already substantially crippled from the 1st half (where luffy's rubber caught him by surprise), and he was too distracted with his plan to fight luffy full on
i believe if luffy and enel fought then, in a setting where their main focus was to kill each other, enel would probably have won
it's about the same as crocodile then. crocodile just threw luffy away time and aga in and never dealt the killing blow, if he had been lethal from the outset he would have won
that's about how the story goes as well. the storyline is about a guy called luffy who has strong willpower in carrying out whatever's in front of him, never thinking or hesitating, never distracted by anything else material or immaterial. he who hesitates loses, and that's how luffy won most of his matches, if not all
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he adapted and used tonnes of other methods after he realised luffy was immune to it
all u need is a gold ball, then just couple it with god's wrath (blast a hole under luffy, and watch him fall to his doom out of skypiea into the sea below)
this wouldn't work on the luffy now, hwo has soru and COO haki, but it would have been enel's win back then. much like crocodile, twice he had luffy at his mercy and all he had to do was just unsheath his poison hook and poke him slightly, but he never did
On the Enel thing...
Enel is one of the strongest characters in the series so far, it's just that Luffy is made out of rubber, so he can't hurt him with lightning.
He's so strong because not only does he have one of the top Logia powers, he also has totally unrivaled CoO haki (mantra) which is supercharged by his devil fruit power. He's also physically resilient enough to restart his own heart after taking huge amounts of damage.
Luffy wins against him, but I don't see many others winning. He seems like more or less around the level of Admirals, though probably a bit lower since they are masters of CoA haki. Enel's supercharged CoO isn't a substitute for CoA.
But there are a few who in theory can win.
I forget how Lightning clouds work, but do they come from Steam or Smoke?
I always saw Enel as somebody at Vice-Admiral level at the very minimum, he could still pull of a win against Zoro or Sanji at this stage in the story.
Update: Mihawk, Vice Admiral Onigumo, Shanks, Fisher Tiger is now move to speculation. Oars Jr and Wiper are now under discussion.
Ask about 2-3 characters at a time per post, it take freaking forever to reply to ya. Beside I am writing why they are at where they are anyhow. And please try not to ask the same questions again. Lastly, THINGS ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE WITH MORE EVIDENCES. This isn't the bible (oh wait they revise that shit too).
Characters from this arc and main characters are subject to change. I put them in the ranking but their position should be revise afterward. We can talk about those characters after they had a big fight. As for DD, we will wait until DD vs Luffy match.
OMG, speculation meant subject to change. It is just place there out of pure speculation. Hence there is little evidences for them. I usually do that so I know these guys exist. I WILL NOT CHANGE THESE GUYS UNTIL THERE IS A PROPER BATTLE FOR THEM.
For example Mihawk: one could argue well he fought Shanks in equal term, another would say well he fought Vista pretty shortly and pretty equally. Both can be use as evidences but very little evidence. I leave them in speculation because someone will come along and ask where is Mihawk???
Pre meant pre timeskipped. Gura Blackbeard meant Gura Blackbeard pretimeskipped before he is a Yonkou.
The gap between C+ and C is very small. But I had to split them up because it was so big and won't fit the screen for screen capture.
By all meant, this isn't perfect but yeah. If anybody has a question, feel free to ask. As discussion starts and as the story progress, there will be change to the ranking. Though for now, just to heard you guys opinion. Is anything felt out of place?
Since people ask, there it is:
S: Gold Roger, Prime Whitebeard, and maybe Prime Garp
Only a few guys hence I didn't want to cut and paste. If Prime White Beard is here so no Old White Beard can't be here
To generate discussion, I supposed I will attempt to explain my system. But that will take a lot of time. So I will begin with 1 tier at a time.
B- : Surpassing the Supernovas Tier
C+ : Supernovas tier part 1
Last edited by weixiaobao; November 29, 2013 at 08:58 PM.
Personally, I'd put Old WB one league (A++?) above Akainu and the other admirals. He was stabbed through the stomach and fought thousands of marines including vice-admirals before beginning his fight with Akainu. His health + the stab got to him and Akainu took the chance and wounded him badly. EVEN AFTER THAT he gave Akainu a serious beating. Old WB is A++ is what I'd say. I'm not making a case for the others, but I do think he was above Akainu and Aokiji (who may or may not be the same as Rayleigh, Shanks, etc).
Or wait, are you also making little sub-rankings by whose names you write on the top? cuz maybe then that makes more sense to me..
EDIT: Ok, I see that you are even putting smoker and vergo in the same league. I guess it makes sense then. I just didn't know how broad the range of power levels were included in each letter grade or w/e
Last edited by Roarchu; November 29, 2013 at 12:51 AM.
I'd put doflamingo in the A+ group.
Last edited by weixiaobao; November 29, 2013 at 08:42 AM.
What I don't get is how Mihawk is firmly placed in the A+ while three of the Yonkou and Dragon himself are only speculative? How is he ranked above Marco, and how is Marco ranked on the same level as a pre-Gura BB? Why is Prime Chinjao ranked alongside Vista and Jozu, and above DD? And how is Vista two ranks below Mihawk when a battle between the two at the War at Marineford was at a draw before it was interrupted? What possessed you to place Squardo on a list with DD? The B rank seems to be a hodgepodge of individuals who really don't seem to belong on the same list, and B- seems even more random. After that it seems mostly good with some glaring oddities like Tashigi's placement, or the Pacifistas', or Wiper's, and a few others. Some levels are broad, others very limited, and some seem somewhat random and purely based on popularity sprinkled with lots of speculation, although a lot of those names are individuals we have very limited knowledge about and it becomes somewhat difficult to place them.
I'd put WB on a league of his own. An S group for him. I'd take Mihawk and Prime Shiki out of the A+ group. Pre-Gura BB should be below Marco, and Zephyr as an old man is relatively weak. I wouldn't put Chinjao with Jozu. The B+ group is a chaos. How come DD and Oars. Jr are in the same league? And John Giant and other VAs on the same league as Ace and BB? And especially Squardo, he's completely out of place.
But that's my take on the list.
Sorry if I sound annoy, I just woke up. If I had write this later on the day, I wouldn't be this annoy >__<. I am grateful for the questions.
Pre stand for preskip, not pre Gura. Certainly pre timeskipped BlackBeard is not the same as post time skipped Blackbeard.Quote:
Well Aojiki and Jozu was a draw, Crocodile and Jozu was a draw if they were like interrupt like 5 minutes into the fight. The chance of Mihawk being here is great. Until there is evidences otherwise, like he got his ass kick by DD. Where do you think Prime Chinjao is? And what do you think of his splitting continent feat? DD and Luffy are shady as bad. We have to wait until the end of this arc to decide where they are.Quote:
Hmm, he is in speculation. Because there is no feat from him, beside it seemed WB pick him in commanding position out of all of the allies. They are both in speculation. If they are not in speculation, and I permanently pace them somewhere like Prime Chinjao then we can talk. As you can see, we can't even talk about how Jozu and Chinjao relate to Doflamingo because I still have DD in speculation.Quote:
Wait until my explanation. Didn't you read my explaination for B-??Quote:
Tashigi had soru and haki and is the right hand of Smoker. If the Boa sisters shown post skip feats they may very well stronger than Tashigi. But right now, I placed her as stronger than Boa sisters pre skipped. One could said Tashigi did a poor job with Monet, or a decent job with Monet.
Wiper?? Wiper was shown to be equal in capacity with a near supernovas Luffy (100 million berries he need just 1 million berries). He has weapons that destroy DF users and mobility of a top notch fighter. Perhaps he can't take down the stronger supernovas. But he certainly can make the rest run for their money.
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If more people share the concern, I will move Mihawk to speculation until we see a proper match. That is pretimeskipped BB that just acquire gura fruit, there is a blackbeard with just his original fruit. And then there is yonkou Blackbeard which is place at speculation along with other Yonkou. There are two Chinjao. His continent splitting is as impressive as Jozu. Beside if I place Prime Garp as S, then this prime Chinjao is fine where he is.Quote:
I don't know if I should include semi canon people like Z. He is all over the place in term of feats (remember the ending of that movie taking all those people).
John Giant had shown to be in charge of the head quarter since like early One Piece (up course there higher up than him but it seems he is de facto vice admiral). Giant + haki. hmmm... He is just unfortunate to go up against White Beard and be such a huge target. Read my reply on Squardo (but he is in speculation people heck even John Giant). Speculation meant there is no evidences for him anywhere. I will just speculate and put them there for now.
Unlike those 2, Oars Jr. is not speculation. So what is your problem with him among the non speculations?
Okey-dokey. Although, even wielding Whitebeard's fruit, I question his standing alongside Marco. I guess in general I just think Marco should be on the level above.Quote:
So why is Mihawk ranked two levels higher? Chinjao should be, in my mind, a level lower. His bounty at his peak was comparable to some of the original supernovas, and Garp's quick handling of him was pretty embarrassing. I can't imagine Jozu or Vista getting man-handled by anyone like that.Quote:
I don't even know why you'd speculate about him. He isn't worth much of a mention. Even with some speculation, there is some basis for everyone's placement, be it reputation, standing, or rank. And it just seems illogical to have his name next to DD's.Quote:
I read your explanation, but I just don't get how Enel, Moriah, Monet, and pre-skip Smoker end up on the same level. That just doesn't make much sense to me. And the rank above (B) is just an exhaustive list that seemingly covers such a broad range of abilities, and some individuals stand out, like Bartolomeo. The issue with Tashigi is that she's on a list with current SHs and some of the pre-skip Supernovas, and Fisher Tiger amongst others; that entire rank just seems mixed up. It seems to be even more the case when you notice the Pacifista on the list. How is that the Pacifista is ranked the same as pre-skip Luffy, when it took the entire SH crew to bring one down.Quote:
Really? Wiper was as good as pre-skip Zoro and Sanji, or any of the other Supernovae. You even have CP9, Coribou, and current Nami. I know Wiper was popular, but what did he show to suggest that he could take on these individuals. Wiper showed up long before the end of Paradise, and some of the SHs were already superior to him.Quote: