It's really clear that you're somewhat biased towards Yama. Oh well, I seriously doubt he's going to kill Aizen if he spreads out his power that much. And remember EJ took the amount of time many Captains and Vizards could buy to prep.Quote:
And Yama used his Captains and Vizards to buy time for him to prep Ennetsu Jigoku (which he couldn't have prepped if they didn't stall Aizen as cannon fodder). Hardly sounds like a fair 1 to 1 fight to me under either circmstance.Quote:
Oh yeah, this is base Aizen we're talking about, not before the Hog transformations kicked in. If you're going to talk about what Aizen predicted, well he DIDN'T predict 3rd form and above so using his words as some sort of proof that Yama > Hog Aizen isn't valid. It's really that simple.
Also, some food for thought: at the center of nuclear bombs, or actually any explosion with the power to take out a city, the temperature reaches up to ten million degrees at the core. Just sayin', certain Bleach characters have tanked attacks that can destroy a city. In fact Ichigo's wiped out a mountain with the Ken'atsu of his slash which y'know, is a nuke level feat (reducing that much rock to smoke takes around the amount of power you'd need to destroy a city). Yeah, his Ken'atsu was nuke-level. And then he tanked Aizen's fragor, which is also nuke level.
You know an extra 5 million degrees is a lot right....10 mil and 15 mil are like night and day. Without regeneration on Aizen, I see Yama with a fighting chance.
Most of the early transcendent crap came from a Aizen that was insane... well delusional is a better word. He was talking a lot of BS.
Ok explain this, why did Aizen destroy the Koutotsu (a being described by Gin & Isshin to be beyond shinigamis power) with reiatsu? http://www.mangapanda.com/94-53161-5...apter-407.html http://www.mangapanda.com/94-53161-6...apter-407.html http://www.mangapanda.com/94-53161-1...apter-407.html
Normally the response to this question for those you think it's BS is another question to deviate from the phenomenon that occurred such as, 'if Aizen is such a transcended & he wasn't making it up, how come he was hurt by Gin?'. By now this question should have gotten old. What part of, his reiatsu was purposely lowered to the point where Ichigo's friends & ordinary humans (who have reiatsu) can comprehend it do you not understand? http://www.mangapanda.com/94-56926-1...apter-417.html
What part of Ichigo's friends & Aizen (who is also is a transcendant) being unable to comprehend Ichigo's reiatsu (because he didn't lower it like Aizen did) do you not understand? http://www.mangapanda.com/94-56926-1...apter-417.html
What part of "when spiritual beings collide, the weaker side with weaker reiatsu will get hurt" do you not understand?
What part of you must subconsciously releash reiatsu to be able to withstand & pushback attacks (something Aizen did not do against Gin because he purposely lowered his guard by deactivating his transcendant reiatsu for mere humans to feel) do you not understand?
Kubo went through the troubles of introducing a new concept backed up with solid proof/facts/evidence & the fans called it BS? Pls Cracker, explain why you call it BS given all the things that was said above?
---------- Post added at 05:40 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:27 AM ----------
Actually did I say a new concept? Scatch that, it was introduced since the beginning of the manga. Remember how humans (with no reiatsu) are unable to comprehend a shinigami's power? Remember when Ichigo trained with Mr Hat & Clogs to achieve his zanpakuto but during that training it was explained to us that a normal weapon ain't hurting a shinigami? Remember how Mr Hot & Clog then explained that Ichigo is correct but his berihime is in fact not a normal weapon but Zanpakuto therefore capable of hurting Ichigo? It's not a new concept at all. It actually a very old one. Aizen & Ichigo just raised the level, It's that simple.
I have said this before in the "The Concept of "Transcendentality"" thread & I will say it again. "The context of the manga & how characters are portrayed is far more important than concentrating on petty quantities like how hot or how cold a character is."
Last edited by Kay3795; November 20, 2012 at 01:25 AM.
Hmmmm...the same Aizen also said this
and this (lol)...discarded
and this, where he argues impossibilities(lol)
It's interesting also how Ichigo questions his reasoning abilities....lol
I think I'm in the right when I question his reasoning or sanity lol
I guess though, that since Ginjo did mention the idea of becoming transcendent albeit somewhat different circumstances it's very likely a legit thing...
Bleach has stated more than once, that battles are essentially reiatsu vs reiatsu...yet other than the time when Ichigo attacked Kenpachi, Chad attacked Nnoitra and when Kenpachi initially started against Nnoitra there aren't any other instances where someone uses a higher reiatsu to effectively and completely cancel out an attack. And in those instances, there were special circumstances. Ichigo was weaker and untrained in effectively controlling spirit pressure output (plus Kenpachi emits alot of spirit pressure subconsciously), Chad was weaker and Nnoitra had the strongest steel skin out of all the Arrancar and Kenpachi had to adjust to Nnoitra's skin, which really meant he had to adjust his spirit pressure output in order to hurt him. Even when Soifon attacked Aizen that's debatable since it's generally accepted that he was using KS the whole time...it's likely she hit air or something.
Look at the battle with Ichigo vs Aizen...even though Ichigo was above Aizen he still took damage from himj when he attacked his arm...why is that...he was so much stronger.
Note what I said about Yamma vs Aizen...although it's likely that in the end Aizen was indeed stronger, it was not so that he could not be harmed by a "lower" being...giving the opinion I'm sure Yamma could hurt him but if he has regeneration Yamma couldn't kill him. Being strong or even stronger is good but sometimes what really matters the most in Bleach fights is finding an opening and exploiting it... Rukia vs A.A, Tousen vs his Lieutenant, Shunsui vs Stark etc.
About the train thing...your question shouldn't be why...but how right? I mean because we know the why....
About your last part...spirit beings hurt by other means as well...
I will try to quote Shinsui here, The guys who is saying in a logical way that Yama-jii will lose to Aizen, well, listen! With Yama-Jii, that Logic wont work!
look at this
Your post would have had so much more impact if he didn't actually die shortly afterwards lol
Yamamoto got tricked badly, and twice too
As for Yamamoto hurting him... Well nah, look at Ichigo who was above Aizen, he took an attack that made an insanely huge explosion and crater, which we've never seen before, and only his arm was a bit harmed, not even too much
Yamamoto just cannot win against Godizen, two different beings standing on two different places, that's all I have to say
Was such a thing really mentioned ? Makes me think that Ichigo using Mugetsu was even dumber than I what I originally thought... It wouldn't make sense that Cocoon Aizen was stronger than Butterfly Aizen tho, but mehQuote:
Last edited by Zehahaha; November 22, 2012 at 08:30 AM.
Apparently his arm was rendered useless at that point...
I was just quoting Aizen, paraphrasing but I guess he was wrong...again. He was wrong a lot in those days lol
Most likely to what he meant was that Ichigo couldn't effectively use the arm anymore... Meh I'm probably grasping lol
You should look at what FKT looked like after the battle. It looks like the top Espada fought there. It was in shambles.That wasn't an exaggeration, based on what Ulquiorra and Yammy showed they can do, and what happened to FKT, there's no questioning the logic behind them being forbidden to release under the dome. Also, the captains actually reacted to Yama's Bankai, Shunsui's lips got chapped, Hitsu's Bankai immediatley melted, and everything his sword touched disintegrated immediatley. Regeneration doesn't matter in a battle like that if Yama disintegrates the whole body. Yama doesn't BS, SS was definitely in danger. I still don't see how Aizen can even hurt Yama in Bankai. I don't give a crap, its 15 million degrees.
I remember Soi Fong saying that Homonka can only be cancelled is she wished to do it... Yet Aizen did it himself just by his reiatsu
15 Million degree or not, it means shit if there's a huge gap of reiatsu between two people
This is not base Aizen, this is Godizen we're talking about here, Godizen, a being far superior from any Shinigami, Hollow, Arrancar we've ever seen
Until just a couple chapters later, when we've seen a being even stronger appear. Aizen was more smart ass than smart later on, thus I can't take much of his words for certain. And now we've even seen the Royals Guards mocking the most senior captains, people Aizen didn't even knew, he wasn't able to judge.
Is this match und starting with Yama being under KS already? If yes, that would be highly unfair.
Judging how Bach was a puss... had stolen the Bankai for his own purposes, as well as his famous words 'nobody stronger than me was born in the last thousand years' hold some truth, I will keep siding with Genryuusei.
kkck: Early on you mention 'Aizen being able to destroy the. Dangai train, something Yamamoto was never capable to.' Where did you get the information with him every even trying?
Last edited by Schabrak; November 26, 2012 at 04:57 AM.
The ,manga has stated as fact that reiatsu could not destroy the train and the train basically transcended the world's ordinary physics. The manga pointed out shinigami, reiatsu, can't do a thing to it and yamamoto is a shinigami who uses reiatsu.
And the fact that the Dangai train cannot be destroyed is based on the Shinigami's perception only. No one would even try that, as it's required to be in Dangai, anyway.
I suppose Aizen destroyed it purely with the aid of his reiatsu. What else he could have used is a completely vague concept.