I suppose it's possible but I consider it highly unlikely. I would think Hoshino would have started to show signs of this by now, if so. Are you thinking the babies at the end of ch 213 (that look like twins) are Mana and the missing mystery sibling? Seeing as the ensuing chapters focus on Mana and Nea, I find it bizarre that the sibling wouldn't come up again from then onward.Quote:
We don't know if there's a third brother (or sister) in the first place. Nea's eventual arrival as a character has been foreshadowed at least since Allen's near-fatal encounter with Tyki, if not earlier. I don't think it fits Hoshino's well-developed plotting to suddenly bring another Campbell sibling into being out of nowhere.Quote:
They are the same person, I assure you. Have you read the D.Gray-Man Reverse novels? Their contents are canon, and the "Lost Fragment of Snow" chapter in particular is focused on Mana and little Red (he was simply called by the colour of his left arm before he became "Allen"). Both in LFoS and in the chapter(s) in which Allen asks Cross about Mana, it's explained/shown that Mana wasn't in his right mind (at all) when Allen was little. If he chose the name, it was probably a brain-addled way of remembering his brother Nea's last words for him (check my post on Mana = the Earl for a refresher on that from ch 205): "Never stand still, always keep walking."Quote:
It was already confirmed when you posted that this month wouldn't be it (but always see the hiatus and hangout threads for updates on this status). Soon would be nice but I think we'll have to wait a little longer yet. I think that at the end of the hiatus we're getting a HUGE reveal though. My guess is that it'll finally be confirmed Mana became the Earl of the Millennium. But we'll see.Quote:
Last edited by kannazuki; July 03, 2013 at 04:20 PM.
Today, I had an epiphany.
Road has been clinging to Allen like crazy since their first meeting, yes? And then in 206 we have Cross testifying that Allen has taken on the speaking characteristics and mannerisms of Mana. (and then some time back, in a chapter number that i don't remember, Cross also references Allen wearing a "mask of Mana).
....And then in 218's flasbacks, Road is seen holding a sleeping/comatose young!Mana.
...I'd assumed Road had a thing for the 14th, and was therefore attracted to Allen by some weird bond. But what if she's attracted to Mana, because right now, Allen is essentially acting/speaking the same way Mana did?
If you read the manga in Japanese (it's also in a scanlator's translation notes in the margins for chapter 173 iirc), you notice Allen has in fact been speaking less and less politely and more and more plainly as time wears on. He kind of goes back and forth between polite speech and plain speech depending on his state of mind or who he's speaking to. It's very possible Road loved Mana but Nea didn't approve, but personally I think that's because she saw the Earl's presence in him (or beginning to take over) and she was attached to that. If you look at chapter 202 (beginning of Lavi's torture), you get a clearer idea of how much all the Noah clan love and care about their Earl (look at Tyki's jealousy that Road understands their Earl better than he does-- why does she think the Earl is "scared" to see the 14th?). They are willing to follow literally any order he gives them but in that chapter they've essentially noticed the Earl is a bit messed up when it comes to the 14th, and now they've got these conflicting orders about how to handle him (destroy him or protect him with their lives?), and just don't know what to do.
Hey no worries. MS was talking about Road's clinginess toward Allen and relating it to her maybe having a romantic attraction to Mana, because Allen was behaving like Mana for so long. First, I acknowledged that's possible. Then I talked about the alternative theory that rather than it being "romantic," it's a semi-familial "affection" or "attachment" to the Earl being in Mana (which would be unrelated to Allen directly, but would explain her behaviour in 218 as referenced by MS). If Mana and the Earl are one and the same, it would be much like her behaviour in 202, where she's sitting on the edge of the Earl's bed (after he's apparently cried himself to sleep) and affectionately doting on him. Tyki says he's jealous in that chapter, apparently because she seems to have a deeper understanding of the Earl's feelings than him (even after he's been serving the Earl for 10 years).
Last edited by kannazuki; July 06, 2013 at 03:58 PM.
why do the chapters take so long to come out!!! argh earl is the most mysterious character, and after 218 chapters I still don't get him. I think mana's evil side is earl. I think earl couldn't kill allen because deep down in earl's core mana's will was preventing him. I think the cardinal will do something crazy next chapter. Personally, I feel like Earl is the heart--which I know it sounds crazy but I'm willing to bet my money on it.
so i decided to go back and take a look at some of the most important chapters of DGM, including the most recent chapters, and i want to bring back the possibility that at the end of chapter 218 it was not Allen speaking but instead Nea. what do you guys think nea would do in a situation like that and what of the other noah, tyki and wisely, who were hanging around the town earlier? are they just going to stand by the sideline whilst the earl loses his mind???? and what the hell will apocrophos (spelling) do?! sorry if any of this has already been mentioned in previous posts i can't really remember what's already been said since its been 7 months since we've last had a chapter....
If you're talking about the last page of the chapter, the only one speaking there was the Earl of the Millennium. :/
Anyway going by the look on his face (page 21), I don't think Nea was in control again already. (I mean his plan was to let Allen see some "dreams" first and then sort of "fade away," from them, wasn't it? Now Allen has seen a slice of the Earl's, Nea's, and some of Mana's perspective too in that dream sequence/flashback.) Going by facial expressions, Nea should either be all emotional, or should be smiling that creepy slasher smile of his. The look on Allen's face is one of unbridled rage. Looks like he understood some of what happened in those strange flashbacks and it's only fuelled his anger at the Earl of the Millennium's tendency to feed upon tragedy.
If it's page 20 you mean, where it's definitely either Allen or Nea speaking, then I suppose it could be Nea but it kind of contradicts what Nea said already in chapter 215. It's possible, but I'd think Allen is just saying "Mother" because he's dazed and confused. imo, he gets a grip on things again in the next page when you can see how angry he is becoming.
Last edited by kannazuki; July 10, 2013 at 06:43 PM.
i did mean page 20 but "allen" seemed to be genuinely mourning the loss/memory of mother's death. almost as if he knew her as his mother his entire life....
It's an interesting idea. I'm not convinced Allen wasn't simply confused and sympathizing though. I believe Allen even did the same thing with both Suman and Kanda's memories, where he forgot who he was for a few minutes at the end of each series of flashbacks. I can't believe Nea would react with such anger on page 21 either. He was so friendly and familiar with the Earl (who I think is Mana) in chapter 189-ish, like he's made peace with the past and is only concerned with his future, just like he's said he's resolving to do in 215. Then there's also the issue of Nea telling Tim he'd give Allen "dreams" so he'll come to "remember" something.
Hey, I wonder if Tim's "death" (he's coming back man, I refuse to believe he's gone for good) will change Nea's plan...
I actually believe it was nea at the end of the chapter as well. Mostly because of three reasons (reference to page 20):
1) The drawing of Nea's face superimposed over Allen's at the top. For me that looked like Hoshino was indicating Nea being in control.
2) He then says "shit what just happened...... like a flashback". Why would Allen consider a series of images he's never seen before as a flashback when he has never experienced them before. Whilst it could be argued that Allen was just making a hunch, you still have to question why it is that there is no indication of confusion or inquiry (like using a question sign at the end of his statements). Even when he goes to say "Mana.....!" and "..Mother...", he says them with a sense of familiarity rather than confusion.
3) In 215 http://mangafox.me/manga/d_gray_man/v24/c215/8.html, Nea tells Tim to give Allen clues to stimulate memories of the past (not just memories of the past from his perspective in particular). Considering that the Earl himself could be considered a very big "clue" and assuming that the Earl has visions of the past as well that can be triggered in the same way it, could be possible that both their consciousnesses fused for a short instance in chapter 218 http://readms.com/read/dgrayman/218/1719/16.
Well that's just what I think about that but when all has been said and done I personally think reason #1 was the most ponounsed indication. However in my opinion I think Hoshino did that scene specifically to be a bit ambiguous to provoke the minds of her fans LOL (Hoshino you sadist) Really want chapter 219 to confirm this...
On a slightly separate note I actually don't think Nea forgave the Earl at all. In chapter 189 it looked more like Nea was trying to be snarky and provocative. Especially with the Earl choking him and Nea going as far as threatening the Earl's life, I'd say that a great deal of tension and hatred (mixed in with a strange sentiment of love) is present between the two.
also just because neah wanted tim to give allen clues doesn't necessarily mean everything goes according to plan. the earl is definitely a wild card here. is it possible that when the earl and neah/mana's memories fused allen was rendered unconscious so that neah was sort of forced out?
I agree with Candy. When the Earl knocked Allen into the wall, I think Allen lost consciousness for a bit at that point, and for the most part when Allen sleeps a bit of Nea's memories emerges. I believe at that point in chapter 218 Nea, as Candy put it, was forced out due to the current situation.
I agree a memory did emerge in the chapter, but I don't think Nea took control of Allens body at any given point.
Allen had a "flashback" from a real memory, a memory doesn't only contain information about the event, it also contains emotions, and Allen was probably flushed by these emotions along with the memory.
So when Allen "woke up" again from doing nothing in the physical world during the flashback, it was like he had just experienced these memories for the first time, despite of them being a memory, so I think it's normal for Allen to be shocked.
After all, it's not any memory that he had himself originally, he never had time to "process" these memories, so I find it likely that he was shocked, and thus named the names that was emotionally important from the flash back.
Just my opinion
---------- Post added at 02:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:30 PM ----------
Thinking about it for a bit, I never really thought this through probably before now, but the Noah doesn't seem to have lost the memories of their current host, if reflecting a bit on it.
However what if "Noah" has a lot and really strong memories, perhaps it overwhelms most of the hosts and thus claim their body in a complete hostile takeover rather than a merger.
On the other hand, what if the Host is strong and have valuerable memories, then these memories won't be overwritten by Noah's memories.
But perhaps even in weaker hosts, it seems like not all memories are overwritten, as such, the Noah has a problem, but that's really just an assumption.
In the end a Noah seems like a merger between the current Host and the Noah's memories, becoming a being that is neither pure Host nor pure Noah, but a being of both, different everytime the Noah finds a host.
So put in other words, Allen can have huge influence of the 14th Noah, essentially becoming a mixture of the 14th and himself.
But if that is so, the question is whether previous hosts has any influence on the current host, or whether the host can permanently change the Noah's memories onward to the next time it finds a host?
I certainly find these questions interesting, I hope we'll one day have answers for them!
But I find it likely that Allen will keep important aspects of himself, I think he's strong, but will eventually probably end up merging with the 14th.
This new memory that Allen got this chapter will probably be too strong for Allen to shake, it's become important for him it seems, and thus one of the first real merges with the 14th perhaps.
- - -
Essentially if the Earl's past different hosts had a different view on the 14th, perhaps this is what is causing conflicts in the Earl? Assuming the Noah's memories takes a part of their changed self with them onto the next host? or is it a clean sheet every time a Noah finds a host?
Also the possibility that the Earl's Noah is suppressing these memories, because they're painful, and therefore this is the first time the Earl is having these memories too, as such, it would explain his weird behaviour, although none of this can be considered fact or anything, just theory.
That's actually a very interesting theory. A merge between Noah, and the host, thus creating a new being for the most part. I hope we get a clear understanding of this in the series. If Skinn Bolic, er I should say Raasura (Noah of Wrath), returns he could be a determining factor of this theory.