Yes, Hinata is thinking about Naruto's big, strong
hand and holding it tightly
No way, Sakura will come in.... soon! A-and slap Hinata off him!
Those two are dull, blonexblonde (NarutoxIno) ftw!
We all know the only one Naruto cares to be paired with is Sasuke
Naruto will die, pairingless.
Why? We all know Naruto will get all the bitches in the end
Another fact is when people try to downplay Naruto by spamming the Kyuubi argument. This is also ignoring the fact in the manga. Kushina was merely a container for Kyuubi, and I have not seen any reference of her using Kyuubi power. Hiruzen and all Konoha were surprise to see that Naruto could extract Kyuubi chakra. Naruto himself can keep Kyuubi under lock meaning his chakra can power stronger than Kyuubi can fight back to destroy it. You should understand that if the Jinchuriki is weaker than the tailed beast, he will be as Gaara was. This give an idea of Naruto's own will and power. Moreover, Naruto without Kyuubi's power can make 500 Kage Bushin at 12 years old, and he could be a Jinchuriki at zero years old. Unless you are kidding, these are facts that are undeniable, and prove that in this manga, unless you implant Hashimara's cell, there is no way you can match Hashimara and Naruto in load of Chakra. If you consider Kyuubi, then only Juubi can compete with Naruto.
Now, you can understand that what you are mistakening for stamina is the power of the Mangyeko sharingan. This power was fixed, and because Sasuke overused it, he lost his light in one day. Tobi warned him, but he disregarded the warning. This is not stamina, but the power of the mangyeko sharingan that can be spammed as long as the light is on. This mean right now with EMS, Sasuke can spam MS power as he wants, but if he were to go Chidori, Kage Bushin, and other non Sharingan Jutsu, he will need serious upgrade on his body for physical energy.
Last edited by so6pww; January 15, 2013 at 11:10 PM.
Kakashi can make quite a few KBs http://www.tenmanga.com/chapter/Naruto33/173068-10.html , this was during the zabuza arc, so he most likely have gotten higher stamina and chakra levels since then...
Being an Uchiha only negates the drain of having the Sharingan active, it doesn't lessen the cost of any of the Sharingan techniques. Nor does the Sharingan generate it's own chakra. Aside from us seeing the likes of Sasuke and Itachi affected by the cost of their MS techniques, it's been pointed out several times that Sasuke's Susanoo is of his own cold chakra. And one clone would not weaken him, not any greater then employing a powerful technique.
As previously mentioned, the number of clones isn't a testament to power. The technique splits the chakra proportionally, regardless of amount. That's the whole reason the Tajuu Kage Bunshin was forbidden, because of how easy it would be for a weaker ninja to kill themselves using it. Besides, Naruto's chakra was also mixing with the Kyuubi's, so that doesn't mean much anyhow. And actually, there are quite a few ninjas with stated large chakra pools, some bigger then Naruto's like Ee and Kisame.
I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that MS has some separate power. The MS draws upon the user's chakra like any other technique.
Ugh. I avoided replying to you not only because Rikudou King was successfully refuting you, but because you also can't post without belittling everyone elses knowledge of the manga. Your posts would be alot more pleasant if you didn't try so hard to remind everyone how fond of yourself you are.Originally Posted by so6pw
There is SO much wrong here I don't even know where to start. First of all, the reason you can't compare Sharingan usage with Kage Bunshin usage is because one is a Kekkei Genkai that not everyone can use, while the other is a jutsu proven to be usable by ANYONE with the chakra and training to do so, nevermind the fact that no one here is even arguing that Sasuke can make as many clones as Naruto. All we're saying is you don't need Naruto's level of chakra inorder to make multpile clones, or to be effective with clones. Too many characters have proven this already.Quote:
Here you go:Quote:
Part 1 Chakra: 2 and then 2.5. Chakra in part 2, 3.5.
Part 1 Chakra: 3 and then 3 at the end of Part 1. During part 2 it was also 3.
So according to the databook Sasuke's chakra reserves have surpassed Kakashi. You want more proof though? You're in luck!
Chakra Prowess Edit
Originally, Kakashi's primary weakness was his barely average reserves of chakra and stamina. He could only maintain his Sharingan for a short time, quickly tiring out from overusing it and ultimately collapsing, followed by great difficulty to even stand for days. He also claimed he could only use his signature technique, Lightning Cutter, four times in a single day before it wouldn't work. To compensate for this, Kakashi possesses very refined chakra control, allowing him to use multiple techniques quickly with the minimum necessary chakra and to their highest level. Kakashi’s control also allows him to perform various techniques, usually lightning-based, with few to no hand seals.
Proof he has low chakra. As for proof of Sasuke's large chakra reserve....
Sasuke's chakra becoming colder and darker.
Even by the Uchiha standards, Sasuke has exceptionally strong and large amounts of chakra. At age 7, he was already able to use his clan's signature fire release technique. This later surprised even Kakashi, as such techniques usually require more developed chakra. In Part II, his reserves grew considerably greater, able to use many highly chakra-consuming techniques in a day, even recklessly using three different Mangekyō Sharingan techniques plus Chidori multiple times respectively without visible exhaustion; able to continue fighting effectively with plenty of stamina left against the Kage. Also, even when extremely weakened, he could summon Manda, a high level summon (though he may have used Orochimaru's chakra for this). After gaining Itachi's eyes, Sasuke's reserves appear to have grown even further, as during the battle against Kabuto, he was visibly unaffected from using several of his Mangekyō Sharingan techniques as well as his Chidori multiple times.
Now compare what was stated about Kakashi, to what was stated about Sasuke. I fully expect you to claim that "wiki's aren't accurate" or somesuch other excuse. So instead I could simply post the manga scans where different characters praise Sasuke's chakra reserve... or the one page when Kakashi is training Naruto where Kakashi flatout admits to having a small chakra reserve. Maybe later if you persist.
I dare you to prove me wrong now though. Prove that my claim is wrong. Prove that Sasuke's chakra reserves are not superior to Kakashi's.
All of this is wrong too. I'm not even taking Sharingan usage into account, I'm talking lasting during battle while using high cost jutsu after high cost jutsu. Sasuke's MS abilities are more taxing than any one Raikiri or Chidori and he uses them almost exclusively in his recent fights. And there's no such thing as "replica on the same level as Naruto". Every KB is the same. The literal ONLY way Naruto would surpass Sasuke in KB usage would be in sheer amount of clones that could be created at any given time.Quote:
I repeat: if both ninja made one shadow clone at the exact same time, no one's gonna look at Naruto's clones and say "Yeah, you're far superior at making clones than that guy. Yours are so much more... cloney."
Nope. Stopping you right there. This has absolutely nothing to do with Kyuubi. The argument is "does Sasuke have the stamina to use Kage Bunshin" That's it. That's all you and Roman however turned it into something outrageously biased and unprovable when you started saying things like "Sasuke can't use KB as long as Naruto" or "He can't use them on the same level as Naruto". Define both of these. What determines "clones on the level of Naruto"? The literal only argument you could make is that Naruto can make more. That's it. That's all.Quote:
Once again, who in the hell claimed that Sasuke had chakra levels equal to Naruto? You were so eager to jump to Naruto's defense that you're arguing a completely different point than we're trying to make. The only thing that was ever said is that Sasuke has the necessary amount of stamina to use clones effectively. You guys are so defensive of Naruto you won't acknowledge that Sasuke could do something that Naruto can do, even when characters that are inferior to Sasuke can pull it off?Quote:
Damn. Well, we might aswell take away Henge and Kawarimi too. How dare we assume Sasuke can use a D rank jutsu that Naruto can use! He simply doesn't have the stamina for it!
Last edited by ninjabot; January 16, 2013 at 12:17 AM.
Sadly but databooks doesn't make senses if we go by them, it will be alot weird shit....i preferred to go by what kishi write in the manga..
Fair enough. I expected atleast someone to go that route. Good thing I posted more than just what the databook said. Read the bolded parts.
Also, databooks should only ever be dismissed when the manga directly contradicts it. Example? The databook says that Sasuke's Genjutsu is close range, but we see when he uses it against Deidara he's practically a mile away. This is one such contradiction. Another? Deidara and Sasuke both have the same speed stat, except Sasuke's speed is WAAAAAY above Deidara's. This is another contradiction.
Comparing Sasuke and Kakashi's stamina however wouldn't be the same for the simple fact that Kakashi admits to having a small chakra reserve (and does NOT blame it on the Sharingan usage). Hell, I don't think he's had a single fight where he didn't monologue about how close he was to keeling over from chakra exhaustion. Sasuke on the other hand takes the "I'll sleep when I'm dead" mentality and presses on, full steam ahead.
Actually, Deidara and Sasuke can have the same speed, but Sasuke's Sharingan could give him the edge. I'm sure the definition of speed is broad and doesn't just apply to foot speed.
Didn't Kakashi say Sasuke and Naruto had a lot of chakra during the tree climbing exercise, but that Naruto had way more chakra?
May be in 1 hr 30 minutes, we will get the chapter and try to get over with this fight and switch to sasuke and orochimaru, I'm afraid that it will be the same story of the last few chapters, naruto and allies using good jutsus but not effect to the juubi unless the used the tragedy that shikaku came up before getting blow up.
Kakashi use of the Sharigan causes him to burn though chakra quickly, especially when he uses MS. But that doesn't mean he has below average chakra levels, it just means he burns through his chakra faster than normal because he uses a Kekkai Genkai not of his clan.
Furthermore, look at these two fights
Vs. Kakazu: Pulled off like 5 Rakiri's. A Kage Bushin, multiple suitons, and tons of taijutsu and Sharigan uses and STILL had enough chakra to perfrom Kamui before Naruto arrived.
Vs. Pain: Multiple Rakiri's, Raiton Bushin, two uses of MS before he completely ran out of chakra.
And keep in mind his physical energy in both these fights would be greatly affected by all damage he took.
Case and point, Kakashi has average chakra, and it only seems low because of all the chakra beasts that are around him.
As for Sasuke, he certainly is reaching the upper echelon of chakra levels, he's certainly better than above average.
---------- Post added at 12:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:42 AM ----------
Gaara has massive amounts of chakra even without his Biju.
Jiraiya is also a chakra reservoirs hence why he can perform Sage Mode.
Kimimaro is another ninja who has a massive chakra supply, and we didn't even see it's full extent due to the fact he was terminally ill.
Gai, or any gate user for that matter, can also match massive levels of chakra although for only short periods of time.
Their is no average jounin you either are or your not it's a rank. And if he meant it in the the way you interpret it then that would mean an AVERAGE JOUNIN could pull off more clones than kakashi did at the naruto bridge. could you imaging what would be considered an AVERAGE JOUNIN in pt2 (tsunade)
Well the wiki says Kakashi's chakra is "barely average". As in it's average, if not a little bit less. Kakashi himself says he has a low chakra supply (I might aswell find the scan since we're still on the subject, lol)
http://narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/315/10 "Guys like me with little chakra". At the top of the page he's comparing himself to Naruto, but not at the bottom. At the bottom he's comparing himself to other ninja with small chakra reserves.
As for Sasuke being above average, look at the feats. When he was a kid he was using techniques that required too much chakra for a ninja his age. People wank about the potency of his chakra (which doesn't really mean the same as "amount", but it's something). And also, it's stated that the Uchiha clan have a powerful chakra in general, so he's naturally above the average ninja when it comes to chakra reserves.
---------- Post added at 06:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:06 AM ----------
Also, Kakashi isn't the average Jounin. His chakra control is immaculate. He can get more milage out of less chakra, so someone with more chakra than him probably wouldn't be able to pull off the same stamina feats unless they were as impressive at ninjutsu as he is. Remember when they explain the difference between Sasuke, Sakura, and Naruto's chakra control? About wasting chakra even though you get the same effects as another ninja?
I imagine it'd be the same thing here.
---------- Post added at 06:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:09 AM ----------
@Delbi: Maybe. When I say below average I don't mean THAT far below. Still, his lacking reserves is made up for with his perfect chakra control. He wastes no chakra, spends all of his training gaining stamina and learning to use his strongest jutsu more times than he originally could.
as always informative ninjabot but the fight isn't we will meet again.
well thats thats wating for this chapter is annoying its sleeppy time see you guys and girls 10 h from now. ah good mourning to some and good night to others.