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I'm not sure Kakashi would go underground because when underground he'd be vulnerable to a smash of a rasenshuriken on the ground and would not be really able to attack anyway.Originally Posted by manu
Going underground is rather something you do when you are hidden from your enemy (Kakashi going underground hidden by Itachi's Goukayou no jutsu) because moving underground is harder than moving on the surface, putting you in a disadvantage against the enemy (he can't see you but you can't see him either and he'll definitely change position if he sees you going underground)
As for Sharingan, Kakashi wasn't able to dodge Kakuzu nor to strike Hidan so I guess that against skillful opponents, a stab to the heart isn't that easy to make. And I do think that Naruto is at least as good as Hidan in taijutsu now, especially if supported by Kage Bunshins.
manu: He doesn't have the balls? Erm, didn't he just put the RasenShuriken on Kakuzu's chest with the INTENT TO KILL HIM? I'm sure he did. Also, he sent a Rasengan right into the stomach of Kabuto WITH THE INTENT TO KILL HIM! Also, I'm pretty sure Naruto was trying hard as hell to kill Deidara. So what the heck are you talking about he doesn't have the balls to kill? He just hasn't suceeded in killing these people but he sure as hell wants to.
So your saying that futon rasengan can peirce the earth down to its core? I highly doubt Naruto would even know where to aim the thing. Also Sharigan gets better each time he fights an opponent. Remember what he said to Zabuza, no one has ever survived to face the Sharigan 3 times. Exception being other sharigan users since sharigan crosses out sharigan.
And I'm bringing this up because Kakashi has studied Naruto more then anyone. Last chapter alone proves that nothing Naruto does will suprise him. We could continue this debate but I feel like I'm repeating my self when I say the Kakashi has Naruto's number and that Naruto has never had to fight for his life and would most likely freeze again.
Of course there is always the Kyuubi option but Jiraiya gave him tags to block out that option. Part of being a ninja is to always be prepared and I don't think Kakashi is stupid enough to turn his back on the nine tails ever.
@ PredatorNar when he was fighting Kakuzu he had back up, agaisnt Kabuto he had backup, and agaisnt Deidara he had backup. In all those cases if he failed (which he has) someone would bail him out. If you want to kill someone you make sure the job is finished. Even if its at the stake of your own life. Take Neji for example, the first one of the chuuniners to become Jounin. When he fought his soundnin he killed his opponent but in return got an arrow throught the heart. That is when you fight with the intent to kill.
As someone who knows Naruto so intimately, a ninja like Kakashi could definetly strategize his way to to victory.
If he was forced to, that is.
I think Kakashi is still stronger than Naruto (sans 4 Tail Kyubi). Kakashi is an elite jonin who has fought and defeated tons of A-rank and S-class ninja.
Once Naruto beats Kakuzu, I think he'll be on par with Kakashi.
still not on par with him he would have to beat the whole bunch of memebers to be on par with kakashi
We can't really fault Naruto for never actually finishing off an enemy. Naruto has always been paired up with enemies that outclass him. Kabuto at the time he was fighting Naruto was at least as powerful as Kakashi. Also, there is the matter of "that jutsu". Naruto has yet to reveal what "that jutsu" is, although he might in the upcoming fight. That might tip the scales in Naruto's favor in this debate.Originally Posted by manu
well, even right now i think that naruto would probably win 3 out every
10 battles with kakashi, i mean he definately has all the utilities to do
so it's just a matter of how really.
with of course narutos trump card being the toad summon, as
kakashi has shown no jutsu of that scale.
Naruto not killing is the very point of Naruto XD
He's the main character, a good guy and a sentimental good guy at that. His very strength is that those he comes into contact with can't help BUT respect and befriend him. He's Naruto's Goku for crying out loud o.O;
It's not the main character's job to do the killing. If anything, he'll leave Kakuzu wounded, but he definitely won't be the one to KILL Kakuzu.
havent read the entire thread only the first post, why? im lazy.
so to answer the first post i would say no. but he could mmost definetly do it. he's not just there yet.
having one jutsu thats stronger than kakashi doesnt really give an overall view of ones ability.
and kakashi has been said to have copied 1000 jutsus with his sharingan.
the thing i USED to love with naruto was his amazing quick wits. against zabusa, the shuriken clone.
against neji, dig your ass off. against gaara, konoha hidden taijitsu ougi: sennen gorashi with an exploading tag.
that was his strength. AND when he realized in the end of the fight against gaara that you get stronger when you protect someone. that was his strengths. but nowadays...............
he is only focused on sasuke, getting him back. and he never shows any inventivness in the fights. he's clearly forgotten that protection=great strength but if he could get his head together and
use his new found element to creat more than 1 jutsu thats actually unnecessary(sp?). considering that it is the rasengan. its used the same way, point blank hit that destroys your target. both fuuton and regular rasengan does that.
so my point is this:
if naruto remembers why he should fight and starts doing more than one thing in battles THEN he will have surpassed kakashi. but now he's nowhere near as good as him.
uh? naruto hasn't killed anyone? what? have you all forgot about yuura, the sand nin disguised as itachi?
first, we don't know if kakashi had ever defeated an s-class criminal...second, naruto's fighting style is similar to kakashi's...if he defeat kakuzu fighting like that he would be stronger than kakashi in close combat.Quote:
still i don't think he have surpassed kakashi(even if he defeat kakuzu): kakashi is an all-round nin, who can fight in both close/mid/and long range, surpassing him in close combat only doesn't make naruto stronger than him. Nartuo has way to go to surpass kakashi
Yuura was still a team effort.
Considering that Kakashi and Naruto &co assumed they were dealing with the real Itachi. Naruto didn't have any killing intent, killing Yuura was more of an accident than an intended murder.
While he may have killed Yuura, he never did display killing intent (though, I KNOW, I know, against Haku he did display killing intent, but in the end he still managed to restrain himself)
This lack of killing intent sets him apart from all the other characters.
I guess I should correct myself: Naruto never fights with the intent to kill and as a result will rarely, if ever, kill his opponent.
Dude, Yuura was already dead to begin with. The jutsu kills the "puppet" in exchange for making them stronger. I think... thats only a theory but it seems to be the case with Orochimarus resurrection jutsu he used on the two gennin sound nins. It could be agrued that I don't know this for a fact but it seems really unlikely that when a person's body is used as a sacrifice for a jutsu that they come back to life. The word sacrifice usually indicates that someone died before hand. So Naruto didn't kill him.
I like Boffen's explaination of Naruto's weakness, definately his Sasuke obsession isn't making him as strong as he should be. As for whether Kakashi has defeated an S-class criminal you must not have actually paid attention to anything that Zabuza said King Crimson. Zabuza's bingo book only contained S-class ninja's, and guess what Kakashi was in it. Try to fill in the gaps more often
even if he didn't kill him, how can you say that he has never shown killing intent? he goes at him, thinking he was itachi, with the intent to kill him