Until now, it turns out the quest for white snake has always been in blood for the innocent children. Hiruzen was pathetically pacific, and despite seeing the evilness in Orochimaru thought he would change. Orochimaru in my opinion is not a human - I call him a snaky entity.
Do you remember how Kishi used Kabuto's SM? The most evil sage mode!
Last edited by so6pww; January 22, 2013 at 11:10 AM.
What you stated as opinion could well be a fact. Gamabunta is like the Toad Boss and Manda is the Snake Boss in that sense. I'm not thinking any different there. Those who were after the snake sage mode weren't angels. What I don't agree with is simple. It's not that snake sage mode was deemed as evil because it was related with the snakes, but it's because that mode was used by Kabuto who had evil intentions (granted, evil from a certain perspective only).
Orochimaru was only a person with twisted persona until he began his experiments. He wasn't evil, and yet, he used the snakes beginning with his youth. Same goes for Anko, who had barely any evil qualities. Even Sasuke, whilst being trained by Orochimaru, was no evil. He was after his older brother to avenge his clansmen. What exactly can be considered evil about that? He became an antagonist and was deemed as evil only after learning the truth about the Uchiha from Tobi.
Of course, you can see the nature of snake nesting in all those people's character here and there, but it's not to go as far to call it evil, in my opinion.
And the White Snake has nothing to do with "innocent children's" blood. You're thinking of his Mokuton experiments.
I'm sure I can guess what one of the reasons are but... for the sake of discussion let's just see, lol.Originally Posted by Suzaku
Well, here's the thing here: there's nothing that states the only two potential senjutsu instructing animal pacts are snakes and toads. Suigetsu tells us all animals can sense natural energy. I'll find the scan soon. As for hawks having access to Senjutsu, why not? They don't have arms for Hawk-Fu, but then snakes don't have arms or legs for Snake-Fu either and they still can teach Senjutsu. And while the Humid Bone Forrest may be the domain of Slug Sages, we've no confirmation yet.Quote:
And Sasuke has an entire torso's worth of Juugo's flesh inside of his body. I'd say that passes for enough of his DNA to produce the same feat IMO. As for focus, he's a genius-type ninja. I've no doubt he can get the knack with the aid of Juugo's DNA once they figure out how to activate it's ability.Quote:
I'd say that Madara and Obito's current abilities run counter to the Senju vs. Uchiha parallels aswell. Madara now has everything that makes Hashirama a threat. Ditto for Obito. Ontop of that they have Rinnegan and MS jutsu. I do NOT want Sasuke to be a carbon copy of them. With Senjutsu Sasuke could rely entirely on his MS/EMS abilities without branching out into Senju territory. Then it will truly be Senju vs. Uchiha when he and Naruto fight.Quote:
I also disagree with the idea that Sage Mode is any way indicative of Senju power, since it relies on power that's not genetically pre-installed in his body. It's power from everywhere. Sage Mode, to me, always seemed like it was intended for genius type ninja because of the level of patience and understanding it requires. I always thought it made no sense that a ninja of Naruto's mentality could use it, let alone perfect it.
Agreed. But the pinnacle of that spiritual power manifests in the Rinnegan, meaning in obtaining said Rinnegan he would also gain Senju strength and chakra. Gaining the Rinnegan is FAR more likely to destroy the "eyes vs. body" motif Kishi has going than Sage Mode would. Hell, look at Madara. His Perfect Susanoo isn't even using the Rinnegan's power to strengthen it, and it's capable of Bijuu level destructive feats. The sheer amount of stamina it would take for something like this is borderline Senju level already.Quote:
I expect him to perfect his Susanoo eventually aswell. Still this doesn't really give him an answer for his lacking stamina. Either he gains the Rinnegan and his stamina is increased thanks to Hashirama's DNA... or he does something else. Sage Mode seems the most possible next to Rinnegan. I don't particularly like either idea. But I like the thought of Sasuke gaining the Rinnegan far less than the thought of him being a Sage.Quote:
Now, as I told someone else, the snake SM will be perfect for Uchiha because they don't worry about pumping the energy and storing it. Since they have an antenna that is adjusting the level and enery and drawing on-demand, the user can draw as much as he need any time as we saw with Juugo. In fact, Kishi never explained how Snake SM works in detail.
From the beginning, Sasuke has not been Uchiha. Yes, he got Sharingan and used it as Uchiha, but in major battle, Sasuke were saved most of the time by power up that are external to Uchiha. From curse seal, Kakashi's chidori (body based jutsu), to Orochimaru's full power, and maybe to summoning. You can see that Sasuke is more than an Uchiha with Sharingan.
Next, I continue to claim that anyone who think Rinnegan is an eye technique is really misundertanding the manga. Not only we are shown that you cannot have it without the Senju body, but in its operation, it heavily rely on the body. Madara choosing Nagato to revive him was the greatest evidence. While Uchiha power is needed to activate Rinnegan (as for now), I believe strongly that Rinnegan is a power that fit more the Senju than the Uchiha. If you take a pair of spare Rinnegan, I cna guaranty that an unaltered Uchiha will be unable to use it perfectly while a Senju or Uzumaki will use it perfectly, better than the Uchiha.
Also noticed that Obito's usage of it is poor despite having half his body Senju, and notice that Rinnegan (the eyes themselves) are keys to knwoledge, while the body allow for using that knowledge.
- Sage Mode
- Orochimaru power
At this point, it is hilarious to talk about Senju vs Uchiha.
Trust me, Sasuke's stamina will not be a problem
On topic, I prefer Sage Mode over Rin'negan every day, doesn't change the fact though that it would still be the same as Rin'negan:
overused, already seen, nothing new.
Just like we saw the Rin'negan with Madara, Obito and Nagato we saw Sage Mode with Naruto, Jiraiya and Kabuto. So I would not be totally convinced on it as well, even though Sasuke in Sage Mode would finally close the gap with Itachi and truly surpass him.
It doesn't change the fact though that Oro surely wanted, after taking Sasuke's body, to inject Hashirama's cells in it and obtain Sage Mode and Rin'negan himself, so the possibility isn't totally unreal
So, orochimaru would let sasuke gain the ultimate senjutsu?
Not unless orochimaru is an idiot. Giving the ultimate senjutsu to sasuke whereas he was after to sasuke's body is some sort of stupidity.
Or not unless orochimaru cared for sasuke. He wants sasuke to gain power because of his parental love.
Although Sasuke boasted about not needing Orochimaru's tutelage in the end, he failed against Itachi on his own, so, if Orochimaru really thought something of that sort, it wouldn't make him an idiot at all.
Ah, that. It's possibly love.
Not parental, though
And I agree with @so6pww, snakes is evil. For them, humans are just their foods. When oro summon manda, he wants to have at least a hundred humans as a sacrificed for calling him in a battle field. And it's not impossible for the white snake to asked kabuto to sacrifice a hundreds of humans in exchange for kabuto's training in sage mode. Yeah, that's what they are. Thats why kishi called the snake sage as the most evil sage mode.
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So, if oro would really do that, then for me, he's an idiot.
No. It's parental love.
Orochimaru doesn't have to give Senjutsu to Sasuke. Infact, Sasuke has no snake pact so the great snake sage wouldn't teach him most likely. If Sasuke were to obtain it, it would be from a hawk sage.
I expect the same thing, but I'd prefer it be explained away via his coming powerup. Unless they say somewhere "Your chakra has grown Sasuke", I'd be okay with that too. It's just Kishimoto tends to prefer being vague.Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood
What the hell is that? Where was stated that sasuke's hawk is a sage? Wow. Just because you want sasuke to gain a powerups, you're assuming that sasuke's hawk is a sage? So, the humid forest(?) Is where the hawk sage lives?
When did I say that one existed?Originally Posted by marshall313
Go ahead. Quote the exact point where I said that a hawk sage exists. I said that if he becomes a sage it would be thanks to a hawk sage's tutelage, because you can only learn senjutsu from an actual senjutsu master. And since his summoning pact is with hawks, the only one he could potentially gain this knowledge from, is a hawk.
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@NinjaStar: I remember that instance. I didn't bring it up because I thought Kurama had something to do with him having the chakra to make another since he can use FRS in Chakra Mode.
Orochimaru, Kabuto, Anko, and Sasuke's connection to snakes has nothing to do with "evil". Snakes are regularly attributed to "forbidden" knowledge and wisdom, which fits all all four characters, either because they know some sort of information (Orochimaru and Anko) or because they were on a quest to discover some information (Sasuke and Kabuto).