Discussion Is Wahl Eehto's Ehtherion as powerful as Satellite Square?

Sheridan Cain

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For reference, Satellite Square was stated to destroy countries, the size of continents in chapter 79. Wahl Eehto in chapter 473 was going to finish off Laxus with an Etherion blast. Certain people say FT characters scale to continental because of this.

Thoughts?
 

Jean Grey

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probably not.

if you go back to Makarov's meeting with Alvarez empire, one of the main reasons Zeref and his country never went up against Ishgar was because of councils Etherion. if Spriggans are continental in destructive capacity (honestly, country or continental level is irrelevant cause two strongest attacks are house level LMAO), especially Zeref, then Etherion would be a joke to them and would never be mentioned.


so Wall either hacked councils Etherion or it's straight up weaker.
 
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GL_Nova

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That
probably not.

if you go back to Makarov's meeting with Alvarez empire, one of the main reasons Zeref and his country never went up against Ishgar was because of councils Etherion. if Spriggans are continental in destructive capacity (honestly, country or continental level is irrelevant cause two strongest attacks are house level LMAO), especially Zeref, then Etherion would be a joke to them and would never be mentioned.

so Wall either hacked councils Etherion or it's straight up weaker.
Thats something that Makarov claims, but we learn that the only real reason was Zeref was waiting for Natsu to kill him. None of the Spriggan were worried about Etherion, they just didn’t want to cross Zeref. So it doesn’t support them not being equal. We see the exact same satellite squares being prepared in the anime, an we know Mashima took the opportunity to clear up a bunch of scenes in the manga.
 

Sheridan Cain

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That


Thats something that Makarov claims, but we learn that the only real reason was Zeref was waiting for Natsu to kill him. None of the Spriggan were worried about Etherion, they just didn’t want to cross Zeref. So it doesn’t support them not being equal. We see the exact same satellite squares being prepared in the anime, an we know Mashima took the opportunity to clear up a bunch of scenes in the manga.
Is the anime canon/does Mashima actually work on it?

Even then, if Wahl was using the Satellite Square, then I'm pretty sure that doesn't translate to him being continental in power because those old guys in the council used it and they sure as hell weren't.
 

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It was shown to be the exact same and as shown with Brandish, the S12s have the capacity to produce country level attacks with their MP.
 

Sheridan Cain

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It was shown to be the exact same
How so?

and as shown with Brandish, the S12s have the capacity to produce country level attacks with their MP.
Only Irene. Despite Brandish's nickname, she was never shown to shrink a country/continent. Besides, those aren't attacks.
 

Jko

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How so?



Only Irene. Despite Brandish's nickname, she was never shown to shring a country/continent. Besides, those aren't attacks.
In the anime.

Current manga shows she can manipulate people to the size that would allow them to level a country. Attacking while the size of a giant is an attack....
 

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Is the anime canon/does Mashima actually work on it?

Even then, if Wahl was using the Satellite Square, then I'm pretty sure that doesn't translate to him being continental in power because those old guys in the council used it and they sure as hell weren't.
Yeah, he was quite instrumental in the major changes between the two stories. He made a point of being pretty involved. He did an interview about it on PlayStation today
 

grey matter

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In the anime.

Current manga shows she can manipulate people to the size that would allow them to level a country. Attacking while the size of a giant is an attack....
Aldoron has 4 small cities in his body. He's large city sized, multi-city size at best. Definitely not "country sized". Brandish enlarging Gajeel doesn't change anything. We already knew Spriggan tiers have MP that's city or multi city level. Ajeel's sand world encompassed entire Magnolia. Brandish shrank a city sized island. Neinhart's MP extended from port to the city quite a bit far away from port (i.e large city or multi city tier).

What Brandish showed is that her limit is Aldoron size, i.e large city or multi city level.

The only ones with country level magic power are August and Eileen. And that too, at their absolute limit. Eileen just rearranged the country, it's not destruction. August, who has same MP has Eileen, needed to give his life for a country destruction attack. It's safe to assume that the attack is beyond his capacity, since he needed to sacrifice himself for it.
Country level >~ August's MP >>>> Brandish's MP. This basically proves that the average Spriggans aren't actually country level, when the strongest among all spriggans is barely country level while sacrificing himself
 

Jko

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Aldoron has 4 small cities in his body. He's large city sized, multi-city size at best. Definitely not "country sized". Brandish enlarging Gajeel doesn't change anything. We already knew Spriggan tiers have MP that's city or multi city level. Ajeel's sand world encompassed entire Magnolia. Brandish shrank a city sized island. Neinhart's MP extended from port to the city quite a bit far away from port (i.e large city or multi city tier).

What Brandish showed is that her limit is Aldoron size, i.e large city or multi city level.

The only ones with country level magic power are August and Eileen. And that too, at their absolute limit. Eileen just rearranged the country, it's not destruction. August, who has same MP has Eileen, needed to give his life for a country destruction attack. It's safe to assume that the attack is beyond his capacity, since he needed to sacrifice himself for it.
Country level >~ August's MP >>>> Brandish's MP. This basically proves that the average Spriggans aren't actually country level, when the strongest among all spriggans is barely country level while sacrificing himself
Aldo has multiple mountains on his wrist that only look like zits. His toenail clippings are bigger than mountains. All five cities on him are bigger than Crocus which is a large city lol. Aldo is as big as country not a city. His hand alone is already the size of a large island lol. Brandish made Gajeel stronger than casual Aldo's stomp which leveled a land three times the size of himself.

The average S12 have already shown to easily be able to use island level power with no sweat. Brandish just showed they have the capacity in MP to do more.

Aldo himself is just much stronger than a country level mass. It had nothing to do with his size but the amount of power he has. He is a Dragon God.

No, August and Irene have shown continental level energy by feats. Fiore is the size of the US which is considered a continent.
 

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Not really sure. In the anime it's shown that Wall was seen hacking the etherion. The satellite orbiting the earth was seen. But I dont know why they didnt do it long time ago :hmm
 

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Aldoron has 4 small cities in his body. He's large city sized, multi-city size at best. Definitely not "country sized". Brandish enlarging Gajeel doesn't change anything. We already knew Spriggan tiers have MP that's city or multi city level. Ajeel's sand world encompassed entire Magnolia. Brandish shrank a city sized island. Neinhart's MP extended from port to the city quite a bit far away from port (i.e large city or multi city tier).

What Brandish showed is that her limit is Aldoron size, i.e large city or multi city level.

The only ones with country level magic power are August and Eileen. And that too, at their absolute limit. Eileen just rearranged the country, it's not destruction. August, who has same MP has Eileen, needed to give his life for a country destruction attack. It's safe to assume that the attack is beyond his capacity, since he needed to sacrifice himself for it.
Country level >~ August's MP >>>> Brandish's MP. This basically proves that the average Spriggans aren't actually country level, when the strongest among all spriggans is barely country level while sacrificing himself
That is the worst downplay I've ever seen for Aldoron. How the heck is he the size of only a couple of cities? The dude literally has mountains on his hands that look like pimples, and 5 cities on his body that make up like 5-10% of his body at most. He looks large island size, though i wouldn't say the size of a normal country since that's stretching. Brandish already increased Gajeel's size to a point where he dwarfed Aldoron's cities, which are each bigger than Crocus. And Brandish is so much weaker than August. Now, I'm not saying every Spriggan can destroy a country because they all use different types of magic, some of which aren't meant for widespread destruction, like Bloodman and Jacob, but they most definitely have the magic power to rival characters who could threaten countries like Brandish.
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Not really sure. In the anime it's shown that Wall was seen hacking the etherion. The satellite orbiting the earth was seen. But I dont know why they didnt do it long time ago :hmm
Plot armor. The spriggans were all so cocky, they thought they didn't need to try.
 

Jean Grey

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Thats something that Makarov claims, but we learn that the only real reason was Zeref was waiting for Natsu to kill him. None of the Spriggan were worried about Etherion, they just didn’t want to cross Zeref. So it doesn’t support them not being equal. We see the exact same satellite squares being prepared in the anime, an we know Mashima took the opportunity to clear up a bunch of scenes in the manga.
no, it's not.

Zeref literally agreed that one of the main reasons they never invaded was because of Etherion and Faces


I don't really care about nitpicking some hypothetical scenarios. Etherion was one of the biggest threats to them which is flat out stated by Zeref. why would that be the case if August and Irene (especially Zeref) is beyond that???

Etherion makes countries disappear (Fiore is a country).

Wall probably hacked Etherion since Etherion was neutralized and hence was vulnerable and even if he did that doesn't mean his Etherion equals the one from the councils because Wall's Etherion beam comes from his hand, not a satellite above Earth. all he did is getting necessary components to cast Etherion.

besides, he would have used it against dying Laxus so I guess Laxus is beyond continental when healthy :cookiehand

Wall's Etherion is, at best, stronger than Jupiter cannon.

plus, if Wall's Etherion was really like the councils then he would have killed everyone in Fiore, including his own comrades.

the fact remains that none of the Spriggans have fire power that equals the destructive capacity of Etherion.

there is a reason why Mavis used an example of Etherion for Fairy Heart because Etherion is the most destructive (and impressive) spell in the series.

August needed to use suicidal spell to effect Fiore (a country) and even that is under a question because dude was going through some mental breakdown so what he said probably isn't even true.

according to Mavis, it would destroy Magnolia and it can be defended from if you put your MP strictly to defense (kinda bad it messed up with Mavis' telepathy because it would be sick to see how Romeo tanks continental attack :teehee)


and even if you accept that, August is way beyond Wall and August's strongest spell (suicidal)>>>> Wall's strongest spell

if Wall is casual country destroyer and August needs a suicidal spell while Irene needs prep time, why is Wall not up there with them???

oh and Aldoron is a very, very, very small "country" sized which isn't really country sized, not Fiore sized so Brandish cannot increase someones size to Fiore size :yodawg:yodawg:yodawg

plus, casual Natsu was melting Domus Flau after 1 year time skip which can house a town and there are five towns on Aldoron.

EDIT: images sometimes don't work for some reason :-_-
 
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grey matter

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That is the worst downplay I've ever seen for Aldoron. How the heck is he the size of only a couple of cities? The dude literally has mountains on his hands that look like pimples, and 5 cities on his body that make up like 5-10% of his body at most. He looks large island size, though i wouldn't say the size of a normal country since that's stretching. Brandish already increased Gajeel's size to a point where he dwarfed Aldoron's cities, which are each bigger than Crocus. And Brandish is so much weaker than August. Now, I'm not saying every Spriggan can destroy a country because they all use different types of magic, some of which aren't meant for widespread destruction, like Bloodman and Jacob, but they most definitely have the magic power to rival characters who could threaten countries like Brandish.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



Plot armor. The spriggans were all so cocky, they thought they didn't need to try.
Yea, he's multi city level in size. I don't think you realize how big a REAL island is (I'm not talking of the tiny islands here, I'm talking of ones which form small countries). His area (from top view) would be, say 20 cities like ones he had. That would still be multi city, not island.

Those mountains aren't really big. They're hills.

The good guys were able to see Gajeel fighting Aldoron. They could see his form. This is impossible if he's actually island sized, that would be too large for you to comprehend.
--- Double Post Merged, ---

Aldo has multiple mountains on his wrist that only look like zits. His toenail clippings are bigger than mountains. All five cities on him are bigger than Crocus which is a large city lol. Aldo is as big as country not a city. His hand alone is already the size of a large island lol. Brandish made Gajeel stronger than casual Aldo's stomp which leveled a land three times the size of himself.

The average S12 have already shown to easily be able to use island level power with no sweat. Brandish just showed they have the capacity in MP to do more.

Aldo himself is just much stronger than a country level mass. It had nothing to do with his size but the amount of power he has. He is a Dragon God.

No, August and Irene have shown continental level energy by feats. Fiore is the size of the US which is considered a continent.
Lol, your doing calcs based on drawings to say Fiore is continental. Fiore is a fraction of size of Ishar, it's meant to be shown as a regular country.

Aldo's power might very well be country level when he tries his best, but nothing shows that he used that strength against Gajeel.
 

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Yea, he's multi city level in size. I don't think you realize how big a REAL island is (I'm not talking of the tiny islands here, I'm talking of ones which form small countries). His area (from top view) would be, say 20 cities like ones he had. That would still be multi city, not island.

Those mountains aren't really big. They're hills.

The good guys were able to see Gajeel fighting Aldoron. They could see his form. This is impossible if he's actually island sized, that would be too large for you to comprehend.
--- Double Post Merged, ---



Lol, your doing calcs based on drawings to say Fiore is continental. Fiore is a fraction of size of Ishar, it's meant to be shown as a regular country.

Aldo's power might very well be country level when he tries his best, but nothing shows that he used that strength against Gajeel.
Those calculations are based off a canon map and number to scale them from lol. 370km is the distance between Hargeon and Magnolia.

Magnolia to Hargeon is 370km -> 934/53*370 = 6520.4km
It's easy to get an estimate to the size of Fiore by using the the distance between Hargeon and Fiore as a scale. Warrod's tree feat (2000km tree inside Fiore) only reinforces the numbers given from the calcs as well. The FT planet has been proven to be much bigger than Earth as it houses several super continents on only one side of Earthland.

Aldo leveled a country sized area with a casual stomp lmao. He doesn't need try his best as he was casually able to do so and Gajeel scales to that casual stomp.
--- Double Post Merged, ---

Calling those mountains hills is just straight downplay too. Those are clearly mountains he dwarfs and were stated to be mountains as well lmao.
 
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GL_Nova

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Not really sure. In the anime it's shown that Wall was seen hacking the etherion. The satellite orbiting the earth was seen. But I dont know why they didnt do it long time ago :hmm
Where did you get that out of him forming the magical seal? We see the formulae for the spell, but none of the council’s mechanisms.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

no, it's not.

Zeref literally agreed that one of the main reasons they never invaded was because of Etherion and Faces


I don't really care about nitpicking some hypothetical scenarios. Etherion was one of the biggest threats to them which is flat out stated by Zeref. why would that be the case if August and Irene (especially Zeref) is beyond that???

Etherion makes countries disappear (Fiore is a country).

Wall probably hacked Etherion since Etherion was neutralized and hence was vulnerable and even if he did that doesn't mean his Etherion equals the one from the councils because Wall's Etherion beam comes from his hand, not a satellite above Earth. all he did is getting necessary components to cast Etherion.

besides, he would have used it against dying Laxus so I guess Laxus is beyond continental when healthy :cookiehand

Wall's Etherion is, at best, stronger than Jupiter cannon.

plus, if Wall's Etherion was really like the councils then he would have killed everyone in Fiore, including his own comrades.

the fact remains that none of the Spriggans have fire power that equals the destructive capacity of Etherion.

there is a reason why Mavis used an example of Etherion for Fairy Heart because Etherion is the most destructive (and impressive) spell in the series.

August needed to use suicidal spell to effect Fiore (a country) and even that is under a question because dude was going through some mental breakdown so what he said probably isn't even true.

according to Mavis, it would destroy Magnolia and it can be defended from if you put your MP strictly to defense (kinda bad it messed up with Mavis' telepathy because it would be sick to see how Romeo tanks continental attack :teehee)


and even if you accept that, August is way beyond Wall and August's strongest spell (suicidal)>>>> Wall's strongest spell

if Wall is casual country destroyer and August needs a suicidal spell while Irene needs prep time, why is Wall not up there with them???

oh and Aldoron is a very, very, very small "country" sized which isn't really country sized, not Fiore sized so Brandish cannot increase someones size to Fiore size :yodawg:yodawg:yodawg

plus, casual Natsu was melting Domus Flau after 1 year time skip which can house a town and there are five towns on Aldoron.

EDIT: images sometimes don't work for some reason :-_-
You mean where he corrects Ajeel that while it was a factor because they would sufffer damage as well it didn’t matter to them as they were now. The only difference being Zeref going all in on his dark plan. Which is a far cry from only being held back because of the Etherion blast. Not that either downplays the impressive nature of the blast. I mean it’s a recurring Mashima theme. That being said.

All the rest of this is headcannon. Now the idea is that instead I’d generating his own weapon with his how power he hacked Etherion for a weaker blast? None of that headcannon makes sense. If he was taking over the council’s weapon it would have been mentioned or shown to some capacity. An the idea that there’s an editor’s note in the volume itself to get across how much power Wahl is generating here it doesn’t make narrative sense. Especially with the added caveat of somehow using the actual Etherion canon and for some reason fireing a weaker blast. An yes, being as Brandish was quite clear that all of the Spriggan are at least as strong as she is, along with their being several country level spells used throughout the Alvarez arc. That and him being powerful enough to create another Spriggan tier character to be chosen as a Spriggan representative on a raid team. Since he made a point of calculating all his attacks against Laxus, and this is his response to Laxus surviving past the perceived time. I do feel confident arguing that Wahl decided he needed to use an Etherion to ensure Laxus died, since his organs failing wasnt enough. What would you conclude from that bro?


Speaking of, why do people ignore the part where August clearly says he abandoned his original power and didn’t use it. He didn’t know how to really even use Ars Magia, and even using it on a whim, weakened, he had enough power to effortlessly disintegrate Fiore. An while the First Master is quite smart. The 5th master was right there and clarified that he didn’t run out of anything, he stopped the spell. The idea that a healthy Wahl’s best spell is a country lvl magic. An thata weakened August and a weakened Irene can both cast spells like that effortlessly. (2 for Irene, 1 for August) That tracks with them being essentially a tier above them. I’m not sure why it’s such a big leap for people that when Mashima wrote Etherion, he meant it. An then passed up the chance to walk it back.

I mean I think by now Aldoron has easily earned his tiering. An it matches what’s needed to back up the statement he and the other Dragon Gods rival Acnologia. Lifting oceans effortlessly on half power, and these casually destructive steps. Can’t wait for the others. Though hopefully better henchmen than fish and the disappointing Seeds.
 

Kurumi Tokisaki

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Speaking of, why do people ignore the part where August clearly says he abandoned his original power and didn’t use it. He didn’t know how to really even use Ars Magia, and even using it on a whim, weakened, he had enough power to effortlessly disintegrate Fiore. An while the First Master is quite smart. The 5th master was right there and clarified that he didn’t run out of anything, he stopped the spell. The idea that a healthy Wahl’s best spell is a country lvl magic. An thata weakened August and a weakened Irene can both cast spells like that effortlessly. (2 for Irene, 1 for August) That tracks with them being essentially a tier above them. I’m not sure why it’s such a big leap for people that when Mashima wrote Etherion, he meant it. An then passed up the chance to walk it back.
Don't bring in your headcanons into this. It was never an effortless spell for neither Irene nor August. Irene needed prep time to cast Universe One and August needed a suicide spell to cast Args Magia. Needing to commit suicide to achieve is hardly effortlessly. Whal never fired his Etherion so anything you tell about his power is nothing but headcanon. He could have fired a lesser version of it. Firing council Etherion would end up killing him as well. That's why he quickly removed the Laxus Barrier because he didn't wanted to taken out by his own attack.
 

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There is no lesser version of Etherion or eben another version. The one Wall used was the exact same as the council. I don't think Wall needed Etherion to finish Laxus tho lol. It was just a display of power.

And U1 was pretty effortless. The cast time was minimal and it didn't even tax her magic. In Dragon Form she could most likely do it instanously seeing as her magical AoE is multi planetary (note this is AoE not DC).

August suicide spell was capable of vaping Fiore of the map which would yield a much higher result of energy than just simply destroying it as well.
 

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It's headcanon to think that the Etherion Wahl is using is a weaker version of Etherion. We've only ever had one Etherion, and there are no statements that say there are multiple. I bet Wahl would use a country level blast from Etherion if he charged it up enough.
 

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Don't bring in your headcanons into this. It was never an effortless spell for neither Irene nor August. Irene needed prep time to cast Universe One and August needed a suicide spell to cast Args Magia. Needing to commit suicide to achieve is hardly effortlessly. Whal never fired his Etherion so anything you tell about his power is nothing but headcanon. He could have fired a lesser version of it. Firing council Etherion would end up killing him as well. That's why he quickly removed the Laxus Barrier because he didn't wanted to taken out by his own attack.
Prep time of a few minutes for Universe One, while also holding off Acnologia. Then her meteor. An Is there a part where it says he had to die? It was the fact that he wasn’t familiar with the Magic not a power limit issue. An even if he fired a smaller AOE as shown during Tower arc, the power released from Etherion remains the same despite the focus of the beam. So the only headcannon is suddenly placing a non existent limit on a magic we already know.
 
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