Discussion The Four Knights of The Apocalypse Thread

[Tristan]

You are focusing way too much on that Annihilation power, it's not everything. Tristan is the Knight of Pestilence, it's not tied to that kind of destruction in general.

It is actually! Look, the fact that Percival is a Life Spirit has everything to do with him being the Knight of Death! It is the power of a L.S that gives Life force through Hope, and Death through Despair.
Tristan is neither like his dad nor is he like his mom, he is HIMSELF ... a Nephilim:

Annihilation is the power special to him as a Nephilim according to Gawain:

Schwarz confirmed that by calling it (Annihilation) a "Nephilim's Power"

You are focusing way too much on that Annihilation power, it's not everything.

It's Tristan's plot as a Nephilim that focuses too much on Annihilation, not me!

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 25, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 25, 2024 ---

Tristan is the Knight of Pestilence, it's not tied to that kind of destruction in general.

How do you know??
The term "Plague" shouldn't be limited to just diseases or epidemics. It generally means any kind of disaster inflicted on a massive scale as a Divine Punishment (Nakaba uses Biblical context and references quite often!)
If you deny this, then you have to explain how come the 10 disasters that inflicted ancient Egypt happened to be called "10 Plagues of Egypt"!

Second, even if we accept the interpretation of Plague as disease, then this doesn't change anything since the phenomenon of Annihilation is known for producing Gamma radiation which causes many lethal diseases in fact:

 

[Demonspeed]

It is actually! Look, the fact that Percival is a Life Spirit has everything to do with him being the Knight of Death! It is the power of a L.S that gives Life force through Hope, and Death through Despair.
Tristan is neither like his dad nor is he like his mom, he is HIMSELF ... a Nephilim:

Annihilation is the power special to him as a Nephilim according to Gawain:

Schwarz confirmed that by calling it (Annihilation) a "Nephilim's Power"

It's Tristan's plot as a Nephilim that focuses too much on Annihilation, not me!

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 25, 2024, Original Post Date: Jan 25, 2024 ---

How do you know??
The term "Plague" shouldn't be limited to just diseases or epidemics. It generally means any kind of disaster inflicted on a massive scale as a Divine Punishment (Nakaba uses Biblical context and references quite often!)
If you deny this, then you have to explain how come the 10 disasters that inflicted ancient Egypt happened to be called "10 Plagues of Egypt"!

Second, even if we accept the interpretation of Plague as disease, then this doesn't change anything since the phenomenon of Annihilation is known for producing Gamma radiation which causes many lethal diseases in fact:

This is a case by case thing. Percival's attributes which make of him the Knight of Death don't apply to the others the same way.

I said that Pestilence isn't about that kind of destruction in general and it's true. You are talking about it as if it was a sci-fi series or had heavy elements from these kind of series. Nakaba isn't going to suddenly focus on science so heavily for his case only.

Tristan is a Nephilim and he has that Annihilation technique but that's not all there is to him and it's certainly not the foundation of everything. Pretty much all of his techniques are sky/stars themed and his actual Magic is named Nova, not Annihilation. He has a stars theme just like Lancelot and Gawain have a moon and sun theme respectively.

For Gawain I can see a link between the sun and Famine, there is her personality to consider as well, but how are stars and the moon linked to Pestilence and War? They aren't. Unless if you want to try really hard to find the slightest link, which isn't how Nakaba operates.

Each of them simply have several elements which are part of their characters. For that destruction that you are talking about the Death or War title would be more fitting, but he is neither.

The destructive side of him is more in line with his demonic nature which he inherited from Meliodas, not his title of Knight of Pestilence.

 

[Yakkun]

Bro is talking about thermodynamics when they have not even invented the blunderbus yet

 

[Tristan]

Bro is talking about thermodynamics when they have not even invented the blunderbus yet

Oh really! Thanks goodness we had @Vortigern and many other fans (in Reddit) refer to this point of (Annihilation in Physics) before I did!

The idea is very simple. We've seen how the collision of Light & Darkness in Tristan's case resulted in Destruction. And I assumed that there is a high chance that if Tristan can bring his Light & Dark power to harmony, they could result in the opposite: something like Reconstruction / Creation.
Is this far-fetched or baseless? Absolutely not!
We've seen Arthur who harnesses the power of Chaos (aka an entity of Darkness & Light) Annihilated parts of Britannia and using them to "build /create) in Camelot. The same feat he used when he visited Liones last time using the debris from the destroyed ground and houses to create stairs:

This is in principle what the "power of Stars" in NnT: Origin did ... no?

 

[Yakkun]

Not sure if talking about the respective platoons would warrant a whole new thread since they are kinda attachments to the 4KotA, so i'll just post my thoughts here:

With the recent introduction of Bors as a new character and the current goings-on with Myrtle in the fairy king forest, do you think these characters might permanently join the good guys as well as Nakaba bringing in even more "side characters" like these until there are enough assembled for Gawain and Lancelot to have their own platoons as well? Also, there is still the empty spot Jade left in the Tristan platoon that I reckon will eventually filled up as well.

 

[Demonspeed]

I don't see Lancelot or Gawain getting a platoon. Lancelot is probably not interested and Gawain would probably only be willing to lead a group of female knights or something.

I'd say Percival and Tristan to a lesser extent are people who attract others with their personalities while Lancelot and Gawain are more introverted and don't want to bother with stuff like this. Perhaps Nakaba took this into account and that's why he put the emphasis on Percival-Lancelot and Tristan-Gawain as duos among the KoAs.

I still believe that Jade will probably be replaced by Dreydrin.

 

[Yakkun]

I don't see Lancelot or Gawain getting a platoon. Lancelot is probably not interested and Gawain would probably only be willing to lead a group of female knights or something.

I'd say Percival and Tristan to a lesser extent are people who attract others with their personalities while Lancelot and Gawain are more introverted and don't want to bother with stuff like this. Perhaps Nakaba took this into account and that's why he put the emphasis on Percival-Lancelot and Tristan-Gawain as duos among the KoAs.

I still believe that Jade will probably be replaced by Dreydrin.

Lancelot I am not sure about. Lancelot certainly doesn't want a fanboy/girl squad and he doesn't suffer fools. He does however like to have friends. If he met people he would genuinely click with, I think he would be fine if they followed him. He might be the current top dog among the KotA but he doesn't really advertise it. He is super chill about how far ahead he is and doesn't brag. So he isn't out with the need of constant attention or evaluation, he's just fine having people who like him for who he is, he doesn't want or need worshippers. Just some genuine friends.

Gawain was mostly acting aloof, somewhat secretive and also a bit isolationist at first but recently she has begun to open up to the idea of other people genuinely liking her as a friend and she also begins to like other people more. There is still hope for her to be alright. Her squad doesn't necessarily have to be all female either because she obviously respects capable and strong people. As long as she is seen as the boss woman here I think she'd be fine.

Dreydrin joining would be something I'd love to see as well.

 

[Mighty Escanor]

Not sure if talking about the respective platoons would warrant a whole new thread since they are kinda attachments to the 4KotA, so i'll just post my thoughts here:

With the recent introduction of Bors as a new character and the current goings-on with Myrtle in the fairy king forest, do you think these characters might permanently join the good guys as well as Nakaba bringing in even more "side characters" like these until there are enough assembled for Gawain and Lancelot to have their own platoons as well? Also, there is still the empty spot Jade left in the Tristan platoon that I reckon will eventually filled up as well.

FOUR teams of FOUR, led by the FOUR knights, that's to be expected from Nakaba tbh!

So you think only of who joins them, but what about another major loss? Percy, Anne, Nascien is still a problematic triangle. The death flag is still there. It can even be tied to the problem of where to find and how to contact Percy's soul. Not sure about it, but won't rule it out either.

 

[Yakkun]

FOUR teams of FOUR, led by the FOUR knights, that's to be expected from Nakaba tbh!

So you think only of who joins them, but what about another major loss? Percy, Anne, Nascien is still a problematic triangle. The death flag is still there. It can even be tied to the problem of where to find and how to contact Percy's soul. Not sure about it, but won't rule it out either.

I don't see another impactful loss like that, at least not with the already introduced platoon members. They are all too cemented into the story now, especially post timeskip.

 

[Demonspeed]

Percival is back stronger now. Do you think he is still the weakest of the quartet at the moment? And now that he is back who do you think will be the next KoA to appear? I am honestly surprised that none of them appeared before him.

 

[Tristan]

Percival is back stronger now. Do you think he is still the weakest of the quartet at the moment? And now that he is back who do you think will be the next KoA to appear? I am honestly surprised that none of them appeared before him.

I would say Gwain is next with the Celestial realm arc. Mael may have been teaching her how to use Sun power in the past two years

 

[Yakkun]

Percival is back stronger now. Do you think he is still the weakest of the quartet at the moment? And now that he is back who do you think will be the next KoA to appear? I am honestly surprised that none of them appeared before him.

No, I don't think so. I actually think Gawain may be (as much as that pains me to admit). She was the most likely to just quit this whole 4KotA prophecy thing because she never fully identified as a part of that "team" (they aren't really a team but they have definitely grown closer with each other towards the end of the first part of this manga.).

So after Percival departed his soul the prophecy kinda fell apart. She is the most likely to just disappear and do her own thing and it might not be necessarily training or mastering anything in particular. First, because she is still trying to find out who she is and what her background is, something the other three don't need to do or do not have as pressing as a priority for now (Percival might develop an interest in this in the future about who his body originally was, who knows). Second, her ego. She has been put in her place before and seen that other people are as strong and stronger than her but deep down she might still feel like she is the best there is. It might not really drive her as much to improve on herself. People like Tristan have that drive constantly, as a contrast.

I think Gawain may currently be the weakest right now. And if theories are correct, she is probably heavily tied to Merlin, maybe Escanor and even perhaps to Worreldane OR Beltreipe. Some of this stuff will likely only be relevant much further down in the story so it is not her time to shine just yet. She may even be kept for last, just like Escanor was over a long time in NNT.


The next KotA to appear will, in my opinion, be Tristan. Likely because he is theorized to be in prison.

 

[Samael Morningstar]

New Ranking
1. Percival
2. Lancelot
3. Gawain
4. Tristan

 

[Demonspeed]

I think Gawain is the most likely to be at Liones and will appear first. Then Lancelot then Tristan. They are worried about Tristan because they don't know where he is so they can probably contact them. Tristan will probably appear last on a last page or something.

 

[Yakkun]

I think Gawain is the most likely to be at Liones and will appear first. Then Lancelot then Tristan. They are worried about Tristan because they don't know where he is so they can probably contact them. Tristan will probably appear last on a last page or something.

Is there a reason why you think Gawain stays at Liones? Didn't she tell Meliodas she doesn't quite consider herself their ally and may even betray them?

 

[Demonspeed]

Is there a reason why you think Gawain stays at Liones? Didn't she tell Meliodas she doesn't quite consider herself their ally and may even betray them?

The power of friendship got to her in the Demon Realm arc and no matter what she says she is part of the quartet. With Percival dead, Tristan apparently lost and whatever Lancelot is doing I think it would be weird to have none of the KoAs at Liones.

 

[Ann Firestar]

Is there a reason why you think Gawain stays at Liones? Didn't she tell Meliodas she doesn't quite consider herself their ally and may even betray them?

Who says that she stayed willingly?
They lost 2 out of 4 4KotA. And while Lancelot is with his parents and is protected, Gawain literally has nowhere else safe to go to.
It would make sense if Meliodas and Elizabeth prohibited her to leave the city after Tristans disappearance.
I think it would work nice as a reason to bring up her life in Camelot, considering she wasn’t allowed to leave there too.
Thought she’s quite an escape artist, so that rule probably won’t hold her for long.

 

[Yakkun]

The power of friendship got to her in the Demon Realm arc and no matter what she says she is part of the quartet. With Percival dead, Tristan apparently lost and whatever Lancelot is doing I think it would be weird to have none of the KoAs at Liones.

Who says that she stayed willingly?
They lost 2 out of 4 4KotA. And while Lancelot is with his parents and is protected, Gawain literally has nowhere else safe to go to.
It would make sense if Meliodas and Elizabeth prohibited her to leave the city after Tristans disappearance.
I think it would work nice as a reason to bring up her life in Camelot, considering she wasn’t allowed to leave there too.
Thought she’s quite an escape artist, so that rule probably won’t hold her for long.

Well, I am fine with almost any scenario, and you two do have valid points of course. I am just keeping open to the scenario that Gawain is back to being on her own because I imagine Percival's death hit everyone in that group pretty hard. Plus, the situation with Camelot further escalated so overall there is a general "shit hits the fan"-vibe hanging in the air and you can also see that in how Donny and Anne changed. Some of that can be attributed to overall maturity but they do not really fuck around anymore. Anne asks extremely pointed questions now that she knows how her power works and is a general "no nonsense" person, even more so than in the past. Even resident joker Donny seems more serious now. Nasiens stayed with Percival's body but it is clear that the occasional episode of despair got to them as well.

I can only imagine what that means for the other 4KotA. It seems Lancelot was hit the hardest but I don't think Gawain just shrugged it off either even if she wasn't so close with Percival. If anything she might relapse into distancing herself again because the flower of friendship was just about to start budding at the end of the first part, then Perci dies and that might've just nipped it in the bud. Literally. All that trust that is riding on opening yourself to comrades and developing friendship maybe has evaporated for her the moment Pericval decided to nope himself out of existence. There is a legit possibility that she thought afterwards that she was indeed better off alone. If only so she is spared the pain of having to remember Percival's death by staying with that group and also because no one sees her vulnarable like that.

Tristan is the person she had the closest connection to but we do not know the circumstances of his disappearance. Gawain may stay in Liones in order to find him or Tristan disappeared only after Gawain left the group first because he felt like the group fully fell apart and his self-imposed knight code only made him shoulder the burden, especially since it is his home kingdom that is at war with Camelot first and foremost. There is that possibility but I guess we will learn soon.

 

[Vortigern]

I doubt Gawain is in Liones because her and Lancelot were apparently not taking part in the search for Tristan. Anne and Donny went on a scouting mission to Camelot and the latter also mentioned that Isolde and Chion were looking for Tristan too, but there was no mention of the other two KotA. Lancelot is Tristan's long-term friend and Gawain got along with her fellow washout as well, so why would they be sitting out the search if they were available? Their absence is also reinforced by the fact that Meliodas had to send Gowther to watch over Anne and Donny even though both Lancelot and Gawain would have wanted to keep the two safe. I think something has happened to both Lancelot and Gawain, but it's apparently not anything urgent like Tristan's sudden disappearance and potential imprisonment.

Ban mentioned that Lancelot was strongly affected by Percival's death and was holed up in his room crying all day, which could explain his situation. He wouldn't really be in any shape to participate in the war against Camelot, but at the same time his life wouldn't be in immediate danger either. Gawain's current status is a complete mystery, but I could see her simply leaving Liones after it looked like the KotA prophecy was a dud. During her conversation with Mortlach she brought up some questions she had about her origins and identity, so perhaps she decided to go search for answers on her own? This would have left Tristan as the sole remaining KotA who then eventually succumbed to the pressure, bit off more than he could chew and presumably got himself captured. Essentially, Percival's death would have more or less doomed the whole group.

What I really like about this scenario is that it would put Percival into a position where he could establish himself as the de facto leader of the KotA by being the one who got the gang back together again. It would be a nice parallel to how Meliodas gathered up the Sins at the start of in NnT. What's more, Percival bringing Lancelot back to Liones would mirror the way that he himself was originally picked up and escorted to the kingdom by Lancelot, essentially bringing things full circle between the two of them. Perhaps something similar could also happen with Gawain and Tristan if Gawain were to be found first? We never learned the circumstances behind how Tristan recruited Gawain, so an inversion of that situation would be a golden opportunity for Nakaba to give us a flashback of that trip. Gawain being the next KotA to appear post-timeskip would be a good way to allow her to catch up in terms of screentime as well as giving her a chance to bond with Percival a bit more.

 

[Yakkun]

I doubt Gawain is in Liones because her and Lancelot were apparently not taking part in the search for Tristan. Anne and Donny went on a scouting mission to Camelot and the latter also mentioned that Isolde and Chion were looking for Tristan too, but there was no mention of the other two KotA. Lancelot is Tristan's long-term friend and Gawain got along with her fellow washout as well, so why would they be sitting out the search if they were available? Their absence is also reinforced by the fact that Meliodas had to send Gowther to watch over Anne and Donny even though both Lancelot and Gawain would have wanted to keep the two safe. I think something has happened to both Lancelot and Gawain, but it's apparently not anything urgent like Tristan's sudden disappearance and potential imprisonment.

Ban mentioned that Lancelot was strongly affected by Percival's death and was holed up in his room crying all day, which could explain his situation. He wouldn't really be in any shape to participate in the war against Camelot, but at the same time his life wouldn't be in immediate danger either. Gawain's current status is a complete mystery, but I could see her simply leaving Liones after it looked like the KotA prophecy was a dud. During her conversation with Mortlach she brought up some questions she had about her origins and identity, so perhaps she decided to go search for answers on her own? This would have left Tristan as the sole remaining KotA who then eventually succumbed to the pressure, bit off more than he could chew and presumably got himself captured. Essentially, Percival's death would have more or less doomed the whole group.

What I really like about this scenario is that it would put Percival into a position where he could establish himself as the de facto leader of the KotA by being the one who got the gang back together again. It would be a nice parallel to how Meliodas gathered up the Sins at the start of in NnT. What's more, Percival bringing Lancelot back to Liones would mirror the way that he himself was originally picked up and escorted to the kingdom by Lancelot, essentially bringing things full circle between the two of them. Perhaps something similar could also happen with Gawain and Tristan if Gawain were to be found first? We never learned the circumstances behind how Tristan recruited Gawain, so an inversion of that situation would be a golden opportunity for Nakaba to give us a flashback of that trip. Gawain being the next KotA to appear post-timeskip would be a good way to allow her to catch up in terms of screentime as well as giving her a chance to bond with Percival a bit more.

This is exactly along my line of thinking as well. Percival will reunite the group again but I think Nakaba will keep Gawain for last or second to last.