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Chapter Tower of God Chapter 456 Spoilers & Discussion

Jubei_Kibagami

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Going back to the very early bit of S1. We see flowers. Dowon might be the promised Heroine
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

What chapter is this for references' sake and context?
 

Jubei_Kibagami

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That first panel, the carving to the right of the obvious flowers you highlighted - that looks like a snake being wrapped in flowers...

but the artwork in chapter 1 seems to also have rando monsters, fighters, rivers/waterfalls, mountains, and a cherry blossom tree. So it's all over the place.

btw, who is the FIRST character shown in the whole series? In the prologue where Headon is saying 'what do you desire...' and it shows someone with jewels... we see what is clearly Hats, AA, Rak, Anak, and so on, but who is that first person? Rachel?
 

toil

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btw, who is the FIRST character shown in the whole series? In the prologue where Headon is saying 'what do you desire...' and it shows someone with jewels... we see what is clearly Hats, AA, Rak, Anak, and so on, but who is that first person? Rachel?
From memory, isn't it the anima girl who winds up disappearing after S1?

EDIT: I looked and am 99% sure it's the tiny little anima girl (who's gone absentee after S1).

Any SIU scholars here know if she was more-prominent in that pre-naver "first draft" of S1?

--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Going back to the very early bit of S1. We see flowers. Dowon might be the promised Heroine
That's a sick, sick find (in the best possible sense). I especially like that the flowers are "over, maybe around" the snake-like steel eel cage.

Seriously well-spotted.
 

Jubei_Kibagami

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Well, um, whoever it was that spotted that....
 

Sade Morte

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I don't think LPB family is restricted to these beast types, but that only the special branches can summon these sacred beasts. Such as Elaine's Fenrir being a rare trait only she was able to. Fenrir might be actually one of these beasts then, but not everything the LPB summons is one.

LPB FH reminds me of Budha and the 12 animals that visited him to pay respects. Those were the 12 chinese zodiac Animals, which in some cultures (i.e. Vietnamese) has cat in Tiger's place If I'm not mistaken. Thinking like this sets the hype a little, cause there might be a Dragon branch somewhere lol. But I think the absolute majority of LPBs and the things they summon are not within these sacred beasts' scope. Fenrir is special in several ways, many unique abilities stacked, can't even be targetted and don't require a bowl. That Fox is rare but can't even begin to compare to these. Neither bull or whatever else we saw being summoned.



Androssi said explicitly that its her stepfather. Its not a tool, its a skill by the guy that took Androssi in. Its weird but I think that's exactly because its a sacred beast, and Just like Fenrir it has skills in combo with the anima.

Fenrir could switch places with Elaine and is untouchable. Snake Charmer's body can split into several snakes and reform elsewhere. Imo these are both sacred beast types of skills, game Winner skills that kept Elaine even as a mere regular undefeated for thousands of years.
--- Double Post Merged, ---

There's definitely a toad there, which might be the sacred beast from Frok dude's branch (but not his lame toad, a rare trait he likely hadn't). Likewise the Fox might be from the Wolf family, Just not THE sacred beast, but a smaller art such as Gaara's bro compared to Sasori.

Things I see at that pic(LPBFH):
Deer
Goat
Shark
Toad
Furry (lion's mane?)
A tall scaled being (Snake? Dragon?)
White rabbit (another Budha reference, having nothing to offer the rabbit jumped in the fire and so Budha would have his meat as sacrifice)
This is what makes Snake charmer seem more like a tool or an artificial life form:

(To friends of Data Yu Han Sung in the quarantine area) "That's probably.. because of my uniqueness. I am both and all, an individual that both exist and does not exist. I am merely a 'strand of countless lives', now let the hunting begin."
 

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The white but was nice but I am not exactly clear on how that is helpful to hatsu. i do think white is talking about hatsu's shinsoo quality rather than any physical sword he has.
 

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The white but was nice but I am not exactly clear on how that is helpful to hatsu. i do think white is talking about hatsu's shinsoo quality rather than any physical sword he has.
I don't think White was trying to be helpful. It seemed more like a 'lol git gud u pleb' critique, with some cryptic 'advice' that isn't actually meant to teach Hatsu anything. It'll be up to him to glean something useful out of White's trolling, if he can.
 
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Jack Van Burace

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I don't think White was trying to be helpful. It seemed more like a 'lol git gud u pleb' critique, with some cryptic 'advice' that isn't actually meant to teach Hatsu anything. It'll be up to him to glean something useful out of White's trolling, if he can.
Knowing Hatsu is friends with the protagonist and good guy, we know he is gonna make a breakthrough and surprise everyone by being the first non Arie to use (albeit not in same level) the Arie Swordmanship.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Rak shown us that Arie Swordmanship isn't that broken per se, with Inieta having a hard time against him. Hatsu would only get a higher ceiling If he got Arie knowledge working, meaning he could grow into It, not an instant broken skill.
 

King Dryst

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Knowing Hatsu is friends with the protagonist and good guy, we know he is gonna make a breakthrough and surprise everyone by being the first non Arie to use (albeit not in same level) the Arie Swordmanship.
I mean, Baam already did it so...
 

Wha

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Bam countered Arie moves, not really copy It.
After being attacked from Bam, White said that this is his swordcraft and that Viole should stop imitating his sword (or something like that)
He even read his swordplay (which is said to be impossible) in the same chapter (273)
 

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Yeah, but does Baam really count? He copies all the things.
 

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Bam was able to respond to hoaquin's swordsmanship but at the time he also had access to real arie swordsmanship due to the power of souls which also had arie souls.
 

Jack Van Burace

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Bam was able to respond to hoaquin's swordsmanship but at the time he also had access to real arie swordsmanship due to the power of souls which also had arie souls.
So there we have It: without the Power of the souls nobody yet can wield Arie Swordmanship. Hatsu might become the first.
 

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So there we have It: without the Power of the souls nobody yet can wield Arie Swordmanship. Hatsu might become the first.
Based on the lore hatz could indeed learn arie swordsmanship. He just would be unable to use it as well as actual arie family direct descendants. TBH I don't expect hatz to ever match arie swordsmanship. I've never seen the story head in such a direction, it'd be contrary to the lore and ultimately it's not even important to the plot. Hatz can be a strong fighter and ally to bam, given enough time of course, without him coming up with something better than arie swordsmanship. I would maintain the most important part about this is hatz learning his shinsoo qualities. Even if its not sword related he will get an important shinsoo boost which will translate to him being stronger in general. And if it is a sword then its going to be a massive upgrade. And it could be something quite OP as well. Though I'd maintain that hatz getting something which is a match to real arie swordsmanship is contrary to the lore and should be about impossible.
 

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Based on the lore hatz could indeed learn arie swordsmanship. He just would be unable to use it as well as actual arie family direct descendants. TBH I don't expect hatz to ever match arie swordsmanship. I've never seen the story head in such a direction, it'd be contrary to the lore and ultimately it's not even important to the plot. Hatz can be a strong fighter and ally to bam, given enough time of course, without him coming up with something better than arie swordsmanship. I would maintain the most important part about this is hatz learning his shinsoo qualities. Even if its not sword related he will get an important shinsoo boost which will translate to him being stronger in general. And if it is a sword then its going to be a massive upgrade. And it could be something quite OP as well. Though I'd maintain that hatz getting something which is a match to real arie swordsmanship is contrary to the lore and should be about impossible.
Imo, Arie and Swordmanship is like Arlene and Sorcery: others can learn and become OP with It, such as Sachi and Levi could own lots of people with those skills, but nothing compared to what Arlene and Bam can do. Arie descendants should be unbeatable in their game, but others could greatly benefit by learning them like What happens with Sorcery.

I maintain that Swordmastership and Sorcery are likely special positions still unnanounced as such. And that Hatsu Will have such special position, in a way to not overlap with other Scouts.
 

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Imo, Arie and Swordmanship is like Arlene and Sorcery: others can learn and become OP with It, such as Sachi and Levi could own lots of people with those skills, but nothing compared to what Arlene and Bam can do. Arie descendants should be unbeatable in their game, but others could greatly benefit by learning them like What happens with Sorcery.

I maintain that Swordmastership and Sorcery are likely special positions still unnanounced as such. And that Hatsu Will have such special position, in a way to not overlap with other Scouts.
There's a lot of assumptions in there... We still don't even know if spellcasting is directly related to shinsoo. Or what arlen's or v's talents were at shinsoo. But yeah, hatz would undeniably benefit from arie swordsmanship. But the fact remains that him mastering it without being a direct descendant would be against the lore. And him surpassing arie swordsmanship would be kinda against the lore as well. Of course, that doesn't mean hatz will never beat an arie in combat. It will just take hatz being a lot stronger than the arie in question to barely pull a win or have something else going for him. Like an ignition weapon or some sort of special shinsoo quality.

As for swordsmanship... It's hard to imagine why there would be a need to create a position for it. As in, why classify a swordsman as a swordman rather than as a fisherman or scout? Granted positions can be weird at times, like guide, but at least that one is sufficiently different that it doesn't quite fit into anything else. At least to me it's hard to imagine a type of swordsmanship that would break someone out of a fisherman/scout mold.
 

zikhali

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There's a lot of assumptions in there... We still don't even know if spellcasting is directly related to shinsoo. Or what arlen's or v's talents were at shinsoo. But yeah, hatz would undeniably benefit from arie swordsmanship. But the fact remains that him mastering it without being a direct descendant would be against the lore. And him surpassing arie swordsmanship would be kinda against the lore as well. Of course, that doesn't mean hatz will never beat an arie in combat. It will just take hatz being a lot stronger than the arie in question to barely pull a win or have something else going for him. Like an ignition weapon or some sort of special shinsoo quality.

As for swordsmanship... It's hard to imagine why there would be a need to create a position for it. As in, why classify a swordsman as a swordman rather than as a fisherman or scout? Granted positions can be weird at times, like guide, but at least that one is sufficiently different that it doesn't quite fit into anything else. At least to me it's hard to imagine a type of swordsmanship that would break someone out of a fisherman/scout mold.
Doesn't the wiki say Adori and Jahad royal guards learn Arie swordmanship, it's possible for Hatz but he won't bend any space that's my take. It will improve his overall power and control over shinsoo while using a sword which it's said to be difficult to wield a sword the higher you go.
 
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