Chapter Tower of God Chapter 478 Spoilers & Discussion

The Crypts

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Apr 7, 2020
Messages
42
Reaction score
68
Age
22
Country
Nigeria
I usually disagree with many of the critics of SIU's choices in creating TOG's setup and many of the plot points, but for the first time, I completely agree with the critics of Bam's performance in this fight.

The very reason for his training for the past 2 years is to get to a level where he could challenge Kallavan. That's the only qualification he's got for making use of a considerable amount of FUG's key resources to attempt an almost impossible rescue of his master Jinsung. And his performance in the fight against Kallavan shows how unqualified he is. Sowo is right, he has no basis, no qualification, no right to ask FUG to make such incredible sacrifices, to risk the loss of 3 Slayers in order to satisfy an underperforming and underachieving individual like him.

Bam possesses the bloodline of 2 GWs, the power of the God of the outside, the power of 2 thorns, 2 administrator-like beings, and most importantly he is an Irregular, an existence who is not bound by the usual tower rules and contract restrictions. Even Jahad's data considered him very unique (IIRC), so even among Irregulars, he is supposed to be special. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Hence, it makes no sense to me that Evankhell, a powerful, and the notorious warrior would train him for the purpose of taking on Kallavan, consider his training completed, then have to rush to his aid the moment he faces off the very individual he was trained to overcome. It smacks of a ridiculous level of incompetence. Both he and Evankhell faced Kallavan in the past, have a clear understanding that he defeated a powerful ancient warrior like Jinsung, so understand how difficult a challenge he is. Why he would choose to challenge the Nest and Kallavan at this point given his abysmal performance in the fight is incomprehensible. If Kallavan brought the full force of his power to bear, Bam would be dead already. His performance is even worse when you consider that he's got a virtually unkillable character as his tank. It is difficult to understand SIU's decision to paint him in such a light, and I would hope that those who can communicate with him on his blog raise this question.

Disappointing.
 

brzytki

Registered User
中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2019
Messages
227
Reaction score
550
Age
31
Country
Poland


Crosspost from reddit

If you guys look closely at the attack Karaka is using vs Kallavan, it looks VERY similar to the attack Zahad used against Baam (but metallic) whereas Zahad's move looked more organic

This struck me as interesting in two ways (1) Father and Son have a very similar move pool, but potentially more interesting (2) Karaka seems to use a move that looks like a synthetic form of his Father's attack. In many stories metals and the like signify "unnatural" or "human" creations. Could this potentially hint to Karaka's origin
I've always said (and saw a few other people say something similar) that Karaka might have the same tentacles as Zahard but they are just covered by his armor.
 

shaheer

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Jul 7, 2009
Messages
3,981
Reaction score
1,896
Gender
Male
Country
Singapore
Oh? "Recently," as in just this chapter, Kallavan stated that Bam will be a threat to Jahad. That doesn't sound to me like he's calling Bam weak. Sure, he's still weaker than Kallavan, but so what? 99.99% of all rankers are weaker than Kallavan (assuming top 100 rank, 1 million rankers).
You tagged the wrong guy. But yeah both of his teachers found him weak but having potential. Even GoG thought so iirc. His friend 's who knows him as irregular finds him strong compared to them. But those who saw the 13 ie6tge ones who saw eid an and Zahard fight snapped out of how powerful Bam was compared to an irregular at that point. Ofc he trained and got better but the point is as far as comparing irregular he was sub par and we don't know now if he is on par
 

EternalWinter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2019
Messages
1,662
Reaction score
2,971
Age
30
Country
United States
You tagged the wrong guy. But yeah both of his teachers found him weak but having potential. Even GoG thought so iirc. His friend 's who knows him as irregular finds him strong compared to them. But those who saw the 13 ie6tge ones who saw eid an and Zahard fight snapped out of how powerful Bam was compared to an irregular at that point. Ofc he trained and got better but the point is as far as comparing irregular he was sub par and we don't know now if he is on par
He matched Zahad on the HF...if you're saying current Baam can't match current Zahad (as we saw when Zahad current entered the HF)....no shit

The fact remains Baam is shocking and wowing everyone atm
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I've always said (and saw a few other people say something similar) that Karaka might have the same tentacles as Zahard but they are just covered by his armor.
Very possible, still holding out for the princess theory, but looks increasingly bleak at this point
 

Turtle hunter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
1,743
Reaction score
1,610
Age
22
Country
France
Man, I really just can't stop laughing at this sentiment. It's like dying inside. How can someone lionize cowardice and surrender with a straight face? It has to be trolling.

I am at lost for words .
 

Jedikos

Registered User
上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
Joined
May 26, 2019
Messages
473
Reaction score
695
Age
22
Country
Ghana
Really at this point of the story, I guess the only thing that will make some people understand that Baam is shaming the title of irregular is when a Family Head preferably Lo Po Bia FH actually appears and insults Baam too, with comments like, ' you look too small for an irregular' , becos Gustang in my opinion needed something from Baam , he can't be exactly dissing him when he needed a favor from him, better still, he might be looking through Baam in some special lenses to grasp his irregularity.

Mind you I'm not saying Baam isn't powerful, if we were considering talent then what he did against Kallavan these past chapters are really impressive, but as it is now, what we are all being shown is "his superiority in handling shinsu and other entities in the 'Tower' ", when his said state of being an irregular must include whatever he is when he came from the 'outside'.

All the things that we praise Baam for are not what makes him an irregular, giving us feats about how he can handle objects in the tower won't cut it. The red thryssa belongs to the tower, blue ethryssa belongs to the tower, he found the thorns in the tower albeit it's origin from the outside, he uses the shinsu of the Tower, so far he only basks in such privileges of things 'handed to him' or 'found', if we are considering that only then vs Kallavan he was really impressive.


BUT his irregularity is in
1. The fact that a full fledged irregular, his own mother, calls him 'Monster' , when he was on the outside, without shinsu, without thorn, without the damned thryssa.
2. Why Baam's memory had to be wiped because of course, who knew what he could do if he remembers who he is and all his monster issues.
3. The Sun power in him that can devour administrators
4. His blessings in the tower, and how he opened the gates by himself.

So far number 4 is what we've been seeing, so yes he isn't holding up to his title at all, everyone will call him talented, but please, who will look at Baam now and say 'Hey, he is comparable to a Family Head?'

No one

Kallavan shouldve been easy pickings by now if he was actually being an irregular in all aspects and not some superior talents to the Tower's residents. Which as I should say is not boiling my blood any more. Baam is handicapped in every way and the only part we are being shown too of his talents...he has been proven incompetent in stamina, willpower and brain cells too...at least go all out Baam, but no... our author doesn't want us to think he is an irregular in actions and feats, but tossing comments here and there about how special he should be and many 'almosts' accomplishment.

It's getting tiresome, Baam should show mastery at least once...it's not too much to ask for is it?
 

Turtle hunter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
1,743
Reaction score
1,610
Age
22
Country
France
Oh, I have a few. But the mods will get angry if I speak them.
I feel you bro .
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Really at this point of the story, I guess the only thing that will make some people understand that Baam is shaming the title of irregular is when a Family Head preferably Lo Po Bia FH actually appears and insults Baam too, with comments like, ' you look too small for an irregular' , becos Gustang in my opinion needed something from Baam , he can't be exactly dissing him when he needed a favor from him, better still, he might be looking through Baam in some special lenses to grasp his irregularity.

Mind you I'm not saying Baam isn't powerful, if we were considering talent then what he did against Kallavan these past chapters are really impressive, but as it is now, what we are all being shown is "his superiority in handling shinsu and other entities in the 'Tower' ", when his said state of being an irregular must include whatever he is when he came from the 'outside'.

All the things that we praise Baam for are not what makes him an irregular, giving us feats about how he can handle objects in the tower won't cut it. The red thryssa belongs to the tower, blue ethryssa belongs to the tower, he found the thorns in the tower albeit it's origin from the outside, he uses the shinsu of the Tower, so far he only basks in such privileges of things 'handed to him' or 'found', if we are considering that only then vs Kallavan he was really impressive.


BUT his irregularity is in
1. The fact that a full fledged irregular, his own mother, calls him 'Monster' , when he was on the outside, without shinsu, without thorn, without the damned thryssa.
2. Why Baam's memory had to be wiped because of course, who knew what he could do if he remembers who he is and all his monster issues.
3. The Sun power in him that can devour administrators
4. His blessings in the tower, and how he opened the gates by himself.

So far number 4 is what we've been seeing, so yes he isn't holding up to his title at all, everyone will call him talented, but please, who will look at Baam now and say 'Hey, he is comparable to a Family Head?'

No one

Kallavan shouldve been easy pickings by now if he was actually being an irregular in all aspects and not some superior talents to the Tower's residents. Which as I should say is not boiling my blood any more. Baam is handicapped in every way and the only part we are being shown too of his talents...he has been proven incompetent in stamina, willpower and brain cells too...at least go all out Baam, but no... our author doesn't want us to think he is an irregular in actions and feats, but tossing comments here and there about how special he should be and many 'almosts' accomplishment.

It's getting tiresome, Baam should show mastery at least once...it's not too much to ask for is it?
I would agre that Baam is somewhat dumb and naïve .
--- Double Post Merged, ---

The arcs is still not finished i am hope that he does somethings after that .
--- Double Post Merged, ---

One thing that i whant to talk about is the concept of muling , does who play video games know what that is .

I am surprised that no organisation create a system where they make the climbing much more easy for those that who merit it .
 

Kr[o]cK

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
8
Reaction score
6
Age
21
Country
United Kingdom
[QUOTE="EternalWinter, post: 5238985, member: 203685"

korean raw said 1, line said 2.
Interesting ... I wonder why it changed? It's not as if numbers would be hard to translate. It makes me speculate that the Korean posts will be updated to reflect this change as well.
[/QUOTE]

Some guy on the line translation said that they admitted they got it wrong and it is lvl one
 

PlotArmouredTitan

Registered User
上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Messages
474
Reaction score
782
Age
23
Country
Nigeria
The very reason for his training for the past 2 years is to get to a level where he could challenge Kallavan. That's the only qualification he's got for making use of a considerable amount of FUG's key resources to attempt an almost impossible rescue of his master Jinsung. And his performance in the fight against Kallavan shows how unqualified he is. Sowo is right, he has no basis, no qualification, no right to ask FUG to make such incredible sacrifices, to risk the loss of 3 Slayers in order to satisfy an underperforming and underachieving individual like him.
That's my problem here, he's much stronger than he was at the last station but he still has the same stamina problems that he did or even worse. I'm really disappointed.
The entire point of having him train without the thorn was to improve his base so that he can use the thorn to full potential. But we have him gasping for breath without even igniting a single thorn. Either SIU is inconsistent or EVK is made a bad decision restricting him from training with the thorn.
Maybe if he spent the last 2 years training with the thorn and Black March and pushing his powers to the limits, he wouldn't be out of energy like he already is.

The very reason for his training for the past 2 years is to get to a level where he could challenge Kallavan. That's the only qualification he's got for making use of a considerable amount of FUG's key resources to attempt an almost impossible rescue of his master Jinsung. And his performance in the fight against Kallavan shows how unqualified he is. Sowo is right, he has no basis, no qualification, no right to ask FUG to make such incredible sacrifices, to risk the loss of 3 Slayers in order to satisfy an underperforming and underachieving individual like him.
Ever since EVK got sniped, I started to understand why Sowo was ranting back then. He's too weak right now. He should have kept climbing till he's at least strong as 100 Floor Urek or close enough before going on a suicide mission like this.
Nobody said Jisung Ha was going to be executed, he was going to be imprisoned in the nest. There's absolutely no reason to rush things. But here we have him still being carried around when he's clearly not ready.

I never expected Baam to beat Kallavan as he is now, but I expected more fro the 2 years training. At least ignite a thorn or use some administrative tier power like he did to Data Jahad, but no. He's out of energy.
Like I've said before, His attack power is already HR tier, his lv1 BT sheild was able to block EoB attacks until he ran out of juice so his defence is already HR tier too. But from what we have seen in this fight, his stamina is still regular tier and not anywhere close to a ranker.
.
I don't expect him to fight Kallavan again later in this arc. No matter what power up he gets, if he doesn't have the stamina to use it, then its just useless e.g BT shield. He's gone really far in two years but sadly he hasn't solved his original problem at the Last station i.e stamina.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

...he has been proven incompetent in stamina, willpower and brain cells too...at least go all out Baam, but no... our author doesn't want us to think he is an irregular in actions and feats, but tossing comments here and there about how special he should be and many 'almosts' accomplishment.
You are speaking the language of gods there my friend
 

FoolishWisdom

Registered User
中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
223
Reaction score
282
Age
55
Country
United States
You tagged the wrong guy.
Yes, sorry about that. I was originally trying to respond to one of your posts, and then decided against it (as possibly too off-topic), then, I decided to respond to one of King Dryst's posts, and I messed up the attributions.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Oh, I have a few. But the mods will get angry if I speak them.
Gotta hand it to you: I might disagree with you frequently, but at least your funny. :)
 

Turtle hunter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
1,743
Reaction score
1,610
Age
22
Country
France
That's my problem here, he's much stronger than he was at the last station but he still has the same stamina problems that he did or even worse. I'm really disappointed.
The entire point of having him train without the thorn was to improve his base so that he can use the thorn to full potential. But we have him gasping for breath without even igniting a single thorn. Either SIU is inconsistent or EVK is made a bad decision restricting him from training with the thorn.
Maybe if he spent the last 2 years training with the thorn and Black March and pushing his powers to the limits, he wouldn't be out of energy like he already is.


Ever since EVK got sniped, I started to understand why Sowo was ranting back then. He's too weak right now. He should have kept climbing till he's at least strong as 100 Floor Urek or close enough before going on a suicide mission like this.
Nobody said Jisung Ha was going to be executed, he was going to be imprisoned in the nest. There's absolutely no reason to rush things. But here we have him still being carried around when he's clearly not ready.

I never expected Baam to beat Kallavan as he is now, but I expected more fro the 2 years training. At least ignite a thorn or use some administrative tier power like he did to Data Jahad, but no. He's out of energy.
Like I've said before, His attack power is already HR tier, his lv1 BT sheild was able to block EoB attacks until he ran out of juice so his defence is already HR tier too. But from what we have seen in this fight, his stamina is still regular tier and not anywhere close to a ranker.
.
I don't expect him to fight Kallavan again later in this arc. No matter what power up he gets, if he doesn't have the stamina to use it, then its just useless e.g BT shield. He's gone really far in two years but sadly he hasn't solved his original problem at the Last station i.e stamina.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



You are speaking the language of gods there my friend
I think that one thing that you guys don't understand about Baam stamina , is that it is linked to using torn or power that are far higher that is base form . What basically Baam is doing , is draining more and more power from the torn .but like Albelda there is a limit at what power you can use .

Baam training just made the power than he can use more higher , Baam will always have those stamina if he use much more power than his base form can't allow him .
 

The Crypts

Registered User
初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
Joined
Apr 7, 2020
Messages
42
Reaction score
68
Age
22
Country
Nigeria
That's my problem here, he's much stronger than he was at the last station but he still has the same stamina problems that he did or even worse. I'm really disappointed.
The entire point of having him train without the thorn was to improve his base so that he can use the thorn to full potential. But we have him gasping for breath without even igniting a single thorn. Either SIU is inconsistent or EVK is made a bad decision restricting him from training with the thorn.
Maybe if he spent the last 2 years training with the thorn and Black March and pushing his powers to the limits, he wouldn't be out of energy like he already is.
Yes. This has been a key challenge. He is yet to show the expected dominance of Irregulars. Having his base level trained is a good decision if the objective is to raise his stamina and power output. Training his use of the thorn and Black March will improve skills and capabilities with those external aids but will do less to improve his own power levels. So, that's a good decision by Evankhell because the most important thing for Bam now is to get him to mirror the power levels of other known Irregulars. His own power without the thorns, Thryssas, souls, Black March, etc must rise to a level similar to that of Urek or the 13 GWs, or even superior to them given his uniqueness and the level of the challenges he faces now and in the near future.

The question here is why Evankell would let him take on this level of challenge and opponents when he's clearly not ready. There's no strategy nor capability for defending the power of the EoB for example, Bam had to invent a new ability on the spot to deal with what is clearly a well-known threat he should be prepared for. It makes no sense. What did he expect in a confrontation with Kallavan then? That Kallavan would take pity on him and fight without the EoB? How did he plan to damage a guy with skin as hard as a diamond? Last time they met, he was shouting for all to hear that he'd beat him the next time they meet and rescue his master. He looks even more pathetic now considering how belligerent he was then.
 

paulbee

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2009
Messages
801
Reaction score
759
Gender
Male
Country
United States
because it's absolutely asinine for Baam to go from beating a test ranker to being superior to Kallavan in a matter of days?

Baam is using a fraction of his power and almost severed Kallavan's arm. Baam united 3 Slayers, buried the hatched among the Baylords, and his team revived the Slayer of Legend.

Have you considered that there may more to winning a war than just being a master of all traits.

For fucks sake, his shield that he found out existed a hot minute ago took THREE EOB punches from Kallavan at the lowest form.

His genuine nature has changed Dowon's mind

Baam has done everything right so far in the nest
Yeah, I agree with you. Bam's sole responsibility in this fight is to release the wall, something only he can do. Moreover, I think that in the grand scheme, if he were to defeat Kallavan now, SIU would probably have to find another even tougher villain to oppose Bam and bring him closer to his maximum potential. Bam's power may in fact be ultimately unlimited, to properly make use of the character, SIU has to be judicial in how soon and how dramatic Bam's comming into his full potential is allowed to happen.

I initially thought the Black March would provide a short-cut/cheat allowing Bam to expend his potential Energy without the customary Backlash of exhaustion (or even passing out), but that was not to be. Maybe the Red and Blue Thryssas will do the job for him, but SIU is not about to relaease all that good stuff too soon, I suppose. Maybe Bam needs to submerge into his inner world and commune with his inner Thryssas to get there. I think I recall Kurosaki Ichigo had to do something like that where his Dad showed him how to bring out the max potential of his Inner Shinigami Zanpakuto before he could face Aizen and defeat him. Unforthunately for us, I don't think SIU is quite ready to release Bam's potential yet. If he does so now, then what? I think/feel that SIU needs to set up a way to carry on the story interestingly. He needs to have plausible opponents who also stronger than Kallavan, he needs to introduce the higher ups in fug. He needs to create a plausible back story regarding the Administrators and their values. He needs to set up a few High Ranker Team Bam members without too much of a gap with Rak and Khunn. He should also get into Jahad, and develop a 3 dimensional personality for him. I don't think we have seen enough of the Family Heads, what they do, how they feel, whether they will take sides vs Jahad.

Basically I don't think the TOG world politics and upper echelon interactions are quite set yet. Things will happen once Bam comes into his full power, but SIU has not finished setting up the background for that yet.

I
 

Zahard's Prophet

Registered User
下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
78
Reaction score
164
Country
Imperium of Mankind
I'm curious. Looking past the salt, what do the people complaining about how weak Baam is think that SIU is about to do? How will the Nest Arc conclude? What will happen to Kallavan and Jinsung?
 

King Dryst

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2018
Messages
2,374
Reaction score
4,024
Country
Cobra
I'm curious. Looking past the salt, what do the people complaining about how weak Baam is think that SIU is about to do? How will the Nest Arc conclude? What will happen to Kallavan and Jinsung?
Baam will bumble through somehow, probably without defeating anyone worth talking about because SIU never lets him outright win against arc villains. He probably has the shoddiest personal record of any manga protagonist this side of Freezing. I still don't think SIU is enough of a hack to completely rip off One Piece and Marineford by having Jinsung die. I don't know about Kallavan, but if Baam doesn't get to take him down then I hope nobody else does either.
 

Turtle hunter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
1,743
Reaction score
1,610
Age
22
Country
France
Baam will bumble through somehow, probably without defeating anyone worth talking about because SIU never lets him outright win against arc villains. He probably has the shoddiest personal record of any manga protagonist this side of Freezing. I still don't think SIU is enough of a hack to completely rip off One Piece and Marineford by having Jinsung die. I don't know about Kallavan, but if Baam doesn't get to take him down then I hope nobody else does either.
Jinsung dying will maybe make Baam less naïve .

Nobody should kill Kallavan or even defeat him , he is Baam nemesis , he shouldn't be losing or dying against anyone .

If SIU doesn't whant Baam to defeat him now , he should at least let Kallavan live .
 

FoolishWisdom

Registered User
中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
223
Reaction score
282
Age
55
Country
United States
It's just too revoltingly cliche to do. I can't see it happening.
I am sure that Jinsung will die at this point; I am unsure however, if it will be during this arc.

The thickest plot armor goes to Bam, Rak, Khun, and (sigh) Rachel.
 

Turtle hunter

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2017
Messages
1,743
Reaction score
1,610
Age
22
Country
France
It's just too revoltingly cliche to do. I can't see it happening.
I can't see it too .

Cliche yes , realistic yes too , even in real life loosing someone meaningful to you , change you .

I think that Baam is less naïve for sure but still naïve , and i think it is partly because Baam never suffered any loss . That is why he can speak shit on Yama's face without being afraid .


--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I am sure that Jinsung will die at this point; I am unsure however, if it will be during this arc.

The thickest plot armor goes to Bam, Rak, Khun, and (sigh) Rachel.
Ahahha i have 0 expectation for that . Until now Baam as been avoided by the tower cruelty SIU as been killing and bringing back to life every Baam who died and when it is not the case , SIU hide it .
 
Top