Discussion Tower of God Ranking Discussion

[kkck]

TOG lore makes the point that the bloodmadder family has the least influence among the noble families. And family strength isn't relative to the amount of kids... at least not just that. It should be a factor of the amount of rankers and the position those rankers have. Heck, we know that 10 family members who aren't regulars are viewed as virtually worthless.... Imagine two family compositions:

1.- 10000 overall members. 100 rankers. 1 high rankers.
2.- 3000 overall members. 50 rankers. 10 high rankers.

I'd argue the second family would be substantially more influential than the first.... And if we go by the bloodmadders...... How do they even get high rankers? And if they do, how long do they last? We know it takes at least a few centuries to become a high rankers but bloodmadders don't even live that long anyways.

 

[Orbs2op]

Why would we think rachel does not want to put the work in? Certainly we have seen bam training more than rachel but we know for a fact that talent is what determines your overall ability at shinsoo. Training merely nourishes talent. And hard work cannot compensate for a lack of talent. From the lore we know that this whole thing is based on talent to begin with. it's fairly explicit about that. In the end this is a series where end results are mostly due to talent rather than hard work. Take season one where the ponsekhal guy taught bam how to make a bang... Bam did in an instant what talent future rankers can do in years. Even that ho person was vastly surpassed at that moment, without bam putting in anywhere near the effort of anyone else there. rachel as we saw her probably could do with a little more training of course but that alone probably won't help her catch up to bam. If gustang actually does something to help her odds are it will have at least something to do with helping her find a shred of talent she can exploit. Or somehow forcing some talent on her...

As wha said she complains a lot and doesn't try, look at headon test she chickened out and bam went for it, that the difference she won't try unless she can win, as I said before there is some sort of level cap imo that separates regulars from irregulars granted by the tower, even if Rachel is a pawn she willingly wants to climb so she has her uses, thus gustang was gonna grant her powers no matter what happened cause its destiny or a plan, but even with all that power she will lose to bam, cause bam stopped solely relying on talent and is working on fundamentals now as well and his powers spiked Rachel ain't doing that, she gonna cheese her powers like bam used to and overwhelmed them.

 

[kkck]

As wha said she complains a lot and doesn't try, look at headon test she chickened out and bam went for it, that the difference she won't try unless she can win, as I said before there is some sort of level cap imo that separates regulars from irregulars granted by the tower, even if Rachel is a pawn she willingly wants to climb so she has her uses, thus gustang was gonna grant her powers no matter what happened cause its destiny or a plan, but even with all that power she will lose to bam, cause bam stopped solely relying on talent and is working on fundamentals now as well and his powers spiked Rachel ain't doing that, she gonna cheese her powers like bam used to and overwhelmed them.

TBH I have a hard time faulting rachel for the bit at the headon test. For all rachel (and we) knew headon would have left that shineuh eat her and never looked back. And still, the notion that bam is not relying on talent and instead relying on hard work is simply factually incorrect and contrary to the lore. Hard work does not explain what bam is doing. Bam learns complex skills instantly and without any effort whatsoever. He simply has the specks for it. If effort mattered then hatz would be the unquestionably strongest being in the tower right now. And yet he likely won't even surpass good old aguero, a jackass who spent most of his comfortable climb to the tower not only not working hard but avoiding his talents like an STD. And he still managed to ride on his other talents as one of the stronger regulars of his class.

 

[King Dryst]

TBH I have a hard time faulting rachel for the bit at the headon test. For all rachel (and we) knew headon would have left that shineuh eat her and never looked back. And still, the notion that bam is not relying on talent and instead relying on hard work is simply factually incorrect and contrary to the lore. Hard work does not explain what bam is doing. Bam learns complex skills instantly and without any effort whatsoever. He simply has the specks for it. If effort mattered then hatz would be the unquestionably strongest being in the tower right now. And yet he likely won't even surpass good old aguero, a jackass who spent most of his comfortable climb to the tower not only not working hard but avoiding his talents like an STD. And he still managed to ride on his other talents as one of the stronger regulars of his class.

Hard work can only beat talent when talent doesn't work hard. And Baam does. But you're generally right. You've mentioned Koon, but an even better example is Androssi who is notorious for lazing about and still manages to outclass everyone except the monster.

 

[Wha]

TBH I have a hard time faulting rachel for the bit at the headon test. For all rachel (and we) knew headon would have left that shineuh eat her and never looked back. And still, the notion that bam is not relying on talent and instead relying on hard work is simply factually incorrect and contrary to the lore. Hard work does not explain what bam is doing. Bam learns complex skills instantly and without any effort whatsoever. He simply has the specks for it. If effort mattered then hatz would be the unquestionably strongest being in the tower right now. And yet he likely won't even surpass good old aguero, a jackass who spent most of his comfortable climb to the tower not only not working hard but avoiding his talents like an STD. And he still managed to ride on his other talents as one of the stronger regulars of his class.

I can only speak for myself, but i wasn't really thinking about her first encounter with Headon, because i do believe that most of the people i know would have made a similar decision - even Evan was surprised about Bam's decision to take the test.
I am more talking about her taking a free ride whenever she can (team khun, FUG) and always complaining how unfair everything is and never even trying. Again, i haven't seen her train, nor was it implied.

I didn't say that he is solely relying on hard work, neither did orbs2op. He said that he doesn't solely rely on his talent, which is correct.
Again, look at Bam without hard training - you think he would come close to his current level?
If effort didn't matter, Hatz wouldn't have been able to beat cassano at their rematch. Their is a limit to what you can do with hard work, yes. The same goes for talent. Both combined can take you to the top, depending on the amount of hard work and talent, of course.

It's not that easy for Bam like you make it seem. Yes, he can take new techniques in with getting hit by them, but first that's kinda painful (just remember him lying on the floor after Jinsung "taught" him the flare wave explosion) and can even kill him (GoG and shinwonryu). Second, he may take the technique, but it's, at least powerwise, not the same (again flare wave explosion as good example). So he needs to train to improve it.

Well Aguero is a perfect example for my opinion. When they faced of at the name hunt station, they looked like equals. If Khun puts more work into it, i doubt that Hatsu can keep up. Hatzu even managed to kinda be on Anak's level with his hard work (and talent, but i suspect it's not comparable to hers) and Anak doesn't just have incredible talent but Zahard's blood as well (although not as strong as a real princess) and she seems to train although it's likely not comparable to Hatzu's work). It's a mix.

 

[King Dryst]

If effort didn't matter, Hatz wouldn't have been able to beat cassano at their rematch.

...He didn't beat Cassano in their rematch.

 

[Orbs2op]

TBH I have a hard time faulting rachel for the bit at the headon test. For all rachel (and we) knew headon would have left that shineuh eat her and never looked back. And still, the notion that bam is not relying on talent and instead relying on hard work is simply factually incorrect and contrary to the lore. Hard work does not explain what bam is doing. Bam learns complex skills instantly and without any effort whatsoever. He simply has the specks for it. If effort mattered then hatz would be the unquestionably strongest being in the tower right now. And yet he likely won't even surpass good old aguero, a jackass who spent most of his comfortable climb to the tower not only not working hard but avoiding his talents like an STD. And he still managed to ride on his other talents as one of the stronger regulars of his class.

I highly doubt headon would let her die it's a grand plan, he read her like a book and showed her true self, Rachel has no doubt in her action and beliefs that why she won't close the gap.

Bam innate talent imo is kinda linked to his core power is devouring/absorbing along with his instinctive fighting abilities, he has a grasp on how he learns things obviously but now he see that alone isn't enough so he starts learning from scratch and his power spiked by a huge margin as it should, as for learning complex technique from an theory that easily explained, cause he is starting from zero and learning properly plus Yhs was their to guide him through the initial stages of forming the loops and everything else is just wave controlling it looks flashy but its just powerful wave controlling, when bam full masters the technique it will look much more complex or simple given the circumstances but the loops aren't a big deal yet until it's being supported by the thorns bam hinted at this, tbh loops seem eob to me hope it end up on his banned list against regulars top b class or a class, he hasn't shown full extent of his base powers and zero techniques.

Hatz is under the level cap he will be very strong for tower standards, AA been serious for a while now cause he felt useless, and slowly took up spear bearing with Evan in the train and accepted his gift at HF, so his talent is gonna combine with training and hatz just won't be able to keep up AA is special, androssi is monster in her own way came up rough through killing and fighting she is built for the tower.

Also Elaine is one power up or 2 away from being one of bam strongest companion, wonder if he gave her a clicker miseng got one ffs.

 

[kkck]

Hard work can only beat talent when talent doesn't work hard. And Baam does. But you're generally right. You've mentioned Koon, but an even better example is Androssi who is notorious for lazing about and still manages to outclass everyone except the monster.

I am not sure if androsi really is comparable to aguero in that regard. She does relax a fair bit of course but on the other hand her backstory is without a doubt the most brutal out of bam's friends. Even more so than aguero's disturbing childhood. Given her overall backstory my guess is that she does train at least. And even then, aguero wasn't just lazy, he actually avoided his talents which is pretty much the equivalent of sabotaging yourself. And he still succeeded.

 

[King Dryst]

I am not sure if androsi really is comparable to aguero in that regard. She does relax a fair bit of course but on the other hand her backstory is without a doubt the most brutal out of bam's friends. Even more so than aguero's disturbing childhood. Given her overall backstory my guess is that she does train at least. And even then, aguero wasn't just lazy, he actually avoided his talents which is pretty much the equivalent of sabotaging yourself. And he still succeeded.

I think she busted her hump back when she had to, and is much less willing to now that she doesn't. She earned the good life and seems mostly content to sit back and enjoy it now. She had the chance to train under Yuri and had to be almost literally forced to be bothered to get out of bed and put in the work, and wasn't exactly giving it her utmost on the Hidden Floor either. We'll see whether that changes with her circumstances down the road.

 

[kkck]

I can only speak for myself, but i wasn't really thinking about her first encounter with Headon, because i do believe that most of the people i know would have made a similar decision - even Evan was surprised about Bam's decision to take the test.
I am more talking about her taking a free ride whenever she can (team khun, FUG) and always complaining how unfair everything is and never even trying. Again, i haven't seen her train, nor was it implied.

I didn't say that he is solely relying on hard work, neither did orbs2op. He said that he doesn't solely rely on his talent, which is correct.
Again, look at Bam without hard training - you think he would come close to his current level?
If effort didn't matter, Hatz wouldn't have been able to beat cassano at their rematch. Their is a limit to what you can do with hard work, yes. The same goes for talent. Both combined can take you to the top, depending on the amount of hard work and talent, of course.

It's not that easy for Bam like you make it seem. Yes, he can take new techniques in with getting hit by them, but first that's kinda painful (just remember him lying on the floor after Jinsung "taught" him the flare wave explosion) and can even kill him (GoG and shinwonryu). Second, he may take the technique, but it's, at least powerwise, not the same (again flare wave explosion as good example). So he needs to train to improve it.

Well Aguero is a perfect example for my opinion. When they faced of at the name hunt station, they looked like equals. If Khun puts more work into it, i doubt that Hatsu can keep up. Hatzu even managed to kinda be on Anak's level with his hard work (and talent, but i suspect it's not comparable to hers) and Anak doesn't just have incredible talent but Zahard's blood as well (although not as strong as a real princess) and she seems to train although it's likely not comparable to Hatzu's work). It's a mix.

How can that be correct? The lore and series pretty explicitly make the point that shinsoo control is all about talent. Which is not to say bam doesn't train hard (he does). But if you were to weight talent vs effort... the ratio would probably be 95% talent, 5% doing the bare minimum. For context:

In story the timespan since the beginning has been something like 25 years. And during that time bam has gone from zero (as in, probably wouldn't beat your average mangahelpers nerd in arm wresting) to being capable of matching some rankers at least. And probably has the raw power of some of the stronger rankers and maybe some high rankers. But... 25 years is virtually nothing by tog standards. Odds are that some of bam's peers at the floor of tests had been training for longer than that since before even making it to the floor of tests.

Lo po bia ren made the point that making a bang usually takes years. And that is for talented people to begin with. Bam did it effortlessly and instantly with a shred of help from laure. And this is how bam learns everything. Like the flash step... quant made the point learning the technique takes a decade or so iirc. Bam learned it by putting in exactly zero seconds of effort. Of course, mastering those things did take more time but... So what? The hard part is still instant for him. For bam the grind for new abilities is non existent.

It's even easier than I can make it seem I'd argue. Imagine you are in a calculus class and you have two alternatives to mastering the stuff in your semester:

1.- You go to every class, pay attention, participate, ask questions, do the homework, and then do the recommended amount of out of class studying over a semester. Basically the usual grind for knowledge for most people.

2.- You can get punched in the gut by an MMA fighter. As in, getting punched in the gut will make you learn pretty much everything you have to learn in the semester. Enough to get you a c without doing much of anything else. And an A just requiring some practice which you can get from looking over stuff in the syllabus without really attending class or anything.

The second option is without a doubt painful. But it's super easy and instant and within a few days you'll barely feel anything and you are guaranteed passing grade without any additional work. This is bam's life in a nutshell. That asshole who passes class not by grinding but because a magical MMA fighter him punches knowledge into him.

And sure, if bam didn't have all the teachers and whatnot with him and didn't do the training he certainly wouldn't be as strong as he is now. BUT he'd still be one of the stronger regulars in his class. Shinsoo would still come to him easily. For bam his training simply makes him stronger faster. Without all the work he is putting in he'd simply become stronger later on in the story. And he only needs to be this strong because he keeps going out of his way to pick fights with the strongest people he can find at every turn. Otherwise he'd climb the tower comfortably, easily and still be ridiculously strong by his peers' standard.

 

[Wha]

...He didn't beat Cassano in their rematch.

He was on his knees, then hatzu got distracted and he managed to break his sword and escape.
Thank you for pointing me into this direction, because in the very same chapter, Leesoo (Siu) said this: "No. No plans. But i don't think he will loose this time. The one who TRAINS HARDER always gets his revenge".

How can that be correct? The lore and series pretty explicitly make the point that shinsoo control is all about talent. Which is not to say bam doesn't train hard (he does). But if you were to weight talent vs effort... the ratio would probably be 95% talent, 5% doing the bare minimum. For context:

In story the timespan since the beginning has been something like 25 years. And during that time bam has gone from zero (as in, probably wouldn't beat your average mangahelpers nerd in arm wresting) to being capable of matching some rankers at least. And probably has the raw power of some of the stronger rankers and maybe some high rankers. But... 25 years is virtually nothing by tog standards. Odds are that some of bam's peers at the floor of tests had been training for longer than that since before even making it to the floor of tests.

Lo po bia ren made the point that making a bang usually takes years. And that is for talented people to begin with. Bam did it effortlessly and instantly with a shred of help from laure. And this is how bam learns everything. Like the flash step... quant made the point learning the technique takes a decade or so iirc. Bam learned it by putting in exactly zero seconds of effort. Of course, mastering those things did take more time but... So what? The hard part is still instant for him. For bam the grind for new abilities is non existent.

It's even easier than I can make it seem I'd argue. Imagine you are in a calculus class and you have two alternatives to mastering the stuff in your semester:

1.- You go to every class, pay attention, participate, ask questions, do the homework, and then do the recommended amount of out of class studying over a semester. Basically the usual grind for knowledge for most people.

2.- You can get punched in the gut by an MMA fighter. As in, getting punched in the gut will make you learn pretty much everything you have to learn in the semester. Enough to get you a c without doing much of anything else. And an A just requiring some practice which you can get from looking over stuff in the syllabus without really attending class or anything.

The second option is without a doubt painful. But it's super easy and instant and within a few days you'll barely feel anything and you are guaranteed passing grade without any additional work. This is bam's life in a nutshell. That asshole who passes class not by grinding but because a magical MMA fighter him punches knowledge into him.

And sure, if bam didn't have all the teachers and whatnot with him and didn't do the training he certainly wouldn't be as strong as he is now. BUT he'd still be one of the stronger regulars in his class. Shinsoo would still come to him easily. For bam his training simply makes him stronger faster. Without all the work he is putting in he'd simply become stronger later on in the story. And he only needs to be this strong because he keeps going out of his way to pick fights with the strongest people he can find at every turn. Otherwise he'd climb the tower comfortably, easily and still be ridiculously strong by his peers' standard.

No, they don't. One example would be what i just answered king dryst. Another would be the examples i have given to you.
Yeah, you need talent as well to advance higher and higher, but without hard work, it's pretty much futile. Because if there are beings not as talented as you, but still very talented, they will most likely leave you in the dust. Not just in real life, but in this series as well. Take Data Zahard and Bam's battle. Bam is wayyy more talented, Zahard admitted that when he was surprised about Bam needing just a month to compete with him. Why was Data Zahard still a threat? Because of the difference of skill - even Bam admitted that. Why does he have more skill? Yes, hard work (and time, of course). And everything i list is part of the lore to..........
60-40? Maybe? 95-5? No way.


Ok, Bam is the epidome of talent. So take Bam and strip him of all his hard work - and he had a lot of it. Just leave his talent, without hard work. Where do you think he would be? Battling Rankers? Or being just another Androssi, only a bit stronger (because he has more talent), or weaker (because he had much less time)?

Do you remember when Bam collapsed while walking towards the building Hansung was in? And Hansung thinking something like "not again"? That right there is hard work. Fighting all those battles is hard work. Training under evankhell is hard work - the Bam we see now is the result. Yes, also because of his talents, but a 95 -5 ratio just doesn't cut it.


Yes, it's like when you fight with a guy that is two heads bigger than you, his weight doubles yours and both of you have the exact same body control and fighting skills. If you can't get to him with psychology, you are fucked. Because he has more strength, his reach is longer and you have no way of countering that. BUT if you used hard work to hone your skills, practice every day your fighting skills, you might have a chance. Maybe it's still not enough, but your hard work might even the odds.


If someone is ready to put himself at risk and get hurt really bad in the processe (kick in the guts by example), to gain something out of it, i do consider it hard work. If he learns it faster than the rest, it's due to his talent. But without the effort and taking a risk, he wouldn't learn it at all.
Of course talent matters. Like size, or strength. But to get the most out of it, you need to learn how to control those things properly. That's where the hard work part comes in.
It's like with your example, no matter how smart you are, you still need to study. You need to learn the facts. It might go much faster than with someone who isn't as talented as you, but the fact that you have to put some work in it remains. If you use one hour of your time and the other guy uses 5, every day, it's unlikely that you can compete with him. Unless you are that more talented. But with a person that is as smart as you (or close), it doesn't work. Which is why you need hard work to stay on top (or catch up).

If you could take a shortcut in martial arts and be of, let's say Bruce lee's levl, would you do it? Even if it means that someone of Bruce Lee's level punches you with every technique of his? It might be over in a short amount of time, but the risk (you might die, loose the ability to walk, break bones,........) that you put yourself in - and the pain - are very real. That's hard work as well. Not just time describes hard work.

To your last point - i already stated the example of pre second revolution Bam and the Bam we see now (or in his fight against Data Zahard) - that's just not comparable. No way that's a 95-5 ratio.

 

[TheMoa]

I think we should avoid some absolutes in this kind os discussion.
We know a lot of "common things" from the lore... that with time were proven to be basead on falsehoods.
When SIU started to give us snippets of the lore, he would give them from a point of speculation, like as:

- It is said that Urek came to the tower after Phanta
- It's believed that Enryu could creat life out of shinsoo

Both things are speculation from the lore perspective that we kind of go with it but that could be absolute wrong. Well, the best example may be that Zahard and his companions were 11GWs... that later we found out to be a lie.

The truths we have are from the point of view of a very Ancient empire where the king is seem as a God.

At one point it was believed that nobody could ever kill a Guardian, but Enryu changed that.

My point is that the discussion gets a little polarized because of different beliefs that cant' be corroborated until SIU devides to show us.

We know that regulars can't kill the FH's because they are bound to the rules of the tower and the FHs got their immortaly from the guardians. Regulars needs to make contracts with guardians, getting bound by those rules.

But we also know that are circumventions of the rules inside the tower:
Karaka believes that melting baam with the thorn would make him able to fight FHs.
GoG using Shinwonryu inside the train because it has special rules in it.

The rules are enforced as long as there an authority to enforce it (on this case, the guardians who let Zahard be king). But we already know that the guardians aren't above everything else.

Now, my personal opnion on Adori/Enne x Family heads. I know they can't kill them and I think they can't beat them, but I don't think it's impossible for them to beat a FH.
Irregulars aren't bound to contracts and can grow indefinitely because they doesn't need the guardian to have authority over shinsoo... regulars have a cap on how much they can grow and at what speed because they'll be restricted by whatever their contracts allow.

Now, we know that contracts can be different between individuals, as we know that people from the great families have different contracts than common regulars.

On the line of thinking, I think it wouldn't be impossible for some guardians to give special contracts to special people. Enne's bloodline (2 FH + Z power) would make her kind of the ultimate existence in terms of potential on the tower.. but she would still be bound by her contracts.
Could Enne have been given contacts that allowed her to grow faster than some FHs? IMO, yes... specially when we think that some guardians want change and they can see the future in some way (sending Evankhell and Hansung Baam's way months in advance).
Did she get this kind of contract? I have no idea, I think she didn't.. but is it impossible? I guess not,

We still lack some clarity on the contracts and immortality stuff and we'll know better when SIU decides to put more clarity on this.

On other poins being discussed... I agree that Gustang has a very arrogant point of view that is true as irregulars are a different thing altogether, but we shouldn't take it as gospel. He's very smart and very arrogant, that can led one to overlook some things.

 

[Jack Van Burace]

Hard work can only beat talent when talent doesn't work hard. And Baam does. But you're generally right. You've mentioned Koon, but an even better example is Androssi who is notorious for lazing about and still manages to outclass everyone except the monster.

You miss the luck factor. You can work hard and be talented but If you are unlucky you might lose.

 

[SOKORO DOUCHE]

Again if they could wipe out the po bidau family they wouldn't care if there is members in the army. They called that order a nightmare. Adori being ranked above gustang is irrelevant to me. Adori beating a FM no matter what people say i will believe it only when i see it. If i follow your logic evan would wipe out yuri. It doesn't makes any sense.

As Gustang said to Urek...the only people equal to him are the 10 floor heads and Baam. The rest of them are just games. Adori might be strong but thats just it. when it comes to floor heads, am sure they are in a different dimension.

 

[TheLastMartian]

I think that you didn't understand something , jahad army is not a combination of all 10 FH family . One great family are basically formed of there descendant so there are many . Jahad empire of what we know is formed bu recruiting powerful soldoerd everywhere and adopting . Bit kahad army and the 10 great family are difderent entiry . With Kallavan arc , you didn't see a official representative of each family . They were all partof jahad army .

Iy was stated nowhere that she can wipe out a whole family . I don't think you know what it is to wipe a whole family that a existed for dozen of thousand of years at minimum . I dont . They should be less than FUG . But imagine Jahad armu trying to wipe out FUG . And furthemore i don't see how she could wipe a whole without Gustang intervening . In the end she would miserably fail and die to Gustang hand .

Urek should be able to give a terrible blow to Gustang family , but he can't anihlate all of them .

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 4, 2019, Original Post Date: Jul 4, 2019 ---

Stop explaning to these people , no matter proof you gave them it is useless . Adori and Enne has only attained the pinnacle of regular ceiling , but the day they were born in the tower , they was limited . It is that simple . Non irregular are a species inferior than irregular . In the same way guardian are superior than irregular . And axis are also superior than all other category . This is right

Globally it is like Garou , oroshi and the aloan in saitama . They attained the pinnacle in the evolution . They could surely defeated most evryone out side saitame with only a hand , but they are bug to Saitama .

And you guys need to chill out about the ranking . There are to many factor that came in ranking someone , someone being higher in the ranking doens't neceserely mean being stronger . Urek and Zahard has never fougth yet Urek is ranked lesser . There are the blue and hole and many other thing .

Guardians are not superior to irregulars, there is no proof of this, Infact we have the exact opposite with a Guardian dying to an irregular and a "baby" guardian losing to Urek / Bam.

 

[Wha]

Guardians are not superior to irregulars, there is no proof of this, Infact we have the exact opposite with a Guardian dying to an irregular and a "baby" guardian losing to Urek / Bam.

Guardians were thought to be immortal until Enryuu proved that this is not the case. If Irregulars are normally superior to guardians, the whole hype around enryuu wouldn't make that much sense. Since he did what "every irregular" could do (if you are correct).

Regarding the "baby guardian". We could also say that Irregulars are not that tough compared to regulars, because the "baby Irregular" Bam could be defeated by quite a lot of people (before the second revolution he might have lost to data maschenny).

 

[Sakashi]

Adori could maybe defeat Gustang in a fight but not kill him which still leads to Gustang winning.

The answer you all are looking for. This thread is really on fire xD.

 

[shaheer]

How do they even get high rankers? And if they do, how long do they last? We know it takes at least a few centuries to become a high rankers but bloodmadders don't even live that long anyways

I have this question as well.. Say bam beats the crap out of kallavan in say next 10 floor will he be seen as high ranker like Enryu (who I doubt climbed the tower)

 

[Jedikos]

I have this question as well.. Say bam beats the crap out of kallavan in say next 10 floor will he be seen as high ranker like Enryu (who I doubt climbed the tower)

Remember when Jinsung went to visit Kallavan again in the past, when Kallavan was still a ranker? He said something like "He has enough power to become a high ranker" but then he wasn't yet. Perphaps "High Ranker" is a title, something that must be recoreded officially in the tower first, maybe by passing a special test, who knows?

 

[Wha]

Remember when Jinsung went to visit Kallavan again in the past, when Kallavan was still a ranker? He said something like "He has enough power to become a high ranker" but then he wasn't yet. Perphaps "High Ranker" is a title, something that must be recoreded officially in the tower first, maybe by passing a special test, who knows?

High Ranker is a title. It means that you are within the 1000 best ranked rankers of the tower. So to be a high Ranker, you have to be ranked first. When you are ranked, you can make big enough achievments to climb the ranks. Kallavan was of the radar after his climb. Maybe he already had everything he needed to get to said high Ranker level, but he was just sitting by that crystal. When he decided to get out into the open and challenge others, his rank started to rise again. At least that's my interpretation.