Discussion Fairy Tail Power Ranking Thread

[Firepower]

It's not that clear but I'd assume that he got that from Keyes, that said I think Bradman built on that through the First Seal as that's what allows the MPB's to flow freely from his body.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 14, 2016, Original Post Date: Jul 14, 2016 ---

Gajeel didn't look like he was escaping the Second Seal without Levy's help, he was straight up being swallowed by the field of skulls, this is why him escaping Over Skelter was BS, especially since Over Skelter looked like it was stealing his life force. Add on the fact that Bradman was visibly shocked that they escaped and it makes no sense, not to mention it wasn't explained.

http://mangafox.me/manga/fairy_tail/vTBD/c487/20.html
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
As for the overpowering argument, we can see here that was straight up amused when Gajeel tried to counter attack, plus he overpowered him earlier when he was caught by the 9DG curses and Over Skelter. To make it worse for Gajeel, Bradman could still have used the Sensation + Enhancement curses, he only didn't because he wanted to enjoy the fight (he says he will fight to his hearts content earlier in the chapter/chapter before that). Honestly I don't get how Gajeel would've fought Bradman in the poison water of Torafuzar, it would have limited his movement whilst Bradman slaughtered him, Levy saved him from that.
The fact that Gajeel (being a prefect counter to Bradman with his iron lungs) and Levy (who bailed him out twice) were getting destroyed should tell you who was overpowering who, especially since Gajeel still needed a power up despite his advantages.

@Bold Could you remind me why we're talking about Tangible Bradman? I'm not being funny I've just forgotten why we were talking about this.

Why is Gajeel escaping over skelter bs? It actually happened. Gajeel screamed for everyone to run. When he was surrounded by skulls he was saying these damn skulls. Levy used her magic to save him. Did he need saving? First thing he said was for her to leave. I would think if he was in deep shit he'd be relieved thank Levy and then tell her to leave. Bradman said he would fight to his heart's content After Gajeel told him that particles have no effect on his metal lungs. You give so much credit to Levy. Yes she did save Gajeel who I don't think needed saving from the skull attack. She also drained the water. Makes me wonder if at this arc Gajeel would have been able to blow it all away. Simply put, I saw Levy react sooner than Gajeel. Nothing more.

Break it down to the beginning of the fight. Gajeel nails him to a wall. Bradman doesn't take any damage. He chokes Gajeel expecting the particles to take effect. Gajeel surprises him, grabs his neck and headbutts Bradman. Bradman stops Gajeel's punch. Gajeel kicks him with iron dragon lance, but was shocked to find Bradman's body is particles itself. Second seal attack is used, hurting Gajeel. Bradman says "You might be able to handle it, but what about the surrounding humans? Gajeel tells everyone to run. Bradman says he'd be consumed by corpses. Gajeel calls them a damn pile of bones. Was he about to die here? Treating it as if it's a fact is wishful thinking. Levy saves Gajeel. Gajeel downplays Bradman's threats and tells him he has little mp. Bradman surprises Gajeel with exploding helix, tenga goken, onimaru, tenchi kaimei. Levy gets rid of the water. Dragon roar vs ice rage. Neither one overpowers the other in this attack. Third seal over skelter is cast and Levy is helpless. Gajeel saves her and escapes. Bradman can't believe it. Gajeel finds out Levy's mask never did much for her. Gajeel nervous recklessly goes after Bradman, but his attack just goes through him. He gets stabbed in his side, but throws a punch at Bradman desperately trying to save Levy from the particles. Gajeel absorbs the particles, gains df, with Bradman now tangible Gajeel beats him. He's moving so fast you could see after images of him hitting Bradman.

What part of this shows Bradman dominating? None. It's all in your head and not how it was actually being played out.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 14, 2016 ---

Lmao this was unexpected. Do you even read the manga yourself? Because if you do you'd actually know that Gajeel was about to die when Bradman used his Second Seal.

Spoiler

Top left. Now please tell me how he could've resist it. And no, don't give me a weak argument like "he survived his Third Seal so he can survive his Second Seal as well". Because if you look CLEARLY at the page I posted, you can see Gajeel drowning in the sea of skulls.

So Bradman can't use Macro on Gajeel once he turns DF just because you think so? You can't be serious.

Good, ignore the fact that he would die once he casts Tenchi Kaimei. I even excluded Sensory Curse and Enhancement Curse in my previous post to make it easier for you.

Yeah my job is done here.

That's funny. Yeah that does not prove he'd die.

 

[Ebony Maw]

Gajeel was under a pile of skulls, does that mean Gajeel's finished right there? He somehow escaped Over Skelter, so I assume he can get from under that rubble himself if he was alone. Levy just made it really easy.

Considering that the skulls steal life from them and he was showing no signs of escaping (he was literally being swallowed by the pile) I'd say that Levy using Solid Script just saved him.

 

[Firepower]

Considering that the skulls steal life from them and he was showing no signs of escaping (he was literally being swallowed by the pile) I'd say that Levy using Solid Script just saved him.

That's possible but just a guess. I'm guessing he'd have survived. Why? Because if can survive over skelter which is a stronger version there's no reason why he can't escape the simpler one. That's more evidence than just a simple guess. If he was about to die, he'd be at least relieved and thankful to Levy instead of just telling her to run. He's obviously wants her safe which is his main priority, but if anyone was at the brink of death they'd at least show great relief or thankfulness first. Instead he treated it like he would have escaped or blown up the skulls to escape, shadow mode or something and told Levy to get to safety. That's just the way I see human behavior and feelings.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 14, 2016, Original Post Date: Jul 14, 2016 ---

@SaberToothFan no hard feelings. You've made good points. I want evidence or a reason why you think Gajeel would have died. Because from my perspective Gajeel didn't seem relieved to be saved by someone else. Meaning he didn't seem too worried about it.

 

[Firepower]

@BluePegasus sorry if I came out rude to you. I get too competitive sometimes. You said some good stuff that are possible too.

 

[Ebony Maw]

Why is Gajeel escaping over skelter bs? It actually happened.

Just because it happens doesn't mean it's not BS, I'll explain further in my post about the Second Seal but for now I'll put it this way: Gajeel was hit by the Second Seal and was trapped under, he was showing no signs of escaping it and was clearly struggling, he didn't escape until Levy saved him. If Over Skelter is supposed to be a more powerful version of that then how did he get out of that much easier than the Second Seal?

Gajeel screamed for everyone to run. When he was surrounded by skulls he was saying these damn skulls. Levy used her magic to save him. Did he need saving? First thing he said was for her to leave. I would think if he was in deep shit he'd be relieved thank Levy and then tell her to leave.

Gajeel loves Levy, of course the first thing he'd do is tell her to get out of immediate danger. Besides, he stopped telling her to get out of there after she revealed her mask so he clearly needed some help.

Bradman said he would fight to his heart's content After Gajeel told him that particles have no effect on his metal lungs.

Yes? That's exactly what I was saying, as soon as Bradman found out Gajeel wouldn't die immediately to the MBP's he decided to have a fight in which he clearly wasn't going all out considering he didn't use his Sensation or Enhancement curses. Despite this he still had Gajeel on the ropes the entire time.

You give so much credit to Levy. Yes she did save Gajeel who I don't think needed saving from the skull attack. She also drained the water. Makes me wonder if at this arc Gajeel would have been able to blow it all away. Simply put, I saw Levy react sooner than Gajeel. Nothing more.

Levy does deserve some praise in this, even though she should have been killed like Bill.

Being serious though, I can't imagine that Gajeel would've survived the fight without her, it appeared that the Second Seal only got removed because of her Solid Script and he likely wouldn't have been able to fight Bradman to full ability in Torafuzar's poison water. The reason I feel Gajeel would have succumbed to the Second Seal is because he showed no sign of escaping prior to Levy using her Solid Script, you can see his arms being pushed closer to his body and the skulls on top of him virtually burying him alive. Remove Levy from that fight and even had he managed to escape it would have taken longer and done more damage. This is also why I think him escaping from Over Skelter was BS, he was shown to have been struggling massively with the Second Seal and yet he just swam out of Over Skelter. That doesn't make much sense, especially since Over Skelter has a visible draining effect.

What part of this shows Bradman dominating? None. It's all in your head and not how it was actually being played out.

Tad harsh.

The bit where I'd say Bradman was dominating was the 9DG curses rotation and Over Skeltor, during the cycle of the 9DG curses Gajeel could only endure his attacks until Levy got rid of the poison water and they cancelled each other out. Straight after that Bradman used Over Skelter which caught both Levy and Gajeel, Gajeel couldn't do anything at first and even when he charged towards him all that happened was he got a thorn through his side. Until Gajeel absorbed the MBP's Bradman was either stalemating or dominating Gajeel, it was only DF Gajeel that was able to blitz him and dominate him.

 

[Firepower]

Ok. For me as Gajeel was falling, he screamed telling everyone to run. He fell and in the next scene already engulfed with skulls. Keep in mind he just fell and instantly is getting buried. Before he tries to get out, only realizing the situation he's in, Levy saves him. With over skelter, Gajeel was getting tangled and tied with the skull bodies. You can see him moving quickly in that picture to go and save Levy. How he untangled and got to her is unknown. If I had to guess he turned partly shadow to escape the attack. Maybe that's why Bradman thought it wasn't possible to escape or very hard to escape. The difference is that no one interfered during over skelter, whiles the second seal Levy saved him, who had just fallen on the pile of skulls and was being swarmed what looked like right away. Because from the look of second seal and third seal, Gajeel was trapped with his hands reaching out as he was getting buried. Second seal was burying him quickly and third seal tied him up and was going to consume him too in a whirlwind of it. That's why I said if he was given enough time he'd have gotten out on his own.

As for the 9 curses, Bradman surprised Gajeel with those abilities and went all out one after another as if it's one long attack. Gajeel while underwater was not upset that there was water, but freaked out to know Bradman has all nine powers. Levy gets rid of the water. Gajeel thanks her as it does make it easier for him. Bradman continues using the 9 curses with ice rage which Gajeel counters with dragon roar. Neither one overpowered the other. Next Bradman uses over skelter, which Gajeel escaped without much trouble. I guess you could call it dominating, but Gajeel being as tough as he is tanked the onslaught of curses, then even matched Bradman with dragon roar. Bradman was winning, but I don't think he was dominating. I don't consider one being dominated if he's taking it well.

Yes Gajeel loves Levy and her safety comes first, but if you were about to die, but was saved I don't think that would be the look or reaction to Levy. Why did Gajeel let her fight with him? Simply because he believed she was not in danger of the particles, and I think he wanted to do it on his own, but his girlfriend won't leave him. Will continue tomorrow.

 

[Ebony Maw]

Ok. For me as Gajeel was falling, he screamed telling everyone to run. He fell and in the next scene already engulfed with skulls. Keep in mind he just fell and instantly is getting buried. Before he tries to get out, only realizing the situation he's in, Levy saves him. With over skelter, Gajeel was getting tangled and tied with the skull bodies. You can see him moving quickly in that picture to go and save Levy. How he untangled and got to her is unknown. If I had to guess he turned partly shadow to escape the attack. Maybe that's why Bradman thought it wasn't possible to escape or very hard to escape. The difference is that no one interfered during over skelter, whiles the second seal Levy saved him, who had just fallen on the pile of skulls and was being swarmed what looked like right away. Because from the look of second seal and third seal, Gajeel was trapped with his hands reaching out as he was getting buried. Second seal was burying him quickly and third seal tied him up and was going to consume him too in a whirlwind of it. That's why I said if he was given enough time he'd have gotten out on his own.

As for the 9 curses, Bradman surprised Gajeel with those abilities and went all out one after another as if it's one long attack. Gajeel while underwater was not upset that there was water, but freaked out to know Bradman has all nine powers. Levy gets rid of the water. Gajeel thanks her as it does make it easier for him. Bradman continues using the 9 curses with ice rage which Gajeel counters with dragon roar. Neither one overpowered the other. Next Bradman uses over skelter, which Gajeel escaped without much trouble. I guess you could call it dominating, but Gajeel being as tough as he is tanked the onslaught of curses, then even matched Bradman with dragon roar. Bradman was winning, but I don't think he was dominating. I don't consider one being dominated if he's taking it well.

Yes Gajeel loves Levy and her safety comes first, but if you were about to die, but was saved I don't think that would be the look or reaction to Levy. Why did Gajeel let her fight with him? Simply because he believed she was not in danger of the particles, and I think he wanted to do it on his own, but his girlfriend won't leave him. Will continue tomorrow.

Fair enough, I believe Bradman was dominating but I would be stupid to try and say Gajeel wasn't tanking it well. Since we've argued this extensively I don't see much point in continuing this debate, especially since we both see the result as roughly the same. The only thing I would say is that I still see Gajeel escaping Over Skelter as a plot hole as he didn't look like he went ISD but that's our separate views. You made some great points though.

 

[Firepower]

In that case I'll end it by saying that Gajeel could have gotten out of second seal with or without Levy, but she helped him almost instantly as you could see in the manga. That's why even when wrapped up by over skelter Gajeel got out on his own. You could see him struggling in over skelter also with him making noises too. That's not any different from how he was struggling with second seal. Having more skulls around him because he fell into the skulls does not make a difference if he could swim around it. Why didn't he? It's as I said, Levy helped him instantly. If Lucy's clock popped out to save Natsu and Lucy while August used his fire attack, does that mean Natsu needed help because he'd be killed? No it does not. It just means he was helped before he could act. I've found this manga to make sense in every way, maybe except the time Natsu defeated Laxus. But other then that the manga has been solid.

Gajeel showed struggle in both seal attacks, but the only difference is that no one came to save him against the stronger one. If you looked at it in this perspective that Gajeel would have gotten out on his own it would make more sense. Second off not trying to be rude, but landing attacks that does little damage is not dominating. Just as we've seen the wizard saints pull a combo on Serena, and all that did was surprise Serena, but no damage from that. Gajeel did take damage from the curse combo, but not much and definitely not enough to consider dominated. Point is Bradman could not use his seals on Gajeel. He did surprise Gajeel and combo him, but that didn't have much effect. If it was the same way he reacted when it was Laxus that hit him before you would be right. Why is it so hard to believe that not only Natsu got crazy strong? Gajeel and Natsu did fight together against Bakel and Kareem. Both looked equally as dirty and exhausted. The rivalry and competitiveness was still there with Gajeel saying he used about 10% of his strength on Kareem, and Natsu making stuff up that it was about 1% for him. I don't think the difference between them has grown at all. Natsu would still beat Gajeel but he'd have to go all out to beat Gajeel's ass. The same way he did when they fought. It is what it is.

 

[Ebony Maw]

In that case I'll end it by saying that Gajeel could have gotten out of second seal with or without Levy, but she helped him almost instantly as you could see in the manga. That's why even when wrapped up by over skelter Gajeel got out on his own. You could see him struggling in over skelter also with him making noises too. That's not any different from how he was struggling with second seal. Having more skulls around him because he fell into the skulls does not make a difference if he could swim around it. Why didn't he? It's as I said, Levy helped him instantly. If Lucy's clock popped out to save Natsu and Lucy while August used his fire attack, does that mean Natsu needed help because he'd be killed? No it does not. It just means he was helped before he could act. I've found this manga to make sense in every way, maybe except the time Natsu defeated Laxus. But other then that the manga has been solid.

Gajeel showed struggle in both seal attacks, but the only difference is that no one came to save him against the stronger one. If you looked at it in this perspective that Gajeel would have gotten out on his own it would make more sense. Second off not trying to be rude, but landing attacks that does little damage is not dominating. Just as we've seen the wizard saints pull a combo on Serena, and all that did was surprise Serena, but no damage from that. Gajeel did take damage from the curse combo, but not much and definitely not enough to consider dominated. Point is Bradman could not use his seals on Gajeel. He did surprise Gajeel and combo him, but that didn't have much effect. If it was the same way he reacted when it was Laxus that hit him before you would be right. Why is it so hard to believe that not only Natsu got crazy strong? Gajeel and Natsu did fight together against Bakel and Kareem. Both looked equally as dirty and exhausted. The rivalry and competitiveness was still there with Gajeel saying he used about 10% of his strength on Kareem, and Natsu making stuff up that it was about 1% for him. I don't think the difference between them has grown at all. Natsu would still beat Gajeel but he'd have to go all out to beat Gajeel's ass. The same way he did when they fought. It is what it is.

Though I disagree on the Seals we have debated this extensively and neither of us is going to change our opinions so agree to disagree? You raised some great points but I don't feel convinced and I know I can't convince you.

 

[Talenel]

Wasn't the whole point of the fight between Silver and Gray so that Gray could believe he overcame Deliora? Silver even explicitly says at the end of the fight that he was waiting to be killed by Gray. I don't see how any of that translates to "Silver was fighting to win".

He wanted Gray to surpass him. That plan wouldn't work and would render the fight pointless if he had just held back and let himself be beaten. What's proven then?
He had ample opportunity to take a dive and didn't....at all. He countered everything from Gray that he possibly could and only fell when he was out of options and couldn't stop Gray from landing a crippling blow.

OK that's one of the two positions.

....The only of the 2 supported by the actual manga.

Etherious form Shaila was on par with Etherious form Kyoka according to the amplifiers that mashima gave us that we had to apply to their rankings.

...No she wasnt. what kind of math did you use?
Kyoka: 2600 + 2700 + 2500 + 3000 + 2900 + 2700 = 16400
Silver: 2800 +3200 +2800 + 2000 +1500 +2600 = 14900
Sayla: 1600 +1200 +1000 + 800 + 1800 + 4000 = 10400

It is debatable, but it has been debated too many times There reason why Mirajane's macro didn't affect everyone was probably because, either:
- It only affected the soldiers that were in Mira's field of vision. As a matter of fact you can see that she manages to make them all sleep until in the following panel, more appear.
- or Wahl deactivated it.

no, it was stated that they ignored her order.

 

[Crimson Ice]

Dude it's an enchantment it literally says enchantment in the official translation. Are you blatantly ignoring facts now?

Wendy also has never created a barrier before either and her enchantments look like that too.

Spoiler: Her using enchantments again

Accept when you're wrong.

So just because an echamant has never made a barrier pre skip it can't? Wendy's enchantments can make multiple things including barriers now. Chelia has never made barriers so does that mean it came out of thing air? It's funny to see people surprised when people do new things after a timeskip. You're wrong even by your logic because Chelia hasn't made a barrier either, deal with it.

 

[Demon Hunter]

tbh, when you look at the moment when Dimaria hits Chelia, there is no barrier at her side at all. the barrier is only on Wendy' side. now, unless there was invisible barrier on Chelia' side then there was no barrier at all.

 

[Axiomus]

It really doesn't matter if Wendy's enchantment is a barrier or a boost to Chelia's durability. The point was that it allowed Chelia to survive Dimaria's all out attack. That means anything stronger than the enchantment would survive it as well.

 

[Crimson Ice]

tbh, when you look at the moment when Dimaria hits Chelia, there is no barrier at her side at all. the barrier is only on Wendy' side. now, unless there was invisible barrier on Chelia' side then there was no barrier at all.

You literally see parts of the barrier get blown away from Infront of Chelia:

http://www.mangapanda.com/fairy-tail/476/13

 

[Char]

Kyoka: 2600 + 2700 + 2500 + 3000 + 2900 + 2700 = 16400
Silver: 2800 +3200 +2800 + 2000 +1500 +2600 = 14900
Sayla: 1600 +1200 +1000 + 800 + 1800 + 4000 = 10400

Ughhh... third time I have to post it in this thread...

By @Jko (page 50 of this thread):

"It was translated to be her Limit Release form which gives her a 4000 boost in all her stats. Silver gets a 2000 boost when he puts his feelings into it and Kyouka gets a 2500 boost when she use her Strengthen. Franmelth was also translated to get a 2000 boost when he uses his Revolution. Those 4 were the only ones that had boost in the source's translation of them.

So there boosted stats are

Franmelth:
Atk: 2600
Def: 2600
Spd: 2500
Curse: 3000

Silver:
Atk: 5200
Def: 4800
Spd: 4000
Curse: 4600

Seilah:
Atk: 5200
Def: 5000
Spd: 4800
Curse: 6000

Kyouka:
Atk: 5200
Def: 5000
Spd: 5500
Curse: 5200"

So, Seilah and Kyouka are pretty much equals

 

[Jko]

It really doesn't matter if Wendy's enchantment is a barrier or a boost to Chelia's durability. The point was that it allowed Chelia to survive Dimaria's all out attack. That means anything stronger than the enchantment would survive it as well.

Wendy enchants can double stats so calling it a barrier is ridiculous. Also Sherria like every slayer has resistance to god attacks and her TO power up probably put her low S12 at least so an amp in stats would be significant.

So just because an echamant has never made a barrier pre skip it can't? Wendy's enchantments can make multiple things including barriers now. Chelia has never made barriers so does that mean it came out of thing air? It's funny to see people surprised when people do new things after a timeskip. You're wrong even by your logic because Chelia hasn't made a barrier either, deal with it.

Show me ever that Wendy enchants barriers then. Oh, wait you have zero feats to back up your claims. Also how tf do enchant a barrier up? Wendy isn't a high enchanter either so don't try to bring up Irene. You are wrong and the manga keeps proving you wrong so deal with it. Wendy enchants stats and it was called her Enchantment so again there was never a barrier there. Like @Jean Grey said why would Wendy put a barrier around herself if she was trying to protect Sherria?

 

[Axiomus]

Wendy enchants can doublestats so calling it a barrier is ridiculous. Also Sherria like every slayer has resistance to god attacks and her TO power up probably put her low S12 at least so an amp in stats would be significant.

Chelia shouldn't have resistance to a god's attacks. She should have resistance to wind-type attacks. Chelia's attacks are super-effective against gods.

 

[Jko]

Chelia shouldn't have resistance to a god's attacks. She should have resistance to wind-type attacks. Chelia's attacks are super-effective against gods.

Gray had resistance to every Curse despite being a Ice Demon slayer so I'm pretty sure the concept applies to GS too. Unlike DS there really aren't a set of Wind Gods or Ice Demons for their slayers to fight.

 

[Axiomus]

Gray had resistance to every Curse despite being a Ice Demon slayer so I'm pretty sure the concept applies to GS too. Unlike DS there really aren't a set of Wind Gods or Ice Demons for their slayers to fight.

Did Gray have resistance to curses? I know there was the thing with momento mori, but I was always under the impression that Gray simply tanked that spell because his demonized form gave him more durability. Technically speaking, not all dragons are elemental either. Like Zilconis is the jade dragon, but he doesn't really use jade in any way.

 

[Firepower]

Though I disagree on the Seals we have debated this extensively and neither of us is going to change our opinions so agree to disagree? You raised some great points but I don't feel convinced and I know I can't convince you.

We won't agree, but I'm giving explanation as to why Gajeel got out of third seal and would have with the second. In simplest terms he was helped before he could act. I don't see how this is a plot hole. It all happened in one fight. It's not hard to get a story that makes sense in one fight. Even if Gajeel was helped with the third seal instead of the second that does not make it conclusive that he'd be killed. Being helped when in an attack does not mean they would have died. That's why you could see Gajeel struggling in both seals. What you said would make more sense if you saw him struggling with only the second seal. But he was visibly struggling more with the third seal screaming aa several times with his mouth wide open. Compare that to a reaction where he feels crowded and all he says is "You damn pile of bones!" That's why no matter how you look at it he had more difficulty with the third seal, but in the next panel he goes to rescue Levy. Whereas with the second seal he was surrounded by skulls, then in the next panel Levy saves him. Check if you believe me. I don't need to convince you. I'll just prove you wrong with more reasoning and logic. If it made no sense and was a plot hole this manga would suck. Assuming right away that Gajeel would have died is a little presumptuous to begin with. Nothing more. If you can prove me wrong I won't even fight back. I'd just agree.