Discussion Fairy Tail Power Ranking Thread

[Axiomus]

No proof from your claim as he was a demon and not a dragon at the time. Sigh, size is not determine the power of attacks, Trunk’s strongest attack only destroyed a mountain top and he was stronger than Mecha Frieza who was stronger than his 100% final form. Your logic does not work. It is true, you deny it just to draw straws which don’t work. Even killing every human on earth at once is only Wall Level. All I proven that they used the same attack in both instances, dragon force or not has nothing to do with this. In short savage flames is not even a real technique just an expression of his flames of emotions, something END is more than capable of doing

Natsu doesn't have to be a dragon to be dying. His seeds don't even have to be fully fused. His seeds just need to be ATTEMPTING to fuse for Natsu to be dying. The seeds were attempting to fuse the moment the demon seed was created, hence why he was dying back when Happy brought him to the guild. The only time Natsu wasn't dying was when Brandish shrunk his demon seed. He started dying again the moment Brandish enlarged it.

If size does not determine the power of attacks, why can't I say Bluenote is planetary because of the mass of his black hole? The fact that your energy radiation energy calculation relies on a measurement of surface area is an appeal to size. So if you want to use Wall's calc, then size absolutely matters.

You're telling me....Wall can kill every human on earth? Lol okay. I'll store this right next to Kugelblitz.

Savage flames is Natsu turning his feelings towards the guild into magical power. END can't do this, because whenever Natsu calms down and thinks about his friends, his END power will disappear. Actually, Natsu probably can't even use his fire dragon king spells when he's in END mode. His FDK attacks are magic spells, not a curse power.

Wait. You think Laxus ESO is city+ level? How? All the Spriggan are on the same tier, and that's confirmed country. An August and Irene both showcased the ability to affect all of Fiore, which has been calced at Small continent. So how do you have him as city+...

Spriggans have never been confirmed country level. Even among the Spriggans that aren't August or Irene, people like enchanted Neinhart and Larcade are above the rest. When a Spriggan or anyone whose beaten a Spriggan blows up a country, I will accept them as country level. But if you want to go around thinking half the characters in the cast can blow up countries, be my guest.

 

[GL_Nova]

Natsu doesn't have to be a dragon to be dying. His seeds don't even have to be fully fused. His just need to be ATTEMPTING to fuse for him to be dying. And the seeds were attempting to fuse the moment the demon seed was created. The only time Natsu wasn't dying was when Brandish shrunk his demon seed.

If size does not determine the power of attacks, why can't I say Bluenote is planetary because of the mass of his black hole? The fact that your energy radiation energy calculation relies on a measurement of surface area is an appeal to size. So if you want to use Wall's calc, then size absolutely matters.

You're telling me....Wall can kill every human on earth? Lol okay. I'll store this right next to Kugelblitz.

Savage flames is Natsu turning his feelings towards the guild into magical power. END can't do this, because whenever Natsu calms down and thinks about his friends, his END power will disappear. Actually, Natsu probably can't even use his fire dragon king spells when he's in END mode. His FDK attacks are magic spells, not a curse power.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 8, 2018, Original Post Date: Nov 8, 2018 ---

When a Spriggan or anyone whose beaten a Spriggan blows up a country, I will accept them as country level.

So we're going to ignore the fact they talked about being able to wipe countries off the map, or Brandish title, or when Irene effortlessly manipulated the size of all of Fiore, or when August stated he could wipe it off the map and proceeded to turn everything to dust in his vicinity. The story is told in a very clear way. They were Island level back during the GMG. Brandish shrank one with the same ease Irene altered a country. Your ranking demands we ignore feats that took place, because of some AOE?

 

[WoWfan]

Which does not prove that he was dying as a demon. Again, scaling which is another fundamental part of finding stats, calcing and scaling and consistency. Not all calcs are created equal, each serves their purpose, radiation energy served it’s own when calcing Wall’s power. You are the one making th claims which are nonsense to the highest level. Wall is large country, case closed. Which is not an official technique, just a phrase, it is not even listed on his list of powers and abiltities. So no, if Natsu can do it, so can END.

@GL_Nova don’t bother, he is drawing straws at this point and should not be relied on information about power stats finding

 

[Axiomus]

So we're going to ignore the fact they talked about being able to wipe countries off the map, or Brandish title, or when Irene effortlessly manipulated the size of all of Fiore, or when August stated he could wipe it off the map and proceeded to turn everything to dust in his vicinity. The story is told in a very clear way. They were Island level back during the GMG. Brandish shrank one with the same ease Irene altered a country. Your ranking demands we ignore feats that took place, because of some AOE?

They were never stated to be capable of wiping a country of the map. Infact, I will openly challenge you to find me a single panel from the manga that says this. Brandish's title is nation destroyer. Nation doesn't necessarily mean country. Irene didn't effortless manipulate the size of Fiore. She required preparation, and it was a one-time thing by the looks of it. August is the only one I would accept as a country buster with Ars Magia, his suicide spell. Who was island level back in GMG?

My ranking is strictly feats.

 

[WoWfan]

In this case they do as nations are not meant literally in every instance (unless proven) as her powers proves she can do things to land’s geography. So she is Country-Large Country level with backing of Wall’s power, and universe one is not the strongest spell Irene had. So she scales to small continent and so does August.

 

[Axiomus]

Which does not prove that he was dying as a demon. Again, scaling which is another fundamental part of finding stats, calcing and scaling and consistency. Not all calcs are created equal, each serves their purpose, radiation energy served it’s own when calcing Wall’s power. You are the one making th claims which are nonsense to the highest level. Wall is large country, case closed. Which is not an official technique, just a phrase, it is not even listed on his list of powers and abiltities. So no, if Natsu can do it, so can END.

@GL_Nova don’t bother, he is drawing straws at this point and should not be relied on information about power stats finding

Literally the textbook example of double standard.

If Natsu can do it, so can END? Simply not true.

O, the irony. You do realize that I've had to correct you nearly every time we talk about what someone has or has not said, every time we talk about the names of attacks, and every time we talk about what did or did not happen in a fight? You haven't even show me a single panel of anything I ask you to prove. Not a single one. So for you and @GL_Nova, I'd like to see the page where someone says that a Spriggan can wipe a country off the face of the map.

In this case they do as nations are not meant literally in every instance (unless proven) as her powers proves she can do things to land’s geography. So she is Country-Large Country level with backing of Wall’s power, and universe one is not the strongest spell Irene had. So she scales to small continent and so does August.

Not all nations are countries. There are countries that are home to multiple nations, some of which live in isolated areas.

 

[WoWfan]

Which show you have no proof. END can with emotions like natsu. Another instance you avoid a question/sample, good job, that is why you cannot prove anything beyond size, it’s not the size that counts it’s how you use it. We proved it to you with science, you cannot argue with science. Not in this case as there are no nations within countries in FT world, just countries.

Again, is trunks mountain level? Or not?

 

[Axiomus]

Which show you have no proof. END can with emotions like natsu. Another instance you avoid a question/sample, good job, that is why you cannot prove anything beyond size, it’s not the size that counts it’s how you use it. We proved it to you with science, you cannot argue with science. Not in this case as there are no nations within countries in FT world, just countries.

The proof that Natsu was dying is the fact that his seeds were merging. He was dying the moment Brandish enlarged his seed again. Just because he regained consciousness and went into a rage, doesn't mean he wasn't dying. Imagine if someone had cancer, and spent most of their time comatose. Just because they woke up and started a fight doesn't mean the cancer was gone.

Natsu only has access to END's powers when he is in a murderous rage. Flames of savage emotions are only possible when he thinks about his guild. Natsu thinking about his friendship with Gray and Erza literally stops him from accessing END's powers. How do you expect Natsu to access END's powers when he's thinking about every friend in the guild?

I don't only accept size. I accept all feats, such as beating mages of a higher caliber. If someone beat a guy who blew up a mountain, I would consider that person mountain level as well. In this case here, neither Laxus nor Wall ever blew up a country. NOBODY in Fairy Tail has ever blown up a country, except for Acnologia in a book once. The closest was August with his Ars Magia. I would even accept your calculation for Wall if you own up and accept the Bluenote calculation for his black hole. Either you accept science, or you don't. Don't cherry pick based on your agenda. Also, the Nirvit that created the Nirvana would be considered a nation.

I am still waiting for proof of someone saying a Spriggan can wipe a country off the face of the map.

 

[WoWfan]

And the proof that he is up and moving says otherwise. You can’t prove he was dying as a demon though. No, he can increase his power by emotions even as END, he didn’t stop when thinking about Lucy, so no. Then you should accept that Spriggans are large country level by statement, feat and proof. So get over your drawing of straws. So by your statement, Trunks is only Mountain level, good

 

[Axiomus]

And the proof that he is up and moving says otherwise. You can’t prove he was dying as a demon though. No, he can increase his power by emotions even as END, he didn’t stop when thinking about Lucy, so no. Then you should accept that Spriggans are large country level by statement, feat and proof. So get over your drawing of straws. So by your statement, Trunks is only Mountain level, good

No, being up and moving doesn't mean Natsu wasn't dying. Gray was up and fighting too, but he was still heavily wounded. The moment their rage subsided and their adrenaline dropped, they felt the effects of their condition. You can be dying and still have enough energy to pick fights, you just won't be as strong as you would be when you're healthy. Come to think of it, this would explain why END is so weak compared to Natsu with his own powers.

Natsu wasn't thinking about his friendship with Lucy, or all the good times they had. He was thinking about how sad and angry he was that she died. Completely different context. To pretend that this mindset was anything close to what he was thinking when he fought Zeref is just silly.

I don't know or care about Trunks. He's irrelevant. I care about what the characters in this series can do. Spriggans do not have feats of destroying a country. Nobody ever said that they could destroy a country. You are welcome to prove me wrong because: I am STILL waiting for proof of anyone saying Spriggans can wipe a country off the face of the map.

 

[WoWfan]

Yet being down and out is dying, that is the only proof we have, there is not proof stating that Natsu was dying as a demon, you have yet to show that. That is why his power will be a savage as needed from negative emotions when he fights Zeref, and kill him. So you are in denial again, good to know, so thank you for proving my point as I have proved to you that Spriggans are large country level and above while you show nothing. Stop saying things with no weight to them.

 

[Axiomus]

Yet being down and out is dying, that is the only proof we have, there is not proof stating that Natsu was dying as a demon, you have yet to show that. That is why his power will be a savage as needed from negative emotions when he fights Zeref, and kill him. So you are in denial again, good to know, so thank you for proving my point as I have proved to you that Spriggans are large country level and above while you show nothing. Stop saying things with no weight to them.

Natsu was dying so long as the seeds were trying to fuse. This would have happened whether he was human, demon or dragon. Natsu doesn't have to be in a coma to be dying. His seeds don't even have to be fully fused to be dying. All I need to prove Natsu was dying is prove that his seeds were attempting to merge into one. And that happened the moment the demon seed started growing.

Spoiler: Igneel's explanation for why Natsu was dying

Natsu would have been at peak negative emotions when Lucy died. No evidence to suggest END's powers would have grown to be as strong as Natsu with his own powers against Zeref, especially since in canon it absolutely didn't. Any version of END other than the one that faced Gray is imaginary.

I am STILL waiting for proof of anyone saying Spriggans can wipe a country off the face of the map.

 

[WoWfan]

That does not prove that Natsu was dying as END because he was dying as a human, his seeds don’t merge unless he is one or the other two. Again, Natsu was not fully transformed yet so he would have to mature into full END as we have seen his demon features increase overtime, at full transformation he would be at peak power, Zeref dies at full form & power END. Already proved that Spriggans are large country and above, go read in the past

 

[Axiomus]

That does not prove that Natsu was dying as END because he was dying as a human, his seeds don’t merge unless he is one or the other two. Again, Natsu was not fully transformed yet so he would have to mature into full END as we have seen his demon features increase overtime, at full transformation he would be at peak power, Zeref dies at full form & power END. Already proved that Spriggans are large country and above, go read in the past

Natsu was dying. Period. His seeds were trying to merge whether he was a demon, human, or dragon. Just because he can use END's power doesn't mean the seeds weren't merging. He was still more than 80% human, anyways. Like I said, the only scenario in which END would have been possible is one where Natsu goes into his own heart and decides to crush the dragon seed. If he leaves the seeds alone, he dies. If he destroys the demon seed, he dragonizes. I'll even go out on a limb and say if Erza hadn't knocked some sense into Natsu, she would have just beaten him in a fight. Or Irene would have when she showed up. Destroying the dragon seed and becoming a demon would have been the worst choice for Natsu. He would lose control of his body to blind rage, lose out on flames of savage emotions, and be less equipped to deal with Acnologia.

When you say END > Zeref, you are not arguing for any version of END that existed within the 545 chapters of the manga. You are arguing for a fanfiction.

 

[WoWfan]

Not as END, period. So as a human he would still die? That’s good to know from all the contradictions in that statement. And he was still changing. Still waiting to see the seeds merging as a demon because he was just fine in Demon form, doesn’t have to be that as he just has to choose to be one of the other. Or choose to be human is what crushes both seeds. Not really as he would kill Zeref and end it. Mavis can just use time travel with neo eclipse and just change history. It is factually true that he was still transforming, not fanfic.

 

[Axiomus]

Not as END, period. So as a human he would still die? That’s good to know from all the contradictions in that statement. And he was still changing. Still waiting to see the seeds merging as a demon because he was just fine in Demon form, doesn’t have to be that as he just has to choose to be one of the other. Or choose to be human is what crushes both seeds. Not really as he would kill Zeref and end it. Mavis can just use time travel with new eclipse and just change history.

Natsu was dying so long as the seeds were merging. Natsu would absolutely be dying if his seeds were trying to merge, even as a human. Far from a contradiction, that's exactly what happened in the manga. Obviously I don't mean Natsu would be dying if he goes into his heart, breaks the seeds, and becomes a full human. I don't see how you could possibly think that's what I meant. Natsu was over 80% human even when using END's powers anyways, so I don't see how any of this makes a difference. Just because Natsu grew demon hands doesn't mean his seeds weren't trying to merge.

Yes, the only way Natsu would become a demon is if he goes into his heart and chooses to become a demon. That's the same as destroying the dragon seed. Either way it would have been the worst choice for Natsu to make, as he would lose both his mind and miss out on the opportunity to be an Acnologia-level dragon slayer. But more importantly, this scenario is a fanfiction. This version of END is imaginary. On top of being imaginary, we have to give it powers from normal Natsu using a completely different type of PoF to justify it being able to counter FH's time control. Saying END > Zeref requires layers upon layers of assumption. Saying Zeref > END just requires looking at all their feats from the manga.

 

[WoWfan]

And so long as he was one of the three, he would not die, as a demon, he would not die, like you said. He was still transforming by your percentage giving. But that is what it means not to die by being one of the three things that would keep him from dying, demon would have been the best choice for killing Zeref, or as a dragon to kill Acnologia, either would have been no different as the world would have been saved. It doesn’t matter as his flames would be intense enough to distort time and space to both beat and kill Zeref, not just beat.

 

[LaGOAT]

How can wall be county lvl when he lost to laxus who isn’t country lvl and not on acno lvl who this nigga claim he is only mountain lvl boy said spriggans>Dragons (acno n ingeel) just laughing at this argument

This guy logic is end>dimaria>=zeref

 

[Arjuna]

No, being up and moving doesn't mean Natsu wasn't dying. Gray was up and fighting too, but he was still heavily wounded. The moment their rage subsided and their adrenaline dropped, they felt the effects of their condition. You can be dying and still have enough energy to pick fights, you just won't be as strong as you would be when you're healthy. Come to think of it, this would explain why END is so weak compared to Natsu with his own powers.

Natsu wasn't thinking about his friendship with Lucy, or all the good times they had. He was thinking about how sad and angry he was that she died. Completely different context. To pretend that this mindset was anything close to what he was thinking when he fought Zeref is just silly.

I don't know or care about Trunks. He's irrelevant. I care about what the characters in this series can do. Spriggans do not have feats of destroying a country. Nobody ever said that they could destroy a country. You are welcome to prove me wrong because: I am STILL waiting for proof of anyone saying Spriggans can wipe a country off the face of the map.

Spriggan aren't country level,Axiomus the only entity who might be country level is Time space Absorbed Acnologia.

 

[WoWfan]

Laxus is large country level by scaling to Spriggans. Acnologia and Igneel are well above that. END is simply strong enough to kill Zeref and has the ability to do that