Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[tirakai]

It's really not inaccurate, sure you personally might enjoy it but there's no disputing its very underwhelming overall performance so far. Sure the ToC isn't exact rankings and editors move stuff depending on what they want to promote , but if it was actually popular it wouldn't be shoved under Yui Kamio with the other flops. This is Kishimoto, if it was doing well it would've had a second cover by now.

Like said though, its underwhelming ToC performance so far doesn't really matter until we see the sales. There's no risk of an early cancellation with 3 dead series under it and an extra space being open. And who knows, maybe now that the prologue's done it'll inject some personality and start doing well, most new series these days seem to start low get big after the first couple volumes.

 

[LuckyJim]

I don't see where all the confidence for Yui Kamio is coming from, even with the increased Shoseki ranking, it's still well below the standards for a new Shonen Jump series. The only reason it continues to run is there's so much empty space in the magazine, I think it's safe to say its dead at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the next series to be cancelled, if it makes it past 32 chapters, I'll be amazed.

 

[Rain Spectre]

It's really not inaccurate, sure you personally might enjoy it but there's no disputing its very underwhelming overall performance so far. Sure the ToC isn't exact rankings and editors move stuff depending on what they want to promote , but if it was actually popular it wouldn't be shoved under Yui Kamio with the other flops. This is Kishimoto, if it was doing well it would've had a second cover by now.

Like said though, it's underwhelming ToC performance so far doesn't really matter until we see the sales. There's no risk of an early cancellation with 3 dead series under it and an extra space being open. And who knows, maybe now that the prologue's done it'll inject some personality and start doing well, most new series these days seem to start low get big after the first couple volumes.

I think the issue I and many others continue to have with Samurai 8 is simply that Kishi is the one writing it. It's not a bad series by any means, but when you combine the insane weight his name carries combined with it being pushed so heavily in its first few months and especially before release, it feels like it doesn't live up to expectations. That's not even really its fault per say, it's just the inevitable fate anything Kishi would do after Naruto is going to carry.

 

[tirakai]

Speaking of which, it's been a while since we've actually had a probably immediate hit. Act-age, Jujutsu, and Chainsawman are all doing well now but they all had a somewhat weak/shaky beginning.

We haven't had a real instant hit with the readers since Dr Stone back in early 2017.

 

[lgrmjauffre]

I think the issue I and many others continue to have with Samurai 8 is simply that Kishi is the one writing it. It's not a bad series by any means, but when you combine the insane weight his name carries combined with it being pushed so heavily in its first few months and especially before release, it feels like it doesn't live up to expectations. That's not even really its fault per say, it's just the inevitable fate anything Kishi would do after Naruto is going to carry.

And there's your problem. Letting the supposed "hype" behind a series ruin it for you by "not living up to expectations" is extremely baffling to me. It's either good or bad based on the actual contents of the series. And based on everything post volume 1, a lot more people are starting to lean towards good. Naruto's significance and quality are totally irrelevant and separate from Samurai 8.

 

[Rain Spectre]

And there's your problem. Letting the supposed "hype" behind a series ruin it for you by "not living up to expectations" is extremely baffling to me. It's either good or bad based on the actual contents of the series. And based on everything post volume 1, a lot more people are starting to lean towards good. Naruto's significance and quality are totally irrelevant and separate from Samurai 8.

Uh...you can always argue "Judge Samurai 8 on its own merits" all you want, but saying that it will be evaluated on the basis of Naruto is literally basic marketing stuff.

 

[Vizard]

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 7, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 7, 2019 ---

 

[Xzone]

We had critique or mocks series like Hungry mary, Futari no Taisei, Golem Heart, ibitsu no amalgan,demon's plan,... why they can do it with sam8?

But yeah, this topic is getting old, I prefer talking about other things.

Tosh should try his hand at being a serialized writer. Negi Haruba was only the artist for one series before he came up with Gotoubun. Tosh's oneshot Our Love Counseling is not half bad. Scratch that, what about a non-H version of Harem Time?

Idk if tosh doing the same but without an excuse for the echii will work.

 

[Serinox]

Shima really underestimates himself. This may be a controversial opinion, but if there's a mangaka that possibly has more potential than Inoue and Oda, it's him.

possibly has more potential than Inoue

Inoue

I mean, Oda is even a stretch, but Inoue...? Not even remotely close, imo. I mean, Shima is not bad, don't get me wrong, most certainly better than his reputation that he gets around here, but that claim is a bit too lofty, I feel.

 

[Rain Spectre]

I mean, Oda is even a stretch, but Inoue...? Not even remotely close, imo.

Heh, "stretch".

 

[Halloween]

I mean, Oda is even a stretch, but Inoue...? Not even remotely close, imo. I mean, Shima is not bad, don't get me wrong, most certainly better than his reputation that he gets around here, but that claim is a bit too lofty, I feel.

Personally, I don't feel that Shima has reached his full potential yet. Toriko was great, but I don't think it was, like, his masterpiece.

To me, it seems like he hasn't truly figured out what he wants to do. Like, his passion project. It's part of the reason I want him to serialize Build King, because he seems to have a genuine interest in architecture. I'd say the same for Kubo and fashion, to be fair.

And again, I did say the opinion would be controversial. He may never do another serialization again and just leave his potential untapped. I hope that isn't the case. Part of me wonders if he doesn't just go the Kishi route and have another artist do the next series. Maybe he's a better writer? I guess we'll see.

 

[Konja9]

Thing is, it isn't that certain things worked out that was relevant, it was all the series from that period showed some semblance of potential from Chapter 1. Aside from Samurai 8 (which is more disappointing than anything else), I can't see what Jump saw in the March-May serializations that made them so worthy to be jump-started.

It doesn't matter if you see potential or not. People in WSJ should see some potential in these mangas.

The mangas of this batch are not different from other failures in the magazine.

I don't see where all the confidence for Yui Kamio is coming from, even with the increased Shoseki ranking, it's still well below the standards for a new Shonen Jump series. The only reason it continues to run is there's so much empty space in the magazine, I think it's safe to say its dead at this point. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the next series to be cancelled, if it makes it past 32 chapters, I'll be amazed.

Yui Kamio wouldn't be the next series to be canceled, because there are three series under it that are worse in sales and TOC (I'm not including Samurai 8).

As you say, there is so much empty space, then they can't axe all the bottom. This is why TSS may survive one or two rounds more.

 

[tirakai]

TSS getting bonus chapters Giga does make it seem like they plan to keep it around longer than Beast Children and Double Taisei at least.

Remember there's also still an empty space in the magazine currently being filled by extra oneshots and bonus chapters (Shokugeki, Zumou, and Saiyuuki ended but only two series replaced them).

TSS I can't imagine lasting past one extra batch but at this point Yui Kamio seems likely to stick around until they get a new couple of real hits. Sure it's not successful but, with essentially 6 other slots for new series (TSS, taisei, beast, Yozakura, Security, and one empty slot) and 4 series potentially ending in the next year, there'll always be other stuff that should go first unless they do another special huge batch.

 

[RafGL]

Beast Children is officially out from Shoseki Rankings after 2 days, ranking on its 1st day on #161 and #485 on the second one. We may have a new U19 member?

 

[4Eyes]

Speaking of which, it's been a while since we've actually had a probably immediate hit. Act-age, Jujutsu, and Chainsawman are all doing well now but they all had a somewhat weak/shaky beginning.

We haven't had a real instant hit with the readers since Dr Stone back in early 2017.

IIRC even Dr. Stone was struggling in the beggining. Things only picked up when Inagaki shifted focus away from Yuruziha and Taiju. So I think our last instant hit in the main magazine was The Promised Neverland back then in 2016 (?)
If we consider Jump+, we have SxF.

 

[Jovan]

Interesting thing I just realized, Kamio Yui still hasn't gotten a single CP past the 2nd chapter despite Vol 1/Vol 2 being out. Doesn't seem like Shueisha is happy with how it's doing, but it feels safe unless Jump goes on a killing spree. Which is what they need to do after losing 2 veterans with Neverland nearing the end.

IIRC even Dr. Stone was struggling in the beggining. Things only picked up when Inagaki shifted focus away from Yuruziha and Taiju. So I think our last instant hit in the main magazine was The Promised Neverland back then in 2016 (?)
If we consider Jump+, we have SxF.

Dr. Stone always did well TOC wise since the very beginning. Even WNL was your friendly neighborhood middle manga most of the time except for the Ch. 21 where it was a Bottom 2.

 

[tirakai]

They don't need to start doing more big batches, what they need is better choices of what to run in the magazine. They haven't an instant hit with readers for more than 2 years (ever since Nak joined).

They just did a batch of 4 of which 3 are total flops and the other is an established creator performing significantly below expectations. Killing stuff off quicker won't matter if they keep filling new slots with series that take 2 volumes to introduce an actual story of any kind.

 

[4Eyes]

Interesting thing I just realized, Kamio Yui still hasn't gotten a single CP past the 2nd chapter despite Vol 1/Vol 2 being out. Doesn't seem like Shueisha is happy with how it's doing, but it feels safe unless Jump goes on a killing spree. Which is what they need to do after losing 2 veterans with Neverland nearing the end.



Dr. Stone always did well TOC wise since the very beginning. Even WNL was your friendly neighborhood middle manga most of the time except for the Ch. 21 where it was a Bottom 2.

Yes, I was in doubt if I should consider WNL since middle rankings are actually very good the for romcoms but I still disagree about Dr. Stone. It did only OK in the beggining, it wasn't a flop but wasn't a instant hit either.

 

[Leoat12]

Uh...you can always argue "Judge Samurai 8 on its own merits" all you want, but saying that it will be evaluated on the basis of Naruto is literally basic marketing stuff.

People say that, but the first thing Jump do is put at the cover in capslock "NARUTO'S AUTHOR NEW SERIES" like they did when it started and what they will certainly do once the volume is released. Furthermore, nobody would be defending Samurai 8 so much if it was not for Kishimoto, no series in the bottom right now is receiving the benefit of the doubt like Samurai 8 is, including Yui Kamio, which is from a veteran, but a much less prestigious one.
So people should not come with the merit argument here, Samurai 8 would be in the line for the guillotine if it were not for Naruto and Kishimoto name.

 

[savethecat]

Random, but after Neverland ends, I sorta hope that Posuka starts getting request to provide character designs for anime and games.