Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[Shinuki no Reborn]

MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10

Good Votes!

 

[Halloween]

Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween

 

[Ryuusei]

Spoiler: 52 TOC & 01 Preview

呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル

Spoiler: Issue #52 ToC & Preview

Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file

 

[Halloween]

Thanks to @yadayada for making me remember this.

I absolutely *loathe* the child badass trope. (Hitsugaya from Bleach, etc)

 

[James Rye]

Question - What, in YOUR opinion (don't attack others), are the dumbest shonen trends/cliches that still exists today in WSJ?

Damsel in distress, often in a not so clever way that you have a talented or strong woman who had been shown to be a badass suddenly be in dire need of rescue, either by being helplessly captured or by being on the brink of losing and the hero swoops in to save the day and pretty much he just does and you're like "okay, so why did that work but all the skills and abilities of the girl/woman were unable to help herself?". This happens quite often but it can be done and has been done in either clever ways like team rescues, the hero just providing the means of escape but the damsel escapes on her own, them combining forces to win the battle, etc. But the usual "DiD" happens so often it is really a cliche.

 

[TyVip]

The Lancer (rival) is a foil to the Hero (protagonist). It's a writing trope, you can't really run away from it.

I absolutely *loathe* the child badass trope. (Hitsugaya from Bleach, etc)

Do you mean like a child prodigy compare to his/her peers? or a child prodigy when compare to adult (Hitsugaya, Itachi, Killua)? The former is usually a writing trope that you can't really avoid if you do the rival setting

 

[Halloween]

or a child prodigy when compare to adult

This, yes.

 

[Ryuusei]

Issue 35: 3 August (My Hero Academia cover, 6th anniversary. I personally am betting for Tabata congratulating Horikoshi in the author comments)
Issue 36-37: 10 August (our first groupal cover without Hinata, Tanjirou and Emma, who will join Luffy and Deku in the front?)
Issue 38: 24 August (the issue where HxH will break its longest hiatus record)

I am betting new serialization round on issue 38 or 39. Burn the Witch has also from issue 38 to 41 for appear since Nak said Burn the Witch was coming in summer.

I place all my money on Itadori joining Luffy and Midoriya at the front. Senku, Denji, Yonagi and Asta coming in the second tier since they are pretty much on the same level (unless they put only Luffy and Midoriya at the front and Itadori joins the other 4). Fumino/Rizu are on a weird position with Yuuna gone and it's on a tier of sales of its own, maybe they will form a group with Mash and Andy. The rest of the newbies is up for debate.

 

[ChrissyR5]

Question - What, in YOUR opinion (don't attack others), are the dumbest shonen trends/cliches that still exists today in WSJ?

Probably the pervert character.

 

[ItsSamu]

My last ones were more annoying than anything but some that are just plain bad or lazy:

• When female characters are initially introduced as badasses in their own right only to be beaten as a benchmark/never really given many chances to prove themselves in the long run and end up useless/their potential fights given to another male/main character. It happens so often that sometimes I don't register it until after the fact. (For all its flaws, Black Clover at least does a great job at giving the girls and women their chance to shine).
• Older brother who is obsessed with his younger sister. (Black Clover, Yozakura)
• Dead/overseas parents. I get that's one way of having the teenage protagonist seem independent, but a great parent-child relationship will almost always be better. (Parents being killed off during the story don't count)
• Too much exposition and over explaining details that could be shown, especially in the opening chapters. Prime example since it's fresh in my mind - in the first chapter of Yozakura Family after introducing Taiyo and Mutsumi and their dynamic, on page 4 it has the side characters ask why the most popular girl in school gets on with the socially awkward guy and then proceed to talk about how they are childhood friends in the very next speech bubble. We didn't need those characters to tell us this when the answer was shown literally to the audience 4 pages later.

As for a trope I will always love - mainly due to the Big 3 doing them so well - is introducing groups of powerful characters, whether allies of villains. Captains, Supernovas, Yonko, Kages, Espada, Akatsuki - all were damn good and I never get tired of it.

 

[Serinox]

Dead/overseas parents. I get that's one way of having the teenage protagonist seem independent, but a great parent-child relationship will almost always be better.

This is just a reflection of the Japanese reality though, since absent working parents, especially fathers, are just very common. Some parents are so absent due to work, they might as well be "dead".

 

[BX-02BLODIA]

I don't hate any trope.

 

[Minsel]

I don't hate any trope.

that's illegal

 

[pamuchi]

Yeah, my most disliked trope would be the rival-like characters. But I make an exception with Kaiba.

But what would be the subverted tropes you have seen in jump lately?

 

[ItsSamu]

This is just a reflection of the Japanese reality though, since absent working parents, especially fathers, are just very common. Some parents are so absent due to work, they might as well be "dead".

For sure there's some truth to it if it's tapped into in the first place, but it's still probably way less common than anime/manga would make us believe. I'd bet the vast majority of Japanese households have parents and children living together. I get why writers do it though - them being there might complicate things and maybe prevent certain premises from playing out. But it still feels a little contrived if the parents must be working overseas for the story to take off.

 

[Teennitro]

Damsel in distress, often in a not so clever way that you have a talented or strong woman who had been shown to be a badass suddenly be in dire need of rescue, either by being helplessly captured or by being on the brink of losing and the hero swoops in to save the day and pretty much he just does and you're like "okay, so why did that work but all the skills and abilities of the girl/woman were unable to help herself?

I think this trope is dying out I don't see this happening as much in the current generation of Shonen Jump

 

[therocomotion]

I think this trope is dying out I don't see this happening as much in the current generation of Shonen Jump

Really? It happens all the time in UwU. Nothing against UwU, it's a decent manga, and Unlucky has held her ground decently considering her situation, but she is frequently placed in a situation in which Andy has to save her. I guess at least she isn't really a badass yet and is still in-training?

The damsel in distress trope is also the whole driving force of the plot Ayakashi Triangle and Yozakura Family. And in The Witch's Guardian that ended just a bit ago.

 

[James Rye]

Really? It happens all the time in UwU. Nothing against UwU, it's a decent manga, and Unlucky has held her ground decently considering her situation, but she is frequently placed in a situation in which Andy has to save her. I guess at least she isn't really a badass yet and is still in-training?

The damsel in distress trope is also the whole driving force of the plot Ayakashi Triangle and Yozakura Family. And in The Witch's Guardian that ended just a bit ago.

I think you misunderstand the trope Teennitro is talking about.
We are talking about badass women who got introduced as elites, veterans, awesome fighters, great mages, etc. and who we see constantly in need of saving. An example for that would be that Ninja woman with the fishnets who was one of the high ranked Ninjas, a master and everything and yet we hardly saw much of that. The few times we saw her fighting she always needed someone to come in and help or save her.
In Fuuko's case she was not introduced as a badass she was introduced as a suicidal shut-in who had only lived so far to finish the Shoujo series she loved. If anything Fuuko is on her way to become a badass as in 1. Using her power offensively 2. Think up plans on how to deal with enemies like with Spoil's power being largely useless in space 3. using weapons like guns and swords 4. kill Andy by beheading it when he could't do so himself. And let's not forget that she actually did save Andy from Victor, which is more than Sakura was able to do for Naruto in terms of saving.
The examples you are talking about, and in that UU belongs as well (for now), is "proper Damsel in Distress" (still annoying but at least it does serve a purpose and is due circumstances) as in the said Damsel does need saving as she cannot save herself and is in constant danger thus in need of constant protection. In AT Suzu is an Ayakashi Medium and a normal girl, no way she can fight off Ayakashi trying to eat her. In YF (I seriously forgot her name...) the family head is also a normal girl targeted by the whole world due her genes and as tough and cool as she is, she would not win a fight on her own if it was against a real threat and she and her family know that. In UU Fuuko is thrown into a crazy world where she has to orientate herself, but if you compare her latest acts to her first ones then she has already gone through a lot of development to become a future badass herself someday. At least she will be more of a badass than the Damsels in the other series.

 

[Kobī-Stan]

Favorite tropes are the Post Spectacle Brawl- where after all the crazy stuff the characters have to use from power escalation, we end with just a fatigued slugfest. Naruto vs Sasuke the first Jump example, but my favorite is Kazuma vs Ryuhou from s-CRY-ed

Another is the named technique/screaming the technique name for stronger potency.

And of course the Tournament Arc!

 

[Konja9]

I think you misunderstand the trope Teennitro is talking about.
We are talking about badass women who got introduced as elites, veterans, awesome fighters, great mages, etc. and who we see constantly in need of saving. An example for that would be that Ninja woman with the fishnets who was one of the high ranked Ninjas, a master and everything and yet we hardly saw much of that. The few times we saw her fighting she always needed someone to come in and help or save her.
In Fuuko's case she was not introduced as a badass she was introduced as a suicidal shut-in who had only lived so far to finish the Shoujo series she loved. If anything Fuuko is on her way to become a badass as in 1. Using her power offensively 2. Think up plans on how to deal with enemies like with Spoil's power being largely useless in space 3. using weapons like guns and swords 4. kill Andy by beheading it when he could't do so himself. And let's not forget that she actually did save Andy from Victor, which is more than Sakura was able to do for Naruto in terms of saving.
The examples you are talking about, and in that UU belongs as well (for now), is "proper Damsel in Distress" (still annoying but at least it does serve a purpose and is due circumstances) as in the said Damsel does need saving as she cannot save herself and is in constant danger thus in need of constant protection. In AT Suzu is an Ayakashi Medium and a normal girl, no way she can fight off Ayakashi trying to eat her. In YF (I seriously forgot her name...) the family head is also a normal girl targeted by the whole world due her genes and as tough and cool as she is, she would not win a fight on her own if it was against a real threat and she and her family know that. In UU Fuuko is thrown into a crazy world where she has to orientate herself, but if you compare her latest acts to her first ones then she has already gone through a lot of development to become a future badass herself someday. At least she will be more of a badass than the Damsels in the other series.

The confusion is because you mention "Damsel in Distress" trope, which cover any female character that has to be saved frequently.

The trope you are speaking is "Faux Action Girl".

 

[101nemesis]

Another trope I'm completely annoyed by is the overly perverted side character. Like, Master Roshi or the sticky balls dude in MHA, etc.

Sticky balls dude. Wonder if that's how Horikoshi first thought of the character.

The only pervy character I really liked is Jiraya from Naruto.

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 18, 2020, Original Post Date: Jul 18, 2020 ---

This, yes.

I feel like child prodigy was done differently in jujutsu in the sense that Satoru Gojo's mere presence in the world shifted the power balance scale.
I felt like that was a unique twist to it. But young adult Gojo had all the qualities of an overconfident child prodigy (as does the current Gojo)

 

[SharkBait]

Mineta is kind of funny to me and he has a heart of gold, can't hate the kid when he's acting his age. pervy old dudes though, please go away.
(Jiraiya is no liar, and at least the girls for him were age appropriate)

 

[TheEnhancedExe]

I don't hate any trope.

Me neither. I guess it depends on how a manga executes the trope. For example there are anime and manga, where I really don't like the execution of the "male character that looks like a female character" trope or vice versa. One manga where I didn't mind the trope at all was Assassination Classroom. I also don't mind it in One Piece either.

On the other hand, while I really like HxH, this was one of the issues I had with it. Though I didn't mind it in Kurapika's case, but rather the few other cases that I can think of. It was also one of the things that initially turned me off from Agravity Boys and why I couldn't really get into it despite trying. I honestly can't even tell why I don't mind it in Nagisa's case and Kurapika's case and why I mind it in these other cases. I'd even say it probably enhanced Assassination Classroom because Nagisa looked like a girl.

Though I guess I feel like this with most other shounen tropes. There's examples where I liked the trope and examples where I disliked it. Execution is what matters in the end, imo.