He wasn't necessarily saved by the Doc Sam, maybe he got protected or maybe Marm and I suspect a different scenario might have played out. She is the only one who didn't call me a complete schizo before
Unless you've got something substantial to prove it then its only a theory with nothing to support it; we've seen Pom die as Doc so its at least fact that she protected Hardy and that there was no N1 kill. Without evidence like that you're just fantasising.
So, have you got an actual explanation with backing (your own role actions) that provides an alternate explanation for no N1 kill?
And again, you really should be revealing. The avoidance of that is scummy; you could share targets but you haven't done that either
Hola I’m here now till I fall asleep.
I hinted that I had an active role, but considering the nature of my role thats not actually true. I’m a bulletproof, I wanted to seem like an active cutie to see if a mafia or two might fall for. This does mean there is a possibility Pom did not prevent a kill, there is no one that can confirm that I think.
Now before you get mad and tunnel; if we mislynch we are fucked so please think and lers make decisions when we have all the information.
I do agree that at this point any information is helpful; we need to do it right today otherwise the game might be over very soon. It helps making a balanced decision and hopefully lynch right this time
I do agree that at this point any information is helpful; we need to do it right today otherwise the game might be over very soon. It helps making a balanced decision and hopefully lynch right this time
If he doesn't it'll speak pretty loudly about his alignment. Resisting the mass claims for what reason? Games over if we mislynch again so the lack of information only hurts town. Extra information won't make a difference to mafia who just need to kill again at night if we get there to keep the pressure right on us, so really he should be claiming.
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Refusing to claim whatsoever is exactly what I did as mafia a few games ago and I think that lesson is still fresh in all of our minds given I won that game, so its just incredibly dodgy
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@Marmalade have your thoughts changed at all since you started reading what you were away for? Surely you don't find Vali as middle ground in comparison to people like Nash with that Necro claim
We're probably fucking cooked here but we can definitely extend it if we all lock the fuck in and get a lynch right
(I would still like you and Hardy to hard claim tho)
@Natasha to come back to your earlier question, do you think it's possible Kako saw Hardy Guilty? That would be commensurate with you finding Guilty on Sam and the impossibility of a second Det in this game? If mafia misfired on BP Marm, then Hardy being covered is no longer the reason the kill failed
so it'd be
nashy necro
tatsu avenger
marm bp
pan town
kako det
pom doc
vali ???
hardy guilty by kako? -> no claim
sam eversus
dego mafia for clumsy det claim
Hmmm yeah we absolutely do need to lock the fuck in. I’m mostly thinking out loud here, it is a process.
Alright so looking at the claims.
With Vali I’m mostly wondering if this is something a mafia would do (not claiming when asked). As it draws a lot of attention to him. Surely the mafiateam would have thought of claims by now?
I think one thing to consider is, do we believe the double detective claim and if so, what about their sanities. Dego didn’t stand out to me so far but this is interesting. I don’t think it’s impossible. However if there is also a necromancer in the game… isn’t that a lot of investigative roles in such a small game? So I’m inclined to believe that either Dego or Nash might not be telling the truth. Is it more likely to have a double det combination or a necro + det combination? Perhaps this is a good starting point to analyse.
Assuming only one is being untruthful here.
In my earlier sus list I would have voted Nash over Dego - I’m not sure about that now.
- So we have Nash using Kako’s det to investigate Sam
- Dego getting guilty on nash and innocent on me if I’m remembering correctly.
My issue is that I found BOTH Sam and Nash sus in my latest reading. If Nash is telling the truth, and we only have 1 det in that case, Kako should be sane right.
if I’m looking at Sam versus Nash (and with this Nash versus Dego) in this scenario, I get more mafia vibes from Sam. And big part of that is him suddenly being calm. It is too calm. Where are the tunnels, where is the fast decision making? He was sussing me so much I genuinely thought he would immediately spiral after my claim. And no, this is not old Sam behavior imo. This is what is pushing me to believe Nash over Dego. To add to that, Nash her attitude feels more like a confused townie who doesn’t have the energy anymore to play during this phase.
I need to look into this more and I am sleepy so I need to process this for a bit as well.
Tatsu’s avenger claim is unexpected to me, maybe not impossible. I don’t think her claiming this makes her green for me, but I do wonder if is a move mafiaTatsu would do. Maybe, she’s a smart girl.
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Sorry for the wall I hope it isn’t as long on pc as it is on mobile I hate it when other people post walls hahaha
Hardy randomly playing games with me, hurr durr "guess my role. oh you didnt get it, mafia also wouldn't know", while slowly moving to frame me. Mans didn't even claim.
Sam keeps saying he's changed his opinion but every other post he and Hardy are throwing 3 name combinations to see what seems agreeable.
Dego super clumsy reasoning and roll out?
I just need Vali and Hardy I guess to actually claim before I lock this worldview
Had to stop to wash the place because a cat did a mess.
I wanted to see who claimed before me and who waited to avoid a counter claim but whatever.
I'm another vanilla townie. Since Pom very likely saved me it means mafias went for me thinking I had something good, which is why I asked Panda my role several times but he dodged for wtv reason... I thought that maybe he understood from our exchange in D1 that I didn't have a good role, which in turn meant he wasn't in the mafia team that targeted me, but welp.
Btw since Pom used her role on me you can all be sure I'm not a recruited sleeper. Bums.
I'm fucking lost, like there's so much sus shit going on between Vali refusing to claim for some fucking reason and acting oddly aggressive with Hardy (intent to throw his vote away early in the day phase). Could be an irrational town but I need to mull it over
Do you believe Nash? Do you believe Dego? Answer clearly
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No I think mafia failed their kill on Marm, meaning Pom didn't prevent the kill on Hardy. He wouldn't be the kill target and therefore eligible to receive a guilty result. Vali wouldn't be in the camp with Hardy. Nashy and I can't be with you. Marm must be uncharacteristically bold and assertive mafia to place a vote of confidence in me in the last 30 secs. Tatsu had an odd playstyle at the start of D1 but I do believe her. Man you and Dego also tried to do vote train on me. You and him for sure are mafia. You gon get packed up
There is a scenario where Nash is making it up but Nash said her role fits her character well in post #16, so the hint is consistent with the claim. If Nash is legitimate then her result on me confirms me as Town assuming insane was Kako's sanity; he probably got guilty on T!Hardy hence why he was edgy with him yesterday?
That'd mean me, Hardy, and Nash are town. In that scenario I actually think you're more likely to be town than Marm, so the scums are between Tatsu, Vali, Dego, and Marm.
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What gives me pause is Vali was saying "me and Marm" a fair bit in his recent posts; maybe I'm reading into it too much but could they be teammates? Marm claims bulletproof to discredit Pom targeting Hardy being what stopped the kill, and they try to get Hardy lynched from there?
Unless you've got something substantial to prove it then its only a theory with nothing to support it; we've seen Pom die as Doc so its at least fact that she protected Hardy and that there was no N1 kill. Without evidence like that you're just fantasising.
bro bashing me for not believing pom, then does all this
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Gonna sleep now. Busy day tomorrow but I do wanna hear more Vali Marm Tatsu and Hardy. Mostly I need a Vali claim. We should also discuss how many locks on Sam
For yelling at Vali for being incorrect with the information that was present? You cannot be fucking serious cunt
>Vali argues that Hardy being protected can't be the reason for no kill
>I ask why, ask for evidence
>Cites that him and Marm have a theory, refuses to elaborate
>Marm (perhaps conveniently) claims Bulletproof after previously claiming active
>Vali still doesn't claim
Yet you're giving me shit for calling him out given that sequence of events? If you're town then Marms got you in a trance, and if you're not then I better not speak
By mafia(?) pan pushing agendas and people who aren't thinking
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I really don't like how that bear was starting to come for me in that last exchange, I see it as being a bit similar to his pom comment where he thinks there's blood in the water so he's throwing something out there to see who'll go with him on it
Hmmm yeah we absolutely do need to lock the fuck in. I’m mostly thinking out loud here, it is a process.
Alright so looking at the claims.
With Vali I’m mostly wondering if this is something a mafia would do (not claiming when asked). As it draws a lot of attention to him. Surely the mafiateam would have thought of claims by now?
I think one thing to consider is, do we believe the double detective claim and if so, what about their sanities. Dego didn’t stand out to me so far but this is interesting. I don’t think it’s impossible. However if there is also a necromancer in the game… isn’t that a lot of investigative roles in such a small game? So I’m inclined to believe that either Dego or Nash might not be telling the truth. Is it more likely to have a double det combination or a necro + det combination? Perhaps this is a good starting point to analyse.
Assuming only one is being untruthful here.
In my earlier sus list I would have voted Nash over Dego - I’m not sure about that now.
- So we have Nash using Kako’s det to investigate Sam
- Dego getting guilty on nash and innocent on me if I’m remembering correctly.
My issue is that I found BOTH Sam and Nash sus in my latest reading. If Nash is telling the truth, and we only have 1 det in that case, Kako should be sane right.
if I’m looking at Sam versus Nash (and with this Nash versus Dego) in this scenario, I get more mafia vibes from Sam. And big part of that is him suddenly being calm. It is too calm. Where are the tunnels, where is the fast decision making? He was sussing me so much I genuinely thought he would immediately spiral after my claim. And no, this is not old Sam behavior imo. This is what is pushing me to believe Nash over Dego. To add to that, Nash her attitude feels more like a confused townie who doesn’t have the energy anymore to play during this phase.
I need to look into this more and I am sleepy so I need to process this for a bit as well.
Tatsu’s avenger claim is unexpected to me, maybe not impossible. I don’t think her claiming this makes her green for me, but I do wonder if is a move mafiaTatsu would do. Maybe, she’s a smart girl.
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Sorry for the wall I hope it isn’t as long on pc as it is on mobile I hate it when other people post walls hahaha
Gonna have to start calling you Kelso from That 70's Show
Thanks for taking the time to provide your thoughts even when you were skronked Marm.
On Vali, I agree that not claiming looks dodgy and like scum stalling (case in point, me a few games ago when I refused to claim). I don't think his general play has been very town, and a bit off in places. What did you make of him associating himself with you when he argued you agreed with him and that you both had reasons to not be claiming?
I don't think its a guarantee that Kako is sane. Pom argued that she prevented the kill N1 by protecting Hardy, Kako seemingly checked Hardy and was butting heads with him, but would he do that if he got a sane result? If it was guilty on a T!Hardy in that situation then it'd mean I'm town based on Nash's result of using an insane det to check me. You did raise the possibility that someone targeted you because you were bulletproof; what I'd like to know is why you didn't announce it last day after Pom said that if you thought she might've been wrong about that? Or did you and I missed it? Either way, I'd think Hardy a more likely target for mafia than you (no offense) which makes me think the Pom protection scenario might be the one that happened (regardless of you being bulletproof or not).
I think Dego is lying about being detective. I highly doubt there's a 2nd one assuming Nash is Town and Necro; and for that matter I do think a det in an 11 person game doesn't have to be Sane. His reasoning felt shallow, poorly explained, and poorly thought out because if he got a guilty result on Nash then still trusting her after that is a bit of a leap that I can't follow logically. Townies do illogical shit sometimes but I dunno, if a result says red you'd think more critically of that individual until you have more information.
You don't believe me and I find that a bit surprising because I reckon I'm pretty transparent. I've been sitting back a bit more because I am genuinely feeling fatigued and I've got some pretty bad phen rage from my meds that has made me a bit volatile. I can only offer so much in my circumstances because I'm Vanilla Townie and I'm not confident in how I'm going this game, but this is also high stakes as one mislynch loses it for us and I don't think anyone can realistically take a chance on me at this point.
Maybe you're all paranoid of me after that game when I was mafia recently, but I'm genuinely just town me having a stinker. I also don't think my arguments have been in bad faith; sure you can argue some might be too tunnelly/focused on just Pan, but I'm playing firm with what my reads are and trying to make my best effort. Go back to my arguing of the Pom protection for an example; I don't think its bad faith of me to have argued Hardy was town with the information we had (pom protection, lack of kill).
From my perspective, I only see a couple of possible team comps but I think positionally it comes down to this:
1. Dego/Nash
2. Copan/Marm
3. Vali/Tatsu (heavily leaning Vali) OR Hardy (in a M!Nash scenario)
I don't see you or Copan being on the same mafia team but there's a chance you're both town and barking up the wrong tree. Either way, you guys are giving each other too much rope but I guess you get that when you're bumpin uglies.
Dego/Nash is probably a contest for a spot as I don't think both claims can be true.
Lastly, 3rd slot is a bit hairy depending on scenario. I need to rack my brain more
Sorry for the wall but I wanted to make sure you weren't ignored and had something to read through to hopefully at least understand my perspective. If you don't trust me and you're town then I guess we're screwed, but hopefully some sober reflection can have you seeing the truth.
Hola I’m here now till I fall asleep.
I hinted that I had an active role, but considering the nature of my role thats not actually true. I’m a bulletproof, I wanted to seem like an active cutie to see if a mafia or two might fall for. This does mean there is a possibility Pom did not prevent a kill, there is no one that can confirm that I think.
Now before you get mad and tunnel; if we mislynch we are fucked so please think and lers make decisions when we have all the information.
I believe this, and i will full claim before the last hour to let people discuss.
I can anticipate that i am not able to frame Hardy specifically because my night action on him produced no results in Day 2, hence my frustration, but yours makes it believable that Hardy isn't a confirmed Townie at least.
Still i will have to think about who to focus for my lynch vote, probably Sam or Dego.
I hate it when other people post walls hahaha
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