Discussion About the King Zahard

[Lonatian]

Is Zahard qualified to be King?

My answer is yes.
Just because we know Zahard is main villain doesn't mean he's not qualified to be King.

In terms of strength
Zahard is at the top of strength. There could be an argument about whether he's first or second on the team, but he can't go down to the top 3.

It's very funny when someone says he's weak just because he ran away from the robots, or couldn't break down the door.
We don't know what their challenge is, and the entire flashback only has Yeon actually attacking the robot. The rest do almost nothing.

In terms of leadership
From begining to the end, Zahard has always been their leader.
It will be more unreasonable if someone in this team became King instead of their leader. Even if there is a vote, it is clear that Zahard is the best candidate.

In terms of supporters
According to Amizu's flashback, it seems that all 10 family heads agreed on Zahard being King. At that time, all 10 people had their own subordinates, everyone called them Lords.
Which means there are more people supporting Zahard than you might think. In any case, it is reasonable for the leader of a group of great warriors to become King.

Conclusion
There are some people who create "funny" theories comparing Zahard to V. They believe that Zahard felt jealous and weaker than V, so he brainwashed others into making him King.

That's impossible. Zahard's intention to become King had been around for a long time, since they were young. It seemed like everyone knew about it, and no one complained. They may see it as natural.

There is no information that says V is stronger than Zahard, and nothing proves that Zahard is a weak jealous person. The desire to become king was Zahard's intention, stemming from his desire to make the tower a place where everyone could live happily. Although time has made him realize that he cannot please everyone, it is clear that as King, he actually ended the war and kept the peace for thousands of years.
Zahard and the 10 family heads may not be good rulers of the tower but they really brought about the development of the tower after stopped climping.

If at that time, they would have continued climbing the tower according to V's wishes. Do you think the tower would have developed like it has today?

 

[V_TheHiddenAxis]

Yeah he is. But V > Virgin zahard though.

 

[Demonspeed]

He isn't because Data Eduan said he wasn’t. By trying to become King he lost his way.

Zahard is supposed to be an adventurer.

 

[Lonatian]

Everyone said V deserved to be king more than Zahard. That's possible. Towerborns may prefer V over Zahard.
But the decision-making power belongs to the 10 family heads.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024, Original Post Date: Aug 10, 2024 ---

Considering the context, V also knew that Zahard wanted to become king for a long time.
Obviously, if one day Zahard becomes King, V won't argue about it. If V suddenly took that position, it would be unreasonable.

Stopping climbing the tower and hiding the Key causes them to go into civil war, not because Zahard become King.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024 ---

He isn't because Data Eduan said he wasn’t. By trying to become King he lost his way.

Zahard is supposed to be an adventurer.

We are not sure when the HF time (and flashback about V) occured. It's possible it was early.
But Zahard said that he wanted to be King for a long time, which obviously made Eduan change his mind.

Besides, Eduan said V should become King more than Zahard does not mean that Zahard is not qualified. It's just that Eduan think Zahard should continue to be an adventurer.

 

[VON]

He IS currently the ruling King.

 

[kkck]

Iirc at the hidden floor the framing given about zahard by eduan was that V made more sense as king because V cared about tower inhabitants while the rest cared less and less over time. Data eduan is of course unfamiliar with what happened later in his realm selfs history. The framing given at this point is never about competence for the role but rather disposition. As of now the issue with zahards rule is not that he is inept or incapable of doing it but rather that he is using the throne for his own selfish objectives. Odds are that zahard technically has every competence required to be a kind, just and competent leader that improves the lives of his subjects, he just doesn't give a shit.

 

[Lonatian]

Iirc at the hidden floor the framing given about zahard by eduan was that V made more sense as king because V cared about tower inhabitants while the rest cared less and less over time. Data eduan is of course unfamiliar with what happened later in his realm selfs history. The framing given at this point is never about competence for the role but rather disposition. As of now the issue with zahards rule is not that he is inept or incapable of doing it but rather that he is using the throne for his own selfish objectives. Odds are that zahard technically has every competence required to be a kind, just and competent leader that improves the lives of his subjects, he just doesn't give a shit.

In fact, there are many reasons that made him the person he is today.
To be fair, there is no evidence that he is selfish.
As GoG said, after becoming King, Zahard realized he couldn't please everyone. And Zahard also said that fate is cruel, maybe it forced him to choose his own priorities.

The problem is that people know that, but they still trust Zahard. Zahard is always focused on his position, he can do many things to ensure that peace is always maintained. And that's what normal people need, they just want a normal life without war.
View media item 28955

 

[kkck]

In fact, there are many reasons that made him the person he is today.
To be fair, there is no evidence that he is selfish.
As GoG said, after becoming King, Zahard realized he couldn't please everyone. And Zahard also said that fate is cruel, maybe it forced him to choose his own priorities.

The problem is that people know that, but they still trust Zahard. Zahard is always focused on his position, he can do many things to ensure that peace is always maintained. And that's what normal people need, they just want a normal life without war.
View media item 28955

My point was that he became king to pursue his personal objectives rather than to serve his people. And we know this because he said his goal was to control fate when bam met him.

 

[Lonatian]

My point was that he became king to pursue his personal objectives rather than to serve his people. And we know this because he said his goal was to control fate when bam met him.

I said before, Zahard become a King because he said he want to make the tower a place where everyone could live happily.
That's not personal objectives.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024, Original Post Date: Aug 10, 2024 ---

The control fate is his goal after he became a King.

 

[kkck]

I said before, Zahard become a King because he said he want to make the tower a place where everyone could live happily.
That's not personal objectives.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024, Original Post Date: Aug 10, 2024 ---

The control fate is his goal after he became a King.

What? The series is pretty explicit about how the great warriors cared less and less about tower residents as they climbed. Zahard was an influence over traumerei in this regard. There's no reason to think zahard became king for noble reasons.

 

[Lonatian]

What? The series is pretty explicit about how the great warriors cared less and less about tower residents as they climbed. Zahard was an influence over traumerei in this regard. There's no reason to think zahard became king for noble reasons.

GoG said that. You probably forgot about it.
View media item 28956
Time has changed him. This does not mean that he does it with selfish desires.

 

[kkck]

GoG said that. You probably forgot about it.
View media item 28956
Time has changed him. This does not mean that he does it with selfish desires.

We got more context about that from the data folk in the hidden floor. Eduan himself makes the case that as they climbed they cared less and less. There's no reason to think zahard suddenly changed his goals after ye became king. Eduan specifically notes zahard as a weird choice for king because he didn't care about tower inhabitants while v did.

 

[Lonatian]

We got more context about that from the data folk in the hidden floor. Eduan himself makes the case that as they climbed they cared less and less. There's no reason to think zahard suddenly changed his goals after ye became king. Eduan specifically notes zahard as a weird choice for king because he didn't care about tower inhabitants while v did.

I also said I wasn't sure when the HF event occurred. But Eduan's words are not true to the past story we see.
In the past (Flashback to V), Gustang and Zahard really save people and got stuck after that. Zahard looks so sad when Traumerei pull the lever and people die.
Eduan also said that real Zahard never said he is a King, but we see V called him that.

Obviously, GoG's words are reasonable when Zahard once wanted that.

 

[Demonspeed]

Everyone said V deserved to be king more than Zahard. That's possible. Towerborns may prefer V over Zahard.
But the decision-making power belongs to the 10 family heads.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024, Original Post Date: Aug 10, 2024 ---

Considering the context, V also knew that Zahard wanted to become king for a long time.
Obviously, if one day Zahard becomes King, V won't argue about it. If V suddenly took that position, it would be unreasonable.

Stopping climbing the tower and hiding the Key causes them to go into civil war, not because Zahard become King.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 10, 2024 ---

We are not sure when the HF time (and flashback about V) occured. It's possible it was early.
But Zahard said that he wanted to be King for a long time, which obviously made Eduan change his mind.

Besides, Eduan said V should become King more than Zahard does not mean that Zahard is not qualified. It's just that Eduan think Zahard should continue to be an adventurer.

Saying that V would make a better king doesn't mean that he was more appreciated. They have different kinds of charisma. Zahard can be a good leader no doubt, but being a charismatic adventurer was more fitting for him. Ironically, V and Arlen did what Zahard before his corruption would have wanted to do i.e., tried to keep climbing higher.

From what Thor said, Zahard started talking about becoming king after some painful experience. From there, he made the wrong choice during Revolution. Baam almost did the same thing but he had A.A. and Androssi to pull him in.

When Data Zahard saw his adult self he confessed that he felt that he was different at his core and that's how he convinced him to let Baam go.

Zahard probably has the qualities to become king and he is, but the story tells us that he wasn't the ideal choice. And if there is a "fated king", it's not him.

 

[Lonatian]

Saying that V would make a better king doesn't mean that he was more appreciated. They have different kinds of charisma. Zahard can be a good leader no doubt, but being a charismatic adventurer was more fitting for him. Ironically, V and Arlen did what Zahard before his corruption would have wanted to do i.e., tried to keep climbing higher.

From what Thor said, Zahard started talking about becoming king after some painful experience. From there, he made the wrong choice during Revolution. Baam almost did the same thing but he had A.A. and Androssi to pull him in.

When Data Zahard saw his adult self he confessed that he felt that he was different at his core and that's how he convinced him to let Baam go.

Zahard probably has the qualities to become king and he is, but the story tells us that he wasn't the ideal choice. And if there is a "fated king", it's not him.

My personal opinion is that Zahard is one of "fate king". He was chosen as soon as he entered the tower.
SIU said the king of the tower is not like other kings. Maybe the tower needs a king who is rational and ruthless, but treats everyone equally under the law, and has no emotions involved.
Zahard (data) said he knew he couldn't run away from it whether he wanted to or not. But in the adult version, Zahard said he found a way to fight against fate. That no longer pleased the tower.
The story up until now has always been about Baam changing the tower, defeating Zahard and the 10 family heads. My theory is that this tower is the final boss. It just wants to replace an old cast of main characters (Zahard and his friends) with a new generation.
As the villains of the story (Talse User Story), there is no good ending for them, so they, like every other story, will fight for themselves.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 11, 2024, Original Post Date: Aug 11, 2024 ---

From the Dallar show to the Nest, Baam went from someone who did not let anyone die, even his opponents, to walking among the corpses of hundreds of people.
Isn't it "pull the lever"?
What Baam chooses may not what Baam wants. But this is just game of fate, Baam always needs to choice.

Isn't it something Zahard had to go through?
Zahard also saved people and also wanted everyone to live happily. But in the end, he still put the important friends first.

Zahard's friends and towerborns.
Similar to
Jinsung and Canines.

Do you still think Zahard a fake King? Or have the fate chosen him?

 

[XXGenesis]

I’ll preference with this 1st TOG underlying theme is Humanity. Insert a Tower, Shinsui, etc etc. so here’s my theory.

Zharad naturally at his heart is an Adventurer/Explorer.
The tower was this grand adventure for all of them, Zharad with his personality assumed a leadership role among them….

I believe Zharad was corrupted by something Evil in the tower, during his Revolution. He made the wrong decision during his revolution & the power he attained started to sway him towards what he is today. I believe Zahard was susceptible to the evil taking him over due to his own personality not heading a warning & becoming a perverse form of himself more and more over time.

As far as V, I believe V unlike Zharad the self appointed leader who all are willing to follow. V is more of the Leader that was needed. Someone that didn’t want to be the leader but seemingly was the most responsible and independently / due to his own personality, made good decisions for that group. Ex Sharing Revolution; Appointing Gustang his role & position within the Tower & group.

The Zharad Empire is not a just & righteous Reign. Yes the Tower has advanced & the quality of life has risen; It is a twisted, perverse form of a kingdom.

If V was King. I don’t think V would ever become King because I don’t think the Tower is supposed to have a King. I believe V understood this, but to slightly play along. V would be the figure head that all Races/ Groups / Organizations look to for guidance; He would be the glue to the tower, creating an equal empire. The FH would still have their power & influence but they wouldn’t horde this power & wealth. It would be shared & their families wouldn’t be hated but highly honored, with probably regular Tower natives able to join families within any blood relations

 

[maverickframe_19]

My personal opinion is that a King is no "True King" unless he's acknowledged by the masses he rules.